Americans: Are You Still Holding Out In Thailand ?

[jumnien]

I just bought a boat made in the United States and am having it shipped to Thailand. The devaluation of the dollar has zero impact on purchases such as this. Yes, I had to pass up the purchase of several Australian and European made fine boats due to the weak dollar as the value of their goods no longer compares to US-made goods. That's the breaks!

[JimsKnight]

When I came here in 1992 the $ was 25 baht and the pound 37.

Isn't it great now?

Stop bloody moaning, it's only money.

Fair one, but don't forget what 500 baht got you back then was a hel_l of a lot compared to now.

If anything the baht is too strong not too weak and needs to come down pronto!

[koheesti]

The weaker dollar have push my plans of moving to LOS by a year or two.

I have a pretty low US salary - not much over 1 million baht/year. I still find living here pretty cheap. Of course, it depends what "luxuries" you want to have or are used to.

[Naam]

Feeling a tad testy today Naam?

i always feel testy when my wife sends me out to the doghouse because i didn't behave. and i feel testy² when i read fiction presented as facts

[Pepe']

I miss the mid nineties when the bhat was around 56 to the dollar.

It was definitely...

[BEENTHEREDONETHAT]

Well the weak dollar does impact my social security check. But fortunately I have my money spread around a bit. Australia, New Zealand and Thailand so the exchange rate does not impact us much. Have not lived in the US for 23 years and have only been back once in the last 10 years. Found it raather depressing when I visited, certainly not the same as when I left. But then everything changes and I'd much rather be in LOS.

[sbk]

I miss the mid nineties when the bhat was around 56 to the dollar.

It was definitely...

The crash was in 97, the baht was pegged to the dollar at 25 baht per one US dollar prior to 97 and reached 57 to the dollar in January 98 but had rebounded to 40 by June of that same year. Hope you changed alot of money in that 6 months because you certainly weren't getting that rate for long.

[LinkPopularity]

well, I'm saving them up ... elections in Thailand soon, election in USA for Clinton, she's probably going to win ... so, soon enough the $ will go up ... that's my bet, on my international currency account I can keep them, so in 6 months or so I'll change them at 38 Baht/dollar ... let's hope so

[BEENTHEREDONETHAT]

quote name='LinkPopularity' date='2007-11-21 12:36:52' post='1662275']

well, I'm saving them up ... elections in Thailand soon, election in USA for Clinton, she's probably going to win ... so, soon enough the $ will go up ... that's my bet, on my international currency account I can keep them, so in 6 months or so I'll change them at 38 Baht/dollar ... let's hope so

Hope you are right but I think the economy is to screwed up to be corrected by promises. The government is going to have to do something to restore confidence. And looking at the present congress they have not done a thing but rubber stamp Bush's request for more $$!

[Jingthing]

I agree that Hillary is our next president. I don't follow the logic that a Hillary win means a stronger dollar. Why exactly? And now with threats from OPEC to drop petrodollars, I can see dollarized Ecuador being the next big thing for American expats.

I personally will hold out here as long as it is tolerable (I am also concerned about the double whammy of a lowering stock market). If the dollar goes to 25 or 20, I will be very tempted to sell my stong baht condo and take the money somewhere where the dollar is still worth something. BTW, Hillary is very good for retired expats, she opposes raising the minimum age of 62 for social security benefits.

Edited November 21, 2007 by Jingthing

[xyborg]

<br />As I have mentioned in the past (and got flamed for it), I live very comfortably in Bkk on my retirement income. Even if the exchange rate was at 25/1, I'd still be fine. It's the six months I live in Santa Fe that are getting very expensive. Right now we are paying $3.14 a gallon for gas here and food costs have increased about 10%, no doubt because of the increased transportation costs. <br /><br />My biggest concern is that I think the U.S. is headed for a serious recession. If that happens, there might be thousands more Americans trying to flee to less expensive places to live. Are you prepared for Americans begging for bahts on Sukhumvit street corners? <img src="style_emoticons/default/wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="wink.gif" /><br />

<br /><br /><br />

Poor you try the Uk's $8+ a gallon

[Jingthing]

If the US dramatically declines and the rest of the world doesn't, most Americans will be stuck in the US, and many expats will be forced to return. No chance of seeing many begging Yankees in Sukhumwit. Amsterdam maybe. In the current world economy, a dramatic downturn in the US will also mean a dramatic downturn worldwide, but that isn't necessarily linked to dollar strength or weakness.

Edited November 21, 2007 by Jingthing

[Beardog]

As an American I have been through a recession where it is almost impossible to make a buck, but what you made was worth more. Europe is in a high inflation phase as the U.S. was deep in not to long ago & your money is worth less.

The minor drop only affected me somewhat on a land purchase. It cost a little more.

In the U.S. now the same house I rented in 1990 has tripled in rent while wages have not seemed to tripled.

Although I miss the Turkey dinner coming up. Why move it's only money & besides you meet some pretty interesting characters up here which always keeps the entertainment level going.

Move back cause the dollar is weak why ? Still about the same for fuel, but next to nothing to eat(unless you are living large & eating tons of farang food) And houses are pretty cheap as well......might not be the western quality but who cares. 50,000 -100,000 US here or $500,000-1,000,000 give or take a hundred or 2 thousand Still a killer deal here.

Currency goes up 7 down I remember when Canada's money you could almost use for kindling fire in the 80's(well maybe not that bad)

I enjoy Thailand Why go home now!!!!!!!!!!!

[a2396]

The weak dollar and recent tax laws are hurting many of the 350,000 or so Americans who live in the European Union, especially those who are paid in dollars.

So, how is the situation in Thailand for you Americans or people paid in US $'s ? Are you able to survive ?

I think it's safe to assume that the large majority of Americans living overseas are doing so of their own free will and decision. If currency fluctuations weren't factored in to that decision, then maybe it is a decision to be reconsidered. Ultimately, who is to blame anyway, the individual or government policies or the currency markets?

Personally, I get paid in dollars and am impacted by fluctuations in the pound and the baht. Over the past 3-4 years, these currencies have fluctuated between about 1.65-2.13 and 31-42 respectively. So be it. As the saying goes, "If you wanna run with the big dogs, then you gotta sh*t with 'em too." It's all part of the life of an expat. From an employment standpoint, it is fairly simple to negotiate a decent enough expat deal to offset these kinds of costs anyway (either through direct compensation or perk or both).

Not everyone living here as an expat, are employed by wealty multi-nationals and have the ability to regotiate their salary upward, to acount for negative currency. FAIRLY SIMPLE?? Maybe for you.

[farang prince]

<br />As I have mentioned in the past (and got flamed for it), I live very comfortably in Bkk on my retirement income. Even if the exchange rate was at 25/1, I'd still be fine. It's the six months I live in Santa Fe that are getting very expensive. Right now we are paying $3.14 a gallon for gas here and food costs have increased about 10%, no doubt because of the increased transportation costs. <br /><br />My biggest concern is that I think the U.S. is headed for a serious recession. If that happens, there might be thousands more Americans trying to flee to less expensive places to live. Are you prepared for Americans begging for bahts on Sukhumvit street corners? <img src="style_emoticons/default/wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="wink.gif" /><br />

<br /><br /><br />

Poor you try the Uk's $8+ a gallon

I think you are talking about an Imperial Gallon aren't you? Quite a difference.

[NovaBlue05]

<br />As I have mentioned in the past (and got flamed for it), I live very comfortably in Bkk on my retirement income. Even if the exchange rate was at 25/1, I'd still be fine. It's the six months I live in Santa Fe that are getting very expensive. Right now we are paying $3.14 a gallon for gas here and food costs have increased about 10%, no doubt because of the increased transportation costs. <br /><br />My biggest concern is that I think the U.S. is headed for a serious recession. If that happens, there might be thousands more Americans trying to flee to less expensive places to live. Are you prepared for Americans begging for bahts on Sukhumvit street corners? <img src="style_emoticons/default/wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="wink.gif" /><br />

<br /><br /><br />

Poor you try the Uk's $8+ a gallon

I think you are talking about an Imperial Gallon aren't you? Quite a difference.

About 1 gbp per liter........3.8 liters per US gallon.....yeah....about $8 a gallon

[qualtrough]

The bottom line is that most American middle class members have been losing ground and purchasing power for some time or have been standing still.

In the context of the last 5-6 years, that is a patently false statement [snip]

Spee, you must have a radically different interpretation of 'patently false' than most people. I will post below the summary of one report on the middle class from what I am sure you consider a radical left wing think tank (Center for American Progress--not allowed to post the URL or I would). I know they are probably not as fair and balanced as Fox news, but it's a start. If you can post some contrary stats please do so (with attribution). There are just reams of statistics out there showing that the middle class is losing ground in the USA, and you are in a dream world if you can't see that. Bush may not have started that trend, but his utter incompetence is the equivalent of throwing gasoline on a fire. Worst...President...Ever.

Is the typical middle-class family doing better today than they were 25 years ago? The answer is no, according to new measures of economic well-being developed in this report. The combination of stagnant incomes and staggering cost increases for important middle-class items—housing, health care, education and transportation—have left families with less money to save and spend than just a few years ago, and working longer to achieve the same results as in 1980. According to the analysis here:

* In 2005, the average two-earner family needs to work 31.5 weeks to pay for taxes and a range of middle-class items (health care, housing, college, and transportation). That is an increase from 30.2 weeks in March 2001, and from 28.7 weeks in March 1979.

* In 2005, after paying for the items outlined above, the average two-earner family had about $19,542 left to pay for basics—such as clothing, food, and utilities—to save for retirement, to improve their economic well-being, and to spend on any leisure and recreation. That is $951 less than families had in 2000 and $1,702 less than in 1980.

* While families spend less today on taxes than in 2000—the tax cuts were real—those tax cuts do not offset the cost increases of expenditure items, particularly housing, health care, and education.

* Middle-class families have addressed the economic squeeze by working longer hours. This has meant less time to spend with children and higher out-of-pocket expenditures for child care and for food outside the home.

* Over time, middle-class families have also maintained their consumption levels by borrowing more money. Household debt soared to a record 116 percent of disposable income in March 2005. Average debt service burden levels have remained high throughout the current business cycle.

* The economic squeeze tends to be worse for minorities than for whites. Specifically, income declines have been larger for Hispanics than for African-Americans and greater for African-Americans than for whites.

Edited November 21, 2007 by qualtrough

[PeaceBlondie]

Folks, there's a general practice here on ThaiVisa (not a formal rule) that we don't usually discuss national politics other than the politics of SEA countries. We're already busily bashing or worshipping Bush, Carter, and Reagan. Could we please get the heck off of American politics, and more on Thailand? Thank you.

The topic, for those who can't remember, is how Americans living on dollar incomes, are surviving in Thailand, considering the economic problems of the dollar. I'm doing okay, but it's one more nail in the coffin of my expatriate retirement in Thailand.

[technocracy]

Personally - I love it!

Sorry ... but I love being able buy $2.05 to my lovely £ . . .

Everytime I move money over here I currently buy $ since the amount I get in comparison to the baht outweighs the exchange rates.

Although I have to say having the choice of $, Baht and Kip accounts is nice!

[Scott]

For anyone with any overseas experience, there is and always will be currency fluctuations. These can be big at times, depending on the currency/country your in. It goes with the territory.

It's relatively important not to keep all your eggs in one basket of course. Like bad weather, currency exchange rates come and go.

[mellow1]

Folks, there's a general practice here on ThaiVisa (not a formal rule) that we don't usually discuss national politics other than the politics of SEA countries. We're already busily bashing or worshipping Bush, Carter, and Reagan. Could we please get the heck off of American politics, and more on Thailand? Thank you.

The topic, for those who can't remember, is how Americans living on dollar incomes, are surviving in Thailand, considering the economic problems of the dollar. I'm doing okay, but it's one more nail in the coffin of my expatriate retirement in Thailand.

Thank you for getting it back on topic - or at least trying.

I second that and repeat the question in the OP:

"So, how is the situation in Thailand for you Americans or people paid in US $'s ? Are you able to survive ?"

LaoPo

We are still doing fine on my retirement, thank you. We of course are not doing as well as the people working in Thailand, making an income comparable to what I made working in the US, and not paying into any retirement fund. Certainly not as well as the many multi millionaires with various investment portfolios and large stashes of money in offshore banks. But we have a beautiful home, a happy and healthy family with no financial debts. Most important of all we have each other to love and care about.

For those of you who take such joy in the vision of America's downfall, I suggest be careful what you wish for. It's not Europe who is going to do anything in this world, you can all see that they lack the balls. So just imagine who is left. Sweet dreams all.

[TokyoT]

So, how is the situation in Thailand for you Americans or people paid in US $'s ? Are you able to survive ?

Survive? H*ll, I am prospering. Generally speaking the weaker the dollar the better for me. Mainly because I work for a US based firm that manufactures in the US. So the weaker the dollar the more we sell internationally, and the more market share we are able to take away from the Japanese and Europeans.

My company has always targeted the top tier of the market and sold on quality and superior performance of our product (as compared to our European and Japanese competitors). The dollar dive has made our product comparable in price and now many times even less expensive than our competitors enabling us to get market share with customers who in the past were not willing to pay extra for better equipment. Now that we have been able to capture those customers they will be able to see for themselves how much better our product is and I am confident even when the dollar eventually gains back we will be able to get those same customers to pay even more for our equipment. We have many customers in the top tier that are willing to pay a premium for our equipment (and some that do not even consider buying from any one but us), and now we will have customers in the lower tiers willing to do so as well. The gain in those lower tier markets is a great bonus for my company that will pay dividend far into the future. We quote and obtain orders now days from companies that have never bought from us in the past - record sales three years running.

As for day-to-day living expenses the value of the dollar does not have that large of an impact on my lifestyle. I have a fixed amount I invest every month, then I cover my living expenses, and what’s left I generally just spend (rather frivolously actually). The lower value of the dollar has not had an impact on the amount I invest or my ability to cover my living expenses. Actually because my pay is effected by sales my total income when converted into baht has actually increased. Lower dollar value has generated sales that I would have not been able to obtain otherwise, and the bonuses/commissions from those sales have increase by income by more than the dollar has lost. It has been a win – win situation for me.

In summary the dropping dollar has been nothing but good news for me, my family, and the families of all the folks employed at our factory floors and offices in the US.

Dive dollar, dive……

[mattias33]

The dollar dive has made our product comparable in price and now many times even less expensive than our competitors enabling us to get market share with customers who in the past were not willing to pay extra for better equipment.

Could your company just not lower the price and make the product competetive? A currensy loosing value is the countrys members loosing money. Americans are getting poorer compared to the rest of the world. This is not something Americans should see as possitive. With your way of putting things the optimal situation would be the dollar going down to baht level, then your company would start selling really good in Europe. No competition what so ever. I think you are fooling yourself a bit. Your company selling better in Europe can have many explanations. What if they they raise the import-tax all over Eu next year because Eu is importing instead of producing? Then you sit there with your weak dollar and no customers. Id say any American thinking dollar-dive is good for America is fooling themselves.

However, the thread is about people living in Thailand with US paychecks, and i dont see how they could ever gain on a dollardive like the past? Never. They are loosing. But i still say your hope is there that the dollar might swing up within the next 5 year period. So hang in.

Thats sad news for Tokyo t though since a stronger dollar will make his company less competative and he will loose market shares. But i think for the rest of the Americans, specially the ones this thread is about, a stronger dollar is to prefer.

[TokyoT]

Could your company just not lower the price and make the product competetive?

Sure we could lower our price – so could Luis Vuitton. But we market our product to the top tier and sell on quality and performance, which many companies are willing to pay for. And we have certainly made strategic decisions related to price in the past to gain or secure market share – but with the decrease in the value of the dollar this point becomes mute. Our customers are now able to get IMHO the best product at prices comparable to lower quality products.

Americans are getting poorer compared to the rest of the world. This is not something Americans should see as possitive. With your way of putting things the optimal situation would be the dollar going down to baht level, then your company would start selling really good in Europe. No competition what so ever. I think you are fooling yourself a bit. Your company selling better in Europe can have many explanations. What if they they raise the import-tax all over Eu next year because Eu is importing instead of producing?

Obviously there is a limit to how much good the falling dollar can do for me and/or my company. At a certain point there would be a negative return on the sliding dollar for me and for the company that I work for.

Sure but do you think the EU wants to start a trade war – and do you think this is really even possible considering the WTO implications? Additionally a significant portion of the product we sell is involved in projects that allow our customers to get tax/duty free status, so are sales are rarely effected by duties or taxes. Not to mention that we provide a rather nich type of product that would hardly interest most of the folks making tax decission in the EU or Asia for that matter.

And sure there is more at play in regard to our increased sales in Europe than just the weak dollar but the weak dollar has certianly helped.

Then you sit there with your weak dollar and no customers. Id say any American thinking dollar-dive is good for America is fooling themselves.

No customers? We have a very loyal key customer base that has been willing to pay pretty much any premium necessary to get our product over the years. The market share that we are now gaining is sure to only add to our key customer base, pretty much ensuring a certain future sales level (of course within reason, and assuming we maintain and even improve our product to stay ahead of our competition).

And I did not say it was necessarily good for America or American’s as a whole. But it sure has been good over the past few years for me, and the folks that I work with – including the many employees we have working for us outside the US. Besides the fact that weak/strong are relative terms and who is say where the middle ground really is? In real terms how weak is the dollar now? Or how strong was it before?

Besides the US IMHO has far too much of a consume and discard mindset. The decreasing value of the dollar, and thereby the general increasing cost of what many American buy might be the wake up call many of them need to be a bit more responsible in what they buy and how they spend. Which in the long run will be good for everyone.

However, the thread is about people living in Thailand with US paychecks, and i dont see how they could ever gain on a dollardive like the past? Never. They are loosing. But i still say your hope is there that the dollar might swing up within the next 5 year period. So hang in.

Thats sad news for Tokyo t though since a stronger dollar will make his company less competative and he will loose market shares. But i think for the rest of the Americans, specially the ones this thread is about, a stronger dollar is to prefer.

I live in Thailand and I get a US dollar based paycheck, and as I explained earlier I have personally gained by the decline in the value of the dollar because my income has increase by far more than the dollar has declined primarily due to sales that have been generated by the declining value of the dollar. Had the dollar not declined there would not have been such a significant increase in sales and so even with each dollar being worth more baht I would be making less in baht terms.

And sure when the dollar starts to gain in value we will loose some of the market share that we have gained recently. But as I stated earlier I am certain that many of the new customers we have been able to get will be willing to pay the premium for our product in the future (that they were not willing to pay in the past) – now that they have personally been able to experience the difference. Additionally the product the we make requires custom spare parts and service, so as long as existing customers want to continue to use the product they have bought from us they will have to come to us for the spare parts and the service.

[BEENTHEREDONETHAT]

lose a little on each sale and make it up on volume?

[mattias33]

Tokyo t. I see know that my post was not valid at all in your particular case. I dont know all the facts about your specific company or product. I do see how you mean you gain some buy the dollar-dive.

My post was more ment to be general than about your specific case, but i do appologise for the wrong use of the word "you". I get your point and agree to certain level with you.

[TokyoT]

Tokyo t. I see know that my post was not valid at all in your particular case. I dont know all the facts about your specific company or product. I do see how you mean you gain some buy the dollar-dive.

My post was more ment to be general than about your specific case, but i do appologise for the wrong use of the word "you". I get your point and agree to certain level with you.

Sure, no harm no foul.

There are winner and losers with any currency swing. And I am fairly certain the dollar will bounce back at some stage. The when and how fast are the big questions – and the why could be pretty important as well.

And most probably if the dollar continues to decline there will be negative effects on me and my company eventually. But so far most of the decline has been beneficial for us, and will even pay dividends (market share, spare parts, service) in the future.

[JetsetBkk]

<br />As I have mentioned in the past (and got flamed for it), I live very comfortably in Bkk on my retirement income. Even if the exchange rate was at 25/1, I'd still be fine. It's the six months I live in Santa Fe that are getting very expensive. Right now we are paying $3.14 a gallon for gas here and food costs have increased about 10%, no doubt because of the increased transportation costs. <br /><br />My biggest concern is that I think the U.S. is headed for a serious recession. If that happens, there might be thousands more Americans trying to flee to less expensive places to live. Are you prepared for Americans begging for bahts on Sukhumvit street corners? <img src="style_emoticons/default/wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="wink.gif" /><br />

<br /><br /><br />

Poor you try the Uk's $8+ a gallon

I think you are talking about an Imperial Gallon aren't you? Quite a difference.

The UK gallon is only about 1.2 US gallons - not so different. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallon

[mbkudu]

I brought all the money I had from the US here about four years ago when the baht was around 45 to the dollar. I feel fine now about the decision. Anything could change in the future, but if I'm going to live in Thailand one baht is worth one baht. What I did obviously isn't for everyone, and it depends on how much money it is. I did it to invest in a piece of property and education, so the decision has been sound.

Edited November 22, 2007 by mbkudu

[ray23]

Short version of the answer yes it has effected my living here drastically, roughly a 30% redution in usable income.