Non Imm. B Visa Re-entry

[chrispdx]

Hello,

I can obtain a non imm. B visa from my home country for thailand, my question is the work permit. I won't be working for a thai company or a company that has a thai location (can't really get a thai work permit).

When I leave the country every 90days am I required to show a work permit? Or is the visa stamp in my passport good enough for re-entry?

If so then I could just return to the states once a year and obtain a new non imm. b visa vrs the extension that requires all the paperwork to obtain..... Can some one clearify if the visa stamp alone will allow me back into the country every 90days?

Chris

[lopburi3]

Presently that would seem to work if you can obtain the visa(s). As to the future (as more data is crunched); we can not predict.

[PoorSucker]

Is it a 1 year multiple entry Non-B you can get?

Then you can get a new stamp every 90-days.

I won't be working for a thai company or a company that has a thai location

So are you going to work in Thailand?

[chrispdx]

I am a web developer, the company I work for is willing to create the letter for the multiple entry B visa! I would be working for an american company drawing an american salary.... The company has no involvment with THailand, I just want to move to thailand and they are willing to keep me employed...

The question is more on a 90 day visa run stand point, is immigration going to require me to show a work permit the second or third time into the country?

Chris

[lopburi3]

And we can not answer that. Do they normally ask? No.

[sober]

Hello,

I can obtain a non imm. B visa from my home country for thailand, my question is the work permit. I won't be working for a thai company or a company that has a thai location (can't really get a thai work permit).

When I leave the country every 90days am I required to show a work permit? Or is the visa stamp in my passport good enough for re-entry?

If so then I could just return to the states once a year and obtain a new non imm. b visa vrs the extension that requires all the paperwork to obtain..... Can some one clearify if the visa stamp alone will allow me back into the country every 90days?

Chris

you don't need a work permit and you don't have to show one at immigration. if you get a multiple reentry for 1 year, that visa gets stamped in your passport. when you arrive, immigration staples an exit visa ticket into your passport. when you make your 90 day run to another country to refresh your 90 day stay increments, you give the immigration officer your passport. they take the exit visa ticket. when you return, they give you another exit visa.

so everything you have assumed is correct. what gets you in each time is the 1 year multiple reentry visa.

also, you can disregard any concern about work permit unless you want to get paid in Thailand.

[lopburi3]

Terminology above is not quite right. The visa is called a multi entry non immigrant visa. When you arrive you fill out an arrival/departure card and the arrival section is kept by immigration and your passport is stamped with a permitted to stay until date. When you leave the departure card section is collected and you are stamped out. When you return you fill out a new card and are stamped in with a new permitted to stay until date.

By law you need a work permit to work. It has nothing to do with being paid in Thailand; or even being paid.

[sober]

Terminology above is not quite right. The visa is called a multi entry non immigrant visa. When you arrive you fill out an arrival/departure card and the arrival section is kept by immigration and your passport is stamped with a permitted to stay until date. When you leave the departure card section is collected and you are stamped out. When you return you fill out a new card and are stamped in with a new permitted to stay until date.

By law you need a work permit to work. It has nothing to do with being paid in Thailand; or even being paid.

Thanks for cleaning up my language.

On the work permit, I agree that the law requires you to obtain a work permit if you will work in Thailand. Unless you join to a Thai payroll, I cannot think of a circumstance in which you must present a work permit. Do you know of any? Thanks.

[lopburi3]

When found to be working is the most obvious circumstance.

[sober]

When found to be working is the most obvious circumstance.

When who finds him? How? The guy is going to do Web development from his home and get paid directly by US employer. If he doesn't have a work permit, he's breaking the law. But who is going to notice that he's working in this case? Thanks.

[LivinLOS]

When found to be working is the most obvious circumstance.

When who finds him? How? The guy is going to do Web development from his home and get paid directly by US employer. If he doesn't have a work permit, he's breaking the law. But who is going to notice that he's working in this case? Thanks.

Thats more accurate advice, your now saying that he can probably break the law and get away with it, thats very different from 'you dont need'..

If he did get caught, he sure 'would need' !!

[sober]

When found to be working is the most obvious circumstance.

When who finds him? How? The guy is going to do Web development from his home and get paid directly by US employer. If he doesn't have a work permit, he's breaking the law. But who is going to notice that he's working in this case? Thanks.

Thats more accurate advice, your now saying that he can probably break the law and get away with it, thats very different from 'you dont need'..

If he did get caught, he sure 'would need' !!

We have the same law on the books in the US. If you are a french poet, and you don't have a work permit, you'd be breaking the law to write a poem while visiting US. If you snap a photo with intent to distribute, you'd be breaking the law. But we don't enforce the law at any time other than day 1 on the job -- when the employer is required to obtain I-9 authorization to work. My question is sincere and I do not know the answer. I am only curious. Do other countries enforce similar laws at different occassions -- such as entry, random checks, surveillance, etc?

[LivinLOS]

When found to be working is the most obvious circumstance.

When who finds him? How? The guy is going to do Web development from his home and get paid directly by US employer. If he doesn't have a work permit, he's breaking the law. But who is going to notice that he's working in this case? Thanks.

Thats more accurate advice, your now saying that he can probably break the law and get away with it, thats very different from 'you dont need'..

If he did get caught, he sure 'would need' !!

We have the same law on the books in the US. If you are a french poet, and you don't have a work permit, you'd be breaking the law to write a poem while visiting US. If you snap a photo with intent to distribute, you'd be breaking the law. But we don't enforce the law at any time other than day 1 on the job -- when the employer is required to obtain I-9 authorization to work. My question is sincere and I do not know the answer. I am only curious. Do other countries enforce similar laws at different occassions -- such as entry, random checks, surveillance, etc?

You raise an interesting question but I am guessing it is decided somehow along not looking to define 'work' as the Thais do (which is to include anything and everything.. You work on your garden.. You work on learning a language.. You do charity work) but I would guess that western legal definitions would be more based around 'employment' be that direct employment for an employer or self employment where you are producing goods or services with the expectation of renumeration ??

Most certainly there are checks and measures in place to prevent illegal employment or self employment.. But no checks and measures around the general terms 'work' I would think..

Thats my random guess for the day !!

If there was an avenue for non Thais to operate some form of self employment and pay taxes on it, you would think it would be a boon to both sides, however that would involve Thais allowing Farangs to operate with less control outside of a firm corporate structure and hence does not seem to appeal to the powers that be.

[on-on]

I guess it's probably bad to discuss whether this arrangement works successfully for a number of people, but I can tell you that on my own trips through Immigration with a Non-Imm B I've only ever been ask once what I do. I replied with my profession which is a web-related field that's sort of niche and they blinked at me like most people do and stamped the passport like regular. As the people said, though, it's not a problem unless it's a problem - then it's a problem. However, much like being checked for your passport randomly on the street or immigration raids and other potential and obscure snags, all the stories I hear about problems are anecdotal/friend of a thai visa member/guy a thai visa member met in a bar, so I'd keep in mind that you could have serious problems, but not expect them (as someone else said, for now, once they start crunching data it'll be over). I've certainly never met anyone who has actually had a problem.

Edited December 15, 2007 by on-on

[Gerry290]

I have a ltd company in Ireland, & I like the OP. I work "remotely. tele-work, virtual e- work...wow cool exression" basically I use the phone, email & internet, and I work into Ireland & the UK a little, as a recruiter. 90% of my clients are in Dublin, as is 90% of the IT Network Support Engineers, I find jobs for. All invoicing is done in Ireland & me accountant, is a director of the Limited company, so all is 100% proper. ( I work usually from home, & on odd occasion is bored Starbucks Beach Road, is a pleasant place to do a wee bit, if not too many calls to be made).

Any to the OP point.

I do not believe in taking chances, & as much as I dislike redtape & paper work, I have B Visa, Thai Company & Work Permit. In fact, my lawyer told me this, what I do "Teleworking" is an actual Job Description which requires a work permit.

I pay tax to what is legally required as per my Thai company & work permit . (and I use my "offshore" status re Ireland tax laws, which means I do not have to pay any tax on personal income in Ireland, my Irish company has to pay take but it makes a loss since I move here Boo Hoo at owning a loss making Irish Ltd company,,ah well you cannot pay Corporation tax if you made a loss, so I just got to do the VAT in Ireland).

Now, they way I have heard it, especially in Pattaya, where there is a stricter view on Immigration issues. As we all know in many countries, Laws or Taxes etc can be interpreted in different ways. Now I believe it is much better, safer, and with a work permit you have other advantages too, to set up a Thai Ltd company & do the thing properly, & pay a wee bit of tax, after all we are guests here, and its nice to give back!

Now back to interpretation of this idea does our OP need a work permit (my setting up his own Thai co & fulfilling the minimal obligations) or can he sit home work into USA and be Ok, and he 95% will probably be for now, but is it 100% legal. I do not know? Personally I d rather not take the chance. One thing I do know, if for some 1 in a million reason, he fell foul of immigration police or other law official (or out of spite unfriendly neighbor passed on some info..)

I do assume strongly for a fact, that my interpretation of what I think the law is on this issue, will not be a bloody thing, if the officials came to have a look at the OP. Might get a person a 99 year special Visa OUT of Thailand, or I m sure a special arrangement might be possible ahem!!! nuff said. ahem

If I were he, I would get a Thai co, and get the work permit.

Now, long after I got the work permit & Thai Co, and when I setr up the company I got added to company papers I can teach self defense as a krav maga instructor, to I do need work permit for that. However regardless of that home working quietly into Europe, I would still go and get it. banks take you more serious etc etc too..

[SamuiBond]

Webworker isn't taking a job or anything from anyone living and working in Thailand (billion to one). If someone moves here, does his job at home using internet and computer, pays rent, buys food, -drinks and -goods around, this person is also paying indirect "taxes". This is more or less just moral issue. It surely does nothing bad for Thailand itself that people who can spend actually live and spend it here.

In a country where they hardly stop max speeding cars or home drug users, its going to take a while to come up with a way to stop and figure out how one uses someone' computer to what purpose at one certain time. Chances are NILL.

Not that I'm endorsing doing this, but just claiming the fact.

[lopburi3]

Who is "Webworker"?

First of all the chances may be low but they are not nill. Secondly drug use is not tolerated and often ends in imprisonment or death. Third if you read another visa runners post today you will find he was stopped for speeding twice on the trip north. I'm sure glad you are not endorsing your advise.

[manijohn]

Who is "Webworker"?

First of all the chances may be low but they are not nill. Secondly drug use is not tolerated and often ends in imprisonment or death. Third if you read another visa runners post today you will find he was stopped for speeding twice on the trip north. I'm sure glad you are not endorsing your advise.

By the way, the Highway Police have many speed monitoring devices. My USA radar/laser detector does not pick the signals that are transmitted from the Police units used here. Beware!

[thaikahuna]

Hello,

I can obtain a non imm. B visa from my home country for thailand, my question is the work permit. I won't be working for a thai company or a company that has a thai location (can't really get a thai work permit).

When I leave the country every 90days am I required to show a work permit? Or is the visa stamp in my passport good enough for re-entry?

If so then I could just return to the states once a year and obtain a new non imm. b visa vrs the extension that requires all the paperwork to obtain..... Can some one clearify if the visa stamp alone will allow me back into the country every 90days?

Chris

The only problem with that logic is if the BiB at BKK ask you for your tax records proving you worked here. I have heard of people being asked for their tax reciepts and getting in a trickbag when they could not produce any.

[sriracha john]

A disgruntled Thai neighbor with an unspoken grudge over some innocuous event... a Thai acquaintance with a trivial, yet self-perceived, slight... a Thai shopkeeper, who through some communication barrier, feels cheated... a Thai government official with more time on his hands than common sense... the number of scenarios that could result in someone's activities in Thailand being looked into is almost limitless, but hey, go for it.. because the chances of being found out or grassed out, especially over something the OP may not even be aware of, are supposedly "nil"

[chrispdx]

Gerry 290,

I don't mind paying the small Thai taxes, how do I go about setting up a thai business, and obtaining the work permit through the thai business?

It is my understanding that in order to get the work permit my thai company would need to have Thai employees, and 2 million baht in a thai bank (no "FDIC" insurances), is this correct?

if I own the company is it easy for me to obtain a WP/Business visa for myself? what are the qualifications? what percentage is the Thai taxes? also would my company have to pay thai taxes, then also me personally since my thai company will be paying me?

also could my thia company then start doing web work for other Thai companies? or would I be limited to working from non thai companies? (although its probably more profitable to continue working on american sites)

Can you point me to your thai lawer?

Chris

Edited December 17, 2007 by chrispdx

[sober]

Chris, don't let these guys spook you. There might be some law on the books that is as arcane as the same US law. Nobody has given instance of its enforcement besides when it is logically to be enforced -- upon showing up to work in Thailand. Since that event will not occur in your case, you do not need to trouble yourself with a work permit, which you cannot obtain anyway unless you can satisfy requirements that you cannot satisfy. You are doing nothing wrong if your intent is to visit Thailand and not to reside in Thailand.

My advice to you is not legal but career -- enjoy a month or two here and then go home. How long do you think your job will last with you working remotely? I know many people who have done so and, invariably, they are the first cut loose when the economy turns bad and corporations RIF. The US economy is headed for the toilet. I think now is a bad time for you to be away from the mothership. If you are ready to set sail, then make sure you can earn a living on your own, independent of the US company. In that case, if you want to reside in Thailand rather than just live here a few months, then you must build the solid legal foundation for your business and work responsibilities here. In that case, you should hire a lawyer.