Eighty Years On: Honoring VE Day and Confronting the Rising Tide of Holocaust Denial

[hotandsticky]

1 minute ago, Cory1848 said:

Well, a certain present-day US megalomaniac just a few days ago posted that the US did “more than any other Country [sic], by far,” in beating the Germans in the war, and 35 percent of US Americans will fall in line and unquestioningly believe the statement, so there’s that. Said megalomaniac I'm sure has never heard of the Eastern Front.

 

 

I believe that statement

[Patong2021]

1 hour ago, connda said:

And then there are those who will deny that Russians, Slavs, Roma, and a host of other Utermenchen were also subjected to genocide in concentration camps and the Nazi Holocaust.

 

You are confused. Russians and Slavs were not sent to extermination camps. Russians both POWS and civilian deportees  were sent to labour camps where they were often worked to death. However, their living conditions were slightly better than those earmarked for death. Because they were used for work, their food rations were higher. 

 

An estimated 250,000-500,000 Roma were killed in mass shootings or  either labour or designated  extermination camps. They were treated much worse than the Russians because they were  to be killed. The people who deny their death, also deny the  that the holocaust occurred. There is no differentiation.

 

Because Russia had its own system of gulags that were just as bad as those operated by Germany  and had sent Poles, political dissidents,  and non ethnic Russians to the gulags,  had committed its own atrocities in Ukraine and Poland, and had been an enabling ally of Nazi Germany, sympathy for Russia was hard to muster.  It in no way diminishes the wrongful acts visited upon  Russian POWS or civilians, but makes it difficult for Russia to claim victimization since it had also been a participant in the wrongful  acts.

[Nick Carter icp]

3 minutes ago, Cory1848 said:

Well, a certain present-day US megalomaniac just a few days ago posted that the US did “more than any other Country [sic], by far,” in beating the Germans in the war, and 35 percent of US Americans will fall in line and unquestioningly believe the statement, so there’s that. Said megalomaniac I'm sure has never heard of the Eastern Front.

 

   Did a web search :

 

"No results found for US did “more than any other Country [sic], by far,” in beating the Germans in the war,."

 

   But even though , lets not get into yet another discussion about what Donald Trump has said or didn't say 

[hotandsticky]

3 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Did a web search :

 

"No results found for US did “more than any other Country [sic], by far,” in beating the Germans in the war,."

 

   But even though , lets not get into yet another discussion about what Donald Trump has said or didn't say 

 

 

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S007961232200156X

[Nick Carter icp]

3 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

 

 

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S007961232200156X

 

  Why did you waste my time posting that link ?

[Cory1848]

6 hours ago, Yagoda said:

The white feather again. Another one bites the dust.

 

You know where the topics are.  You have had the white feather for a while. You might want to read Kubizeks memoirs when you get a chance

Kubizek’s memoir might indeed be an interesting read, but what are you saying, that Hitler professed some curiosity about socialism during their chats, when they shared lodgings in Vienna in 1908? So what? They were teenagers! By the 1930s, Hitler knew in which direction his political fortunes lay.

 

“Another one bites the dust”? Really? That’s so cute!

[Patong2021]

19 minutes ago, Cory1848 said:

Well, a certain present-day US megalomaniac just a few days ago posted that the US did “more than any other Country [sic], by far,” in beating the Germans in the war, and 35 percent of US Americans will fall in line and unquestioningly believe the statement, so there’s that. Said megalomaniac I'm sure has never heard of the Eastern Front.

 

The Eastern Front is in large part a direct result of Russia having enabled  Nazi Germanys expansion and the start of WWII.  It was Russia which helped initiate WWII with its expansionism.

 

- 23 August 1939: The Soviet Union and Nazi Germany signed a pact that created a partnership between them in dividing up Poland and the rest of Eastern Europe. On September 17, Russians stabbed Poland in the back and invaded. 

- In June 1940, Russia attacked, invaded and brutally occupied the 3 Baltic states

Russia then proceeded to attempt to annex other parts of Eastern Europe. In so doing it left a trail of  destruction.

 

Germany's attack on Russia came in part because the Russians were too aggressive and presented a threat to the Nazis. Two greedy sick despots had a turf war and the  death and destruction that followed  is history. Much of the Russian military  deaths is attributable to the  lack of concern for the personnel. Sacrificing tens of thousands  was nothing to Stalin. Even the Germans were shocked by the Russians's callous disregard for the well being of military personnel. The Russians  sent unarmed people into battle. It often denied weapons to jews and other ethnic groups because of "shortages".  An estimated 500,000 jews  served in the Russian military and it was this group of POWs who were the most mistreated, if they survived capture.

 

[hotsun]

13 hours ago, Yagoda said:

Socialism cannot exist without enemies and victims. As long as there is Socialism, there will be deniers.

Its just ironic that most jews, european and american are socialists

[Cory1848]

13 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Did a web search :

 

"No results found for US did “more than any other Country [sic], by far,” in beating the Germans in the war,."

 

   But even though , lets not get into yet another discussion about what Donald Trump has said or didn't say 

Oh for heaven's sake it's all over the news. But of course, how would you know?

[Nick Carter icp]

4 minutes ago, Cory1848 said:

Oh for heaven's sake 

 

  I am not your Wife, there's no need to speak to me like I am 

[Cory1848]

16 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

 

The Eastern Front is in large part a direct result of Russia having enabled  Nazi Germanys expansion and the start of WWII.  It was Russia which helped initiate WWII with its expansionism.

 

- 23 August 1939: The Soviet Union and Nazi Germany signed a pact that created a partnership between them in dividing up Poland and the rest of Eastern Europe. On September 17, Russians stabbed Poland in the back and invaded. 

- In June 1940, Russia attacked, invaded and brutally occupied the 3 Baltic states

Russia then proceeded to attempt to annex other parts of Eastern Europe. In so doing it left a trail of  destruction.

 

Germany's attack on Russia came in part because the Russians were too aggressive and presented a threat to the Nazis. Two greedy sick despots had a turf war and the  death and destruction that followed  is history. Much of the Russian military  deaths is attributable to the  lack of concern for the personnel. Sacrificing tens of thousands  was nothing to Stalin. Even the Germans were shocked by the Russians's callous disregard for the well being of military personnel. The Russians  sent unarmed people into battle. It often denied weapons to jews and other ethnic groups because of "shortages".  An estimated 500,000 jews  served in the Russian military and it was this group of POWs who were the most mistreated, if they survived capture.

 

The cruelty on both sides is unimaginable. My parents (Estonians) lived through the first Soviet occupation in 1940, then three years under the Germans, then fled when the Red Army returned in 1944. According to them, life under German occupation was not so bad (German soldiers were polite enough not to rape local women, and they even listened to classical music!), but Estonia had only a minimal Jewish population; those few whom my parents knew disappeared.

[Cory1848]

11 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

  I am not your Wife, there's no need to speak to me like I am 

I would never talk to my wife that way!😆

[Yagoda]

3 hours ago, hotsun said:

Its just ironic that most jews, european and american are socialists

Not any more.

[Yagoda]

3 hours ago, Cory1848 said:

Kubizek’s memoir might indeed be an interesting read, but what are you saying, that Hitler professed some curiosity about socialism during their chats, when they shared lodgings in Vienna in 1908? So what? They were teenagers! By the 1930s, Hitler knew in which direction his political fortunes lay.

 

“Another one bites the dust”? Really? That’s so cute!

Might indeed be. You've never read anything about the time.

[Chomper Higgot]

4 hours ago, Patong2021 said:

 

You are confused. Russians and Slavs were not sent to extermination camps. Russians both POWS and civilian deportees  were sent to labour camps where they were often worked to death. However, their living conditions were slightly better than those earmarked for death. Because they were used for work, their food rations were higher. 

 

An estimated 250,000-500,000 Roma were killed in mass shootings or  either labour or designated  extermination camps. They were treated much worse than the Russians because they were  to be killed. The people who deny their death, also deny the  that the holocaust occurred. There is no differentiation.

 

Because Russia had its own system of gulags that were just as bad as those operated by Germany  and had sent Poles, political dissidents,  and non ethnic Russians to the gulags,  had committed its own atrocities in Ukraine and Poland, and had been an enabling ally of Nazi Germany, sympathy for Russia was hard to muster.  It in no way diminishes the wrongful acts visited upon  Russian POWS or civilians, but makes it difficult for Russia to claim victimization since it had also been a participant in the wrongful  acts.

“An estimated 250,000-500,000 Roma were killed in mass shootings or  either labour or designated  extermination camps.”

 

Roma and Sinti were also murdered in the gas chambers.

 

https://www.auschwitz.org/en/history/categories-of-prisoners/

[jacnl2000]

A Quiet Kind of Freedom

Being born Dutch, my sense of remembrance is shaped less by victory than by loss—and by the enduring importance of freedom. While many commemorate May 8th as Victory in Europe Day, in the Netherlands our hearts are turned toward May 4th and 5th: days not of triumphalism, but of memory and reflection.

On May 4th, at 20.00 hours, we fall silent. For two minutes, we remember all those—known and unknown—who suffered, who were taken, who never returned. We do not compare losses. We do not rank grief. In those two minutes, everyone should feel free to honor what matters to them most.

On May 5th, we mark our liberation. Not with parades of conquest, but with the quiet knowledge that freedom is precious, and never guaranteed. I think of my uncle, the first in our province of North-Brabant to be killed in a faraway land—his loss rippling through generations of our family.

Today, as then, people are still being forced to travel to places of death. That is why we remember. That is why we speak quietly. That is why we stand still. So others may one day stand free.

 

Hope this helps.

[Bkk Brian]

21 minutes ago, jacnl2000 said:

A Quiet Kind of Freedom

Being born Dutch, my sense of remembrance is shaped less by victory than by loss—and by the enduring importance of freedom. While many commemorate May 8th as Victory in Europe Day, in the Netherlands our hearts are turned toward May 4th and 5th: days not of triumphalism, but of memory and reflection.

On May 4th, at 20.00 hours, we fall silent. For two minutes, we remember all those—known and unknown—who suffered, who were taken, who never returned. We do not compare losses. We do not rank grief. In those two minutes, everyone should feel free to honor what matters to them most.

On May 5th, we mark our liberation. Not with parades of conquest, but with the quiet knowledge that freedom is precious, and never guaranteed. I think of my uncle, the first in our province of North-Brabant to be killed in a faraway land—his loss rippling through generations of our family.

Today, as then, people are still being forced to travel to places of death. That is why we remember. That is why we speak quietly. That is why we stand still. So others may one day stand free.

 

Hope this helps.

Sounds good, in the UK and many other countries we have a separate Remembrance day for that in November also known as poppy day. 2 mins silence observed for all who fell in all wars.

 

On the second Sunday of each November, The King leads the nation in remembering those who have died in world wars and other conflicts. In a ceremony at the Cenotaph, the focal point of the nation's homage, Members of the Royal Family unite with others in thousands of similar ceremonies across the UK and worldwide in holding two minutes' of silence at 11am.

https://www.royal.uk/remembrance-day

 

 

[hotandsticky]

18 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

  Why did you waste my time posting that link ?

 

Because you wasted my time by having to read your pointless post.

[Nick Carter icp]

4 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

 

Because you wasted my time by having to read your pointless post.

 

   My post was asking a person to back up their claims , you just posted  random link that didn't back up the claim 

[Patong2021]

17 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

“An estimated 250,000-500,000 Roma were killed in mass shootings or  either labour or designated  extermination camps.”

 

Roma and Sinti were also murdered in the gas chambers.

 

https://www.auschwitz.org/en/history/categories-of-prisoners/

 

And what is different than what I wrote ? An extermination camp consisted of gas chambers and crematoria. 

 

[Social Media]

@Packer a post snipping the quoted context out of context and further off topic bickering removed