Australian Aged Pension

[harrry]

And they will catch a lot of "same-sex" relationships which Centrelink now regards as defacto. After the 1st July 2009. Many of these were receiving single benefits, now they will be penalised and get the "couple" rate.

And that amendment was brought in very quickly by our current goverment. And they never mentioned the loss of pension rate at the time so it was never questioned, they promoted the political line that they were not "discriminating" against same sex relationships to cover up their real agenda.

Actually it was allways clear that this was the case. It is just on consequence of marriage like relationships being recognized for men as well as for women. I am for the relationships being recognized but in doing so responsabilities must be accepted too such as this and the counting of assets of couples after two years as if they are legally married and enforcing sharing.

[david96]

And they will catch a lot of "same-sex" relationships which Centrelink now regards as defacto. After the 1st July 2009. Many of these were receiving single benefits, now they will be penalised and get the "couple" rate.

And that amendment was brought in very quickly by our current goverment. And they never mentioned the loss of pension rate at the time so it was never questioned, they promoted the political line that they were not "discriminating" against same sex relationships to cover up their real agenda.

Actually it was allways clear that this was the case. It is just on consequence of marriage like relationships being recognized for men as well as for women. I am for the relationships being recognized but in doing so responsabilities must be accepted too such as this and the counting of assets of couples after two years as if they are legally married and enforcing sharing.

Look at it this way, one it not interested in morals this is about money.

Everyone should be treated as an individual person. It does not matter if you are in a dejure or a defacto marriage or your partner is one of the same sex, as things stand at the present time

all are being discriminated against financially because they are no longer regarded as single.

But they run their financial affairs as single persons, so logically they should be treated as single persons.

It is discrimination. Anti-discrimination laws can work for you and against you.

I have always regarded people as individuals, one thing I never do is ask them if they are

married/ defacto/same-sex as that does not interest me, and it is none of my business,

and they reserve the right to tell me if they so wish. The same with a persons financial

standing unless you need to know you do not ask.

[harrry]

If you are living outside of Oz for more than 12 months centrelink may deem your house in Oz as not your primary place of residence and deem it to be available for rent at a certain amount. This amount will then be deducted from your age pension payments.

"from sezzo"

The way that rents are going in Melbourne at this time, you would probably gain a lot more $'s from grabbing the rent and keeping away from Centrelink anyway.

Seriously though, for those of us who have worked a considerable amount of our lives at home and paid a Sh..load of our $'s in tax, we should not have to go through such stress to get a pension, no matter where we choose to live out our final years.

I'm no great lover of the USA system, but they can do whatever they like in retirement and get what they are entitled to wherever they choose to be.

The "Lucky Country" is not what it seems in many ways.

not correct they would count it as a non cash asset and the demed rent has nothing to do with it.

Edited October 16, 2009 by harrry

[Artisi]

If you are living outside of Oz for more than 12 months centrelink may deem your house in Oz as not your primary place of residence and deem it to be available for rent at a certain amount. This amount will then be deducted from your age pension payments.

"from sezzo"

not correct they would count it as a non cash asset and the demed rent has nothing to do with it.

Think if you are in the position where they now consider your "residence" as an asset it is then becomes an assests versus deemed or actual income on the rental potential of the property - the pension is then considered evaluated on which results in the lowest pension payable to you either based on assests or income. Usually it would become an assests consideration as real estate is normally greater than income from rent after deducting all allowable outgoings.

Edited October 20, 2009 by Artisi

[sam45]

I don't turn 65 for another couple of years but when I do, I was under the impression that I could claim the Australian Aged Pension while continuing to reside in Thailand.

Having paid massive amounts in Australian income tax and every other tax they can think of for my entire working life, I figured I could look forward to living reasonably well on our Aged Pension in Thailand. Problem is, according to one source, I might not be able to claim the pension if I am not living in Australia. Another says it will cut-out after 26 weeks if I am away from Oz.

Tried to get info from the so called "Seniors" Link through the Aust. Gvt. website. No USE!!

Would greatly appreciate ANY and ALL info you can offer.

Cheers,

VOICEOVER.

This may help, but may change before you hit the big 65

"To lodge a claim and qualify for Age Pension, you must be:

in Australia on the day you lodge your claim - the exceptions to this rule are that the person is:

in an agreement country when the claim is lodged and is either a resident of Australia or a resident of an agreement country, or

transferring from a different payment type and does not need to lodge a claim (e.g. a person in receipt of a Disability Support Pension, turning Age Pension age does not need to lodge a claim).

In most cases, you can be paid Age Pension outside Australia indefinitely, although the rate of payment may vary after a period.

Generally able to be paid indefinitely, proportional after 26 weeks." Source.....the friendly govt centrelink office

The reduction after 26 weeks depends on a few different factors and can differ from person to person. I do know one gentleman that receives about $100 less per f'nite due to his being in Thailand full time.

do I have to reside in australia to collect age pension prior to retiring in Thailand

[sam45]

I don't turn 65 for another couple of years but when I do, I was under the impression that I could claim the Australian Aged Pension while continuing to reside in Thailand.

Having paid massive amounts in Australian income tax and every other tax they can think of for my entire working life, I figured I could look forward to living reasonably well on our Aged Pension in Thailand. Problem is, according to one source, I might not be able to claim the pension if I am not living in Australia. Another says it will cut-out after 26 weeks if I am away from Oz.

Tried to get info from the so called "Seniors" Link through the Aust. Gvt. website. No USE!!

Would greatly appreciate ANY and ALL info you can offer.

Cheers,

VOICEOVER.

This may help, but may change before you hit the big 65

"To lodge a claim and qualify for Age Pension, you must be:

in Australia on the day you lodge your claim - the exceptions to this rule are that the person is:

in an agreement country when the claim is lodged and is either a resident of Australia or a resident of an agreement country, or

transferring from a different payment type and does not need to lodge a claim (e.g. a person in receipt of a Disability Support Pension, turning Age Pension age does not need to lodge a claim).

In most cases, you can be paid Age Pension outside Australia indefinitely, although the rate of payment may vary after a period.

Generally able to be paid indefinitely, proportional after 26 weeks." Source.....the friendly govt centrelink office

The reduction after 26 weeks depends on a few different factors and can differ from person to person. I do know one gentleman that receives about $100 less per f'nite due to his being in Thailand full time.

[sam45]

I don't turn 65 for another couple of years but when I do, I was under the impression that I could claim the Australian Aged Pension while continuing to reside in Thailand.

Having paid massive amounts in Australian income tax and every other tax they can think of for my entire working life, I figured I could look forward to living reasonably well on our Aged Pension in Thailand. Problem is, according to one source, I might not be able to claim the pension if I am not living in Australia. Another says it will cut-out after 26 weeks if I am away from Oz.

Tried to get info from the so called "Seniors" Link through the Aust. Gvt. website. No USE!!

Would greatly appreciate ANY and ALL info you can offer.

Cheers,

VOICEOVER.

This may help, but may change before you hit the big 65

"To lodge a claim and qualify for Age Pension, you must be:

in Australia on the day you lodge your claim - the exceptions to this rule are that the person is:

in an agreement country when the claim is lodged and is either a resident of Australia or a resident of an agreement country, or

transferring from a different payment type and does not need to lodge a claim (e.g. a person in receipt of a Disability Support Pension, turning Age Pension age does not need to lodge a claim).

In most cases, you can be paid Age Pension outside Australia indefinitely, although the rate of payment may vary after a period.

Generally able to be paid indefinitely, proportional after 26 weeks." Source.....the friendly govt centrelink office

The reduction after 26 weeks depends on a few different factors and can differ from person to person. I do know one gentleman that receives about $100 less per f'nite due to his being in Thailand full time.

do I have to reside in australia to collect age pension prior to retiring in Thailand

[sam45]

If you are living outside of Oz for more than 12 months centrelink may deem your house in Oz as not your primary place of residence and deem it to be available for rent at a certain amount. This amount will then be deducted from your age pension payments.

"from sezzo"

The way that rents are going in Melbourne at this time, you would probably gain a lot more $'s from grabbing the rent and keeping away from Centrelink anyway.

Seriously though, for those of us who have worked a considerable amount of our lives at home and paid a Sh..load of our $'s in tax, we should not have to go through such stress to get a pension, no matter where we choose to live out our final years.

I'm no great lover of the USA system, but they can do whatever they like in retirement and get what they are entitled to wherever they choose to be.

The "Lucky Country" is not what it seems in many ways.

not correct they would count it as a non cash asset and the demed rent has nothing to do with it.

Glad to hear it may be a non cash asset

Thanks

sam45

[JEUNIQUE]

Hello below is some information regarding my Centrelink Disability Pension and Centrelink's corruption

Hope this helps

I have lived here on a Disability Pension since 2000 when aged 31-2

During this time I had to return to Australia every 26 weeks to satisfy Centrelinks portability legislation

On July 1st 2004, Centrelinks portability legislation changed from 26 weeks to 13 weeks

In April 2004, I returned to Thai.

Before I returned Centrelink instructed me that I needed to return in October 2004, for a medical. Still had 26 weeks portability. If I did not return my pension would be cancelled

I had been trying to have my Australian residence status changed to a non residence but still an Australian citizen

After returning for my medical Centrelink then put me under the new legislation requiring me to return to Aus every 13 weeks.

I used to fly into Brisbane, ring Centrelink to say I am back then catch the next plane back. Did not leave the airport

I contested my portability for 2 1/2 years and finally got the below

Centrelink also denied any knowledge that I was required to return to Aus for a medical.

It took 4 years to find out the truth regarding Centrelink's denial. In 2008 after doing a freedom of info search. I found that Centrelink deleted this information and then pretended it did not happen (see letter from the Ombudsman)

Unfortunately fighting the Aus gov from Thai without a legal team is impossible. Centrelink has a legal division with unlimited funds

Name and other personal info deleted

Locked Bag 86 Darwin NT 0801

Centrelink

4th Floor 80 Mitchell Street Darwin NT 0800

Telephone: (08) 8936 3756

Fax: (08) 8936 3899

August 2006

Mr ???

Dear Mr ???

I am an Authorised Review Officer who has actioned your request to have the decision about your Disability Support Pension reviewed. I’ve had no previous involvement in your case.

After carefully looking at the matters presented in your case, as well as relevant parts of Social Security Law and policy guidelines, I have decided to change the decision to regard you as a permanent resident of Australia. This is because it has been found that you are a permanent resident of Thailand. This means that you have unlimited portability.

I have given a copy of my decision to our Casuarina Customer Service Centre. I have asked that office to reflect that your Disability Support Pension is to be regarded as a saved case for portability. You should contact that office if you want to know more about your case.

If you still think my decision is wrong, you can appeal to the Social Security Appeals Tribunal (SSAT). If you decide to appeal, it is important to do so within thirteen weeks of receiving this letter. If you appeal after thirteen weeks and the SSAT decides arrears are payable, these may be backdated only to the date your appeal was received by the tribunal. Details of how to appeal are included in the enclosed SSAT pamphlet. If you don’t agree with the decision of the S SAT, you can appeal to the Administrative Appeals Tribunal (AAT).

If you wish to comment on the quality of service you received from us you can talk to our Customer Relations staff on Freecail 1800 050 004. If you have contacted-our Customer Relations staff with a concern and they have not been able to resolve it to your satisfaction, you can take the matter further by contacting the Ombudsman’s Office on 1300 362 072 for the cost of a local call from anywhere in Australia.

You can arrange to look at papers on your Centrelink file, subject to the provisions of the Freedom of Information (FOl) Act. You may need to ask for access to these documents under FOl in writing. Centrelink staff can assist you further with this.

Yours sincerely

Authorized Review Officer

Area North Australia

Decision Statement of ARO

Customer Mr ???

Payment Disability Support Pension APL B 111448

Decision under review to regard you as a permanent resident of Australia

Date of decision September 2006

ARO’s decision Set Aside

Name of ARO

Date of ARO’s decision August 2006

Why customer believes the decision is wrong

Customer said:

• When you returned to Australia on 8/9/04 you were only returning due Centrelink request for doing a medical review;

• You had a return ticket to Thailand which should show that you were not permanently residing in Australia.

Issues to be decided

The issues to be decided in this case are:

• Whether you are regarded as a permanent resident of Thailand;

• if so, from what date does your residency take place;

• Whether you have a Disability Support Pension overpayment;

• What is the correct amount of the overpayment; and

• Whether any portion of the overpayment can be waived.

Evidence I considered

This includes:

• Our phone conversation on 4/8/06 & 17/8/06;

• Information received from International Services Branch;

• Record of departures maintained by Centrelink from Australia since July 2000;

• Record of contacts you have made when returning to Australia; and

• computer records maintained by Centrelink of your Disability Support Pension claim.

Findings of fact and reasons for decision

You were in receipt of Disability Support Pension and frequently overseas in Thailand since July 2000.

On 1/7/04 the portability rules changed. As you were overseas before these changes, your Disability Support Pension was payable indefinitely. When you returned to Australia on 8/9/04 a decision should have been made in relation to your residency status which would effect your Disability Support Pension. As this did not occur, your residence was regarded as Australia and your departures overseas where recorded as temporary. This meant that you were subject to the new rules when you departed overseas as of 30/9/04 which means that your Disability Support Pension was only payable for a maximum period of 13 weeks.

You advised that over the past two years you have had no accommodation in Australia and that when you do return to it is usually only a day return and you stay at the airport. You contact Centrelink to advise that you are in Australia and the day you are returning to Thailand. You said prior to this, you would stay at the University for a maximum period of two weeks.

You said that the only family you have in Australia is a younger step sister and sister whom you have had no contact with in the past two years except to send greeting cards on special occasions.

You advised that you have no ties or assets in Australia. The only tie is with the Univeristy in Queensland.

Your record shows that you have been travelling frequently to Thailand since July 2000.

Based on the information available to me, I have made a decision that you are a permanent resident of Thailand. This decision is to be back dated to 29/6/04 which is prior to the 1/7/04 changes to portability. This means that you have indefinite portability and no longer have an entitlement to any add ons (eg: rent assistance, Pharmaceutical, Remote Area Allowance, Telephone Allowance).

As a decision has been made about your permanent residency and that this has been back dated, an overpayment exists due to you receiving these add ons when you returned to Australia after the 1/7/04 changes.. This overpayment will be raised, however, you will not be required to repay this due to solely admin error and you recieved the payments in good faith.

In relation to whether you would be required to return to Australia to maintain your Disability Support Pension - there is currently no legislative or policy requirement that a non Australian resident would be required to return to Australia.

In relation to any out of pocket expenses that you have incurred during the period- you may wish to make a claim for Customer Compensation if you believe you have been given incorrect advice by Centrelink and suffered economic loss as a consequence.

Yours sincerely

Authorized Review Officer

Area North Australia

From: Complaints Brisbane ([email protected])

Sent: September 2009 2:33:35 AM

To:

Dear Mr ???

I am writing to let you know we have finished investigating your complaint about Centrelink.

Background

You complained to our office in 2005 (our reference 2005-) and in 2007 (2007-), about Centrelink’s decisions in response to two Compensation claims you had made.

The central issue you raised in your 2005 complaint was that, in April 2004, Centrelink incorrectly advised you that you needed to provide a medical report in relation to your Disability Support Pension (DSB). On the basis of this advice, you returned to Australia in September 2004 and obtained a medical report from an Ophthalmologist and provided this to Centrelink. You then found out that this was unnecessary, and claimed compensation for the cost of your trip to Australia.

Centrelink did not accept your argument, and rejected your CDDA claim. You complained to this office about this decision. We investigated your complaint and concluded that Centrelink’s decision was not unreasonable in the circumstances. In particular, the Investigation Officer considered Centrelink’s documents from the relevant period of time, and determined that they did not support your claim that Centrelink had advised you in April 2004 that you needed to provide a medical report in relation to your DSB.

In May 2008, you provided our office with a copy of a Centrelink document dated 21 April 2004, which you obtained from Centrelink through Freedom of Information. The document refers to a ‘dsb opthmologist [sic] report’, and has an annotation indicating that it was deleted on 29 July 2004.

This document appeared to support your argument that Centrelink had advised you in April 2004 that you needed to provide a medical report in relation to your DSB. Our office also noted from a review of your earlier complaint files that Centrelink had not previously provided this document to our office, despite its apparent relevance.

Our Investigation

In November 2008, our office interviewed the Centrelink employees who had created and deleted the record of 21 April 2004. It was our view, following these interviews, that the document had not been deleted for an improper purpose. Rather, the document was deleted because the Centrelink officers involved believed that you did not need to attend a medical appointment with an Ophthalmologist, as your condition was not likely to improve.

In our view, the deletion of the document was not appropriate. Centrelink did not create a replacement record to document its contact with you around that time, and it did not record its reasons for deleting the record. Moreover, even though Centrelink believed you did not need to attend a specialist appointment, nobody from Centrelink contacted you to let you know.

Centrelink has accepted that the deletion of this record was not appropriate, and that it should have advised you at that time, or when it again had contact with you in August 2004, that you did not need to return to Australia for a medical review. Centrelink has also accepted that this record was relevant to your CDDA claim and that further evidence which might have shed light on the issues was lost with its deletion. We have recorded administrative deficiency against Centrelink for these reasons.

Although Centrelink accepted that the evidence supported your claim that it expected you to provide an Ophthalmologist report by 15 October 2004, Centrelink has not provided our office with any explanation as to why its staff members held this expectation. In our view, had Centrelink kept adequate records, it would have been able to account for the events which took place in 2004. We have therefore also recorded administrative deficiency against Centrelink for its failure to keep adequate records.

Remedies

We commenced our current investigation on the basis of new evidence you provided to our office, which suggested that Centrelink had failed to consider relevant evidence in arriving at its decision not to compensate you for travel expenses you incurred in returning to Australia for a medical review in September 2004. We have now thoroughly investigated this issue and, as a result of our investigation, Centrelink has agreed to consider a further offer of compensation for these expenses and the additional expenses you have incurred in pursuing the matter over a long period of time. We expect that Centrelink will be in contact with you shortly.

In response to your request that our office provide you with advice in relation to Centrelink’s further offer, because we are an independent and impartial body, we are not able to provide you with this advice. We therefore suggest you seek assistance from your solicitors and/or Welfare Rights in this regard.

Other Matters

We confirm we have received and reviewed your emails of 4 August, 11 August and 7 September 2009. In response to your request that our office reconsider the deed of release which you signed in accepting Centrelink’s offer of compensation, and the breakdown of your compensation offer, our office cannot revisit these matters. Our office has already considered these issues in response to your previous complaint (our ref 2007-106689) and the investigation officer’s decision was reviewed by a Senior Investigation Officer. As the Deputy Ombudsman advised you on 12 October 2007, it is the policy of our office to only review our decisions once.

If you want to discuss this decision, please contact me on 1300 362 072 or by return email. If I do not hear from you by 6 October 2009 I will close your complaint.

You can have my decision reviewed within our office. Should you wish to do so, please contact me and I can tell you more about this process. This information is also available on our website at www.ombudsman.gov.au.

Yours Sincerely,

Dr

State Director - Queensland

Commonwealth Ombudsman

Email [email protected]

website www.ombudsman.gov.au

Assisting the Australian community by resolving complaints and fostering good government administration

[chiangdan]

Did I read somewhere on T.V. a while back that the Age Pension (65+) for a male, almost cuts out if you are married to a younger lady who is still considered able to wok and provide family income.

I think a male member quoted that he was living in Thailand and had his pension almost zeroed when he advised Centrelink that he was married in the above circumstance.

Yes that is true. My father who is 68 yrs and his partner is 53yrs gets next to nothing on the aged pension because his partner is considered to be of working age until 55 for a woman and is forced by centrelink to actively seek employment. So all you 65+ men married to 20 something yr old thai women planning on retiring in Thailand on the pension forget it. By the time your wife reaches 55 and you become allegable for the pension the tree you were planted under will already be bearing fruit.

[bails]

Did I read somewhere on T.V. a while back that the Age Pension (65+) for a male, almost cuts out if you are married to a younger lady who is still considered able to wok and provide family income.

I think a male member quoted that he was living in Thailand and had his pension almost zeroed when he advised Centrelink that he was married in the above circumstance.

Yes that is true. My father who is 68 yrs and his partner is 53yrs gets next to nothing on the aged pension because his partner is considered to be of working age until 55 for a woman and is forced by centrelink to actively seek employment. So all you 65+ men married to 20 something yr old thai women planning on retiring in Thailand on the pension forget it. By the time your wife reaches 55 and you become allegable for the pension the tree you were planted under will already be bearing fruit.

Interesting point chiangdan. Do you know how this would apply to a couple living in Thailand.What i mean is if the blokes pension was cut because his younger Thai wife was considered to be of working age what would happen if she was unable to find employment.Would Centrelink then be obliged to pay the bloke the full pension amount as i am sure they would not pay the dole to the Thai wife. Or would it be a case of "bad luck mate your entitled to bugger all!"?

While i am at it i would appreciate it if anyone could clarify the 2 years resident requirement for me as i can,t get an answer from centrelink.I am aware that to claim the pension you have to be living in Oz for the 2 years prior to claiming the pension at 65. How would this apply to someone working part time in Thailand.e.g. would a person teaching english part time be required to toss the job in at 63 just to return to Oz to be eligible to claim the pension at 65? This would seem senseless to me as at 63 returning to Oz at that age would probably mean the next 2 years on the dole.If anyone can shed some light on this for me it would be appreciated.

[david96]

If you are married in Thailand under Thai law and your wife has not got an Australian

permanent visa 100 you should receive the full single benefit.

Centrelink will regard you as a couple one partner eligible as soon as your wife receives

a 309 visa. You will be regarded as single if your wife has a visitors visa 676 and is in Australia

with you.

If you are married and intend to live in Thailand you separate before you leave and then you will get the single pension. This would prevent them regarding you as a couple for payment purposes while she is holding the 100 visa

Your marriage status in Thailand is of no concern of Centrelink unless you both intend to return to Australia to live.

You may have problems if you return to Australia to claim the age pension as you may be restricted in your travel to and from Thailand for 2 years.

With a 309/100 visa your wife can work, with a 676 visa she is prohibited from working.

[fishhooks]

So David and Chiangdan:

For a 65+ male, the worst pension eligibility scenario is to be living in Australia together with your Thai wife who has been granted a "100" visa, and is under retirement age for a woman.

I hear you David on the point re legally married under Thai law, but I'm fairly sure that whether you choose to live in Australia or Thailand and are married here or there, Centrelink will deem you married no matter what.

The situations you raise re separating (for Centrelink reporting purposes), must surely have holes in it, or if not now will raise it's ugly head in the future.

I mean, do you really think that no matter if originally married in Australia or Thailand, you pack your bags and leave Oz to live in Thailand, Centrelink are going to cop your story that you are living under the one roof in the LOS, but separated.

Edited October 28, 2009 by fishhooks

[david96]

So David and Chiangdan:

For a 65+ male, the worst pension eligibility scenario is to be living in Australia together with your Thai wife who has been granted a "100" visa, and is under retirement age for a woman.

I hear you David on the point re legally married under Thai law, but I'm fairly sure that whether you choose to live in Australia or Thailand and are married here or there, Centrelink will deem you married no matter what.

The situations you raise re separating (for Centrelink reporting purposes), must surely have holes in it, or if not now will raise it's ugly head in the future.

I mean, do you really think that no matter if originally married in Australia or Thailand, you pack your bags and leave Oz to live in Thailand, Centrelink are going to cop your story that you are living under the one roof in the LOS, but separated.

If you separate you have to advise them within 14 days if you no longer have a "partner".

This means that you will not be assessed as a "couple" to use their own wording.

You will be assessed as a single person. What you do in Thailand is of no concern of

Centrelink and remember that your wife is a Thai citizen. The visa is only applicable to visit

and stay in Australia. She is no longer in Australia.

"partner" means "married", "defacto" or "same sex" as far as "relationships" are concerned.

Centrelink can not turn up in Thailand and start interviewing you and your wife.

They can in Australia if they so wish.

You could advise them that you have separated using a Statutory Declaration in Australia.

What problems would you expect in the future?

Australia does not have any social security agreements with Thailand.

And what you do in Thailand is no business of Centrelink, only if you bring money into Australia from Thailand, which you would not do if you had any sense ie. bank transfers.

You separate you do not divorce.

Edited October 28, 2009 by david96

[bombers]

as i understand it from this thread,if you left australia prior to being at the pensionable age of 65 to live in thailand you do not automatically become elligible for the state pension.To receive or qualify for the pension you would be required to return to australia 2 years before age 65 and take up permanent residence again.then at age 65 apply at local centre link office.

After that i think you just let centrelink know you will be going overseas to live in thailand and they will continue to pay into your aussie account.there will be strings attached to you still receiving the pension but i think it can be done.if you look back to the early postings in this thread,an aussie guy posted that he was receving his pension while living in thailand and on eof the criteria was that he keep in touch with centrelink as to his whereabouts.

[Artisi]

Did I read somewhere on T.V. a while back that the Age Pension (65+) for a male, almost cuts out if you are married to a younger lady who is still considered able to wok and provide family income.

I think a male member quoted that he was living in Thailand and had his pension almost zeroed when he advised Centrelink that he was married in the above circumstance.

Yes that is true. My father who is 68 yrs and his partner is 53yrs gets next to nothing on the aged pension because his partner is considered to be of working age until 55 for a woman and is forced by centrelink to actively seek employment. So all you 65+ men married to 20 something yr old thai women planning on retiring in Thailand on the pension forget it. By the time your wife reaches 55 and you become allegable for the pension the tree you were planted under will already be bearing fruit.

All of the above is incorrect, if you are 65+ and retired and married to a younger women you are assessed for part of the singles pension - in my case I am married to a younger lady, my pension is based on the amount of assets that I have and my wife is considered as being able to work, ever though she is a fulltime university student (PhD) and not working. My pension considering it is assets based and my wife is capable of employment is still nearly the full single rate.

No complaints from me - love the Aussie government and their support I get

[fishhooks]

Artisi:

If on-record with Centrelink as being married, how does your classification swing around to being looked at in a single situation.

I don't doubt you in any way, you know what you are getting, but I was always under the impression that Centrelink will always go for the lowest form of denominator and if they can pay out less to a married couple they would certainly use that avenue.

I'm not trying to be a "Sm..t A', just learning as not in the situation yet.

[ozzydom]

Did I read somewhere on T.V. a while back that the Age Pension (65+) for a male, almost cuts out if you are married to a younger lady who is still considered able to wok and provide family income.

I think a male member quoted that he was living in Thailand and had his pension almost zeroed when he advised Centrelink that he was married in the above circumstance.

Yes that is true. My father who is 68 yrs and his partner is 53yrs gets next to nothing on the aged pension because his partner is considered to be of working age until 55 for a woman and is forced by centrelink to actively seek employment. So all you 65+ men married to 20 something yr old thai women planning on retiring in Thailand on the pension forget it. By the time your wife reaches 55 and you become allegable for the pension the tree you were planted under will already be bearing fruit.

All of the above is incorrect, if you are 65+ and retired and married to a younger women you are assessed for part of the singles pension - in my case I am married to a younger lady, my pension is based on the amount of assets that I have and my wife is considered as being able to work, ever though she is a fulltime university student (PhD) and not working. My pension considering it is assets based and my wife is capable of employment is still

nearly the full single rate.

No complaints from me - love the Aussie government and their support I get

I have difficulty reconciling the above post, as you are in one of the three main catagories ,these being Single, Couple both eligible or Couple one eligible partner.

For the information of members I will quote from the latest edition of Australia Pensioner News International edition

RATES=Overseas Pension Rates .

Single Couple both eligible Couple one eligible partner

Per Year AUD $16010-80 AUD 24138-40 AUD $ 12069-20

supplement $509-60 $852-80 $426-40

As you state that your Pension is Asset Based ,I assume you are saying that you have assets in excess of the Allowable threshhold , and if so the amount would be deemed as earning 3%, this amount will reduce the pension you receive by 50 cents in the $ as a single or 25 cents in the $ as a couple.

Rate of payment is calculated under both income and assets tests. The test that results in the lower rate will be applied.

If your circumstances are as you state ,then your pension should be about $4000 per annum less than the Single Pension and that does not take into account any reductions from the assets and incomes tests.

[xerostar]

More on: The Return to Oz for a Paltry Pension Quandary

I've been in LOS for almost a year with my TW (who is many years younger than I).

I am a citizen by birth and have worked most of my life in Oz.

I had to return to Oz in March to finalise the sale of my house.

I have no assets and no income.

I've established a nice home here in LOS for myself, my wife and her family.

I've been doing part-time voluntary English teaching.

I've only a few thousand dollars left in savings.

I will be 65 next June.

I have a brand-new passport.

I am due to apply for the extension to my Non-Imm-O visa before the 8th December.

The quandary is, should I apply for the extension and get a big stamp in my passport

that says I want to stay in LOS for another 12 months or do I leave quietly and just

get a little exit stamp with no apparent intention to come back.

What I mean is, it won't look too good when trying to prove my resident status if they see

that I have a 12 month extension to stay (in LOS) in my passport.

I don't want to leave any "earlier than neccessary" so I was thinking about applying for a

30 day extension and then leaving for Oz in early January.

Six months away from my wife and our new baby is not going to be easy and should

not even be required!

Plus the expenses of air-fares, rent, insurance, setting up a cheap(?) flat with a bed,

a fridge and buying a cheap car will make the 6 months un-economic to say the least.

I'm not even sure if I can get more than a part-time job as my health is not too good.

Taking my TW and child with me would be a very costly exercise and besides she

doesn't want to go away from her mum and family and I agree, rightly so.

All because of stupid immigration laws that were designed to stop new immigrants

cashing in and returning to their homelands.

It has left us early-retired Aussie expats in an untenable position when applying for our pension.

It's like being sent to purgatory for no bloody reason!

My sin is that I gave up my job early and ceased to be a burden to the Oz economy.

We deserve better treatment!

After getting the pension (on the basis of being a resident) in June, I hope to apply for

a new Non-Imm-O Visa and return HOME to LOS for good!

The idea that my wife could also earn an income in LOS and be classed as

a supporting partner equivalent to a wife in Australia, is ridiculous.

She has no formal qualifications, so at most she would only get a Thai farm labourer's wage.

So I will be forced to declare our separation so that I can get the full single pension.

Well it is a separation isn't it?

Forced upon me!

I do have a choice I know ("do as we say or get lost and starve, for all we care!")

So I won't be telling a lie!

Besides, I want something in return for my involuntary sojourn in "the lucky country".

But I refuse to stay in Oz for 2 years because some nerdy pen-pusher in Canberra

made a rule one day so he could justify his job.

Jumping through hoops to the heedless will of politicians and their staff goes heavily against my grain!

I really sympathise with you guys who retired earlier than me because trying to prove

your resident status is going to be a devil of a job (and should not even be neccessary!)

Any advice or helpful suggestions gratefully accepted.

P.S. I am now fully qualified to join the: "thebitchersmoanersandwhinersclub.blogspot.com"

and you are cordially invited to join me!

[fishhooks]

Does one need to show their Passport to Centrelink when applying for an OAP?

You seem (xerostar) seem to be concerned about them noting your Thai Visa Status!

Centrelink definitely (if you have any record with them for Newstart etc) does have all of your entries and exit info directly from Immigration, but as to Visa info in your Passport?????

[GungaDin]

CL have no need to look at your passport, they're only interested in time spent abroad and in Aus.

Like the poster above said, they track you thru Aus Immigration info.

[Artisi]

xerostar - trust you aren't working (volunteer) in Thailand without a work permit - Thailand also has rules that many might not agree with - but rules are rules.

[xerostar]

When you apply for the pension, one of the first things they ask in the application form

is that you must prove your identity.

They give you a list of documents that you can use with their worth as ID in points.

You need 100 points.

Passport (current) 70

Citizenship Certificate 70

Birth Certificate 70

Certificate of Evidence of Resident Status 70

Australian Entry Visa 70

Driver’s Licence 40

Marriage Certificate 40

Divorce Papers 40

Birth Certificate(s) of any of your child(ren) 40

Education Examination Certificates 40

Bank Card or Statements 40

Mortgage Papers 40

Certificate of Name Change 40

Rates Notices 20

Financial Papers (inc. share or superannuation statements) 10

Taxation Assessment Notice 10

I think if you present your passport as proof of ID, they would most likely take the opportunity

to take a look through it to see what visas you have.

I suppose it depends on the officer.

If they are trying to determine if you are genuinely intending to stay in Australia, then finding a 12 month Non-Imm O visa

for Thailand in your passport would not strengthen your case.

Perhaps I'm being paranoid here but I have learned in the past not to give the opposition too many free points.

Or in other words, expect the worst and be prepared.

As prepared as you can be, with Murphy looking over your shoulder ..

So for me, a birth certificate and a driver's licence should do the trick.

Another problem:

If you've worked overseas for any length of time and paid into a super fund, you are obliged to apply

to that country for a pension before you can begin to ask for the Australian pension.

I spent a few years working in Europe, 30 years ago, so I'm going to start early on that one.

Evidently they have a section of Centrelink that will help you apply of that foreign pension.

I'll be giving them a call.

Once that avenue has been tested and settled, only then will Centrelink consider paying you the balance.

[fishhooks]

I've often wondered what right C/Link has in scrutinising ones Passport for info, particularly stamps etc from overseas countries.

They obviously have the right and I agree with that, to know the details of your arrivals and departures from Australia, but as to other info off shore, apart from the front identity page......................?

I don't think you are being paranoid, xerostar, but I think as a general strategy, you never hand any official any document that is not specifically required.

Congrats for reopening this thread which has had a pre-Christmas holiday!

[ozzydom]

xerostar, I would not worry to much about trying to hide your movements as Centrelink has direct access to the immigration data base, you will have little trouble getting a pension at 65 years of age, keeping it will be the problem as, if you leave Oz your pension will be automatically stopped after 13 weeks out of Oz unless you have done the qualifying two years.

If your pension is stopped it means returning to Oz to reapply.

Standing on your hind legs criticizing Centrelink is an excercise in futility , sometimes we just have to toe the line no matter what we think of the system.

Having said that, I wish you every success as hassles are something we can do without in our latter years.

[reallyok]

When you apply for the pension, one of the first things they ask in the application form

is that you must prove your identity.

They give you a list of documents that you can use with their worth as ID in points.

You need 100 points.

Passport (current) 70

Citizenship Certificate 70

Birth Certificate 70

Certificate of Evidence of Resident Status 70

Australian Entry Visa 70

Driver's Licence 40

Marriage Certificate 40

Divorce Papers 40

Birth Certificate(s) of any of your child(ren) 40

Education Examination Certificates 40

Bank Card or Statements 40

Mortgage Papers 40

Certificate of Name Change 40

Rates Notices 20

Financial Papers (inc. share or superannuation statements) 10

Taxation Assessment Notice 10

I think if you present your passport as proof of ID, they would most likely take the opportunity

to take a look through it to see what visas you have.

I suppose it depends on the officer.

If they are trying to determine if you are genuinely intending to stay in Australia, then finding a 12 month Non-Imm O visa

for Thailand in your passport would not strengthen your case.

Perhaps I'm being paranoid here but I have learned in the past not to give the opposition too many free points.

Or in other words, expect the worst and be prepared.

As prepared as you can be, with Murphy looking over your shoulder ..

So for me, a birth certificate and a driver's licence should do the trick.

Another problem:

If you've worked overseas for any length of time and paid into a super fund, you are obliged to apply

to that country for a pension before you can begin to ask for the Australian pension.

I spent a few years working in Europe, 30 years ago, so I'm going to start early on that one.

Evidently they have a section of Centrelink that will help you apply of that foreign pension.

I'll be giving them a call.

Once that avenue has been tested and settled, only then will Centrelink consider paying you the balance.

Working in Europe 30 yrs ago ! ..............Hope for your sake, that was'nt in the UK. I immigrated to OZ from UK aged 38 having worked since i was 15. Paid my stamp for over 23 years. But the 'buggers' froze my pension at 1973 rate and will not index it so i get a paltry few quid a month from the government who took my money for all those years.

Now if i lived in say, Germany, USA or a dozen other countries the bastards would index my pension, and i would be getting the same as a gentleman who has done a finantial migration from India or Pakistan or a dozen or so other 3rd world countries.

Don't expect anything from the bloody brit govt !

[reallyok]

Sorry to be the bearer of Bad News, my wife and I are both australian old age pensioners, we were leaving australia on the 21st of september last year on a 6 month tour of asia and europe, we were informed by immigration at Brisbane if we stayed out of australia for more than 13 weeks we would both lose our age pension and have to wait a further 3 months before being eligable to apply again,so we cut short our trip and returned after 12 weeks,when we returned on the 3rd of december we contacted a solicitor to check up on this new regulation, uptil now all we are getting is conflicting informationas soon as we hear something definite in writing we will post it here Nignoy

If you want the true entitlement story DO NOT go to a general centrelink office, they know bugger all and appear to be hellbent on reducing anything and everything.

There is a special office for pensions payable overseas and they are good. I was first told by centrelink ,that if i was overseas for "X" number of weeks my pension would cease ! However i got on to the overseas pension office and they checked my file and awarded me with full pension less medical entitlements which i will get if i return from Los to OZ.

So don't be panicked until you talk with the right people.

[reallyok]

I thought the 13 week rule applied to other Centrelink payments such as the dole, not aged pensions. I would take the advice of immigration officers at the airport with a large grain of salt.

There are also other rules as well as being in Australia on the day you lodge. You must have lived in Australia for a minimum number of years during your working life- I think 20 years - and paid tax during that time. It's all on the Centrelink website.

We both receive aged pension as previously stated, , on the 9th of december we were called into centrelink Caboolture for an interview, to prove that we actually did return to australia, we were informed that as aged pensioners we have to inform centrelink when leaving australia and if leaving for over 13 weeks financial penalties could apply,Nignoy

Hi Nignoy, i am from Rocksberg and also used the Caboolture office. And that is where i got all the bloody strife till i found the "overseas pension" phone number. I am now happily ensconced on Samui and get my full pension. .......ReallyOK mate !

[brianb1944]

There is a great deal of misinformation contained in the above postings.

I am an OAP living in Thailand with a young wife, in receipt of a comfortable Supernnuation, and still qualified for some Age Pension.

I am required to return to Oz after 26 weeks to remain eligible for the amount that I receive, as I have stuff to do in oz, and grandkids to visit, this is no hardship.

As many people have pointed out, the info is all available on the website, but may take a bit of finding. I would recommend writing or Emailing Centrelink with any queries, rather than phoning, you will then receive "hard copy " reply.

Incidentally, I worked for Centrelink for 26 years prior to retirement.

[Xangsamhua]

There is a great deal of misinformation contained in the above postings.

I am an OAP living in Thailand with a young wife, in receipt of a comfortable Supernnuation, and still qualified for some Age Pension.

I am required to return to Oz after 26 weeks to remain eligible for the amount that I receive, as I have stuff to do in oz, and grandkids to visit, this is no hardship.

As many people have pointed out, the info is all available on the website, but may take a bit of finding. I would recommend writing or Emailing Centrelink with any queries, rather than phoning, you will then receive "hard copy " reply.

Incidentally, I worked for Centrelink for 26 years prior to retirement.

Brian, were you continuously resident in Australia when you applied for the OAP? If so, wouldn't you be entitled to your pension payments wherever you resided subsequently?

Do you mean you have to return to Australia every 26 weeks to remain eligible for the pension or to obtain certain benefits that you would not receive without returning? That is, would you still receive some of your pension if you didn't return?

When you suggest writing or emailing Centrelink are you referring to Centrelink International in Hobart?

Thanks for your advice.