Investment Logic Of Foreigners In Thailand

[gzu88bv]

It is pouring down in Isaan and the rice farmers like it. And while it is doing that I got together with a friend about something that just boggles our little brains. Btw this thought has not come up in between a few beers and therefore I look forward to serious discussions and answers.

Why the hel_l so many Falangs with no legal rights to property (except the company route) come over here, buy land and house, a car or even a small business, and all this in the name of their darlings with the premises that one day all that investment may never pay off, be lost or even disappear.

On the other hand, we also ask ourselves what is it really, that again the same guy would act differently in his own country, unless he wants or needs to cover his ass(ets) from whatever circumstances.

Are Thai partners really that more trustworthy than their Western counterparts?

[asiaworld]

GR8 question ! just boils my mind , these people bring plenty of development into the country , but get NothinG in return

WEIRD

[Jingthing]

Something in the bottled water?

Snake charmers?

[lannarebirth]

I can't answer as to why someone would put property solely in their wifes name, but I can tell you why owning property here can be a good idea. except for some very touristy areas, land here is pretty cheap. By taking ownership (however), you have fixed your cost of a home forever. You are no longer at the whim of exchange rates. f you know you're going to be here for the duration, it makes sense. To me anyway.

Edited August 7, 2007 by lannarebirth

[GuestHouse]

Perhaps its wrong to assume that anyone investing in Thailand has disregarded the golden rule 'Don't invest money in Thailand that you can't afford to loose'.

If they can afford the loss then where is the problem?

We need to keep a sense of scale here.

I had a beer in the pub lastnight with a friend who has just been taken for a £420K house in the UK in a divorce settlement - I've known a few guys loose Bht2million houses in Thailand.

Apples and Oranges - methinks.

[asiaworld]

Perhaps its wrong to assume that anyone investing in Thailand has disregarded the golden rule 'Don't invest money in Thailand that you can't afford to loose'.

If they can afford the loss then where is the problem?

We need to keep a sense of scale here.

I had a beer in the pub lastnight with a friend who has just been taken for a £420K house in the UK in a divorce settlement - I've known a few guys loose Bht2million houses in Thailand.

Apples and Oranges - methinks.

now thats IRONCLAD LOGIC why don't invest in Nigeria , or some poorer countries than

imrove their lot & btw. also got plenty of willing women over there

[GuestHouse]

now thats IRONCLAD LOGIC why don't invest in Nigeria , or some poorer countries than

imrove their lot & btw. also got plenty of willing women over there

I'm quite certain there are people who do just that, but the subject of the question and (oddly) this website is Thailand.

Perhaps we should take a side track and start discussing actual Risks - Of course to do that we'd need some measure of how many Thai/Farang relationships in which property is owned fail (leaving the Farang robbed of his investment), fail but the Farang gets his money back/life long use of the property OR ... Shock Horror! - Don't fail and the Thai/Farang relationship continues on into a happy sunset.

Getting such data would not be easy, since in line with human nature we delight in hearing and passing the bad news - so we seldom hear the whole truth.

Just like guys potraying themselves as being blessed with Investment Savvy, trumptting that they have not invested in Thailand because of the risks, while berating others who have.

We should not accept this claim to 'Smarts' without considering the alternatives - Perhaps the reason they have not invested in Thailand is because they don't have the cash to do so, perhaps the reason they berate those who have the cash and have invested is 'spite and envy'.

Who knows, people make their own choices.

I think it is interesting to understand why they do, but hardly a case of Right and Wrong.

Edited August 7, 2007 by GuestHouse

[asiaworld]

well lets see .. i'm pretty well set here ( no wife .. ouch) but car , condo etc.. ALL in My Name ..

i can't own the buffalo farm thou , well my loss i guess

[GuestHouse]

Well done, you've made YOUR choices, let other's make THEIR'S.

[pumpuiman]

My wife owns our land and house. I gladly paid the lions share of the purchase to fulfill our dream of a fine home. Knowing she and her (now my) family are happy warms my heart. If our relationship were to sour....I will have lost the price of a nice car in the U.S.

I can get another car

[bendix]

Ahhhhhh, thaivisa. The home of a million cliches. Only invest what you can lose blah blah blah. All thai women are cheats blah blah blah. Everyone is out to cheat me blah blah blah.

Perhaps there are some farang who have been cheated out of land and house; well, if they're going to marry bargirl girlfriends, what do they expect?

However, for every one instance of that happening, there are hundred and hundreds of - shock horror - farangs leading perfectly ordinary lives, loving and trusting their wives, never losing anything.

[GuestHouse]

However, for every one instance of that happening, there are hundred and hundreds of - shock horror - farangs leading perfectly ordinary lives, loving and trusting their wives, never losing anything. (Edit by GH - And Gaining a whole lot more than they give).

But let's not try to tell them what they don't want to hear Bendix.

[jetjock]

However, for every one instance of that happening, there are hundred and hundreds of - shock horror - farangs leading perfectly ordinary lives, loving and trusting their wives, never losing anything. (Edit by GH - And Gaining a whole lot more than they give).

But let's not try to tell them what they don't want to hear Bendix.

I agree totally with both of you guys. There are smart and stupid investors and investments in every country of the world. It just seems on TV, there are a great many members that like to talk and piss and moan about their bad investments and choices in Thailand whether it be property or women. My guess is that there are a great many of us that are big winners when it comes to our investments and experiences in Thailand.

[bangkoksingapore]

i don't see what the big deal is about putting property in your thai wife's name. if she legally selsl it, then you still have rights to half of that money? If you were to get divorced, your assets would split 50/50 anyways, so people who put their house in their wifes name and lose it probably do so because they are too lazy to hire a lawyer.

Edited August 7, 2007 by bangkoksingapore

[Arunsak]

Why the hel_l so many Falangs with no legal rights to property (except the company route) come over here, buy land and house, a car or even a small business, and all this in the name of their darlings with the premises that one day all that investment may never pay off, be lost or even disappear.

Good question. I've wondered this myself for many years. It seems like the first thing, the very first thing, that comes out of the mouth of any stupid farang who gets involved with a Thai is that they're going to buy a small plot of land or condo in Thailand. What fools. Thailand does not welcome foreigners to start with, look at how this website is so popular, you need a huge resource just to figure out how to get legal residence in a country where you have a legal marriage! I have been married nearly 12 years now, with kids all born outside of Thailand (fortunately easy to get Thai passports for them) but as for me--not allowed more than 90 days visa. What an insult! People should be protesting this at the Thai consulates overseas, I have a mind to do that someday in fact. A friend of mine said he comes from Taiwan and the Taiwanese government is also very unfair to people who marry foreigners, not giving them residence in Taiwan. He said there have been some street protests on this fact.

In the meantime my wife can enjoy full right of employment and permanent residence in my country with a 10 year extension. Very easy for her. What Thailand does is not fair at all. As a matter of principle I will never buy land or invest there.

Back to your original topic. I know a guy who worked in Iraq as a private security contractor for nearly 2 years. Lost some of his hearing, came home totally shell-shocked from living in hel_l 2 years. Fortunately he made good money. I asked him if he has enough saved up, he says he and his wife used the money to buy land in Thailand. <deleted> is it too hard to find a place to rent there for your allowed 30 day stay?

[JimsKnight]

I'd love to know what the hel_l he bought that sucked all his savings away! A house and land is cheap in Thailand! Especially if your on megabucks from 2 years of Dangermoney in Iraq! Was it a replica of Buckingham palace!?

For me being a single dude only enough money that can be easily replaced should be risked. No wife, no kids (thank god!) and dosh is squirreled away overseas.

Maybe a Condo if I had the cash to hand, some vehicles but nothing too extravagant.

For married guys its a different deal and I think it gets a whole lot more expensive!

Edited August 7, 2007 by JimsKnight

[Sanpatong]

My wife owns the house. It's not an investment, it's a house. It's mortgaged of course, because neither of us have the cash sitting in a bank somewhere. We do both make enough money to pay off the mortgage.

Why the "hel_l" is any of that strange?

[true blue]

it all comes down to trust at the end of the day and experience i suppose it must be a culture shock to part with your cash and your fingers crossed behind your back hoping it will all work out and it will be sweet dreams and roses all the way but thats life as they say

[No beleeeeve!]

So the question is...why do guys come to Thailand and make foolish financial decisions and take high risks with their money? What is different for them in Thailand that they do not have in their homeland might be the answer.

The guys get a woman in Thailand that they couldn't possibly get in their homeland and get hooked on the pu**y!

There are exceptions but the dozens of guys I have personally seen it happen to ALL got led around by the nose by their little Thai girlie and lost all sense of reality. Captains if Industry back home turn to morons after they get the taste of a nubile 21 year-old who hooks him in.

Guys come to Thailand and get the "$50 Brad Pitt makeover" on the flight over. Once off the plane, with at least $50 in their pocket, they have been transformed into getting attention from women they never received back home and think they are suddenly different people (Brad Pitt-like) and they fall for the deceptions. Not thinking that they are the same person who couldn't get laid in a whorehouse back home two days earlier who now has women hanging on his every word.

Again, not all (save the flames if this doesn't apply to you) but you know what I mean.

Somewhere in that lies your answer.

[Sir Burr]

Who says buying land here is a foolish investment. Talk to the many foreigners that have made millions (dollars, not baht) in real estate in Phuket and Ko Samui.

Just because you don't have the balls to invest and win doesn't mean there aren't foreigners that have already.

[chinthee]

If you read the OP's post properly, he and his pals are only asking about farangs like this

Why the hel_l so many Falangs with no legal rights to property (except the company route) come over here, buy land and house, a car or even a small business, and all this in the name of their darlings with the premises that one day all that investment may never pay off, be lost or even disappear.

The precise inquiry is why invest cash and put ownership in the name of your Thai darling? Would you do this back home? Would you invest, in some cases, your life savings and gayly put them into the name of a girlfriend only with no ownership rights of your own? I think not. And, that is the crux of the matter. We're not discussing all the ways you can own things yourself here.

I agree that it is wise to invest in all manner of things in Thailand if those investments make sense. hel_l, the whole world is my investment oyster. But, last time I checked, most foreign men who previously bought homes in farangland held them in joint tenancy or ownership with their wives. (I agree, most of them then subsequently lost those homes to the ex-wives in divorces! -ah the joys of being a man)

Now, granted, there is something in the "nesting" instinct that demands you settle your little piece of domestic bliss happily into a home, car, etc.. And, in Thailand, most men don't have much choice. Either put it in her name or rent. So, this forces a lot of them to lose perspective. Add to that the year-to-year insecurity of Visas for farangs and it really does add up to a stupid investment to put it in the name of your darling only. Yes, I agree with the OP. Having said that, I have put cars, motorcycles and other things in Thai wife's name just for ease of purchase and because I'm too lazy. In a divorce, those are lost, but to me, those are acceptable loss risks.

A 12 million Baht home or two? No way.

[Arunsak]

And, in Thailand, most men don't have much choice. Either put it in her name or rent. So, this forces a lot of them to lose perspective.

What's wrong with renting? Seems ok to me.

[jackr]

And, in Thailand, most men don't have much choice. Either put it in her name or rent. So, this forces a lot of them to lose perspective.

What's wrong with renting? Seems ok to me.

Great if you're on your tod, but not so swell if/when the landlord tells you to up sticks and you have a family.

[Maigo6]

I know a guy that has rented houses in Thailand for 17 years, he could have bought one for 300,000 baht at the time when he went to Thailand in 89, but he refused cos his wife would have owned it.

I wonder how much rent he has paid over the years, I bet it's a whole lot more than 300,000 baht, and he's still with the same women. But if he died tomorrow, she would have nothing but the rent to pay at the end of the month.

If you can't afford to buy a house then there is nothing you can do about it, if you can afford to buy a house and do, then fair play.

I have a good house, and it cost little more than my car did.

Is it in my name, No.

Do I care, No.

Can I afford it, Yes.

Does my long suffering wife deserve some security, Yes.

Would I do it all over again even after reading all the posts from the barstool experts on TV, Yes.

Would I rent in Thailand instead of buying if I had the choice, No.

If I was on a very limited budget would I buy a house, No.

[chinthee]

However, for every one instance of that happening, there are hundred and hundreds of - shock horror - farangs leading perfectly ordinary lives, loving and trusting their wives, never losing anything. (Edit by GH - And Gaining a whole lot more than they give).

But let's not try to tell them what they don't want to hear Bendix.

From reading your posts, I guess that you two guys have only been married once...so far. I suppose you both have never been through economically painful divorces. If you had, (or even if not are wise) you might think about doing some antenuptial planning. In the case of Thailand, that would include holding property not solely in your wife's name, regardless of the amount of trust. This has absolutely nothing to do with Thai women, it's just good common sense.

You are probably the types who would also blindly trust your business partners and not build in contractual and other protections for yourself just because you are good mates and trust them so much?

Come on...wake up and stop defending all things Thai so much. This is not even a Thai issue.

[UnknownPoster]

Ahhhhhh, thaivisa. The home of a million cliches. Only invest what you can lose blah blah blah. All thai women are cheats blah blah blah. Everyone is out to cheat me blah blah blah.

Perhaps there are some farang who have been cheated out of land and house; well, if they're going to marry bargirl girlfriends, what do they expect?

However, for every one instance of that happening, there are hundred and hundreds of - shock horror - farangs leading perfectly ordinary lives, loving and trusting their wives, never losing anything.

Perhaps? That's funny. I suggest you spend a few more years here and get to know some locals.

One thing you are right about, there probably a hundred or so leading perfectly ordinary lives, loving and trusting their wives, never losing anything.

Cheating the Farang is a national pastime.

Edited August 8, 2007 by UnknownPoster

[kmart]

Same old cliches recurring here again. Groundhog Day all over.

Lets stick with the hackneyed, trite old phrases theme for a minute and just say that its better to regret something you have done rather than the other way around.....

[palm]

Ahhhhhh, thaivisa. The home of a million cliches. Only invest what you can lose blah blah blah. All thai women are cheats blah blah blah. Everyone is out to cheat me blah blah blah.

Perhaps there are some farang who have been cheated out of land and house; well, if they're going to marry bargirl girlfriends, what do they expect?

However, for every one instance of that happening, there are hundred and hundreds of - shock horror - farangs leading perfectly ordinary lives, loving and trusting their wives, never losing anything.

Perhaps? That's funny. I suggest you spend a few more years here and get to know some locals.

One thing you are right about, there probably a hundred or so leading perfectly ordinary lives, loving and trusting their wives, never losing anything.

Cheating the Farang is a national pastime.

It's always a good laugh reading some of the TV threads - it makes it so easy to spot who married someone 30 yrs younger (and 300lbs lighter) than them, and also those who can't even afford to invest anything here anyway without risking their shirt.

Why are there so many clueless riff-raff on TV who think anyone investing money in Thailand doesn't have substantial greater assets overseas? No wonder you guys are so bitter.

[bendix]

Perhaps? That's funny. I suggest you spend a few more years here and get to know some locals.

One thing you are right about, there probably a hundred or so leading perfectly ordinary lives, loving and trusting their wives, never losing anything.

Cheating the Farang is a national pastime.

You really are an unhappy, bitter man, aren't you? Would you like to tell us your story?

[JR Texas]

Ahhhhhh, thaivisa. The home of a million cliches. Only invest what you can lose blah blah blah. All thai women are cheats blah blah blah. Everyone is out to cheat me blah blah blah.

Perhaps there are some farang who have been cheated out of land and house; well, if they're going to marry bargirl girlfriends, what do they expect?

However, for every one instance of that happening, there are hundred and hundreds of - shock horror - farangs leading perfectly ordinary lives, loving and trusting their wives, never losing anything.

Perhaps? That's funny. I suggest you spend a few more years here and get to know some locals.

One thing you are right about, there probably a hundred or so leading perfectly ordinary lives, loving and trusting their wives, never losing anything.

Cheating the Farang is a national pastime.

It's always a good laugh reading some of the TV threads - it makes it so easy to spot who married someone 30 yrs younger (and 300lbs lighter) than them, and also those who can't even afford to invest anything here anyway without risking their shirt.

Why are there so many clueless riff-raff on TV who think anyone investing money in Thailand doesn't have substantial greater assets overseas? No wonder you guys are so bitter.

In the past (last two decades) Thailand was a fairly nice place to live....not too many big headaches. Expats came here to live because it was "easy." There really were no good alternatives to Thailand.

Now.....things have changed......the visa/business rules have become completely insane/xenophobic and good alternatives to Thailand have surfaced.....even lowly Cambodia has a far better economic growth rate than Thailand has (and far better visa/business rules).

So, I guess my answer is that we really did not have good alternatives to LOS back then, so we made decisions based on that (also it was easier to live here back in the good old days). Now all of that has changed. I think more and more expats/investors will choose to live/invest elsewhere......many are already doing so.