Inquiry Into Foreigners Valuables By The Police

[qualtrough]

Some of you posting support of this document must be mad.There is no way i would put a list of valuable items in my house and give them to 2 guys who come to my door.Even if they are real police,you never heard of police corruption ?

I am not supporting the document. I am saying that the paranoid fantasies about its real purpose are ludicrous. It is voluntary, not an order, and I too would probably not bother to fill it out, just as I do with the majority of government requests, surveys, etc. that come to my house.

[samran]

It is just a misguided attempt at being helpful. It isn't compulsory, nor is it being forced upon you. Higher ups have in their wisdom decided to be helpful. Take the form for what it is, a token of goodwill. And then don't fill it out if you aren't comfortable with it.

[mikethevigoman]

Finally some posters hit the nail on the head! If it really were a community project to protect foreigners and they believe it is effective - why not giving this great service to their own people first? Nobody can be so ignorant to believe that foreigners are going to be treated better than the locals from now on.

Do you know that they don't? If yes, how do you know? Have you been reading the Thai papers, listening to the Thai radio, and watching TV so that you keep abreast of what is going on here? Do you read the mail that comes to your house in Thai from local and or national government organizations? Or do you get your info from fellow TV members, your Thai GF, or the Thais you know who speak some English, or your own fetid imagination?

Did you know they have house registrations here, and have for years? Imagine, having to register where you live and present that paper to officials from time to time. Sounds like a nightmare straight out of 1984 (the novel). I have to wonder why any of the paranoid nutters who have blown this all out of proportion would have even moved or visited such a country in the first place??

I agree, we are in a third world country and must expect to be treated like this,.all you have to do is volunteer some details and keep the rolex where it is and to yourself !

[croftrobin]

Also possible is that the Higher Ranking Police Officer who thought up this idea also has a wife who speaks good English and just happens to work for a household insurance company and is looking for some easy leads!

As an aside -

When I lived in Malaysia (Penang) with my parents in the 70's it was not unknown then for expats who had forgotten to renew their household insurance on time to have the house burgled just before they could renew it.

So as a word of warning if you have a household insurance policy here (Where you will have clearly stated your valuable items) please make sure you do not forget to renew it!

[Edonista]

Why when they live in thailand, some people loose their common sense. Why one thing in their country of origin would make them react, and the same thing in Thailand will put them at sleep ?

The hot climate and the thick air have a sedative effect.

[gzu88bv]

Sorry, I could not believe what I am reading here. The header of this thread to me is very suspect and my common sense tells me what bs is this again?

Of course, in hindsight it is always easier to say what I would have done in such a matter. But even with the men in brown in front of you, one always has to use one’s brain more often than anywhere else, otherwise you are going to be screwed in no time.

[astral]

Have your wife speak to them and say

"<deleted> off, NOYB (None of your business)

we have a safe and burglar alarm!!"

If they persist then tell them you will discuss the matter with the senior officer

at the Police Station, who will be a major, or possibly Colonel, depending on where you live.

[pointofview]

I know there are a lot of protectors of all things thai on these boards - but to think, especially considering the current anti ferang /xnephobic climate within thailand at the moment, that the authoritys have decided to favour the rights of foriegners, with respect to their personal property, over thais is absoulutley ridiculous.

Even the thais must know the message this type of action will send out to normal - not thai appologist - expats living in thailand. Why do the appologists always intimate that the thais are somewhat naive in commiting such actions - surely such intimations are indeed insulting to thais. These things are thought through!

Having lived in thailand for 14 years i am strongly convinced that the police are involved in a lot of crime and complicit in a lot more. This is an incidious act - if you think the worst then you may be close to the frightening truth. But i know that would be too much to consider for most people - after all it is much nicer to believe that the powers that be ,and their agents (the police), have the best interests of the foreign community at heart!

[PadThaiGuy]

Give a location and a list of my valuables to a Thai Cop... yea..right.

[cobra]

Lists of valuables are for insurance companies, not the police (until they get lifted).

Exactly right,

If the Police inquire again as to the status of the form, I'd tell them specifics related to any valuables is on record with your insurance provider,

[Cheeky Farang]

Make your own list with photo. full value, description, notes and all for free.

My Things Link.

I use it, and its secure and no one knows who you are unless you want them to and handy to show the insurance company rep so he can take notes from there.

http://www.mythings.com/

CF

[ludosiam]

Finally some posters hit the nail on the head! If it really were a community project to protect foreigners and they believe it is effective - why not giving this great service to their own people first? Nobody can be so ignorant to believe that foreigners are going to be treated better than the locals from now on.

Do you know that they don't? If yes, how do you know? Have you been reading the Thai papers, listening to the Thai radio, and watching TV so that you keep abreast of what is going on here? Do you read the mail that comes to your house in Thai from local and or national government organizations? Or do you get your info from fellow TV members, your Thai GF, or the Thais you know who speak some English, or your own fetid imagination?

Did you know they have house registrations here, and have for years? Imagine, having to register where you live and present that paper to officials from time to time. Sounds like a nightmare straight out of 1984 (the novel). I have to wonder why any of the paranoid nutters who have blown this all out of proportion would have even moved or visited such a country in the first place??

Since I had posted the form along it surely isn't a fetid imagination of mine. And yes - I know that they do not inquire Thai households, confirmed by the relevant authorities. I had decided to post this topic to inform other members after consulting some police officers I do trust. They too have some doubts about the intention of such an inquiry. I did not post this information to draw insult from other members though.

[importford]

Ludosiam,

- are there more farangs in your village, city that received the same documents,

or did other farangs also got visits from the local police?

- How long do you live here, on what kind of visa or extension?

- Are you a teacher?

- Do you own a bar or restaurant?

- Do you have a work permit or do you own a company in Thailand?

- No problems with the business or the extensions of visa?

- Did you had problems before this with the local police?

- ....

Answers to these questions can quickly change the meaning and idea of this kind of visits by local police.

I am insinuating nothing, just asking questions before I can make a clear opinion on the reason of this visit to your house by the local police and the reason why they gave you this document.

It seems to me that this is not a general practice,

for this I think you have to think what the reason could be for a local police man to come to your house and give you this document.

All these questions are only important if they only visited you.

If they visited other farangs in your neighborhood,

and if they presented them with the same document,

then I would not think too much of it.

But again, if they visited only you, then question yourself for the reason why.

[jayjayjayjay]

Handed over by 2 police officers in uniform coming to my wife's house.

Hope your wifes not setting you up for divorce!!

[ianc66]

I would be doubtful about anything to do with this for all the reasons given above and the additional privacy and data protection issues. The police visit does imply data gathered for one purpose (immigration I presume) was used for another purpose.

An anecdote:-

Back around the time of the Suchinda coup I was working as a consultant to a Thai central government department. Off to lunch takeaway fried banana, wrapped in used A4 paper, and what was printed on that paper? A copy of a commercially confidential memo authored by myself!

In my experience secrets don't get kept, confidences are not respected here.

BTW

Am I alone in thinking the layout of the form is rubbish for instance ............ rather than ________________ for space to reply. Another Thai bureaucracy thing -- just do it like Granddad did. (An amusing aside misspelled bureaucracy the spell check suggested gerontocracy same thing really)

[somtaamgaiyang]

Dear Members, there are currently some activities, apparently by the police here in Korat, to inquire about foreigners houses, personal information and how many valuables are at their homes. How many other members have heard about this inquiry already? For more information you can PM me, I don't think it's a good idea to publicly talk about theories, could be bad for the board. Attached is the form submitted to me by the police.

May be in response to large insurance claims after some roberries.

Insurance companies in Thailand are notoriously inexact at analysing risk. Just read the small print in any household insurance policy. The most obvious issue is gold. They will almost never insure it if it is held at home, even in a safe. To quantify the value of goods in my house for general house contents insurance had to run as long as my arm in order to give it a value. Even had to estimate the value of knives and forks in the house.

Could also be a way of trying to find people working illegaly in the country.

[ludosiam]

Ludosiam,

- are there more farangs in your village, city that received the same documents,

or did other farangs also got visits from the local police? Yes, other farangs I know did receive the same document

- How long do you live here, on what kind of visa or extension? - Alltogether 12 years, since 6 years unbroken non immigrant "B"

- Are you a teacher? - No, I'm an engineer

- Do you own a bar or restaurant? - My wife does own a restaurant

- Do you have a work permit or do you own a company in Thailand? - I have both work permit and company

- No problems with the business or the extensions of visa? - No problem with visa extension

- Did you had problems before this with the local police? - I personally never, but my wife has had a local police officer shooting at our staff because he didn't want to pay his bill

- ....

We had a meeting with the local head of police yesterday, explanations about the reason of this inquiry were somewhat helpless. To me it looks like it is a rather innocent and not well planned attempt to collect more information about foreigners. In some way I do understand this as there is a huge inflow of foreigners in the moment and not everybody is a decent one. One information we got is that these informations will be collected nationwide. The reason I got suspicious about this inquiry is that the person who signed the inquiry is the same that goes around asking for some extra salary, but it seems to me now that these 2 issues are not connected.

[ludosiam]

We had an official and higher ranking police officer dropping by after requesting some more information about the purpose of this inquiry, the explanations were somewhat helpless and not satisfying last weekend. Today 2 officers have dropped by insisting to get the filled out form back, no chance but to comply. I have not filled out the information about valuables though, any other information requested is freely available from immigration anyway. Might be just a lack of cooperation between departments, but not really sure and unhappy about this kind of treatment.

[asiaworld]

Well innit only insurance matters.. Take most of western countries for instance, if you comply with the law, you probably did the similar disclosures, to your local taxman, and those in my book are not much better,than the thai thieves ..

[threelegcowboy]

If there are rule changes to the Visa that causes a mass exit from Thailand what would the powers that be need to know? One thing that they might want to know is how much loot will be left behind.

Do you think this is far fetched?

[elkangorito]

I just read the document and do not think the intent is sinister. Basically the local police at the directive of higher ups elsewhere have been asked to assist in preventing crimes against foreigners and their property. The first page asks for documents such as passport, house registration, etc. and family details, etc. The second page asks for a list of valuable items, and to note any defects. Ostensibly this would be to help in identification if those items were recovered, although the paranoid here will I am sure assume it is a shopping list. I read it quickly, but did not see anything that indicates you are required to complete and submit the form. In fact the term used on the first page when asking for the information is the English equivalent to "We invite you". It is just some kind of community relations project, well-meaning but somewhat misguided. I recall a similar project years ago in MN, in which the police would provide you with a form to list valuables, and an engraver to etch a trackable number on items.

Nothing to see here, move along...

P.S. Jews, France in WWII, puleeze!

Finally some posters hit the nail on the head! If it really were a community project to protect foreigners and they believe it is effective - why not giving this great service to their own people first? Nobody can be so ignorant to believe that foreigners are going to be treated better than the locals from now on.

Do you know that they don't? If yes, how do you know? Have you been reading the Thai papers, listening to the Thai radio, and watching TV so that you keep abreast of what is going on here? Do you read the mail that comes to your house in Thai from local and or national government organizations? Or do you get your info from fellow TV members, your Thai GF, or the Thais you know who speak some English, or your own fetid imagination?

Did you know they have house registrations here, and have for years? Imagine, having to register where you live and present that paper to officials from time to time. Sounds like a nightmare straight out of 1984 (the novel). I have to wonder why any of the paranoid nutters who have blown this all out of proportion would have even moved or visited such a country in the first place??

Some of you posting support of this document must be mad.There is no way i would put a list of valuable items in my house and give them to 2 guys who come to my door.Even if they are real police,you never heard of police corruption ?

I am not supporting the document. I am saying that the paranoid fantasies about its real purpose are ludicrous. It is voluntary, not an order, and I too would probably not bother to fill it out, just as I do with the majority of government requests, surveys, etc. that come to my house.

I fully, wholeheartedly, absolutely & 100% agree with qualtrough.

What is all the fuss about?

I asked one of my Thai collegues to translate the document. He said that it was in "invitiation" to supply the requested information. In short, if you feel your privacy is being invaded, POLITELY decline to supply any info.

May this topic R.I.P.

[meadish_sweetball]

I would never fill out such a list personally, but I also don't believe the theory of listing valuables of foreigners before throwing them out.

My guess would be similar to samran's; some high-ranking Thai police officers have seen a trend of increasing burglaries lately (this is certainly true here in Chiang Mai) and somebody thought this could be a good system for tracking valuables if they disappear.

The risk that the wrong person gets access to the information and decides to make use of it unlawfully is the problem IMO.

If it is not compulsory to fill out the form, then don't.

[ludosiam]

Checking in our local forum and so far knowing of 3 foreigners have received the form, of whom I'm the first one where they have demanded the filled out form back again yesterday. The thing that had made me suspicious in the first place was that the police department in town doesn't know anything about this activity and not a single farang outside the area I'm living at has received such a request. So to me it looks like the activity of a single person who's motives aren't clear and this does make me worry.

[mrtoad]

Checking in our local forum and so far knowing of 3 foreigners have received the form, of whom I'm the first one where they have demanded the filled out form back again yesterday. The thing that had made me suspicious in the first place was that the police department in town doesn't know anything about this activity and not a single farang outside the area I'm living at has received such a request. So to me it looks like the activity of a single person who's motives aren't clear and this does make me worry.

If you're not comfortable with it, don't fill it out. It clearly isn't a compulsory legal document if the Police department doesn't know anything about it.

[farang prince]

It is just a misguided attempt at being helpful. It isn't compulsory, nor is it being forced upon you. Higher ups have in their wisdom decided to be helpful. Take the form for what it is, a token of goodwill. And then don't fill it out if you aren't comfortable with it.

Samran, you are correct. This is a spin-off of a crime prevention project utilized by a number of police departments in the USA beginning in the 1970's. The idea is to get descriptions of valuables so they can be entered in a computer file at the police department in case a residence or business is burgled in the future. We also asked homeowners to engrave their birthdates or social security numbers on some of their electronics so that it could assist us in case the items were later stolen.

The project, called "Operation I.D." was eventually scrapped because it required too much maintenance and the inventories and engraving did not assist detectives enough to warrant the effort.

I would still recommend that homeowners take pictures of their valuables and put the file in safe place.

[ludosiam]

Checking in our local forum and so far knowing of 3 foreigners have received the form, of whom I'm the first one where they have demanded the filled out form back again yesterday. The thing that had made me suspicious in the first place was that the police department in town doesn't know anything about this activity and not a single farang outside the area I'm living at has received such a request. So to me it looks like the activity of a single person who's motives aren't clear and this does make me worry.

If you're not comfortable with it, don't fill it out. It clearly isn't a compulsory legal document if the Police department doesn't know anything about it.

Thank you for the advice, but the 2 officers in uniform have demanded the filled out form back already, I have refused to make any statements regarding valuables though.

[LomSak27]

"Thank you for the advice, but the 2 officers in uniform have demanded the filled out form back already, I have refused to make any statements regarding valuables though. "

If Tony Soprano came to your house and wanted a list of your possesions would you give it to him?

Do what you have to do, perhaps smile a lot and pretend not to understand, however under no circumstance give a list of valuables to representatives of the largest criminal organization in thailand!

[PadThaiGuy]

"The idea is to get descriptions of valuables so they can be entered in a computer file at the police department in case a residence or business is burgled in the future."

Some Thai Cops, want a list of your valuables, in case maybe they get stolen, in the future ?...and the Police station doesn't have a clue?

Somthings wrong.

[ludosiam]

"Thank you for the advice, but the 2 officers in uniform have demanded the filled out form back already, I have refused to make any statements regarding valuables though. "

If Tony Soprano came to your house and wanted a list of your possesions would you give it to him?

Do what you have to do, perhaps smile a lot and pretend not to understand, however under no circumstance give a list of valuables to representatives of the largest criminal organization in thailand!

Thank you for your advice. I have given my personal information like name, age, nationality and address here in Thailand but no information about valuables. This was accepted I believe.

[ludosiam]

"The idea is to get descriptions of valuables so they can be entered in a computer file at the police department in case a residence or business is burgled in the future."

Some Thai Cops, want a list of your valuables, in case maybe they get stolen, in the future ?...and the Police station doesn't have a clue?

Somthings wrong.

That's what I thought, yes. And this was also the reason why I have started this topic to keep other members informed. We'll see if there is something else on it's way or it can stop right here.