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Trump Faces Crowd Worries Ahead of July 4 Celebration

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1 hour ago, MIke B Bad said:

Trump?......Plus a recognition of the role the US has played in geopolitics......very much akin to the British when they were running riot and building an empire.

You may be right. Lefties take politics much more personally and transactionally. Their patriotism depends on who is in office, rather than any genuine feeling of love for their country. The same doesn't happen on the right to nearly the same extent. Even when Obama was President, Republicans overwhelmingly were still proud to be American.

1 hour ago, BLMFem said:

Look at the picture on the right. That's also from DC. And when you get a president that's an adjudicated rapist, credibly accused of raping children, who is blatantly enriching himself and his family through insider trading, grift and corruption, who bombs a country killing 170 school girls, who severely disrupts US and world economy, whop threatens allies with an invasion, who's acts and behaviour are so bizarre that the whole world laughs at him, I think a dip in patriotism is understandable. In fact, it's a sign of intelligence and emotional maturity.

I swear you folks must keep a draft of your "Trump Rant" on your PC desktop, ready to copy-and-pasta at the slightest provocation.

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18 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

You may be right. Lefties take politics much more personally and transactionally. Their patriotism depends on who is in office, rather than any genuine feeling of love for their country. The same doesn't happen on the right to nearly the same extent. Even when Obama was President, Republicans overwhelmingly were still proud to be American.

I swear you folks must keep a draft of your "Trump Rant" on your PC desktop, ready to copy-and-pasta at the slightest provocation.

Slightest provocation? You asked and I gave you my honest answer. Strange that you find that to be a negative.

19 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

You may be right. Lefties take politics much more personally and transactionally. Their patriotism depends on who is in office, rather than any genuine feeling of love for their country. The same doesn't happen on the right to nearly the same extent. Even when Obama was President, Republicans overwhelmingly were still proud to be American.

I swear you folks must keep a draft of your "Trump Rant" on your PC desktop, ready to copy-and-pasta at the slightest provocation.

Suuure! For example, Trump and his goons were quite " patriotic" during Biden's mandate! 🤣🤣🤣

Listen to this clown show. A guy stuck his hand into the green sludge in the (non)Reflecting Pool, and he promptly got arrested* and indicted.

So Pirro held a press conference and hilarity ensued. The US is such a sad joke these days with these muppets in charge.😂

*Arrests made in connection to the Epstein files: zero - 0 - nil - nada.

3 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

It is rather pathetic that those on the left cannot simply celebrate the 250 birthday out of a sense of pride and patriotism.

Yet polling clearly shows that Democrats' pride in being American has been slipping for 25 years. And slips even more if a Republican wins the Presidency. At the moment, less that n30% feel proud or very proud to be American.

There is no such effect on Republican voters.

Yep. Patriotism and nationalism have never appealed to me. You're born somewhere, great. It does give you more right to criticise. Pride?!? In what? The long-gone separation of powers, illegal wars, kidnappings, extrajudicial killings, victimisation of immigrants, being run by lobbyists, stacked courts, snuffing abortion doctors, banning womens' rights to their own medical decisions, homelessness, prison population, death by healthcare, air pollution, fracking, climate change and vaccine denial?

But you can get arrested for burning a flag!

54 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

You may be right. Lefties take politics much more personally and transactionally. Their patriotism depends on who is in office, rather than any genuine feeling of love for their country. The same doesn't happen on the right to nearly the same extent. Even when Obama was President, Republicans overwhelmingly were still proud to be American.

I swear you folks must keep a draft of your "Trump Rant" on your PC desktop, ready to copy-and-pasta at the slightest provocation.

"Even when Obama was in office." You mean because he was a Black warmonger rather than the current White one.

Yes, I do love the country of my birth, best expressed in Pete Seeger's song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxiMrvDbq3s

3 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

I didn't mention anything other than the fact that lefties are less patriotic than right wingers, which is a rather undisputed fact.


The burden of proof is yours — you need to prove your claims of fact with evidence from a relevant reputable source. An assertion from a cult member doesn't quite cut it.

3 hours ago, candide said:

Suuure! For example, Trump and his goons were quite " patriotic" during Biden's mandate! 🤣🤣🤣

Actually, according to the polling there was little or no change in the number of Republicans who were proud to be American during the Biden years. You are letting your personal feelings and emotional response to a man you dont like sabotage your thinking skills.

1 hour ago, LosLobo said:


The burden of proof is yours — you need to prove your claims of fact with evidence from a relevant reputable source. An assertion from a cult member doesn't quite cut it.

Gallup polling suggests that I am right;

https://news.gallup.com/poll/711938/american-pride-falls-year-record-low.aspx

From the article;

When combining “extremely proud” and “very proud” responses, 93% of Republicans express high levels of pride, compared with 51% of independents and 27% of Democrats, both record lows for their respective groups.

From the article, during the Obama years GOP respondents who said "very proud" hovered areound 65-70%, Dems were low 50s to 40s.

Biden years? GOP around 60%.

Reading the to and fros here, I do have a question; sort of an adjunct to my post earlier.

If "undisputed facts" prove D.C. is such a rampant pool of treasonous, country-hating, Radical Left Wing Lunatics that scare off the "loyal patriotic" and law-abiding people of the Right, then Why The Fu..Hell did the organisers - whomevere they may be - decide to hold it in DC in the first place?

Even using those "alternative facts" it's still, as I said, a debacle.

35 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

Gallup polling suggests that I am right;

https://news.gallup.com/poll/711938/american-pride-falls-year-record-low.aspx

From the article;

When combining “extremely proud” and “very proud” responses, 93% of Republicans express high levels of pride, compared with 51% of independents and 27% of Democrats, both record lows for their respective groups.

From the article, during the Obama years GOP respondents who said "very proud" hovered areound 65-70%, Dems were low 50s to 40s.

Biden years? GOP around 60%.


Gallup measures pride, not patriotism. Pride is one sentiment; patriotism includes actions, service, and civic responsibility.
Saying Republicans report higher pride doesn’t make it an ‘undisputed fact’ that they’re more patriotic — it just shows a difference in survey responses.
In fact, your supposedly relevant reputable source does not even mention patriotism.

Where's the check he promised me for $1776? Did he forget that part of the celebration?

Trump by helping still Ukraine is causing inflation to hike all over that is destroying even America's economy. As the Ukraines are bombing oil refineries in Russia. This is decreasing global oil supply and thus prices hike. Obvious. It will plainly make the muslim producing countries more powerful. Europe is foolishly also giving large amount of aid to Ukraine that is backfiring. With his mess Trump is all set for the Republicans to loose forthcomming elections in America and global support of the USA is going to dwindle even more.

5 hours ago, MIke B Bad said:

Is that the reflecting pool on the right?

Reflecting the demise of democracy...

48 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

Gallup polling suggests that I am right;

https://news.gallup.com/poll/711938/american-pride-falls-year-record-low.aspx

From the article;

When combining “extremely proud” and “very proud” responses, 93% of Republicans express high levels of pride, compared with 51% of independents and 27% of Democrats, both record lows for their respective groups.

From the article, during the Obama years GOP respondents who said "very proud" hovered areound 65-70%, Dems were low 50s to 40s.

Biden years? GOP around 60%.

I'm glad some Americans aren't falling for BS nationalism. It's a cancer on society. Look at Israel.

4 minutes ago, SingAPorn said:

Trump by helping still Ukraine is causing inflation to hike all over that is destroying even America's economy. As the Ukraines are bombing oil refineries in Russia. This is decreasing global oil supply and thus prices hike. Obvious. It will plainly make the muslim producing countries more powerful. Europe is foolishly also giving large amount of aid to Ukraine that is backfiring. With his mess Trump is all set for the Republicans to loose forthcomming elections in America and global support of the USA is going to dwindle even more.

Time for the rest of the world to tell the US to butt out and go home.

8 minutes ago, LosLobo said:


Gallup measures pride, not patriotism. Pride is one sentiment; patriotism includes actions, service, and civic responsibility.
Saying Republicans report higher pride doesn’t make it an ‘undisputed fact’ that they’re more patriotic — it just shows a difference in survey responses.
In fact, your supposedly relevant reputable source does not even mention patriotism.

Ah, so in your opinion, one can be proud of one's country without being patriotic? Then logically one can be patriotic without being proud to be a citizen.....

Sounds to me like you are doing what the Dutch call "ant fvcking"....the equivalent of splitting hairs to avoid the actual issue.

So then, if you want, what explains the lack of pride in Democrats?

2 minutes ago, unblocktheplanet said:

Time for the rest of the world to tell the US to butt out and go home.

Very true. As it is also time for the rest of the world to have Israel stop it's land grabbing and return the areas they have stolen. It's the only way to stop the fighting amongst all the terror factions and groups involved.

17 minutes ago, LosLobo said:


Gallup measures pride, not patriotism. Pride is one sentiment; patriotism includes actions, service, and civic responsibility.
Saying Republicans report higher pride doesn’t make it an ‘undisputed fact’ that they’re more patriotic — it just shows a difference in survey responses.
In fact, your supposedly relevant reputable source does not even mention patriotism.

If you want to reword the question to patriotism, yougov did a poll on that;

75% of Republicans describe themselves as "very patriotic", compared to less than 30% of Democrats.

https://yougov.com/en-us/articles/55054-half-of-republicans-and-11-of-democrats-define-patriotism-as-supporting-their-country-unconditionally

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6 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

Because Washington DC and the surrounding counties are approximately 95.3% Democrat voting?

But you fail to address the meat of my post, which is that Lib/Democrats are far less patriotic than their Republican cousins, and even less patriotic than independent voters.

Dems are less patriotic? How did you measure that?

Republicans do not seem to know American ideals, such as rule of law, freedom of speech, the press, assembly and belief or not. Trump and Miller want to suspend habeas corpus. That's not patriotic.

By the way, if you're so patriotic, where did you ever serve the nation?

Stick your nonsense where the sun doesn't shine.

I'm not sure Trump is worried. He's going to lie about crowd size anyway, and his goobers will believe him.

He boasted of 45,000 at his opening speech for his Fair-lure, when real estimates had the crowd at less than 1,000. He has State Media Fox claiming massive crowds, when their own cameras show the entire National Mall empty.

Americans will celebrate in their own way, leaving the self-aggrandizing clown out of it.

1 hour ago, SingAPorn said:

Trump by helping still Ukraine is causing inflation to hike all over that is destroying even America's economy. As the Ukraines are bombing oil refineries in Russia. This is decreasing global oil supply and thus prices hike. Obvious. It will plainly make the muslim producing countries more powerful. Europe is foolishly also giving large amount of aid to Ukraine that is backfiring. With his mess Trump is all set for the Republicans to loose forthcomming elections in America and global support of the USA is going to dwindle even more.

Suuure! It's Ukraine's fault, and not the special operation against Iran and the resulting blockade of the Hormuz strait! 🤣🤣🤣

Trump has hijacked the 250th anniversary for his own benefit by turning it into a popularity contest and political rally for himself. If a large crowd turns up he'll be bragging about how only he can attract the bigliest crowds, which is not only off putting for anyone who doesn't support him, but also for independents who only want to celebrate the country's 250th birthday without all the political overtones. The fact that his supporters are getting so worked up against the general lack of support for this is rather telling. They see it as a Trump benefit, rather than a national celebration, and are furious that it's making him look bad, when crowd size for an occasion like this should have nothing to do with whoever is president at the time.

17 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

If you want to reword the question to patriotism, yougov did a poll on that;

75% of Republicans describe themselves as "very patriotic", compared to less than 30% of Democrats.

https://yougov.com/en-us/articles/55054-half-of-republicans-and-11-of-democrats-define-patriotism-as-supporting-their-country-unconditionally

"Everything I did, I did for my country".

Pol Pot, Nate Thayer interview (1997) Far Eastern Economic Review

I've never met a "patriot" that I did not think less of for discovering them to be such a person.

I regard them as unthinking, unevolved, primitives........whatever their "flag".

4 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

1) Ah, so in your opinion, one can be proud of one's country without being patriotic? Then
2) logically one can be patriotic without being proud to be a citizen.....

3) Sounds to me like you are doing what the Dutch call "ant fvcking"....the equivalent of splitting hairs to avoid the actual issue.

4) So then, if you want, what explains the lack of pride in Democrats?


Your rebuttal contains multiple logical fallacies with no supporting reasoning.

1) Straw man — misrepresents my position by implying I claimed the two are completely unrelated.

2) False equivalence / false dichotomy — treats the concepts as either identical or completely separate, ignoring that they can be related without being the same thing.

3) Appeal to ridicule — dismisses my argument by mocking the distinction instead of engaging with it.

4) Red herring / burden shifting — diverts from whether your evidence supports your original claim by shifting the burden to me to explain the survey results.


7 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

Not the same thing. Polling clearly shows that left leaning folks overwhelmingly do NOT feel proud or very proud to be an American. And that this number drops precipitously when a Republican is elected, and also has been dropping overall in the past 25 years.

Any clues as to why?

Maybe because dems actually believe in democracy civility and integrity rather than a party that does everything possible to attempt to block voters from voting and whining rigged everytime they lose an election...but somehow the ones they win are not rigged. Right now repubss control the house senate white house and supreme corurt as well as many states govs and senates...but spend their time whining about how the elections are all rigged? Really? Really? So I guess we should redo all the elections that gave republicans control as obviously republicans are tired of winning rigged elections? got it.

1 hour ago, SingAPorn said:

Trump by helping still Ukraine is causing inflation to hike all over that is destroying even America's economy. As the Ukraines are bombing oil refineries in Russia. This is decreasing global oil supply and thus prices hike. Obvious. It will plainly make the muslim producing countries more powerful. Europe is foolishly also giving large amount of aid to Ukraine that is backfiring. With his mess Trump is all set for the Republicans to loose forthcomming elections in America and global support of the USA is going to dwindle even more.

Inflation rising? Blame Ukraine!🤣

Yet another CNN (trusted source) anti Trump thread on this forum.

MAGA had better enjoy the 250th party buffet while it lasts.

The planting season won’t go well without fertiliser.

President Donald J. Trump Declares an Emergency and Authorizes the Temporary Suspension of Certain Duties on Phosphate Fertilizer from Morocco.

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