Ups - Uninterruptible Power Supply

[regedit]

Anyone have any experience of buying a UPS here - brands recommended or those to avoid ? Thanks.

[Tywais]

The simple answer is APC brand. I manage a large number of computers at the university, networking equipment and expensive electronic systems and that is all I order. Same for my home use. Bit more expensive but features and reliability are high.

[Crossy]

Yep ^^^

You really do get what you pay for, look in almost any data centre and you'll find APC kit, nuff said.

[crockett]

As Crossy and Tywais said... APC

Just bought the one below in Fortune, 4750 Baht

http://www.apc.com/resource/include/techsp..._basket=4605,3c

[simcity]

I got a Leonics years ago, did not have problem.

Next time i will look at the APC

I was surprise to see if you buy a power supply of quality for the computer, everything run smoothly

Price can got high for it, i think the replacement i got was about 3000 baht, compare to some at 250 baht

How much you guys spending in the power supply, normal home computer ?

[Crossy]

I was surprise to see if you buy a power supply of quality for the computer, everything run smoothly

Price can got high for it, i think the replacement i got was about 3000 baht, compare to some at 250 baht

How much you guys spending in the power supply, normal home computer ?

Good observation

Whilst I've not spent 3000 Baht on a PSU (IIRC think my last was about 1500), the cheapo Chinese 250 Baht units really are a false economy.

[stumonster]

I will add a vote for an APC UPS also

[Tywais]

How much you guys spending in the power supply, normal home computer ?

The power supply I currently have is a CoolerMaster 550W True Power and cost about 4500 Baht. Considering the cost of building my system, I don't want to take chances. I like that phrase Crossy, "false economy".

[Mumbo Jumbo]

This may be of some interest..

http://www.jetcafe.org/npc/doc/ups-faq.html

[davethailand]

I've had a Leonics one also for a while (4 years) and its worked (and still does) perfectly.

[Crossy]

I've had a Leonics one also for a while (4 years) and its worked (and still does) perfectly.

Must be about time for a battery replacement if you've not already done it

[bkk_mike]

I've had

APC (got in 2001 - lasted a long time, but was pretty pricey - needs a new battery, but I was in a hurry to get a replacement, so just bought a new UPS.)

Leonics (actually my most commonly used UPSs, use them on the TV and satellite as well as on several computers - seem pretty reliable - Again, I have one that needs a new battery).

Warrant - only lasted a couple of years, and then leaked battery acid when it failed.

Best II - only lasted a couple of years, but it didn't leak.

In fact - while I'm thinking about it - where would I go to pick up a replacement battery for the APC or Leonics. (Better to do it now while they're not in use, rather than rush out to buy yet another new UPS when one dies).

[Crossy]

In fact - while I'm thinking about it - where would I go to pick up a replacement battery for the APC or Leonics.

Amorn will have suitable batteries, take the old one to verify size and ratings

Branches at :-

- Carrefour Srinakarin

- Fortune Tower Rachada

- Tesco Lotus Rama IV

- 3/F Old Siam Mall

[rak sa_ngop]

My "Mate" distributed by Powermatic which I bought at IT City, Pantip Plaza has died after less than 2 years. Probably needs a new battery.

But it was cheap. (1750 baht)

[lopburi3]

I have had a cheapo "Bright" unit for about 5 years or so and no problems other than battery replacements. Just bought a new battery last week at IT City in Bangkapi at 750 baht. It is called "Leonics BB Battery 12v 7AH" with item number PW3-000012

[OxfordWill]

I have a maxtech ups cost about 1800, stabiliser etc. Of course, since I got it, the power hasnt failed once.

[Greenside]

I have recently moved to an area that gets more power interuptions than where I lived before and so bought my very first UPS from an outfit called Hiracha Components on the second floor of the Computer Centre on the Superhighway (top of the stairs about 10 o'clock). I bought a 1000VA (35W) Qmax which they assured me would run my gear but it failed when I tested it as did a replacement one they gave me to try.

Now I've read the useful jetcafe document about UPS's (see above) but still can't really figure out what went wrong here. My computer has a 450w Asus power supply which is rated at 4.5 amps at 200 - 220v and if I understand that right it should be that a 1000 VA unit should at least pick up the mains failure and run it for enough time to power down in an orderly way.

The Qmax unit was 1850 bht and while I thought that was far enough north of the bargain basement to get me something OK, maybe it's just not a great design. The shop wanted me to change up to an APC 1000VA 60W UPS but I wasn't really up for spending the 6000 bht they're asking so thought I'd explore the subject a bit more first.

I only want to avoid losing data in the event of a power failure so 5 or 10 minutes of battery time would be fine - can someone suggest anything in a medium price range I should try?

Incidentally, I would like to recommend the shop warmly because having supplied me with the replacement unit without hassle, they actually gave me a full refund today, even though I'd have been quite happy with a credit note. That's good service in the computer business in Thailand, I think.

[Tywais]

I only want to avoid losing data in the event of a power failure so 5 or 10 minutes of battery time would be fine - can someone suggest anything in a medium price range I should try?

The first UPS I bought was about 6 years ago and it was a Powercom 500VA (APC and my budget didn't meet up at that time) . It only just now started missing glitches and that is due to the battery (same battery from when I bought it 6 years ago). Upgraded my computer and needed a 2nd UPS so bought a 650 VA APC with USB monitoring. So, from my experience the Powercom worked exceptionally well.

As for your PC power supply rating of 450 Watts, most likely you will be pulling half that with the PC and a monitor attached. My APC montitoring software shows mine at about 180 watts and that is with a dual core computer, 3 hard drives, a high performance video card, 4G memory, monitor etc. Converting your 450 (figuring max load) then it would require a 650VA UPS. 1000 will give you more run time before shutdown. An 800VA Powercom is about 2300 baht and can be seen here > http://www.shop4thai.com/en/category/Perip...39&brand=23

[Greenside]

As for your PC power supply rating of 450 Watts, most likely you will be pulling half that with the PC and a monitor attached. My APC montitoring software shows mine at about 180 watts and that is with a dual core computer, 3 hard drives, a high performance video card, 4G memory, monitor etc. Converting your 450 (figuring max load) then it would require a 650VA UPS. 1000 will give you more run time before shutdown. An 800VA Powercom is about 2300 baht and can be seen here > http://www.shop4thai.com/en/category/Perip...39&brand=23

My computer is about the same spec as your setup so it doesn't sound as if the shop was out of line pointing me to the 1000 VA unit. Do you think it's just the quality of the Qmax gear that was the problem?

[lopburi3]

Are you letting the batteries charge a while before you test the units? It is strange that two units of that size would not work. Do you perhaps have something else plugged into the same power strip (if you using one)? Such as a laser printer? Are you pulling the UPS plug to test?

[Greenside]

Are you letting the batteries charge a while before you test the units? It is strange that two units of that size would not work. Do you perhaps have something else plugged into the same power strip (if you using one)? Such as a laser printer? Are you pulling the UPS plug to test?

I think I covered all those pitfalls except maybe one.

• Minimum 9 hours charge before using either of the units
  
• Plugged into a power strip which was then turned off to simulate the power loss
  
• Removed all peripherals including monitors and ran them separately leaving only the computer itself plugged through the UPS
  
• Only thing I couldn't cover is that the system in my house is not grounded but the documentation that came with the UPS's didn't mention it as a requirement. I ground the chassis of the computer directly to a spike in the ground which seems to work (in that I no longer get a shock from touching the case or USB plugs!) but I tried it with and without that connected in case it made a difference. I do recall that the jetcafe document suggested not pulling the plug from the wall but I'd have expected to be told if a grounded connection was essential to make the UPS switch over, wouldn't you?
  

If you can think of anything I overlooked please tell me.

[jeffer]

If you can think of anything I overlooked please tell me.

Take a look at the specs for your Asus power supply. Do you see 'Active PFC' mentioned anywhere?

[MengWan]

Very interesting thread, thanks !

I have a question about "time to change batteries", how do you know it has arrived ?

I mean before failure when "faï dap"s.

[Crossy]

I have a question about "time to change batteries", how do you know it has arrived ?

Some units have a 'battery change' light (which in my experience always comes on way too soon).

Otherwise load it up to about 50% output (with lightbulbs or just leave your PC plugged in) kill the input and see how long it runs before shutting down on low battery (disable any active monitoring software on the PC so you see the real run time).

The manual (or manufacturers website) should give you approximate run times for various loads, if it manages less than 50-75% of those times then change the batteries

I would replace the batteries every couple of years anyway, they're cheap enough.

Edited March 29, 2008 by Crossy

[Greenside]

If you can think of anything I overlooked please tell me.

Take a look at the specs for your Asus power supply. Do you see 'Active PFC' mentioned anywhere?

Yes, the spec sheet says it does have active PFC although a quick look around hasn't enlightened me as to why this might be the cause of the UPS failing to work properly.

[jeffer]

If you want to use a UPS with your Asus PSU then you need a true sine wave UPS.

[Greenside]

If you want to use a UPS with your Asus PSU then you need a true sine wave UPS.

Thanks for the info. An example of a true sine wave UPS would be.....?

[Crossy]

If you want to use a UPS with your Asus PSU then you need a true sine wave UPS.

APC have a small article here http://jpaa-en.apc.com/cgi-bin/jpaa_en.cfg...amp;p_topview=1 doesn't say anything about needing true-sine though

Something like this would do the job nicely http://www.apc.com/resource/include/techsp...ase_sku=SUA750I

Edited March 29, 2008 by Crossy

[Tywais]

All the APC Smart series are true sine (AFAIK), however you will be paying a premium for something I don't feel is necessary unless you are running Enterprise class servers and network boxes. The vast majority of PC PSUs will not have problems with stepped sine wave (the cheaper UPSes use filtered square waves and would steer clear of them). Reason is that the PC PSU is switched mode and will not really see the difference. Actually I just went through the design process for an inverter for a fuelcell project at work and used the fundamentals of UPSes for it.

Yes, there are some PSUs that will not work correctly with stepped sine wave, but I would put that as rare. I am running over 100 computers with non-pure sine UPSes and never an issue.

[jeffer]

Simple test. Try using any other brand of UPS and see if it works when you pull the plug. You would have to have been very unlucky to have two faulty ones before but anything is possible.

If it still doesn't work then get hold of a APC Smart UPS or a Power King that uses a true sine wave and test with that. If it works then you probably have your answer. You can either buy one (they're not cheap) or simply get a new PSU that will work with a budget UPS. Unless your work is mission critical then buying a true sine wave UPS for home use isn't a worthwhile option for most people due to the cost.

Tywais, out of those 100 computers you are running, how many have a PSU with Active PFC and what brand are they? I'd usually expect to find PSUs with APFC in computers built for gaming and/or low noise rather than in a business environment.

Does anyone know of a place where you can buy a reconditioned APC Smart UPS in Bangkok? You can in the US but I've never seen them for sale in Bangkok, even in Pantip.