Song Kran And Talcum Powder

[wasabi]

I have never attended Song Kran in Thailand, I was hoping to this year but it looks like I may miss it. I understand the point of playing with water, in regards to blessing and cleansing, though I also realize it has grown from this to plain old firefights, but one of the things I've always wondered is why do people smear Talcum powder on each other? Has this always been a part of it? Is it to help dry the water? It just seems weird most people end up looking like melted ghosts.

http://www.2bangkok.com/2bangkok/songkran/index2004.shtml

[Briggsy]

It may have started out as a cooling method in very hot April. Now, however, it is an excuse for men often in drunken gangs to sexually assault women under the guise of 'harmless fun'. If you don't believe me, go witness it yourself.

[TheDon]

It may have started out as a cooling method in very hot April. Now, however, it is an excuse for men often in drunken gangs to sexually assault women under the guise of 'harmless fun'. If you don't believe me, go witness it yourself.

That is so false hahahahahaha

[sweetchariot]

It may have started out as a cooling method in very hot April. Now, however, it is an excuse for men often in drunken gangs to sexually assault women under the guise of 'harmless fun'. If you don't believe me, go witness it yourself.

Where on earth did you get that from?

[AlexLah]

Confirmed.

Sad but true....

[TheDon]

Thats so sad if people think its true, saying the powder is all about sexual assualt is just being completely negative and shows that you have no common sense IMO

[intumult]

sexual assault?? <deleted>?

And last year they used white clay here, not talcum powder and most of it was a quick dab / smear on the face. Each time I allowed myself to be daubed the Thais were genuinely pleased. Wet n white, but it was great fun.

[sriracha john]

sexual assault?? <deleted>?

And last year they used white clay here, not talcum powder and most of it was a quick dab / smear on the face. Each time I allowed myself to be daubed the Thais were genuinely pleased. Wet n white, but it was great fun.

Can we presume then that you are NOT a young Thai woman?

They are the targets of these sexual assaults that often occur under the guise of "just having good, clean fun" as Briggsy pointed out... although it's not, as later distorted by TheDon, to the extent that is what it is "all" about.

[isabelle17]

It may have started out as a cooling method in very hot April. Now, however, it is an excuse for men often in drunken gangs to sexually assault women under the guise of 'harmless fun'. If you don't believe me, go witness it yourself.

That is so false hahahahahaha

No. Not completely false. Happened to me on songkran last year.

I think the wording is off a little bit...but songkran is an excuse for a lot of thai guys (or people in general, even some women) to get drunk and do stupid things. So yes, somewhat true....

[Axistar]

Wet and white not my idea of a good time - but good on those that get into it

(Sorry to hear some taking advantage of the girls though)

[Eric1949]

I think songkran has gone way over the top. My first 3 years in Thailand were in BKK. They were everywhere, the water thugs. I was on a bus once, and we were attacked by a gang of water thugs using talc as well, there was a poor old Thai lady dressed in black, going to a cremation, she was covered in wet talc. The poor lady cried her eyes out. Another time a gang was at a road junction and thought it so funny when they made people fall off their motorcycles. I have seen many accidents like this, including talc and water thrown over cars/taxis etc casing them to swerve and brake sharply because they could not see out of their windscreens.

What started off as a small dab on the face has now got out of control.

Also, I've seen fire hoses used, and of course the pickups and larger trucks with gangs throwing buckets of water over everyone.

[billd766]

Well I suppose it depends on where you celebrate Songkran. I live out in the boonies 65km from Khampaeng Phet and when we go out it is mostly around the villages until the day we actually go to KPP.

Around the villages it IS fun and in the pickup we always slow down for the small kids to "get the farang" ie me at 63. Most of it is good fun and yes the Thais love it when they get the chance to slap all the powder on me which mostly is not talc and comes in many colours.

It is mostly good clean fun, after you slosh the gunk off and very often you fill up with water at somebodys hosepipe and have a drink as well.

The driver always stays dry and you have to be quick at times to shout out something like "mai dai khun kaprot" and you are mostly left alone. The big problem with driving is that when you get ambushed and stop a lot of the time they shove a bottle of lao khao at you and tell you to have a slug. I manage now to stick my tongue in the neck of the bottle and appear to drink a lot while the tip of my tongue gets drunk. It tastes horrible.

Last year my son was nearly 3 and he started to enjoy it a lot more but when the Thais see small kids they don't dump lots of stuff on them while the farangs in KPP do.

This year who knows what he will be like?

:D

[intumult]

^^^ Different places, different attitudes.

I did see a lot of cars and their owners not being daubed or have water thrown over them when the driver or a passenger indicated that they did not want it to happen.

Fire hoses, trucks full of people throwing water etc., yes but was mainly contained to certain areas. Like I say, maybe different attitudes, though I can imagine a few would still act yobbish here.

And it all ceased at around 8 / 9 p.m. when people were getting ready to go or were going out for the evening.

[Briggsy]

I stand by my original post. I obviously don't think that the majority of people who use talcum powder, chalk, flour etc are in it for a grope but my point, probably badly expressed, is that highly inappropriate touching, usually in gangs for safety, is commonplace. The powder thing is a cover.

I notice that 2 posters seem to think I'm nuts. Well, if you're not a Thai woman, it's quite possible for you never to notice what's going on in the madness. But believe me I have witnessed this despicable behaviour on numerous occasions. I now leave Thailand every Songkran, not for this reason but simply because on my precious time off I don't really want to be engaged in a 12-hour water fight for 3-5 days on the trot. I'd rather do something else.

[tw25rw]

I noticed that certain people were left alone, notably the aged, people pushing food stalls and women in muslim garb, so it's not a complete free for all.

Being large and white was no protection though....

For me, the most annoying thing was the western tourists who don't keep in the spirit of it and are drenching people at all hours, regardless of whether they want it.

[JetsetBkk]

I know several long-stay farangs who prefer to leave Thailand during Songkran - it's a good time to go visit the rellies or Vietnam, Cambodia, etc. The days of "Please mister can I..." followed by a gentle dab of white powder on the cheek(s) are long gone in most tourist areas of Thailand. I'll be stocking up the fridges...

And the doctors and pharmacies do a roaring trade after Songkran - eye infections, sore throats, stomach upsets - all from dirty water being used. And the hospitals and mortuaries get extra business too. What a great time of year.

[Mosha]

I always slow down to be soaked, it gets a bit much when it's iced water though. 1 youth on a motor bike tried to escape his soaking a couple of years back. As he approached some very young children, he accelerated and lost control. He woke up in the local hospital with a broken arm

[JSixpack]

I have never attended Song Kran in Thailand, I was hoping to this year but it looks like I may miss it.

Lucky you. Some of us have to go rather far out of our way to miss it.

[a2396]

I think songkran has gone way over the top. My first 3 years in Thailand were in BKK. They were everywhere, the water thugs. I was on a bus once, and we were attacked by a gang of water thugs using talc as well, there was a poor old Thai lady dressed in black, going to a cremation, she was covered in wet talc. The poor lady cried her eyes out. Another time a gang was at a road junction and thought it so funny when they made people fall off their motorcycles. I have seen many accidents like this, including talc and water thrown over cars/taxis etc casing them to swerve and brake sharply because they could not see out of their windscreens.

What started off as a small dab on the face has now got out of control.

Also, I've seen fire hoses used, and of course the pickups and larger trucks with gangs throwing buckets of water over everyone.

EXACTLY!! The whole thing is out of control. The best thing is to leave the country during this time. Second to that is to stay home & off the roads, if possible. Any motorcycle riding is asking for an accident for sure.

[jts-khorat]

I stand by my original post. I obviously don't think that the majority of people who use talcum powder, chalk, flour etc are in it for a grope but my point, probably badly expressed, is that highly inappropriate touching, usually in gangs for safety, is commonplace. The powder thing is a cover.

In the places in rural Thailand where I could enjoy Songkran so far, a female would never be out alone without (numerous) male companionship, so I would really not think it possible what you just described without it ending in a serious altercation.

However you might misunderstand the perfect situation for bar girls advertising for future business if you mix into Songkran in a hooker area, and shame on you if you brought your girlfriend with you then. She being feeled up by drunk people would be entirely your fault (not that I condone such behavior or would contemplate it for myself).

Mixing half naked girls in wet shirts and drunk people is a recipe for bad things to happen, so one would think even where it is not a customer relationship playing out in front of your eyes, the girls do know the risk and welcome it obviously, or they would not be at that time in this place all by themselves.

And oh wonder, there are actually girls who would not mind a little bit of fun without it being labeled as 'sexual assault' right there, but I guess this digresses too far from some narrow-minded perspectives about the rights of women to #also# have some fun. Better put them in the kitchen, is that your position...?

Those two situations being entirely different and the latter having nothing at all to do with Songkran. How you can mix up one with the other is beyond me, if it was not intentional to mislead the OP on his question.

[isabelle17]

I have never attended songkran in places like bangkok, pattaya, phuket, etc. I was in a very rural area last year (which may perhaps be why I had so many problems as I was the only falang, and well, a female.) Songkran WOULD be fun if it weren't for the fact that some people tend to u.se this day as an excuse to do stupid things. I went with a female thai friend of mine and her brother. Of course her brother wasnt paying much attention to us. If it werent for my thai female friend...well lets just say I am VERY happy that I was with her. Things are just way over the top on that day. It is a very fun holiday, but the "fun" has just gone too far.

As for the use of talcum powder, I think it has to do with the fact that thai people use it against the heat and well, its an excuse for thai people to touch (and grope....) other people.

By the way, I do think songkran is a good holiday....but there needs to be more police or something (but then again...this is Thailand we are talking about...)

[happylarry]

Hey jts-khorat

where you are, do females not have to go to work or shopping etc over songkran. Why is it you think decent females always go out with a large escort?

I have been living in Samui for the last four years and the traffic on the main ring road through Chaweng is always at walking pace all day because groups of revellers are standing across the road stopping ordinary decent girls (and others of course) riding their motorbikes to work etc and daubing them with talc. I admit that I have only seen innocent daubing carried out but I have no doubts at all that some men when drunk take it further than they should. But dont say that it only goes on in red light districts because that is nonsense...it is everywhere.

[jts-khorat]

I was in a very rural area last year (which may perhaps be why I had so many problems as I was the only falang, and well, a female.) Songkran WOULD be fun if it weren't for the fact that some people tend to u.se this day as an excuse to do stupid things. I went with a female thai friend of mine and her brother. Of course her brother wasnt paying much attention to us. If it werent for my thai female friend...well lets just say I am VERY happy that I was with her.

This would be abolsutely at odds with caring for a respected guest of the family if the brother of your friend did not take note of aberrant behaviour and take appropriate steps by either preventing it to happen further-on or removing you from the place where this situation was occuring.

Which ergo means, the social situation from his end was not seen as you describe it (you being a guest of his family or person he had any social responsibility for) or there are other details you fail to mention as this would simply not be possible, especially in #very# rural Thailand. It is not unheard of people being knived or shot over slights much smaller than groping a girl.

[jts-khorat]

Hey jts-khorat

where you are, do females not have to go to work or shopping etc over songkran. Why is it you think decent females always go out with a large escort?

I have been living in Samui for the last four years and the traffic on the main ring road through Chaweng is always at walking pace all day because groups of revellers are standing across the road stopping ordinary decent girls (and others of course) riding their motorbikes to work etc and daubing them with talc. I admit that I have only seen innocent daubing carried out but I have no doubts at all that some men when drunk take it further than they should. But dont say that it only goes on in red light districts because that is nonsense...it is everywhere.

Just recapitulating, the point of Briggsy was that countrywide, drunk Thais men do use talcum powder regularly to sexually assault any female around them on Songkran, insinuating that this might be actually the only reason that powder is used at all by calling these happenings "commonplace". You having seen only harmless daubings instead validates my point, that Briggsy is untrue to the point of being ridiculous in his statement.

And yes, I do believe that there are not a large number of "decent" lone females going to work in the middle of a red light district (as the center of Chaweng pretty much is), and if they do, maybe their choice of work place is rather unlucky with personal risks of aberrant behaviour by criminal or intoxicated individuals towards them well known beforehand and surely taken as either accepted or ignored (I am not just talking about assault, but also theft and other crimes).

You work in the gutter, you are part of it; and there is NO need to go shopping on Songkran if you are not totally demented; it is an event not easily forgotten by anybody.

To repeat, the latter has nothing to do with Songkran at all, which can be a lot of fun if done in the right places and with the right people. Your free choice totally as would be anybodies.

Edited February 16, 2008 by jts-khorat

[LinkPopularity]

I don't understand all the complaining; 2 options;

1)you're young of heart and have a great time

2)you stay home ... but please, stop b!itching about it ...

[ozzydom]

I sickened of Songkran in the early days after being hit dead centre by a bucket of cold water complete with chunks of ice,thrown by some drunk farangs in the back of a pick-up.

Problem was I was sitting at a sidewalk table enjoying my lunch.

Later the same day while driving home to Hang Dong, an extremely drunk adult let me have a bucket full as I stopped for the lights near Lotus,trouble was he was using a metal bucket and let the lot go and knocked my passenger side window out..

Here in the village ,the elderly ladies take part in the festivities,the difference is they ask consent ,then they sprinkle water on your head with a small sprig of leaves then an offsider puts a dab of powder on forehead and cheeks,it is more like a religious ceremony.

MIL tells that that is how it was always done.

[Briggsy]

I don't understand all the complaining; 2 options;

1)you're young of heart and have a great time

2)you stay home ... but please, stop b!itching about it ...

What if I need to go to work?

[Briggsy]

jts, your connection of my post to red-light areas is not factual and a deliberate smear in order to discredit me and by extension what I have posted.

I was not referring to red-light areas or prostitutes. I am well aware of the social differences in Thailand between hookers and respectable girls.

FYI, these incidents are widespread. Please ask any females you know (not hookers, please) what they do over Songkran and would they walk alone through a busy water-fighting area. One incident I witnessed was in rural Trang. Alcohol and a group mentality made for a very ugly and intimidating atmosphere.

Perhaps you'd like to go and put these posts in the ladies sub-forum and see what kind of response you get.

[sweetchariot]

Every time there is a thread about Songkran, all the oldies start whinging and whining 'it's not like it used to be' etc.

Best time of the year IMHO, remember when you used to have FUN?

[happylarry]

jts please reread my post , I did NOT say the centre of Chaweng....I said the main ring road, which is well away from the sort of area's that you seem to be obsessed with. And even if I was talking about the centre, there are still bank's, supermarket's, pharmacy's, shop's and restaurants that mostly employ decent hardworking girls that need to travel to get to work. Or maybe you just dont notice that type of girl, aye.