Budget Airlines

[intumult]

No problems travelling with a budget airline either in Thailand or Europe so will continue to use them when needed.

[Abrak]

Those still happy to travel with budget airlines should perhaps take a look at this article in todays Bangkok Post. The CEO of Thai AirAsia seems quite frank about the fact that older planes are inherently more dangerous. Commenting on the imminent arrival of a new plane at the airline he says, I quote:

''It goes without saying that by using new aircraft, it implies greater safety and passengers can have better peace of mind,'' Mr Tassapon said.

http://www.bangkokpost.net/Business/26Sep2007_biz53.php

[lazeeboy]

How many planes from the 70's do British Airways, Easyjet and any other carriers in the UK currently use???

Barking up the wrong tree, I think. 30+ year old planes are not being used by any main carriers or low cost carriers as far as I can see, with the possible exception of Air Philippines or Philippines Air (the low cost one). Some planes built more than 20 years ago are still around. Still a minority I would say. Not the average by any stretch of the imagination.

Anyway, if someone fancies a trip on a 5th hand airplane, then Thai AirAsia is the one to go for.

at the prices BA charge they can afford new planes ,if budget airline maintain there old fleet they can be just as safe ..

[asanee]

Here in Europe, most of the well-known LCC's like EZ, Ryan, also the newly sprouted eastern_eur ones like SkyEurope and WIZZ have brand-new planes (either 737 or AB330). In fact most of the older planes are still being used by AMERICAN airlines (both in USA and also South-America). Just see fleet-stats of comps like NorthWest, Delta, the old VARIG, etc.

Most of the older planes used by the LCC's are 2nd/3d etc. hand. its not just the current maintenance, but also that what they got in previous colours (often by airlines that failed later on)

[Brigante7]

Yes I will continue to use budget airlines. I have used PB Air twice and they are great, loads of legroom, that is all I care about, couldn't give a monkey's about the food or service just as long as I have enough legroom. If your time is up then it's up, why worry.

[old wanderer]

Well I will chime in here as an EXPERT....I am a Senior Instructor and QA Manager of Boeing. I have been to Orient Thai airlines for numerous classes (Teaching) over the past several years. It was there MD82 that crashed in Puket. They were operating for 1-2-GO.

I have found in my dealing with them they were very conciences and tried to improve the quality of the fleet.

While some of you bemoan the age of the aircraft....you are speaking from ignorance. They reliablity of a lot of older aircraft rivals the most current. Look at the DC-8 they are used as freighters and surpass 98% reliability....The last one rolled off the assembly line almost 35 years ago, and they just keep preforming. (Ask UPS why they have 50 of them still??, DHL, Airborne, etc.).

Unlike us they aircraft is most effiecent when being operated, it does not 8 hours of sleep each night. It is the takeoff/landing (pressurization cycles) that age the aircraft. Aircraft are inspected and overhauled at regular scheduled intervals, not just when they break like your auto.

The incident in Puket can be attributed to a pilot decision to satisfy customer demand, but due to bad luck, and ablity, it failed.

We will never see a world without airplane accidents, but the trend keeps improving as we learn with each incident.

As someone stated earlier in the thread, if you think maintenance and training are expensive, try having an accident. It impacts your customer base, airline confidence, and insurance rates, plus a lot more surveleance from the National Aviation Authorities.

In several emails I have had with what have become friends at Orient Thai Airlines they are truly distraut by what has happened. It will hamper thier future growth plans I am sure.

Edited October 3, 2007 by old wanderer

[onzestan]

I believe it's not only a question of would I? but also how important comfort is to the individual traveller.

It is my understanding that elderly passengers are much more interested in making a trip as pleasant as possible, i.e.

flying a reputed company to avoid as many hassles as possible, not to mention flying business or 1st class.

For younger people the price is more important and sitting for 2-3 hours in cramped conditions is not such a big deal as for elderly.

I like my creature comforts and therefore I do not fly budget but can understand that for others the price is the deciding factor.

cheers

onzestan

[cdnvic]

The incident in Puket can be attributed to a pilot decision to satisfy customer demand, but due to bad luck, and ablity, it failed.

In all fairness to the pilot, we don't know exactly what happened yet.

[ClaytonSeymour]

Yes I will continue to use budget airlines. I have used PB Air twice and they are great, loads of legroom, that is all I care about, couldn't give a monkey's about the food or service just as long as I have enough legroom. If your time is up then it's up, why worry.

Strictly speaking PB Air does not fall into the category of a budget airline/low cost carrier.

[david96]

I tried to look up a seat on Jetstar for the Cairns to Singapore leg.

The el cheapo seat "sold out" normal economy class AUD836 on the airline website booking.

Whether the el cheapo seat ever existed in the first place is an interesting point or if it was a "promotional flight" available for only a limited time eg from 2200 to 2300 hrs twice a week we will never know. Jetstar is only a budget airline when it suits them for business reasons.

Check their conditions of carriage carefully, there is a link on their website.

Remember you get what you pay for.

[ace]

Used Air Asia about three years ago from Bangkok to Kuala Lumpur and felt very uneasy that their plane was so old. I'm pleased to note that they have newer aircraft, but I think I've been put off.

I have used Air Asia many times and will continue to do so, but the plane I was just on down to Krabi must have been the oldest plane I ever saw. Inside was totally 70's fit-out. Even older than Eva's planes.

[ace]

Well I will chime in here as an EXPERT....I am a Senior Instructor and QA Manager of Boeing. I have been to Orient Thai airlines for numerous classes (Teaching) over the past several years. It was there MD82 that crashed in Puket. They were operating for 1-2-GO.

I have found in my dealing with them they were very conciences and tried to improve the quality of the fleet.

While some of you bemoan the age of the aircraft....you are speaking from ignorance. They reliablity of a lot of older aircraft rivals the most current. Look at the DC-8 they are used as freighters and surpass 98% reliability....The last one rolled off the assembly line almost 35 years ago, and they just keep preforming. (Ask UPS why they have 50 of them still??, DHL, Airborne, etc.)....................

Sorry to double post but just saw above

QA EXPERT praises 98% reliable planes.

Sweet. 50-1 chance of crash & burn per trip. That's TQM.

[cdnvic]

Well I will chime in here as an EXPERT....I am a Senior Instructor and QA Manager of Boeing. I have been to Orient Thai airlines for numerous classes (Teaching) over the past several years. It was there MD82 that crashed in Puket. They were operating for 1-2-GO.

I have found in my dealing with them they were very conciences and tried to improve the quality of the fleet.

While some of you bemoan the age of the aircraft....you are speaking from ignorance. They reliablity of a lot of older aircraft rivals the most current. Look at the DC-8 they are used as freighters and surpass 98% reliability....The last one rolled off the assembly line almost 35 years ago, and they just keep preforming. (Ask UPS why they have 50 of them still??, DHL, Airborne, etc.)....................

Sorry to double post but just saw above

QA EXPERT praises 98% reliable planes.

Sweet. 50-1 chance of crash & burn per trip. That's TQM.

Of course not. The 2% aren't complete airframe failures, they're leaking hydraulics, navigation lights, radio problems, leaking door seals, and other stuff that also happens on 2yr old aircraft.

[Loom]

Ahem, talk about old aircraft. A China Airlines passenger flight using a Boeing 747 delivered in 1979 disintegrated at cruising altitude near the Penghu Islands, Taiwan in 2002. The cause was attributed to metal fatigue and a faulty repair after a tailstrike in 1980. Ironically, Orient Thai had entered a contract to buy the plane to go into freighter service just before the accident.

I suppose the budget carriers are under pressure to cut costs wherever they can, but at least Tiger, which has a new fleet, is not cutting costs when it comes to aircraft.

Sure, well-maintained old planes should be OK, but I'll avoid airlines operating older aircraft, if possible. The older the plane the greater the chance it's been abused in one way or another.

[lazeeboy]

would always use a budget airline

[legag]

Have tried AirAsia for short trips from Bali to KL and KL to BKK the following week. Have to say it offers reasonable price (if you're not worried about paying over load luggage) and saw their website it's easy to book and many routes flying within SEA.

But the Thai AirAsia plane they use from KL to BKK is so old though, got me thinking it's not a right thing to fly with low cost airline for minute. Thank God it landed safe. Thai flight attendents seemed to have a very low trained as in manner and talking. They were gossiping about passengers right infront of me not knowing there were people who understand their lang. What a shame!! Imagine if they were talking s**t about you. I mean, they could gossip all the wanted as I am sure other airlines flight attendents always do but they don't do it right infront of other passengers.

Edited November 10, 2007 by legag

[stiffoak571]

I use budget airlines all the time in Europe - Easy Jet/Ryanair and very few problems - now I'm looking at coming over at easter and want to do week or so in Phuket then few days in Bangkok - looking at flights etc and was amazed at Air Asia prices - interesting that a 399THB flight becomes over 1000THB when tax is added but even at that it is still under £15 each way!

Silly amounts but is there a catch - something about luggage (Ryanair now down to 15kg here) and do they use the old airport?

Will probably stick with Thai all the way but just find the debate interesting - last time I went to an island went to Samui on Bangkok Air in a propeller driven plane that rattled its way over the Gulf for an hour but was no trouble at all

[chicowoodduck]

Never have, and very unlikely to try one because my most common route is SIN-BKK-SIN and on that route the "budget" carriers are no cheaper than the "full service" ones. Supply & demand I guess...

... the thought of no pre-assigned seat also really puts me off!

flying in thailand on budget airlines is still better than travelling a bus with a crazy doped up driver ..........

I'm with you, much rather take my chances in the air and if by chance we do go down, perhaps it will land on a bus for a softer landing.

[arco27]

I will continue to use budget carriers. I do fly Air Asia a lot, especially now that I can fly from the Gold Coast (60km from my home) via KL to Phuket (my Thai home) in about 10 hours at a very reasonable price (around 20000Bath) Previously I had to travel to Brisbane (over 200km) to get a Thai Airline flight to BKK, which was OK until Thai decided to leave Bribane at 1am and the return flight from BKK at 8am (nice to get up at 4am) and then fly via Sydney to Brisbane a 14 hour flight. Last time I flew with Ethiad to Singapore and on with Air Asia to Phuket which was not to bad except that you have to check out and back in in Singapore. My first Air Asia flight from the Gold Coast will be in January and I look forward to that

[Flow]

Never have, and very unlikely to try one because my most common route is SIN-BKK-SIN and on that route the "budget" carriers are no cheaper than the "full service" ones. Supply & demand I guess...

... the thought of no pre-assigned seat also really puts me off!

Interesting. I pay return 3500 Baht on that route (including all taxes). Can you please tell which "full service" airlines ofer a return seat (including all taxes) for less?

Thanks

[LeungKen]

Just flew Tiger Airways Phuket/Singapore/Perth and back a week or so ago, and as the saying goes "No Wuckin Furries"..........Shame about the leg-room.,,,but clean, safe and reliable will do me.

[Ricardo]

I use budget airlines all the time in Europe - Easy Jet/Ryanair and very few problems - now I'm looking at coming over at easter and want to do week or so in Phuket then few days in Bangkok - looking at flights etc and was amazed at Air Asia prices - interesting that a 399THB flight becomes over 1000THB when tax is added but even at that it is still under £15 each way!

Silly amounts but is there a catch - something about luggage (Ryanair now down to 15kg here) and do they use the old airport?

Will probably stick with Thai all the way but just find the debate interesting - last time I went to an island went to Samui on Bangkok Air in a propeller driven plane that rattled its way over the Gulf for an hour but was no trouble at all

Air Asia use the new airport, so no problem.

However Thai will often offer a domestic-return, such as BKK-HKT-BKK, for only Stg20 extra, when you're booking, so they can be just as cheap !

Air Asia luggage, 15 kgs & strict on it, Thai a relaxed 20 kgs, or 30 kgs for ROP silver-card holders (it is well worth getting !).

Happy Travels

[jeffer]

Never have, and very unlikely to try one because my most common route is SIN-BKK-SIN and on that route the "budget" carriers are no cheaper than the "full service" ones. Supply & demand I guess...

... the thought of no pre-assigned seat also really puts me off!

Interesting. I pay return 3500 Baht on that route (including all taxes). Can you please tell which "full service" airlines ofer a return seat (including all taxes) for less?

Thanks

The question has been asked before but the "full service" fanboi's never seem able to supply a link to illustrate this. I keep seeing similar statements on other message boards but when asked to give an example they never do. If Thai, Malaysian, Singapore and Cathay were as cheap as Tiger, Air Asia and Jetstar then the latter wouldn't have come into existence. You pay your money and you make your choice, it's that simple.

[zink]

One advantage of budget airlines that hasn't been mentioned here is much greater flexibility. They don't have silly restrictions on return date and with budget carriers roundtrip fare usually equals 2 x one-way fare (taking airport taxes into account of course).

With traditional carriers a single one-way fare is sometimes much more expensive than a roundtrip fare, this makes much harder to travel to city A and return from city B for example.

[Shah Jahan]

A quick summary of all the carriers operating around Thailand

Nok - Fantastic - nice girls - good room - fun ride

Air Asia- Is ok if you get express boarding and get the front row or emergency exit - Cant be bothered to push for a seat. I usally en up flying them the most because they go in and out of Suvampoon and there are always seats to buy and fly

12go - the Crash aside, this airline sucks - no leg room - crappy planes and zombie flight attendants

Bangkok Airways - only did the CNX-BKK route and it was in a very old plane so the route took 40 minutes more than the usall - not impressed at all. very small seats as well. They also leave you in the bus for way too long waiting to load.

THAI - really hit and miss - The cabin staff usally looks like they just had a big gulp of kool-aid and are being operated by remote control - They all speak wind-up robot English - They also need to learn how to pronounce 'PRAWNS' I have refused this many times thinking they were saying ' PORK' - They are the only airline staff that cant figure out that I speak thai just by looking at me - the rest already know at a glance.

Other Carriers

CEBU Pacific - Fantastic new planes happy staff - good prices -Now they just need to get an online booking system that works--

Jetstar - I would sooner swim

Tiger - My only flight with them was pretty uneventful.

[david96]

Jetstar warned over trading practice

November 21, 2007

Cut-price airline Jetstar has been put on notice to treat its customers better or face possible action under the Fair Trading Act.

Consumer Affairs Victoria says the aggressive Qantas offshoot is the subject of a disproportionate number of complaints by airline passengers.

Officials from the consumer watchdog met Jetstar representatives late last year, but Consumer Affairs says the airline has not changed its ways.

In its annual report, tabled in Parliament yesterday, Consumer Affairs said many of the complaints related to Jetstar's enforcement of contract terms and conditions such as the stipulation that passengers who fail to check in 30 minutes before the scheduled departure will be denied access to the flight and forfeit their fare.

"Most airlines have similar contract terms and conditions, however the volume of complaints suggests that Jetstar is more rigid in enforcing these," the report said.

"Jetstar has shown reluctance to resolve complaints when contacted," it said.

"Consumer Affairs is inquiring into whether particular contract terms and conditions used by airlines are unfair as defined in the Fair Trading Act."

The report said 39% of complaints about airlines between 2004 and 2006 involved Jetstar.

It said "systemic complaints" about Jetstar related to:

■ Cancellation policies.

■ Failure to provide flights on the dates or times booked, or provide adequate or timely refunds.

■ Unsatisfactory service on flights.

■ Failure to advise passengers of travel or visa requirements.

■ Fees, charges and penalties imposed when passengers make, cancel or change flight bookings.

Jetstar spokesman Simon Westaway last night defended the airline's record, saying customers had to be aware that there was a "flip side" to cheap tickets.

"We've been a popular past-time for people to criticise in the aviation industry, but the conditions of carriage and how we promote those conditions on our website are very clear," he said.

"The fact is, with low-fare travel, one of our fare classes has a lot of inflexibility around the ticket — but the flip side of that is that it's a very low fare."

Mr Westaway said Jetstar took its customer service responsibilities very seriously, and would "take on board" the comments in the Consumer Affairs report.

"But there are reasons why people complain to Consumer Affairs, and it's not the fault of the company in many cases," he said.

Consumer Affairs also reported that it had found widespread breaches of the Fair Trading Act at the Direct Factory Outlets shopping at Essendon.

[misterme]

Just flew several 1-2-Go flights. Price was the motivator here... and they were good in every aspect.

1-2-Go @ 1750B for every seat on every flight. 20KG luggage per person

MD-80 was fine. Planes left on time on each occasion.

If you purchase the ticket from the airport or city office, you can change your date for free. If you buy on the internet or phone, you pay 500B to change. I've heard they'll start hourly service to Chiang Mai next month.

NOK AIR flies ex-TG 737s

business class product is nice for 535B more

every time I check, NOK is more expensive than the other discount carriers, but I've still flown them a dozen times

pretty class act for a Discount carrier, but ALWAYS more expensive

Last time I flew them, they canceled the flight and sent me an SMS hours earlier with a choice of flying Air Asia or Thai Airways... pretty good service, I thought.

Air Asia seems to be doing everything right. If you buy ahead, you can get cheap, cheap, cheap. Last minute fares aren't that great, but they seem to go everywhere.

Newer planes, leather seats, free for all seating. Low baggage allowance.

Thumbs up for success of Air Asia.

Only flown them a few times, but no complaints.

Thai Airways seems to have promotion fares on this winter that compete with all the low cost carriers.

TG's biggest liability is their high prices, so with the discount... they're back to the top of the pack.

If you buy the discount fare, no changes or refunds.

[tigerbeer]

my wife flew airasia last week. to be exact airasia flight from Bangkok to Chiang Mai on Wednesday 21st November. 12.50pm flight. The flight was delayed as they said something was wrong with the plane. finally about 2.30pm, they got a replacement plane. all passengers were boarded to the plane and while on the runway and about to take off, there was a loud sound and the pilot aborted the take off with extreme braking. totally scary experience, they were on taxi for the next 20 minutes or so without any AC. moved to another plane that just landed from some other domestic flight. she finally reached chiangmai about 5something pm. 3 to 4 passengers decided not to fly. perhaps thinking it was just not a good day to be on a plane.

[asiaworld]

Thats funny, probably you guys read my comments,all containing budget airline system 'bashing'. But grudges aside,

after my experience with tiger & Jetstar i found Tiger marginally more pleasant,than air asia, and Jetstar actuallly a decent airline once you onboard (even@ checkin they let you checkin normal amount of luggadge:) ).. So some positives there are..

[wileycoyote]

Yes ,Use Air Asia frequently,mainly because of timings to Chiang Rai