Help understanding how to price and list Buriram house

[rabas]

We built a house in Buriram, Ampur Phuthaisong about 10 years ago, which the family wants to sell. I designed and build the house but know little about the housing market, nor it seems does my family.

 

My immediate task is to workout a reasonable price for the house and land, which raises a few questions. Any help answering them is greatly appreciated.

Description: The house sits in an active moo ban with a mix of modern and old style Thai houses, and occasional new construction. It's modern design, ~150 sqm, 3 bedrooms, 2 baths, a Western kitchen and dining area with a large walk in attic. It sits on elevated poured concrete pilings. There is a separate concrete structure with a Thai style kitchen and dining area. The house sits on 0.77 rai = 1236 sqm.

 

Looking at local listings (dotproperty.com and ddproperty.com) raises a few questions.

1. What is the accepted way to calculate house area? The West is pretty strict that only enclosed heated area is considered. Our raised concrete floor area includes the interior rooms and a living balcony under the same roof. Which parts can I count? The listings I've seen aren't clear.

 

2. Listings I've seen give a 'base price'. What is a base price?

 

Also

3. It would also be helpful to know how much the cost of construction in say Isaan has gone up in the past 10-12 years.

 

4. (Land only) Can the local land office help estimate current land prices, or they only price very low prices for tax purposes?

 

A few post construction pictures, the first two show the front open area that shares the raised floor and roof. Can I count this? The third shows the separate Thai Kitchen and dining area. Click to zoom.

 

 

[hotandsticky]

Why not speak to a local agent?

 

 

Are William Property still around?

[rabas]

2 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

Why not speak to a local agent?

 

Are William Property still around?

 

Good question and I probably will eventually. Two reasons. I've been in Thailand almost 40 years and I would never start talking business or money without being fully prepared. The second reason, it seems the next door neighbor has been making inquires. I assume selling a house in such moo bans is not easy so I don't want to miss the opportunity. Family is pushing me to work out a price. 

[rabas]

11 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

Are William Property still around?

 

Yes, I see them here. https://williampropertythailand.com/  Thanks for the tip. 

[hotandsticky]

Just now, rabas said:

 

Good question and I probably will eventually. Two reasons. I've been in Thailand almost 40 years and I would never start talking business or money without being fully prepared. The second reason, it seems the next door neighbor has been making inquires. I assume selling a house in such moo bans is not easy so I don't want to miss the opportunity. Family is pushing me to work out a price. 

 

 

I have less than half your time in Thailand but in my experience it is a lottery. First, Thais rarely sell, and usually only when they are desperate. 

 

A "Farang quality" house is of little interest to Thais; you know how they live.

 

Therefore, especially if you think that you might be marketing to the western community, a chat with a Farang agent may be useful. 

 

 

[hotandsticky]

2 minutes ago, rabas said:

 

Yes, I see them here. https://williampropertythailand.com/  Thanks for the tip. 

 

 

You are very welcome. I have not had any contact for a number of years but Hywel and Peter,  were always very helpful.

[newnative]

      I don't know that area but I agree with the above post.  I would check with 3 or 4 agents to get a little guidance on pricing.   I haven't found any consensus on what is considered when calculating house area.  I think probably more add in the outdoor areas than don't.    We don't really use base price as such but with some agents we will tell them the minimum amount we want to net so they have a figure to work with.  I don't know what the agent situation is there but we always, always list with as many agencies as we possibly can, as there is no MLS in Thailand.  Good luck with your sale.  

 

[rabas]

7 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

 

I have less than half your time in Thailand but in my experience it is a lottery. First, Thais rarely sell, and usually only when they are desperate. 

 

A "Farang quality" house is of little interest to Thais; you know how they live.

 

Therefore, especially if you think that you might be marketing to the western community, a chat with a Farang agent may be useful. 

 

So when you get to my time you'll realize it's a rigged lottery. 

 

But you hit the issue on the head. I'm selling a house in a Thai moo ban, almost certainly to a Thai though there is a small but growing number of Westerners. But times move on. 15 years ago they were building 'modern' Thai style homes, which are cheaper construction. Now with greater affluence and many Thai tired of big city Bangkok,  some are moving back and building better quality homes.  This is one reason pricing is not easy.

[stupidfarang]

Once you have worked out a price, list it on the Thai property for sale groups on Facebook, also consider running an advert on Facebook and Instagram, you can spend around $2 a day and reach a vast audience. You would need to run the ad for about 3 weeks to get the best results from FB. This way you may reach also a expat audience.

[rabas]

30 minutes ago, newnative said:

      I don't know that area but I agree with the above post.  I would check with 3 or 4 agents to get a little guidance on pricing.   I haven't found any consensus on what is considered when calculating house area.  I think probably more add in the outdoor areas than don't.    We don't really use base price as such but with some agents we will tell them the minimum amount we want to net so they have a figure to work with.  I don't know what the agent situation is there but we always, always list with as many agencies as we possibly can, as there is no MLS in Thailand.  Good luck with your sale.  

 

 

 I haven't found any consensus on what is considered when calculating house area.  I think probably more add in the outdoor areas than don't. 

 

I assumed Thailand = free for all but as I said I really have little experience. Thanks.

 

But the 'base price' in the listing is set by the seller/agent, do they think I may offer more? Oh, are they suggesting to offer more in case of competing bids?

 

EDIT

Alternatively, I see base price may refer to price before any requested fix ups or alterations. Synonymous with "as is", buyer pays for any repair or upgrades. 

 

[OneMoreFarang]

1 hour ago, rabas said:

It's modern design, ~150 sqm, 3 bedrooms, 2 baths, a Western kitchen and dining area with a large walk in attic. It sits on elevated poured concrete pilings. There is a separate concrete structure with a Thai style kitchen and dining area. The house sits on 0.77 rai = 1236 sqm.

 

Just in general, do you think your house is similar to other houses with above description?

Or did you spend a lot more on better quality material, work, etc.?

 

I guess if your house is "nothing special" and you are willing to sell it for a similar price like comparable properties, then this should not be a big deal.

But if you think your house is special (because it is actually built better in many ways), then I guess it will be difficult to sell it for a good price.

[rabas]

1 hour ago, OneMoreFarang said:

 

Just in general, do you think your house is similar to other houses with above description?

Or did you spend a lot more on better quality material, work, etc.?

 

I guess if your house is "nothing special" and you are willing to sell it for a similar price like comparable properties, then this should not be a big deal.

But if you think your house is special (because it is actually built better in many ways), then I guess it will be difficult to sell it for a good price.

I'd say it's an ordinary Western or urban Thai style house. Thinking I may one day live in it, I brought a Bangkok contractor (who I knew) out to build it. I oversaw, made decisions on, and often purchased materials myself. More steel, more concrete, prefab stressed concrete floors, better tiles, roof, large rooms, etc. High quality aluminum frame windows with thick laminated glass. I don't like noise. I designed the wiring and lighting myself. It's a strong but otherwise ordinary house in an ordinary Thai moo ban.

 

It's sits on deep pilings on top of concrete slabs with all required amulets, coins, and other spiritual items underneath. Nothing can go wrong. I'm told this may be more important to Thai buyers.

 

I know the price of anything is determined solely by what a buyer is willing to pay so your point is right on. That's the price I'm looking for. 

[stupidfarang]

12 hours ago, rabas said:

I'd say it's an ordinary Western or urban Thai style house. Thinking I may one day live in it, I brought a Bangkok contractor (who I knew) out to build it. I oversaw, made decisions on, and often purchased materials myself. More steel, more concrete, prefab stressed concrete floors, better tiles, roof, large rooms, etc. High quality aluminum frame windows with thick laminated glass. I don't like noise. I designed the wiring and lighting myself. It's a strong but otherwise ordinary house in an ordinary Thai moo ban.

 

It's sits on deep pilings on top of concrete slabs with all required amulets, coins, and other spiritual items underneath. Nothing can go wrong. I'm told this may be more important to Thai buyers.

 

I know the price of anything is determined solely by what a buyer is willing to pay so your point is right on. That's the price I'm looking for. 

Sounds like very good spec, I would aim for a expat who will appreciate these specs, a Thai is unlkely to.

[Jomtien]

for land value, go to https://landsmaps.dol.go.th/ and drill down to your house to see gov. appr. price.

i think the going land value is around 3-6 times the appraisal price. (but differs widely around prime locations) 

 

In thailand generally speaking, most houses are sold not via fb/agents ect, but via mouth to mouth people who live near, and willing to pay more, than outsiders.

 

Salary from labor did not go up that much in 10 years especially upcountry. For example steel price is on the same level as 10 years ago.  You know what you spend on the property itself,  and maybe the value is still the same. 9But normally property value lowers a bit.

 

Think problem upcountry is the aging population, see many empty houses, there is no new influx.

[rabas]

6 hours ago, Jomtien said:

for land value, go to https://landsmaps.dol.go.th/ and drill down to your house to see gov. appr. price.

i think the going land value is around 3-6 times the appraisal price. (but differs widely around prime locations) 

 

In thailand generally speaking, most houses are sold not via fb/agents ect, but via mouth to mouth people who live near, and willing to pay more, than outsiders.

 

Salary from labor did not go up that much in 10 years especially upcountry. For example steel price is on the same level as 10 years ago.  You know what you spend on the property itself,  and maybe the value is still the same. 9But normally property value lowers a bit.

 

Think problem upcountry is the aging population, see many empty houses, there is no new influx.

Great info,

 

for land value, go to https://landsmaps.dol.go.th/ and drill down to your house to see gov. appr. price. i think the going land value is around 3-6 times the appraisal price. (but differs widely around prime locations) 

 

That site leads to the gov site  https://assessprice.treasury.go.th/, which has everything including satellite images. 3x the gov land estimate sounds about right and matches similar listings for ordinary moo bans I've seen.

 

In Thailand generally speaking, most houses are sold not via fb/agents ect, but via mouth to mouth people who live near, and willing to pay more, than outsiders.

 

I assumed this for a Thai moo ban and an agent I talked to today said the same. He was a Westerner selling homes part time in Buriram for 20 years. But he also cracked the secret code on true house evaluations. When I mentioned a house is worth what someone will pay, he said not exactly. A house is worth what a bank land assessor says it is as that determines what a buyer can borrow. Facepalm, of course. Logically, a bank wants to make the largest loan that will not lose on default. But I need to go the the local bank branch, probably in Phuthasisong.  

 

So at least my search for how to determine a reasonable price is done. Thanks everyone.

 

[donx]

4 hours ago, rabas said:

When I mentioned a house is worth what someone will pay, he said not exactly. A house is worth what a bank land assessor says it is as that determines what a buyer can borrow. Facepalm, of course. Logically, a bank wants to make the largest loan that will not lose on default. But I need to go the the local bank branch, probably in Phuthasisong.

 

This is also true in the United States. I bought my house there in 2016 and because the bank assessed the value of the property $10,000 less than the asking price (which I was willing to pay), the seller was forced to either sell it to me for $10,000 less or find another buyer.

[KhunLA]

Do NOT sign an exclusive contract with any realtor.  I found them to be useless.

 

Sold 2 houses, on 1 rai & the other on 2 rai of land.   The house themselves did not appreciate, as it was the land that appreciated, and accounted for any & all profits.

 

The land office will tell you 'least' value of your house & land.  Since most don't actually state what they sold or bought at, to avoid taxes, unless financed, then hard to avoid any tax assessment, I think.

 

Taxes/fees, who pays, as everything in RE sales, is negotiable.  You pay, they pay, or 50/50 split.

 

10 year appreciation of land, if bought 10 yrs ago, at a guess, appreciation 5-10X value increase.

 

Hopefully you know the value, if you didn't pay for it, 10 yrs ago.  If bought, then your tax assessment at time, tells you what you should have paid for it, actually, ballpark low market price. 

 

House build you should know, and if break even on that cost, consider yourself lucky.   As building construction has stayed the same, price wise, but better materials available now, due to new competitive DIY super stores.

 

Our land buy & sell experience, living 'rural', 15 ish kms outside Udon Thani ...

... 1st house/land, held ~7 yrs, land bought in 2000 for 50k, sold 600k

... 2nd house/land, held ~10 yrs, land bought 2010 for 120k per rai (6 rai @ 720k), sold 650k (2), 550k (1) & 500k (3 w/house).  Motivated seller (us), and during covid, a buyer's market.  Now, 1 rai there worth >1M

 

Present land located Amphur Muang, Prachuap Khiri Khan, again, sort of rural.  No neighbors for 100+ meters, one side, and surrounded by coconut & pineapple farms.

... 3rd & present house/land, land bought ~8+ (?) yrs ago, (1/4 rai) for 76k, now worth >500k. 

 

Buying lots on same soi, to avoid neighbors.

... 2nd lot bought 250k, 1.5yr ago, worth >500k

... lot 3 & 4 bought <6 months ago for 350k each, now worth >500k each

 

Two lots on (our) same soi, we know owners, 1 bought 450k, 2 yrs ago, and another, corner lot to main road, bought for 650k, 2+ yrs ago.

 

Ignore what people say what land is selling at, or value of, unless you know exactly what a 'Thai' bought something for locally.

 

Most buy above the land office assessment price.  We bought all ours, at the assessed price, from motivated sellers.  Present house lot for 76k, was bought from a bank owned repo.