Beating children

[Hummin]

31 minutes ago, Barnet1900 said:

So do I and you, not I can say this for all of these schools. Likewise, I have first-hand experience that proves this theory completely wrong. It does happen. It's always happened. It continues to happen.

Why do you revert to personal insults? Naive because I don't agree with you. Ridiculous because I don't agree with you. 

 

I am not referring to military academies as well you know. I have stated the school I am referring to. It is prestigious by Thai standards, full of rich Thai kids, and it had a disciplinary policy that involves teachers hitting kids. According to the rules, the disciplinarian should be the allocated staff member to hit the kids but other Thai teachers also did it which I witnessed on a frequent basis. The disciplinarian would hit kids everyday and throughout the day.

 

The parents know exactly what happens and do not contend it.

 

Have you considered why the headlines are restricted to poorer schools? Perhaps because the richer ones cannot be challenged or criticised.

 

Just to make myself clear so you understand my point.

 

My original reply was in argument against: a. Hitting kids in schools is restricted to Isan or poorer schools.

 

My response was that:

 

This happens all over Thailand and does happen in the better, affluent  schools also.

 

Move on 

Wasn't this normal on the more privileged schools in Uk, Switzerland, Usa as well or rather say especially at the catholic schools? 

 

 

[richard_smith237]

7 hours ago, Barnet1900 said:

My post is arguing the point made previously in which people said that this abuse is linked to certain demographics of Thailand, Isan and not Bangkok. 

 

My reply was that it happens all over Thailand and is not secluded to the poorer regions or schools. The confusion you've added is bringing international schools into the mix. That comparison has never been mentioned and does not fit here. International schools are entirely different to any Thai school and can't be considered in this debate.

 

In response to the post I picked up on, not only government or poorer Thai schools hit children, the higher-tier Thai schools do also, and not only in Isan.

 

Again, you can do some research and you'll find that parents know full well how discipline is handled in these schools and always have. 100pc certain.

 

Fair enough - however, your quote: [Some of the richest, most affluent schools in the country kick buckets out of kids and with the parent's blessing in advance.]

 

Now you want to ignore certain types of schools...  

 

So... which "richest, most affluent schools" Thai state schools (not International, not military, not private) beat the school children as a matter of policy ?

 

My argument remains: That the type of school which beats children is most certainly not a 'well regarded school' rather it is one where poor children attend. 

 

I know a lot of wealthy Thai parents from affluent backgrounds who send their children to top-tier schools - they are most certainly not the types to sit back and tolerate their child getting hit at school, not at all.

 

 

Thus: I'm still wondering where this sweeping generalisation comes from that "Some of the richest, most affluent schools in the country kick buckets out of kids and with the parent's blessing in advance"... 

 

 

2 hours ago, Barnet1900 said:

I have stated the school I am referring to. It is prestigious by Thai standards, full of rich Thai kids, and it had a disciplinary policy that involves teachers hitting kids.

 

Which school - I've not seen you name the school - feel free to PM me. 

 

& Rich families do not send their kids to Thai schools...  'as generalisations stand' they send them to the top tier international schools...    

 

 

 

[Barnet1900]

1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Fair enough - however, your quote: [Some of the richest, most affluent schools in the country kick buckets out of kids and with the parent's blessing in advance.]

 

Now you want to ignore certain types of schools...  

 

So... which "richest, most affluent schools" Thai state schools (not International, not military, not private) beat the school children as a matter of policy ?

 

My argument remains: That the type of school which beats children is most certainly not a 'well regarded school' rather it is one where poor children attend. 

 

I know a lot of wealthy Thai parents from affluent backgrounds who send their children to top-tier schools - they are most certainly not the types to sit back and tolerate their child getting hit at school, not at all.

 

 

Thus: I'm still wondering where this sweeping generalisation comes from that "Some of the richest, most affluent schools in the country kick buckets out of kids and with the parent's blessing in advance"... 

 

 

 

Which school - I've not seen you name the school - feel free to PM me. 

 

& Rich families do not send their kids to Thai schools...  'as generalisations stand' they send them to the top tier international schools...    

 

 

 

Please read the entirety of my post. I have stated that I shall not be mentioning the name. I have given a few clues as to which one it is. Think outside Bkk, not too far mind. It is a Thai school or name that any Thai worldwide will recognise. Very good at football, many of the school's alumni are from exceptionally affluent backgrounds. This school, as does it's partners in other provinces, all have corporal punishment as part of it's policy. 10 years of experience makes it a fact not opinion. Google top 20 non-international schools in Thailand and it comes up around 3 or 4. Not that it's relevant.

 

I said "some" not all. That is not a sweeping generalisation. Please read more carefully. 

 

I am not ignoring anything, you have included parameters outside of the original argument to suit your side. Military schools and internationals were nowhere near this thread. You added them. The debate is about Thai schools and those between rich and poor. Not international because everyone knows it does not happen there. Nobody said military because...well.. I've no idea why you brought that up.

 

You know some parents...not all...so there's a generalisation on your behalf.

 

This quote.

 

& Rich families do not send their kids to Thai schools...  'as generalisations stand' they send them to the top tier international schools.

 

No they certainly do not. Where are the statistics to back this up?

 

Some do but many still see the top Thai names as a means of securing a path towards Jula, Mahidol, and other leading Thai universities. Alternatively they see the networking route the schools offer as a means of securing the child's future. Some Thai families take their children out of international schools around year 5 or 6 and educate them in a Thai school in order to improve their Thai language and ensure they are prepared for universities here. 

 

I'll make it simple, so you comprehend my side clearly.

 

Original debate.

Only poor Thai schools or areas of social degradation hit kids. Notice the lack of international in there.

 

No, all over Thailand, school staff hit kids. "Some" not "all" affluent Thai schools with strong reputations and those regarded highly amongst the elite do hit kids and have disciplinary procedures in place that involve hitting kids. Again...notice the word Thai schools not international. 

 

My only point is this (below). If you wish to debate it go for it, but stop adding things I have not said nor brought up.

 

Hitting kids in Thai schools is not restricted to poor ones or those for poor families. It's not restricted to Isan as previously mentioned or people who come from the North East to work in other provinces. It happens all over Thailand including some of the high-end rollers too.

 

 

[hotsun]

19 hours ago, dinsdale said:

There's good discipline and there's bad disciple and there's no discipline. A good clip behind the ears is IMHO reasonable. Whacking a kid with a clothes hanger on the legs (caught grandma doing this when my girl was 4 and put a stop to it in no uncertain terms but without anger) is not reasonable, and then there's the liberal no whacking kids approach and we can all see the results of this. Spoilt, self entitled brats (kids and adults) everywhere.

Not for liberals. For parents who understand the outside world is enough suffering, kids need somewhere safe to come back from. If mine ever do anything bad enough to warrant a beating its probably going to be when theyre about to do something that ruins their life. If the child is too spoiled then stop giving them stuff. 

[blaze master]

7 hours ago, Andrew Banks said:

smacking children in legal in most western countries and I sometimes smacked my kids when they were young.

 

Do share with the class which countries made it legal to assault kids.

 

Then you go on to call people bigots after telling us all you were assaulting your own children.

 

Then you used the word ashamed to describe others. 

 

You cant make this shhhhhh up.

[Magictoad]

When they cancelled corporal punishment in the 80s in the UK it lead to an outbreak of anti -social behaviour and violent crime. Many are talking of bringing it back again to cut down on knife crime which has left the streets too dangerous to walk in these days &  public transport is a NIGHTMARE. It's one reason I left the UK - its become unbearable. If we could turn the clock back and bring back corporal punishment; then I and millions of others would vote for a return. 

[Magictoad]

13 minutes ago, blaze master said:

 

Do share with the class which countries made it legal to assault kids.

 

Then you go on to call people bigots after telling us all you were assaulting your own children.

 

Then you used the word ashamed to describe others. 

 

You cant make this shhhhhh up.

You use the emotive word "assault" 

But physical discipline was part of ALL EUROPEAN SCHOOLS until the 80s. That's when they cancelled it in the UK. Since then we have seen a steady increase in attacks on the elderly, stabbings, anti social behaviour & public transport has become unusable due to violent behaviour of young people who have never  learned to behave.

My views are clear. Bring back corporal punishment in the UK. It is not assault.  It is discipline.

[blaze master]

Just now, Magictoad said:

You use the emotive word "assault" 

But physical discipline was part of ALL EUROPEAN SCHOOLS until the 80s. That's when they cancelled it in the UK. Since then we have seen a steady increase in attacks on the elderly, stabbings, anti social behaviour & public transport has become unusable due to violent behaviour of young people who have never  learned to behave.

My views are clear. Bring back corporal punishment in the UK. It is not assault.  It is discipline.

 

I use the word assault because thats what it is. The rest of your comment is just dinosaur thinking and nonsense claims. 

 

Please dont discipline me with a black eye for this comment. I promise to eat all my veggies. 

 

It might of been part od the schools but in no way was it legal. It was just old world mentality...something you clearly continue with. 

[richard_smith237]

4 hours ago, Barnet1900 said:

My response was that:

 

This happens all over Thailand and does happen in the better, affluent  schools also.

 

No... Your response wasn't that...   Your response was this: 

 

21 hours ago, Barnet1900 said:

Some of the richest, most affluent schools in the country kick buckets out of kids and with the parent's blessing in advance.

 

I call BS on that statement...   The richest, most affluent schools in the country...   and then you exclude 'actual rich and affluent schools' (Int'l schools) and restrict to Thai Government schools...  OK, we'll go with that.

 

But, the Affluent, Wealthy and Powerful Thai's 'generally' do not send their Kids to Thai schools - they send them overseas or to International Schools, perhaps very small minority may send their kids to a Thai Government School...   but even the best Schools in Thailand such as Triam Udom Suksa no longer have the the 'draw' they once had, far from it... 

 

 

...Think of any well known, local and major business, famous family names in thailand, CP Group etc, Central Group, Mall Group etc.. Politicians and the Prime-minister's daughter - their kids are at International Schools or Boarding overseas....   (*these are the families who would previously send their kids to Triam Udom Suksa or Mahidol Wittayanusorn... but times have very much changed).

 

I'm not denying physical punishment occurs in 'Thai Government Schools throughout thailand - I am calling BS on your statement that it occurs in the most affluent schools as a policy accepted by Wealthy, Affluent and Powerful families, 

 

... Wealthy, Powerful, Affluent families will not tolerate their children 'having buckets kicked out of them' by any teacher....  in any school...   particularly as a matter of policy... (which is also against the law).

 

4 hours ago, Barnet1900 said:

I have stated the school I am referring to. It is prestigious by Thai standards, full of rich Thai kids, and it had a disciplinary policy that involves teachers hitting kids.

 

No, you haven't stated it... you are refusing to state it...    PM me the school - we may find that its not quite as 'affluent' as you are making out and the students who 'have buckets kicked out of them' by teachers are not from Wealthy, powerful or affluent families...  The teachers wouldn't dare.

 

 

 

 

 

[save the frogs]

11 hours ago, Magictoad said:

My views are clear. Bring back corporal punishment in the UK. It is not assault.  It is discipline.

 

I know a boy who is an extremely well-behaved and educated adult now.

His father used to use some tactics to keep him in line. But it was more along the lines of "go to your room. no video games". Relatively benign punishments. That, combined with lots of love and attention and support in raising kids seems to be sufficient. No need to touch them. 

 

Your thesis may not be encompassing all factors. Many kids are from broken homes with high divorce rates is one thing that comes to mind. Or maybe just parents working too much. One would need to conduct much more thorough psychological research before concluding that lack of corporal punishment to kids is the main and/or only cause of violence in teens, if it's a factor at all. 

 

Teachers can be more caring and patient, although not always possible with large class sizes. 

 

[Barnet1900]

2 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

No... Your response wasn't that...   Your response was this: 

 

 

I call BS on that statement...   The richest, most affluent schools in the country...   and then you exclude 'actual rich and affluent schools' (Int'l schools) and restrict to Thai Government schools...  OK, we'll go with that.

 

But, the Affluent, Wealthy and Powerful Thai's 'generally' do not send their Kids to Thai schools - they send them overseas or to International Schools, perhaps very small minority may send their kids to a Thai Government School...   but even the best Schools in Thailand such as Triam Udom Suksa no longer have the the 'draw' they once had, far from it... 

 

 

...Think of any well known, local and major business, famous family names in thailand, CP Group etc, Central Group, Mall Group etc.. Politicians and the Prime-minister's daughter - their kids are at International Schools or Boarding overseas....   (*these are the families who would previously send their kids to Triam Udom Suksa or Mahidol Wittayanusorn... but times have very much changed).

 

I'm not denying physical punishment occurs in 'Thai Government Schools throughout thailand - I am calling BS on your statement that it occurs in the most affluent schools as a policy accepted by Wealthy, Affluent and Powerful families, 

 

... Wealthy, Powerful, Affluent families will not tolerate their children 'having buckets kicked out of them' by any teacher....  in any school...   particularly as a matter of policy... (which is also against the law).

 

 

No, you haven't stated it... you are refusing to state it...    PM me the school - we may find that its not quite as 'affluent' as you are making out and the students who 'have buckets kicked out of them' by teachers are not from Wealthy, powerful or affluent families...  The teachers wouldn't dare.

 

 

 

 

 

BS..another carefully chosen insult. Nice one. You really do have an overinflated ego Richard. If someone dares to disagree with you the insults and patronising taunts appear.

 

Why do you need me to PM you the name? Go back to this story and you'll see which one I'm talking about. There's always the possibility that you don't know every school in Thailand isn't there? In this case you clearly don't.

 

I call BS on that statement...   The richest, most affluent schools in the country...   and then you exclude 'actual rich and affluent schools' (Int'l schools) and restrict to Thai Government schools...  OK, we'll go with that.

 

International schools were not excluded, you added them to the mix which never had those as the focal point. The debate was rich v poor THAI schools, therefore international schools are irrelevant. That's my point.

 

Quote me where I said THAI GOVERNMENT SCHOOLS. As a rule, rich Thais don't go to government schools and the ones I have referred to are the high-end Thai schools NOT government. I am not referring to government schools.

 

Are you saying that it only occurs in Thai government schools? That's the crux here. ONLY GOVERNMENT schools?

 

Wealthy, Powerful, Affluent families will not tolerate their children 'having buckets kicked out of them' by any teacher....  in any school...   particularly as a matter of policy... (which is also against the law).

 

All? Is that not yet another huge generalisation? The school I'm referring to is full of the like, corporal punishment happens on a daily basis and it's not a government school. It's a very expensive, highly regarded institute that has a massive reputation here. 

 

No, you haven't stated it... you are refusing to state it...    PM me the school - we may find that its not quite as 'affluent' as you are making out and the students who 'have buckets kicked out of them' by teachers are not from Wealthy, powerful or affluent families...  The teachers wouldn't dare

 

I am not refusing, I'm simply not publicly naming a Thai institute that could easily take offense at being named in a public forum. That'd be stupid but then again, ridiculous, naive, bs...so I may as well... right Richard?

 

How would you know the wealth and status of nearly 5000 kids? Who are you to act as judge and jury just because you have a different opinion? 

 

The teachers don't dare? I've stated that I witnessed this behaviour on a daily basis for nearly a decade. As you've now said I'm a BS'er I'm interested to hear you say I'm lying therefore.

 

My view is based on the experience I had from being around a high-end, private, Thai school where hitting kids and humiliation was a frequent occurrence. It wasn't a government school. It was very expensive and full of wealthy Thai children from affluent families. There would be no way in the world that the families had no knowledge of this. It happened. 

 

If you have the gravitas to proceed with respect, rather than continue to hurl abuse, maybe agree to disagree. 

 

I stand by my argument that it's not only Thai government schools that hit kids. It happens in those with rich families also. If you disagree, fair enough. Leave it at that.

[save the frogs]

11 hours ago, Barnet1900 said:

I am not refusing, I'm simply not publicly naming a Thai institute that could easily take offense at being named in a public forum. That'd be stupid but then again, ridiculous, naive, bs...so I may as well... right Richard?

 

Probably best not to name the school on any online platform to avoid problems. 

 

[richard_smith237]

9 minutes ago, Barnet1900 said:

BS..another carefully chosen insult. Nice one. You really do have an overinflated ego Richard. If someone dares to disagree with you the insults and patronising taunts appear.

 

Chill out on the snowflakery...   

 

9 minutes ago, Barnet1900 said:

Why do you need me to PM you the name? Go back to this story and you'll see which one I'm talking about. There's always the possibility that you don't know every school in Thailand isn't there? In this case you clearly don't.

 

I thought it was all affluent schools... So its one and you wont name it or PM it.

 

 

9 minutes ago, Barnet1900 said:

I call BS on that statement...   The richest, most affluent schools in the country...   and then you exclude 'actual rich and affluent schools' (Int'l schools) and restrict to Thai Government schools...  OK, we'll go with that.

 

International schools were not excluded, you added them to the mix which never had those as the focal point. The debate was rich v poor THAI schools, therefore international schools are irrelevant. That's my point.

 

Quote me where I said THAI GOVERNMENT SCHOOLS. As a rule, rich Thais don't go to government schools and the ones I have referred to are the high-end Thai schools NOT government. I am not referring to government schools.

 

Name one - you've been asked my multiple people - you are making general claims...  now its high end Thai schools where the kids are getting the 'bucket kicked out of them by the teachers as a matter of policy and with full knowledge of the parents'...  OK - got it...   (more BS).

 

 

 

9 minutes ago, Barnet1900 said:

 

Are you saying that it only occurs in Thai government schools? That's the crux here. ONLY GOVERNMENT schools?

 

Wealthy, Powerful, Affluent families will not tolerate their children 'having buckets kicked out of them' by any teacher....  in any school...   particularly as a matter of policy... (which is also against the law).

 

All? Is that not yet another huge generalisation? The school I'm referring to is full of the like, corporal punishment happens on a daily basis and it's not a government school. It's a very expensive, highly regarded institute that has a massive reputation here. 

 

Name it...  (PM)...  If you mean Ruamrudee School  (its an international school) that used to be one of the best and most famous and is now out of favour for lack of teaching standards.

 

 

 

9 minutes ago, Barnet1900 said:

 

No, you haven't stated it... you are refusing to state it...    PM me the school - we may find that its not quite as 'affluent' as you are making out and the students who 'have buckets kicked out of them' by teachers are not from Wealthy, powerful or affluent families...  The teachers wouldn't dare

 

I am not refusing, I'm simply not publicly naming a Thai institute that could easily take offense at being named in a public forum. That'd be stupid but then again, ridiculous, naive, bs...so I may as well... right Richard?

 

PM = Private Message...   how hard is it to simply back up your claims... 

 

PM me this 'highlighy affluent school where the wealthiest Thai's send their children with the knowledge they'll be beaten by the teachers as a matter of policy"... 

 

9 minutes ago, Barnet1900 said:

How would you know the wealth and status of nearly 5000 kids? Who are you to act as judge and jury just because you have a different opinion? 

 

Its a small network...    of course, I don't know where they 'all go'...    I know where 'most go'...    its the international schools I named in Bangkok or overseas boarding schools. 

 

9 minutes ago, Barnet1900 said:

The teachers don't dare? I've stated that I witnessed this behaviour on a daily basis for nearly a decade. As you've now said I'm a BS'er I'm interested to hear you say I'm lying therefore.

 

Name the school... PM me.

 

 

9 minutes ago, Barnet1900 said:

My view is based on the experience I had from being around a high-end, private, Thai school where hitting kids and humiliation was a frequent occurrence. It wasn't a government school. It was very expensive and full of wealthy Thai children from affluent families. There would be no way in the world that the families had no knowledge of this. It happened. 

 

You and I might have a very different idea of 'high end'...    The PM doesn't send her kids to the school you worked at, neither do the owners of the major Mall Groups etc...  Housing estate companies and major businesses players, known businesses....    because they send their kids to Harrow, Patana, Shrewbury, NIST, ISB, Prep...  or overseas boarding.

 

 

9 minutes ago, Barnet1900 said:

If you have the gravitas to proceed with respect, rather than continue to hurl abuse, maybe agree to disagree. 

 

You don't even have the 'gravitas' (laughable) to back up your comments with a simple PM - sorry, private message (not sure you know what PM means after so many requests).

 

9 minutes ago, Barnet1900 said:

I stand by my argument that it's not only Thai government schools that hit kids. It happens in those with rich families also. If you disagree, fair enough. Leave it at that.

 

A narrowed down statement...      Which is it now...  Thai Government Schools or is it 'not' a government school (as higlighted in bold above - you are contradicting yourself now).

 

This is easily ironed out by naming the school...    or, if you don't wish to name the school, PM it, or just name a location.

[richard_smith237]

1 minute ago, save the frogs said:

 

Probably best not to name the school on any online platform to avoid problems. 

 

 

He could name the area...  i.e. A well known School near Soi 6 Ramhamhaeng...   

 

But.. he's put his neck on the line by claiming Wealthy Thai's are knowingly accepting that teachers are kicking buckets out of their kids as a matter of school policy... 

 

He's claimed this happens in the Most Affluent Schools in Thailand (but not in Interntionationl Schools), Military Schools are omitted as this is not part of the discussion..   then he can be quoted as stating below: not a Government School, and then stating a Thai Schools....

 

28 minutes ago, Barnet1900 said:

The school I'm referring to is full of the like, corporal punishment happens on a daily basis and it's not a government school. It's a very expensive, highly regarded institute that has a massive reputation here. 

 

[save the frogs]

11 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

He's claimed this happens in the Most Affluent Schools in Thailand (but not in Interntionationl Schools), Military Schools are omitted as this is not part of the discussion..   then he can be quoted as stating below: not a Government School, and then stating a Thai Schools....

 

This is turning into a bit of a riddle. What's NOT a government school, NOT an international school, but a school for affluent kids? 

Let us know if he PMs you the name and then look into it and get back to us. 

 

[richard_smith237]

4 hours ago, Barnet1900 said:

Some do but many still see the top Thai names as a means of securing a path towards Jula, Mahidol, and other leading Thai universities. Alternatively they see the networking route the schools offer as a means of securing the child's future. Some Thai families take their children out of international schools around year 5 or 6 and educate them in a Thai school in order to improve their Thai language and ensure they are prepared for universities here. 

 

Mostly out of date - With the exception of Dentistry, Medicine, Music...

 

However, with those pursuing dentistry and medicine, its now very common to study overseas and then complete the 1 year access courses (MCQ, OSCE)....

 

Music - usually, students may aim to switch to Mahidol. 

 

 

The vast Majority if Thai's who can afford it (you used the term affluent) send their kids to overseas universities... 

The networking now takes on 'alternative means'...  i.e. Secondary education ages...   and Uni's popularised by Thai students... (i.e.  Oxbridge, LSE, UCL,  & Ivy Leagues: Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Columbia...Stanford & MIT, University of California, Berkeley / UCLA / USC...   And also Melbourne to some extent)...

... but Primarily: LSE, Oxford, Cambridge, Harvard, Stanford, USC....

 

 

Your information is just out of date, thats all - you may now be out of a loop that has since evolved significantly over the past 20 years... 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[richard_smith237]

21 minutes ago, save the frogs said:

 

This is turning into a bit of a riddle. What's NOT a government school, NOT an international school, but a school for affluent kids? 

Let us know if he PMs you the name and then look into it and get back to us. 

 

 

I'm genuinely interested...   As if this place is as 'good as he says it is' then I have close friends who's children attend...   

... but I just can't see it.

 

I think he (barnet) may be referring to Sarasas Witaed Ratchaphruek School where in 2020 a teacher was filmed hitting a child and placing a bag over their head...   But, thats a mid-tier Thai (and bilingual) school, hardly anything close to 'affluent' etc.. .

 

The information presented is accurate for pre-2000's....     I know lots of people who went to the high end Government Schools such as Triam etc...     they are not sending their children to the same schools - every single Wealthy, Affluent, Connected etc yadda yadda yadda Thai person I know is getting their kids into the International Schools... 

... There maybe some overlap of those who send their kids to Ruamrudee and St Gabriel's and such schools.... but those parents are less informed...  those schools are far from 'high end' these days...  (from both the perspective of quality and reputation)... 

 

 

[FritsSikkink]

24 minutes ago, save the frogs said:

 

This is turning into a bit of a riddle. What's NOT a government school, NOT an international school, but a school for affluent kids? 

Let us know if he PMs you the name and then look into it and get back to us. 

 

There are private Thai schools which have entry exams to get the best students available.

[save the frogs]

20 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

placing a bag over their head... 

and this is one strong argument for banning it completely.

teachers can go way too far and abuse this power. 

 

[fredwiggy]

17 hours ago, Hummin said:

Wasn't this normal on the more privileged schools in Uk, Switzerland, Usa as well or rather say especially at the catholic schools? 

 

 

 

17 hours ago, Hummin said:

Wasn't this normal on the more privileged schools in Uk, Switzerland, Usa as well or rather say especially at the catholic schools? 

 

 

I went to Catholic school for 8 years, and the nuns could hit you if you misbehaved. In first grade, I swore at another kid and the principal took me to the bathroom and washed my mouth out with soap. Never forget the taste.

 

In fifth through eighth grade in another school, they would use rulers and smack you on the hands.

 

When a friend didn't cut his hair to a decent length, they took him to the bathroom and butcher cut it short.

 

When I was at the blackboard doing a question, and I was goofing around, the lay teacher grabbed me by my hair and banged my head against the blackboard and dust came out, much to the amusement of fellow classmates.

 

This was all light abuse but not like they get here, using sticks and metal rulers, and hitting. This wouldn't be tolerated back home. 

[fredwiggy]

13 hours ago, Magictoad said:

You use the emotive word "assault" 

But physical discipline was part of ALL EUROPEAN SCHOOLS until the 80s. That's when they cancelled it in the UK. Since then we have seen a steady increase in attacks on the elderly, stabbings, anti social behaviour & public transport has become unusable due to violent behaviour of young people who have never  learned to behave.

My views are clear. Bring back corporal punishment in the UK. It is not assault.  It is discipline.

Teaching the children they can control others by hitting them ends up as them using it in their adult lives, and against girlfriends and wives, and eventually their own children. Taking away privileges and explaining how others feel being bullied and learning those in charge are there for a reason gets through to most children. Discipline doesn't have to be physical, and self esteem doesn't take a hit by explaining bad behavior. Hitting is assault, and when a parent or teacher does it, children think it's okay to hit.Bullies are made at home, by parents who abuse and hit their children, and those bullies take their anger out of smaller peers. 

[fredwiggy]

10 hours ago, Barnet1900 said:

BS..another carefully chosen insult. Nice one. You really do have an overinflated ego Richard. If someone dares to disagree with you the insults and patronising taunts appear.

 

Why do you need me to PM you the name? Go back to this story and you'll see which one I'm talking about. There's always the possibility that you don't know every school in Thailand isn't there? In this case you clearly don't.

 

I call BS on that statement...   The richest, most affluent schools in the country...   and then you exclude 'actual rich and affluent schools' (Int'l schools) and restrict to Thai Government schools...  OK, we'll go with that.

 

International schools were not excluded, you added them to the mix which never had those as the focal point. The debate was rich v poor THAI schools, therefore international schools are irrelevant. That's my point.

 

Quote me where I said THAI GOVERNMENT SCHOOLS. As a rule, rich Thais don't go to government schools and the ones I have referred to are the high-end Thai schools NOT government. I am not referring to government schools.

 

Are you saying that it only occurs in Thai government schools? That's the crux here. ONLY GOVERNMENT schools?

 

Wealthy, Powerful, Affluent families will not tolerate their children 'having buckets kicked out of them' by any teacher....  in any school...   particularly as a matter of policy... (which is also against the law).

 

All? Is that not yet another huge generalisation? The school I'm referring to is full of the like, corporal punishment happens on a daily basis and it's not a government school. It's a very expensive, highly regarded institute that has a massive reputation here. 

 

No, you haven't stated it... you are refusing to state it...    PM me the school - we may find that its not quite as 'affluent' as you are making out and the students who 'have buckets kicked out of them' by teachers are not from Wealthy, powerful or affluent families...  The teachers wouldn't dare

 

I am not refusing, I'm simply not publicly naming a Thai institute that could easily take offense at being named in a public forum. That'd be stupid but then again, ridiculous, naive, bs...so I may as well... right Richard?

 

How would you know the wealth and status of nearly 5000 kids? Who are you to act as judge and jury just because you have a different opinion? 

 

The teachers don't dare? I've stated that I witnessed this behaviour on a daily basis for nearly a decade. As you've now said I'm a BS'er I'm interested to hear you say I'm lying therefore.

 

My view is based on the experience I had from being around a high-end, private, Thai school where hitting kids and humiliation was a frequent occurrence. It wasn't a government school. It was very expensive and full of wealthy Thai children from affluent families. There would be no way in the world that the families had no knowledge of this. It happened. 

 

If you have the gravitas to proceed with respect, rather than continue to hurl abuse, maybe agree to disagree. 

 

I stand by my argument that it's not only Thai government schools that hit kids. It happens in those with rich families also. If you disagree, fair enough. Leave it at that.

Just a short note. Wealthy parents also abuse their children, and neglect them also, letting others do the dirty work while they're out working. They are also ones who allow the teachers to be baby sitters, and let them hit their children if they get out of line..........https://lifelessons.co.uk/resource/affluent-neglect/.

[Hummin]

10 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

 

I went to Catholic school for 8 years, and the nuns could hit you if you misbehaved. In first grade, I swore at another kid and the principal took me to the bathroom and washed my mouth out with soap. Never forget the taste.

 

In fifth through eighth grade in another school, they would use rulers and smack you on the hands.

 

When a friend didn't cut his hair to a decent length, they took him to the bathroom and butcher cut it short.

 

When I was at the blackboard doing a question, and I was goofing around, the lay teacher grabbed me by my hair and banged my head against the blackboard and dust came out, much to the amusement of fellow classmates.

 

This was all light abuse but not like they get here, using sticks and metal rulers, and hitting. This wouldn't be tolerated back home. 

My experience, if a teacher first start beating one as an example, this kid will be the one who always takes the beating and the one also who falls out with the class, and being bullied. 

 

Therefor I felt I had to do something gmfor the adoptive daughter. And it actually helped, without being angry and make them lose face. 

 

Her life improved, and happy to see she max out her potential and become more social, as well dare to speak in public. 

 

Even soft correction or abuse can be damaging for life. 

 

My father beating didn't help, I constantly pushed my and his limits, became smarter, more rebellious, and also learned to fight. Though on outside, but actually with very low self esteem, even I did good at sports. 

 

I healed by the years, and as said before, the day I managed to forgive, I completely understood, he was a product of his time, and he only transferred his insecurity to me and my siblings because he didnt know better. 

 

I agree, some kids today, lacking dicipline, but thats not because beating become illegal, it is lack of healthy role models. 

[fredwiggy]

21 hours ago, Andrew Banks said:

I didn’t realize in just joining this group just how many bigots are members. It’s not the Thailand I recognize and my wife is from Isaan and we have two young kids.

 

I have been to Thailand more than 50 times over 40 years and have never seen or heard this and to stereotype Thailand and Thais in this way is racist pure and simple.

 

smacking children in legal in most western countries and I sometimes smacked my kids when they were young. Don’t make out that Thailand is a hostile environment for children it could not be further from the truth.

 

some of the stereotypes of Thais in these messages are shocking.

 

i am about to retire to Thailand and it will be a better environment than the UK.for my kids.

 

shocking series of comments from ugly bigots who should be ashamed

 

21 hours ago, Andrew Banks said:

I didn’t realize in just joining this group just how many bigots are members. It’s not the Thailand I recognize and my wife is from Isaan and we have two young kids.

 

I have been to Thailand more than 50 times over 40 years and have never seen or heard this and to stereotype Thailand and Thais in this way is racist pure and simple.

 

smacking children in legal in most western countries and I sometimes smacked my kids when they were young. Don’t make out that Thailand is a hostile environment for children it could not be further from the truth.

 

some of the stereotypes of Thais in these messages are shocking.

 

i am about to retire to Thailand and it will be a better environment than the UK.for my kids.

 

shocking series of comments from ugly bigots who should be ashamed

It's not just bigots who notice things happening here. It happens. Yes, it happens in other countries but it isn't tolerated like it is here. It's against the law here and it still happens.

 

Schools here, besides a few international schools, pale by comparison to those in the west. I've seen it firsthand children being hit by sticks by teachers, and also parents. Many women carry sticks with them in public places, clinics, shops etc, to keep their children in line.

 

Old school thinking takes a long time to go away.

 

Schools in the west also do not pass failing students.

 

Schools in the west don't allow students to ride on the top of buses unprotected and also to drive to school on scooters under aged and without helmets.

 

Girls here , as much as 70%, are molested, in schools, before they are 18. In the US it's 12% at most.

 

Many people here say things just as they are because of personal experience. You can visit many times and stay in a village and never see 99% of what happens here, and some live here for many years and still don't see but a fraction of what goes on here. This is not a better environment for children and especially girls.

[richard_smith237]

5 hours ago, save the frogs said:

14 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

placing a bag over their head... 

and this is one strong argument for banning it completely.

teachers can go way too far and abuse this power. 

 

Corporal punishment is officially prohibited in Thai schools under the Ministry of Education Regulation on Student Punishment, enacted in 2005.

 

Of course - still happens - especially among underprivileged children whose parents lack the socio-economic power to challenge or resist it and the directors of the schools attempt to 'brush the issues under the carpet' until social media gets hold of the issue.

 

 

... And according to one poster [Some of the richest, most affluent schools in the country kick buckets out of kids and with the parent's blessing in advance.]....  first hand experience apparently... of a very well known 'Top Private Thai School'... 

.....   This Poster has managed to PM me, but still not with the name of the school - but 'wants to meet up'  because I called out his comments that this happens to children of wealthy and connected parents as BS and he think's I've abused him !!!!

....  Hardly quality teacher material if he can't even hold his patience on an anonymous web-forum and has to resort to thinly veiled threats.... 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Hummin]

9 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Corporal punishment is officially prohibited in Thai schools under the Ministry of Education Regulation on Student Punishment, enacted in 2005.

 

Of course - still happens - especially among underprivileged children whose parents lack the socio-economic power to challenge or resist it and the directors of the schools attempt to 'brush the issues under the carpet' until social media gets hold of the issue.

 

 

... And according to one poster [Some of the richest, most affluent schools in the country kick buckets out of kids and with the parent's blessing in advance.]....  first hand experience apparently... of a very well known 'Top Private Thai School'... 

.....   This Poster has managed to PM me, but still not with the name of the school - but 'wants to meet up'  because I called out his comments that this happens to children of wealthy and connected parents as BS and he think's I've abused him !!!!

....  Hardly quality teacher material if he can't even hold his patience on an anonymous web-forum and has to resort to thinly veiled threats.... 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

For sure many weirdo’s At this forum, and doesn’t surprise

 

 

[richard_smith237]

16 minutes ago, Hummin said:

For sure many weirdo’s At this forum, and doesn’t surprise

 

3x PM's so far with thinly veiled threats - thats the mentality of someone who's 'made a claim' they are refusing to back up... 

 

I will still stand by my comments that connected, wealthy, affluent Thai's will not sit back while buckets are kicked out of their children by teachers, nether will they 'give the school their blessing' to do so....

 

 

As news reports suggest: These issues are restricted to the poorer and more underprivileged schools where children's parents lack the socio-economic power to challenge or resist such actions.

 

Barent claims that the 'richest, most affluent schools in the country kick buckets out of kids and with the parent's blessing in advance' are able to brush this news under the carpet which is why we don't hear of such news from these "Top Thai Private Schools"...   

 

I think his comments may have been correct 20+ years ago - but his comments are based in the past - Social Media moves way too fast for these things to be brushed aside.

 

[save the frogs]

11 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

3x PM's so far with thinly veiled threats - thats the mentality of someone who's 'made a claim' they are refusing to back up... 

why would someone put so much effort to make it up?

 

a grudge against the ministry of education? 

 

[richard_smith237]

16 minutes ago, save the frogs said:

20 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

3x PM's so far with thinly veiled threats - thats the mentality of someone who's 'made a claim' they are refusing to back up... 

why would someone put so much effort to make it up?

 

a grudge against the ministry of education? 

 

 

I don't believe he made it up...     he may have seen a few kids get 'smacked' at a school he's worked at years ago...  and then projected of load of rubbish about 'richest and most affluent schools etc' from there and has since trapped himself doubling down on his BS.

 

 

He's certainly going to a lot of effort not to name the school and instead messaging me to "meet up face to face for an a mysterious off-camera tête-à-tête"  because he feels abused....