Starbucks/mcdonalds War

[goatfarmer]

Great to see McD competing with Starbucks. I would never go into McD except for the occasional cone. Now I'm persuaded. Coffee is good. Wifi is free - Sbucks wants to charge 150 baht. Great to see the giants doing battle.

[Onnutrd]

I use to work as a manager in new zealand for starbucks and we'd charge customers about 250 baht for 1 hour wifi access..

Wonder if Mc's gonna do anything in nz too?

Edited January 13, 2008 by Onnutrd

[rgs2001uk]

i will never set foot in either of these places, and thats not because they are american, or anything to do with the quality of their products (which i cant comment on as i have never set foot in a starbucks and last was in a macdonalds about 20 years ago).

[backflip]

"i will never set foot in either of these places, and thats not because they are american, or anything to do with the quality of their products..."

This sounds very angry, and you don't provide an explanation. Oh well.

At least in America, both Starbuck's and McD's use the same coffee bean vendor.

[wintermute]

I have a feeling Starbucks may lose this one. The common "office worker" doesn't give two craps about where his coffee is from as long as it's fresh, tastes good, and is reasonably priced. If Mcdonalds can provide similar quality at even 75% of Starbuck's price they will win. Mcdonalds has enough franchises and enough capital to make it happen. Plus the fact that McD's is offering free wifi pretty much sinks it. Now if they expand on their McCafe concept a bit more and provide better seating and lighting then it's a homerun.

[rgs2001uk]

"i will never set foot in either of these places, and thats not because they are american, or anything to do with the quality of their products..."

This sounds very angry, and you don't provide an explanation. Oh well.

At least in America, both Starbuck's and McD's use the same coffee bean vendor.

not anger at all, just choosing not to buy their products for personal reasons.

one of these companies donated money to what in my opinion was a terrorist organization, the other i will not use because of the way its workers are treated.

if a walmart ever came to thailand i would not use it either, again for its policy towards its employees.

there is another one, off the top of my head i can recall its name, which i will not use, again due to its policy of making workers clock off during quiet periods and clock back on agian during busy periods.

[Lilawadee]

I have a feeling Starbucks may lose this one. The common 'office worker' doesn't give two craps about where his coffee is from as long as it's fresh, tastes good, and is reasonably priced.

Heck, the average starbucks customer doesn't give two craps about coffee, period. It's not about coffee, it's about being trendy.

And Starbucks are trendier than McDonalds, who's corporate mascotte is a scary clown, their marketing target is young kids.

I think Starbucks will be okay.

And no, I don't visit either of them either, especially not in Thailand, but I do find the marketing thinking behind such businesses very intriguing.

[jetjock]

My guess is that it will prove to be a very smart move by MCD getting into the premium coffee business. Free internet will also help contribute to their business. I do not drink coffee so have absolutely no idea how good their new coffee is however some of the recent consumer tests I have read in the news shows that testers prefered MCD over SBUX. I think SBUX is a little scared as they have recently announced they are cutting back on their expansion plans. I am willing to put my money where my mouth is so I will be adding some more MCD to my portfolio next week so I guess in sort of an indirect way I will eventually find out how much people like their new coffee.

(edited spelling)

Edited January 13, 2008 by jetjock

[bri1guy]

How much is MICKY DEES charging for there Lattes??? & can you get Mochos flavors etc???

[Jingthing]

I usually drink either brewed coffee or espresso.

The espresso is OK at McDonalds. I don't think the McCafe's are doing brewed coffee and if they did I doubt they would as good as Starbucks because they don't even tell you the variety of their beans.

I did try some kind of caramel cappuccino at McD. First of all, these are made by a machine, not a human. Secondly, the milky stuff had a chemically taste to me, almost like dairy creamer. I found it disgusting, never again.

So cheaper yes, not better.

Edited January 13, 2008 by Jingthing

[TheWalkingMan]

Coffee at McD's??!!!

Actually, I recall reading somewhere that McD coffee was voted #1 (maybe 2006 or 2007) in the US for over the counter coffee. Apparently, over the last few years they have been trying to capture more of the market and have made a serious effort to satisfy the consumers' tastes.

TheWalkingMan

[Flash500]

they do coffee in 7/11's so that'll do me....why pay stoopid prices for what is basically hot water and a bit coffe, sugar and milk....its all <deleted>

[calibanjr.]

McD's doing free WiFi in Chiang Mai? I just got back from a two month trip to LA. After a few weeks of Thai food, I'll be up for the McMuffin bfast. If the WiFi's there, I might not get out til after lunch!

McD's coffee in the states is serviceable for a decent price. It is weak, "American" style coffee, but I'm used to it. Starbucks or real serious "cafe" coffee is more of a treat for me. Favorite "worker-bee",cheap but effective coffee is Dunkin' Donuts coffee, on the East Coast. Way more popular than Starbucks in New England.

Edited January 13, 2008 by calibanjr.

[DP25]

Starbucks will be fine. McDonald's may get the Thai office workers, government employees, and expats, but Starbucks will continue to be popular with short term tourists and some wealthy expats, and with Thais willing to make a small investment in order to meet these people.

[sbk]

So, is this free wifi in McDonalds here in Thailand? Every McDonalds? Or just the ones in Bangkok?

[CarlBkk]

Anyone tried the "gourmet" coffee in McD's? Absolutely awful so far. As for chains here, S&P's bluecup, Black Canyon and Cafe Nero I find much nicer than Starbucks.

[Prakanong]

Great to see McD competing with Starbucks. I would never go into McD except for the occasional cone. Now I'm persuaded. Coffee is good. Wifi is free - Sbucks wants to charge 150 baht. Great to see the giants doing battle.

Coincidence - I just did two case studies at school today and we covered Wal-Mart and Starbucks oversea's expansion.

MacD and its competing with Starbuck over coffee was mentioned.

I never go to Starbucks but I wonder if the let students sit and study for hours using their wiFi?

The MacD close to my house has them in all day with no restrictions - the one close to the school I attend has signs asking them not to study during peak times - whatever they are providing a service to students to study.

[popshirt]

Very simple choice for me, too many kids at McDonald's !

[DisainaM]

this free wifi is a mad thing.

when they started in Coffee World this free wifi, I used it in bkk in Sukumv.Soi8 near Nana,

and it was really working.

In the Avenue in Pattaya, they had a protection key, but it isn`t working,

now, they charge the customers at the coffe World in the Pattaya Beach World right before Soi 6.

[Monroe]

I don't know if I'd go to either place just for wifi considering I have it at home and I have a card on my laptop that keeps me connected wherever I am, but say I wanted to eat and couldn't make something myself. Starbucks sells overpriced sandwiches and bagels that are alright and McDonald's sells cheap (by Western standards), fast food that's also alright at best.

The atmosphere in McDonald's is so bad I wouldn't want to be there for more than a few minutes at a time. By atmosphere, I don't mean the service (with a smile =) or people--those are always great--but the whole smelling like vat of oil (which sticks to the clothes very strongly).

Starbucks, on the other hand, has a decent atmosphere and smells of coffee. Unfortunately, everyone there is a <deleted> (including my brother) so, either way, I lose.

What would really clinch it is if McDonald's were to sell breakfast all day. Then I could go in, get and Egg McMuffin, some orange juice and get out. I'm not the only one who feels this way =)

[canuckamuck]

Anyone tried the "gourmet" coffee in McD's? Absolutely awful so far. As for chains here, S&P's bluecup, Black Canyon and Cafe Nero I find much nicer than Starbucks.

Nothing personal but I believe the opposite of everything you just said.

Thai coffee chains should be considered some form of coffee genocide. I have never had a palatable cup in five years. Starbucks is better but it is for people who live with the illusion of price equals quality and or value.

Thank you Ronald for bringing affordable real coffee to Thailand.

Edited January 14, 2008 by canuckamuck

[Ulysses G.]

What would really clinch it is if McDonald's were to sell breakfast all day. Then I could go in, get and Egg McMuffin, some orange juice and get out. I'm not the only one who feels this way =)

Only, they've gotten rid of the English Muffins in Thailand - or so I am told. They got rid of the pancakes too!

[Briggsy]

I buy my coffee from street stalls. It comes in a cup or plastic bag. It costs 10-15 Baht. I have maintained for a very long time that in Starbucks you are paying the best part of 100 Baht for a seat in an air-conditioned room. That's fine if you are willing to pay for a seat. Many are.

I haven't bought anything from McDonalds for many years as I personally feel the food is very low quality for the price they charge and the environment of hard plastic, lots of red, loads of screaming kids is a fairly unpleasant one. Obviously from the annual sales in Thailand, many do not share my opinion.

[thaitot]

There are a few things we have overlooked on this thread.

As far as taste mcdonalds did very well in a recent survey.(I do not know what one)

Ambience yes.

Trendy yes.

Starbucks has that.

In the usa the Starbucks drive thrus are always stacked up so ambience and wireless I will give credit where credit is due but not all the credit.

Taste and consistancy does mean allot.

Starbucks has beed successfull in creating a network that guarantees you can go to any starbucks and consistantly get a good cup of coffee,Thailand or the usa or where ever.

Guess who mastered this and made it a success . Mcdonalds

Same burger same fries same taste world wide.

The coffee market is well overdue for this giant

Please don't bash me for my cup of coffee in the USA

Start you own thread

[kmart]

I think Starbucks should retaliate by serving horrible food.

[Jingthing]

I only had the one caramel cap at the McD cafe in Pattaya. It was awful. I will never go back. So if they consistently have chemically crap, you can keep it.

Edited January 14, 2008 by Jingthing

[canuckamuck]

To be fair Jingthing, a caramel cappuccino is not a coffee. It is a form of coffee flavored milkshake that can be hot or cold. This is a major appeal for the Starbucks type chains. Coffee is not the star, the extra ingredients are. You will find that people who drink coffee black with no sugar, find Starbucks coffee to be over saturated and not at all as nice as a cup brewed at home. MacDonald’s Coffee tastes good black. I think from there you can add as many creamy, sugary, empty calories as you want. Coffee for most people is a flavor you add to dairy drinks.

[Jingthing]

To be fair Jingthing, a caramel cappuccino is not a coffee. It is a form of coffee flavored milkshake that can be hot or cold. This is a major appeal for the Starbucks type chains. Coffee is not the star, the extra ingredients are. You will find that people who drink coffee black with no sugar, find Starbucks coffee to be over saturated and not at all as nice as a cup brewed at home. MacDonald’s Coffee tastes good black. I think from there you can add as many creamy, sugary, empty calories as you want. Coffee for most people is a flavor you add to dairy drinks.

I usually drink brewed coffee black anyway but I thought I would try a milky thing to compare to Starbucks, and it didn't even come close in quality. It wasn't the caramel that was the problem, it was the milky stuff which really tasted like non-dairy chemical creamer to me. It was vile. I did try a McD's espresso and found it quite OK. I didn't even know they sell premium brewed coffee. I will try that if they do indeed have it.

I did have a funny conflict at McD's when I tried to order a triple shot espresso. Their menu offers 1 or 2 shots, but there is a note on the menu saying get an extra shot (I presumed on any drink) for a certain amount of baht. Well I wanted a 2 shot espresso with the 1 shot added at the special price, as the menu appeared to offer. You can imagine the Weho style scene as I tried to make them enforce their menu offer. And yes they eventually allowed it. I am sure if I try it again, they will give me the same headache.

Edited January 14, 2008 by Jingthing

[thedude]

Starbucks will be fine. McDonald's may get the Thai office workers, government employees, and expats, but Starbucks will continue to be popular with short term tourists and some wealthy expats, and with Thais willing to make a small investment in order to meet these people.

yeah right, the poor locals here save for months just for the rare opportunity to enter a starbucks and rub-shoulders with the who's who of expatdom. that is just about the most patronising thing said about locals i've read in a while.

you sir are a troll.

[TommyGun]

I have had coffee in both of these places and find them equal good. However, i have had coffee at true and find it much better.

Edited January 14, 2008 by TommyGun