Tons Of Farang In Thailand Are In Trouble

[bangkoksingapore]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap_travel/passports_child_support

WASHINGTON - The price of a passport: $311,491 in back child support payments for a U.S. businessman now living in China; $46,000 for a musician seeking to perform overseas, and $45,849 for a man planning a Dominican Republic vacation. The new passport requirements that have complicated travel this summer also have uncovered untold numbers of child support scofflaws and forced them to pay millions. The State Department denies passports to noncustodial parents who owe more than $2,500 in child support. Once the parents make good on their debts, they can reapply for passports.

Now that millions of additional travelers need passports to fly back from Mexico, Canada, the Caribbean and South America, collections under the Passport Denial Program are on pace to about double this year, federal officials told The Associated Press.

In all, states have reported collecting at least $22.5 million through the program thus far in 2007. The money is then forwarded to the parent to whom it is owed.

Some people never learn.

A boxer paid $39,000 in back child support to the state of Nevada last year to get a passport, which he lost. This year, his promoter had to loan him $8,930 so he could pay off his new child support debts and get a new passport to fight overseas.

In one case last year, a man got his parents to pay his overdue child support — $50,498 to the state of Illinois.

"For us, it's been amazing to see how people who owe back child support seem to be able to come up with good chunks of money when it involves needing their passport," said Adolfo Capestany, spokesman for the state of Washington's Division of Child Support. "Folks will do anything to get that passport, so it is a good collection tool."

The $22.5 million reported to have been collected through the program this year is a conservative estimate. Some states voluntarily report the payments to the federal Office of Child Support Enforcement, but other states don't.

It took all of 2006 to collect the same amount under the program, which began in 1998.

Also contributing to the increased collections was a drop in the threshold for reporting child support debts to the State Department, from $5,000 to $2,500. As a result, 400,000 more cases were submitted to the department.

The state of Washington obtained $24,000 for Teresa Markley through the program. The money accrued over a couple of decades. She said she could have really used the money in past years, and at one point in the 1990s went on welfare for a few months to make ends meet. While her children are now grown, she said the payment still meant a great deal to her.

"What it means to me now is just to have some validation for the suffering I went through," said Markley, a resident of Tacoma, Wash.

Jeannette Dean of Seattle said she had to tap into her retirement savings and her son's savings bond to help pay for basic necessities after Washington state was unable to help her collect delinquent child support payments.

But this year, she received about $36,000 through the passport program. She said the money will be used to replenish the lost savings.

"It has given back to having a normal life versus struggling to pay dental bills and hospitals bills and things like that," Dean said.

The passport denial program is just one of several tools the government has to collect overdue child support. Overall collections totaled about $24 billion last year.

The largest share by far — $20.1 billion — came from withholding from a worker's paycheck. Unemployment insurance or state and federal income tax refunds can also be seized. States with lotteries also can deduct delinquent payments from winnings. Some states submit the names of those behind on their payments to credit reporting agencies.

Payments generated through the new passport requirements are an important sliver of what states collect each year on behalf of about 17 million children, said Margot Bean, commissioner for the federal Office of Child Support Enforcement.

"We often get payments of over $100,000," Bean said. "For whatever reason, this was the only way we could get the money."

For some families, the payments can mean the difference between having to rely on the government for assistance or not relying on it, Bean said. In cases where families have needed cash assistance through the Temporary Assistance for Needy Families Program, a portion of the payments received through the passport program is used to reimburse the government.

Another jump in collections from the Passport Denial Program can be expected next year or in early 2009. That's when the new passport requirements will likely take effect for land and sea travelers too.

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Looks the feminists have gained complete control of the USA government afterall. You hate to see this hit so many guys who ended up in bad marriages and were ruined by their wifes. Its amazing how much power the women have in the USA.

How many farang will have to leave thailand? This could wipe out 50% of the farang expat population.

How does this affect the job market and the real estate market. For investors, how are you planning to take advantage of this?

[markah]

How many farang will have to leave thailand? This could wipe out 50% of the farang expat population.

I think many farang could be in trouble, but I am sure it will be nowhere like 50%.

[garro]

Do those from the US account for 50% of farang in Thailand?

I doubt it.

[Jimjim]

What a load of <deleted>. Americans are a small chunk of expats in Thailand. Also, you wrongly and stupidly assume that all male Americans overseas must be late on their child support payments. You also wrongly assume that women ruined these delinquent men's lives, when it could very well have been the other way around.

Edited August 22, 2007 by Jimjim

[taxexile]

This could wipe out 50% of the farang expat population

i would be very surprised if as many as 50% of the farangs living in thailand are owing child support through the us court system.

and i am all for those that do owe child support payments being forced to confront their irresponsibilities and pay up. this passport denial law sounds like a good measure.

its got nothing to do with divorce settlements or the emasculation of the american male by cropped headed dungaree wearing women.

thats another topic altogether.

[November Rain]

Looks the feminists have gained complete control of the USA government afterall. You hate to see this hit so many guys who ended up in bad marriages and were ruined by their wifes. Its amazing how much power the women have in the USA.

Eerrrmm, this is about a non-custodial parent, of either sex, having to pay up for their children, before getting a passport. How does feminism come into it? And why should we pity parents who try to walk from their responsibilities to their children? AFAIK, courts decide the amount of child support to be paid, not ex-spouses.

[danmarnj]

And how is this bad news?

Why should the american taxpayer support deadbeat parents who dont support their kids? This goes for both deadbeat moms as well as dads.

The deadbeat parents will also not have their driver's license renewed and any income tax refund will be garnished also.

[Aujuba]

Don't have babies and you will be fine. Thailand could connect something like this to offering visas to foreigners. I bet a lot of countries will get ideas from this. If the guy's have enough money to pay tens of thousands of dollars to get a passport they should have been paying already. In the end though I bet that there is an issue of freedom here. Consider a guy who doesn't have that much. He could probably agree to pay a much lesser amount. You can't force someone to work in the US to pay, can you?

[cdnvic]

This is great news

Don't think much of the guys who have abandoned their parental duties to come play in Thailand. Think even less of the ones who are being deadbeats on top of that.

Good on the US for introducing a regulation that makes sense.

Lets hope more countries follow.

[cdnvic]

Looks the feminists have gained complete control of the USA government afterall.

Yeah... all 13% of them that make up the US Senate.

[Jing-jo]

this is brilliant

every country should adopt it

don't f##k if you can't pay the buck

unlike some who leave the country to avoid paying for their kids

I am leaving the UK so I DON'T end up paying for every one else's kids and all the EU and everywhere else Human imports

[tropo]

How many farang will have to leave thailand? This could wipe out 50% of the farang expat population.

Why would they leave Thailand? If they can't afford their back support payments, and can't renew their passports how can they leave? All this would do is force them to overstay and live as fugitives.

I would suspect that a large percentage of people owing very large amounts such as the examples in the article you posted would not be able to afford to pay what they owe.

Edited August 22, 2007 by tropo

[Naam]

This could wipe out 50% of the farang expat population

some people just don't realize that too much C2H4OH is not a good basis for posting in TV-Forum.

[Scott]

Unfortunately, laws such as this also affect the people who need the passport in order to work out of the country to make money. One of the big difficulties is the $2,500 limit, which is really too low. At around $5,000 is about right. The reason is that in the bureaucracy, it takes too long (sometimes) to get your name cleared and if you work--especially overseas, this can have an adverse affect.

Although this law doesn't affect me at all, I do know people who have been in arears because of the delays in transfering money etc., especially people who are newly establishing themselves overseas or who work in/near conflict zones and have to rely on the headquarters to make deposits.

Examples of people who can be affected are oil workers, seamen and contractual employees.

Don't think it will have a real big affect on Thailand though.

[cdnvic]

Although this law doesn't affect me at all, I do know people who have been in arears because of the delays in transfering money etc., especially people who are newly establishing themselves overseas or who work in/near conflict zones and have to rely on the headquarters to make deposits.

If someone wasn't covering for them then what would their kids eat? Should they not have planned ahead for these things? These are kids, not a car payment.

[PeaceBlondie]

I don't see much sympathy on ThaiVisa or elsewhere for all those many thousands of deadbeat dads. Or for those 29 deadbeat moms, either. I delayed retirement and going abroad to live, until I had either paid child support for 15 years, or raised the kids (up to four at a time) single handedly while working full time. I willingly agreed to pay $1,200 per month in child support when my take home pay was less than $1,900 per month.

Supporting your children should not be an issue that can be debated by saying, "But my ex wife was a beeeetch." You support your kids or else you are a dead beat. Real men support their kids.

[Heng]

Can I get h3ll yeah?

Well said, PB.

[November Rain]

Real men support their kids.

Quote of the month in my humble opinion!

[canadiangirl]

Real men support their kids.

Well said, PB.

[britmaveric]

Well done yanks!!! Want your passport - cough up the dosh. It's a sad day when govt has to do smth to force payment rather it being given freely as a parent.

[0Mix1up]

Generalizing on this subject is a dangerous as any.

You'd have to walk in millions of shoes to know all the ins and outs of

child care responsibilities, not just your own situation or that of a few friends.

[a2396]

Tons of Farangs? Where do you get this statistically accurate number? This only applies to Americans, specifically to those Americans who are applying for a new passport or, I suppose a renewal. If they have no passport, they are not in Thailand. American passports are good for 10 years, so I don't think there would be a deluge of renewals in any one year, probably a trickle of those Farangs in Thailand. If the feminists wanted to really get serious, they could have a microchip put in every passport that would track peoples location & contain other usefull data. Unfortunately, these control freak's have been in charge of the U.S. government for some time now. They are "overkill" on some issues and asleep on others, such as illegal immigration and protecting American jobs.

[mikeyj]

I don't see much sympathy on ThaiVisa or elsewhere for all those many thousands of deadbeat dads. Or for those 29 deadbeat moms, either. I delayed retirement and going abroad to live, until I had either paid child support for 15 years, or raised the kids (up to four at a time) single handedly while working full time. I willingly agreed to pay $1,200 per month in child support when my take home pay was less than $1,900 per month.

Supporting your children should not be an issue that can be debated by saying, "But my ex wife was a beeeetch." You support your kids or else you are a dead beat. Real men support their kids.

I agree 100%, I would give my son the shirt off my back!

[Aujuba]

If the US gov't is starting to act on the problems facing the country well that's a good thing. I would like to see smaller families and all the unplanned pregnancies avoided. Don't be a beadbeat- double bag it! It's cool to be single. Who needs kids. The world is overcrowded.

In my mind taking care of your kids is number one. I can't imagine how someone couldn't. I guess it comes from family. I hate to say it but I bet that a lot of the deadbeats were neglected as kids themselves. Then there are also the people in this world who are full of hatred and can't move on. They'll do anything to avoid doing anything which might indirectly help their ex-spouse. The bottom line is you had the babies you need to give them a chance in life. If you can't give them love at least give them money.

[farangene]

I saw a Thai girl's T-shirt yesterday that said:

IF YOU CAN'T FEED 'EM

DON'T BREED 'EM

[Aujuba]

Nice one. How about 150,000,000 of those sent over to the US.

[GuestHouse]

I hear the British government is looking at similar changes to British Law and interestingly also considering extending the application to cover the two very common sides of this equation: Parents who do not pay child maintenance and parents who refuse the other parent child access rights.

While we can dispute the numbers (no matter what unit we use Tons/Thousands/Dozens) there are indeed many fathers in Thailand who have escaped paying child maintenance back home – Just as there are more than a few mothers who have brought children over to Thailand, denying them access to their fathers (secure in the knowledge that the courts back home will guarantee their income).

I like balanced laws.

[mellow1]

Same laws should be applied worldwide.This is by far not only a US problem.Quite common here in Thailand,from what I see.Also,there should be a way to check that the money IS actually spend on the children.I've seen many a single mom using it for everything but for the children.This is a reality no one wants to face.

[PeaceBlondie]

Agreed, that some irresponsible mothers do not use the child support money properly. My child support got to the point it was supporting three to five other people, so I asked my ex wife to give the twin girls to me so I could support them myself. Their standard of living improved immediately.

[jbowman1993]

It looks like a TV consensus. The OP has completely lost the plot on this topic.

Taking care of your children is an obligation that you enter into when you have them. Don't like it? Snip snip - worries over.