Having A Baby

[Shotime]

I have a question regarding having a baby here in Thailand with a Thai lady I've known for a few years now. I am an American, over 60 years old, with two grown children back in the States. Haven't been married for many years. I am retired with zero assets, but a nice monthly pension check coming in every month. I'm not a rich man (in the money sense, anyway). She stays with me whenever I come to Bangkok for 5 months at a time, so we've gotten to know each other some. Our relationship has had it's share of ups and downs, believe me. However, at this point, we totally enjoy being together.

She has recently started asking me to have a baby with her. Never brings up marriage, and says she will move back with her Mom when she gets pregnant. Her family wants me to come live with them, also. She is 36 now, and has been a working girl for some time. That's how we met.

Yes, there are many other considerations, but I'm just asking what are the legal issues, if any, with this. I am a responsible person, and she knows this. Anyone have any experience with something like this?

[Westerner]

I have a question regarding having a baby here in Thailand with a Thai lady I've known for a few years now. I am an American, over 60 years old, with two grown children back in the States. Haven't been married for many years. I am retired with zero assets, but a nice monthly pension check coming in every month. I'm not a rich man (in the money sense, anyway). She stays with me whenever I come to Bangkok for 5 months at a time, so we've gotten to know each other some. Our relationship has had it's share of ups and downs, believe me. However, at this point, we totally enjoy being together.

She has recently started asking me to have a baby with her. Never brings up marriage, and says she will move back with her Mom when she gets pregnant. Her family wants me to come live with them, also. She is 36 now, and has been a working girl for some time. That's how we met.

Yes, there are many other considerations, but I'm just asking what are the legal issues, if any, with this. I am a responsible person, and she knows this. Anyone have any experience with something like this?

You are not a responsible person if you have a child in this relationship!!

[Shotime]

I have a question regarding having a baby here in Thailand with a Thai lady I've known for a few years now. I am an American, over 60 years old, with two grown children back in the States. Haven't been married for many years. I am retired with zero assets, but a nice monthly pension check coming in every month. I'm not a rich man (in the money sense, anyway). She stays with me whenever I come to Bangkok for 5 months at a time, so we've gotten to know each other some. Our relationship has had it's share of ups and downs, believe me. However, at this point, we totally enjoy being together.

She has recently started asking me to have a baby with her. Never brings up marriage, and says she will move back with her Mom when she gets pregnant. Her family wants me to come live with them, also. She is 36 now, and has been a working girl for some time. That's how we met.

Yes, there are many other considerations, but I'm just asking what are the legal issues, if any, with this. I am a responsible person, and she knows this. Anyone have any experience with something like this?

You are not a responsible person if you have a child in this relationship!!

I appreciate the response, but I wasn't asking for your opinion. I'm also not exactly sure why you say that. You know me?

[Scott]

You might want to consult the Embassy concerning citizenship and other things like that--especially if you don't plan to get married.

If she wants to have a child and you are OK with this in general then it's not such a bad idea. This lady's biological clock is probably ticking and she may just choose to get pregnant with or without your help.

The important thing is to make sure that you can provide for the child's needs and education--possibly after your gone. Also, make sure her family is relatively stable, since they will likely have to help her to take care of the child--that's kind of a tradition here.

You might want to check with your grown children about this as well; especially concerning splitting of assets should you die or become incapacitated.

[GuestHouse]

I don't see any 'legal issues'.

There are a number of moral issues, for example you are having a child at 60+ and need to consider the care and provision for the child through to his/her adulthood. As you say you have no assets but a good pension - I'd start by getting in touch with your pension provider to find out what provisions they have for dependents.

You say you are not married, but again, you are in a long term relationship and ought to consider the long term financial security of your partner, your pension provider will have rules relating to what constitutes a dependent and again you should be checking this and ensuring that where your dependents are able to draw on your pension that they are registerd with your pension provider and that all the necessary contact information and instructions are in place for them to receive your pension after your death.

[RY12]

there's no legal issues, unless ur refering to the ability of the baby to come your home country in the future. at face value, which is all we got on this forum, the moral issues seem a lot bigger concern than the legal ones: the bargirl thing isn't a problem, it's the 30+ year disparity and the fact that she wants a baby already only after a few visits. u can go ahead and do it and live in a surreal dream world in los, but i think u'd be ostracized by pretty much everyone thai or farang. good luck

[smartecosse]

and one other thing to bear in mind is that if she is "working" then it wont be her that is looking after the baby

[RY12]

and one other thing to bear in mind is that if she is "working" then it wont be her that is looking after the baby

I don't think there's anyone immoral enough let their gf or wife keep working in bars while the relationship is going on... is there?

[dave111223]

She is 36 now, and has been a working girl for some time. That's how we met.

And she is still "working"?

[Shotime]

I totally agree with all of the financial responsibilities and moral issues you are talking about. I fully understand the fantasy of Thailand. I am well aware of her biological clock, and her fantasies. She seems serious all of a sudden. I'm not sure I even like that.

I am actually meeting her Mom today. I wish I could speak Thai.

Thank you all for your considerations. No babies yet. My old friends from home put everything you've said to me a little more succinctly.

[Shotime]

Oh yeh, she only works me when I'm here.

[RY12]

Oh yeh, she only works me when I'm here.

Oi! well, i guess if neither of you have much else to lose it's ok. I don't want to be judgemental, i know some people are coming at life with radically different experiences and twists of fate.

[soundman]

There are a number of moral issues, for example you are having a child at 60+ and need to consider the care and provision for the child through to his/her adulthood.

Something to seriously consider.....

One of my staff was fathered by a Dutch national in his sixties. Unfortunately his father passed away when my staff member was very young. He doesn't talk about it much, however, I am sure he regrets never really knowing his father.

To the father's credit, he did provision satisfactorily for his son to go through basic schooling & for the mother's wellbeing.

Soundman.

[YoungFarang13]

a mixed child will generate more income in the future for the family... i hope thats not what they/she is thinking.

[soundman]

a mixed child will generate more income in the future for the family... i hope thats not what they/she is thinking.

That would be a really good reason to bring a kid into this world.

[RY12]

a mixed child will generate more income in the future for the family... i hope thats not what they/she is thinking.

how so? it's not guaranteed that all mixed kids are attractive and can be models. are u refering to bilingualism or something?

[tourleadersi]

Your honesty is appreciated as it cuts out speculation from the start but will also illicite a broader spectrum of responses.

I will try and be straight, sorry if any offence is caused.

If you are with her purely for sex then don't have a baby as this will pretty much go out of the window, for a while at least. You will then begin to look elsewhere which may place a strain on the both of you if this is not acceptable to either party. In the end a happy retirement could become one of lies, friction and deceit. Figure out why you are with her, really with her and your answer should be evident.

If you met her in a bar, really dont love or care that much for her and are happy to continue having relationships like that then why go though all of this just to keep her? There are so many people in the world compromising themselves to keep others happy that they really dont want to be with. It all comes from the fear of being alone. If you met her in a bar, then I am pretty confident with a little effort it will be easy enough to find another. If you dont want to have a child with her then let her go so that she might have the chance to find someone who will.

If you don't want all the trials and tribulations of caring for a little one then the answer is clear. However if you want to see out your years watching your child grow up here in the LOS then by all means a child would be the right way to go.

You mentioned that your girlfriend is from the bar, and that she is 36 years old. Not being an authority on this but I should imagine she is approaching the end of her career in the industry and like you is now beginning to think of her pension. She will see the child as a sure fire way of securing a stable retirement as often children from mixed races here in Thailand earn more money. There is also the possibility that she will hope/expect that you will leave a nest egg for the child that she will benefit from.

There are no answers to be found here shotime. The answers are within you. As you have already said, you have done the parent thing. Consider the children you already have. How will they feel about having a half sibling from such a relationship as you have? If they are robust and can take it then fine. The future child does not have a life yet. Remember to take in to consideration all of those that do.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

[tourleadersi]

a mixed child will generate more income in the future for the family... i hope thats not what they/she is thinking.

how so? it's not guaranteed that all mixed kids are attractive and can be models. are u refering to bilingualism or something?

It seems in the public pysche over here that children of a mixed race will earn more money, although I am sure this is often not the case. Factors that will possibly contribute to them earning a higher wage include the bilingualism that you mentioned. I should also image they will benefit from growing up in a multi cultural environment so will possibly understand how to think 'outside of the box' more, something that many of us 'one culture' people are perhaps less able to do (although I am sure we all consider ourselves to be multi cultural as we live here, yet often heckle the Thais for how they are!). Then there is the greater ease and opportunity to travel, and perhaps even go to university overseas. As an employer here in Thailand all of those factors would definately make a candidate more attractive, and I would certainly consider paying them more if they had such skills to offer.

[Shotime]

a mixed child will generate more income in the future for the family... i hope thats not what they/she is thinking.

Just how young are you? We've both made remarks about it, but in a much more positive light.

[YoungFarang13]

a mixed child will generate more income in the future for the family... i hope thats not what they/she is thinking.

how so? it's not guaranteed that all mixed kids are attractive and can be models. are u refering to bilingualism or something?

on average, mixed kids are more attractive thus are more likely to make a higher salary have more options than a Thai child. just think of the sin sot she could command from guys like me in 20-30 years when we turn 50, or how much she could make in working in the upper class bars in bangkok. plus, you never know she could be the next tata young/leuk male pop sensation.

Edited April 30, 2008 by YoungFarang13

[YoungFarang13]

a mixed child will generate more income in the future for the family... i hope thats not what they/she is thinking.

how so? it's not guaranteed that all mixed kids are attractive and can be models. are u refering to bilingualism or something?

It seems in the public pysche over here that children of a mixed race will earn more money, although I am sure this is often not the case. Factors that will possibly contribute to them earning a higher wage include the bilingualism that you mentioned. I should also image they will benefit from growing up in a multi cultural environment so will possibly understand how to think 'outside of the box' more, something that many of us 'one culture' people are perhaps less able to do (although I am sure we all consider ourselves to be multi cultural as we live here, yet often heckle the Thais for how they are!). Then there is the greater ease and opportunity to travel, and perhaps even go to university overseas. As an employer here in Thailand all of those factors would definately make a candidate more attractive, and I would certainly consider paying them more if they had such skills to offer.

its an indisputable fact that attractive people earn more money, are more likely to get a job/position, etc.

bottom line is that poor people have children as a way of generating income. that is why the third world birth rates are astronomical compared to the west. mom needs someone to pay the bills when she is older, having a child is the insurance plan. having a mixed child is an even better plan.

gl.

Edited April 30, 2008 by YoungFarang13

[tourleadersi]

a mixed child will generate more income in the future for the family... i hope thats not what they/she is thinking.

how so? it's not guaranteed that all mixed kids are attractive and can be models. are u refering to bilingualism or something?

It seems in the public pysche over here that children of a mixed race will earn more money, although I am sure this is often not the case. Factors that will possibly contribute to them earning a higher wage include the bilingualism that you mentioned. I should also image they will benefit from growing up in a multi cultural environment so will possibly understand how to think 'outside of the box' more, something that many of us 'one culture' people are perhaps less able to do (although I am sure we all consider ourselves to be multi cultural as we live here, yet often heckle the Thais for how they are!). Then there is the greater ease and opportunity to travel, and perhaps even go to university overseas. As an employer here in Thailand all of those factors would definately make a candidate more attractive, and I would certainly consider paying them more if they had such skills to offer.

its an indisputable fact that attractive people earn more money, are more likely to get a job/position, etc.

bottom line is that poor people have children as a way of generating income. that is why the third world birth rates are astronomical compared to the west. mom needs someone to pay the bills when she is older, having a child is the insurance plan. having a mixed child is an even better plan.

gl.

Yes, and whilst the world is the way it is we should not frown upon it. We really can't expect Thailand to take the moral high ground whilst the elderly starve to death. Iincrease salaries, tax fairly, set up a welfare state, then watch birth rates come down. Dont expect birth rates to go down before people can be sure of their care when they are unable to take care of themselves. We have seen a century of state care in Europe, what precceded that was centuries of what goes on here in Thailand.

[tourleadersi]

"its an indisputable fact that attractive people earn more money, are more likely to get a job/position, etc."

British politics being the exception to the rule I would say.

[YoungFarang13]

a mixed child will generate more income in the future for the family... i hope thats not what they/she is thinking.

how so? it's not guaranteed that all mixed kids are attractive and can be models. are u refering to bilingualism or something?

It seems in the public pysche over here that children of a mixed race will earn more money, although I am sure this is often not the case. Factors that will possibly contribute to them earning a higher wage include the bilingualism that you mentioned. I should also image they will benefit from growing up in a multi cultural environment so will possibly understand how to think 'outside of the box' more, something that many of us 'one culture' people are perhaps less able to do (although I am sure we all consider ourselves to be multi cultural as we live here, yet often heckle the Thais for how they are!). Then there is the greater ease and opportunity to travel, and perhaps even go to university overseas. As an employer here in Thailand all of those factors would definately make a candidate more attractive, and I would certainly consider paying them more if they had such skills to offer.

its an indisputable fact that attractive people earn more money, are more likely to get a job/position, etc.

bottom line is that poor people have children as a way of generating income. that is why the third world birth rates are astronomical compared to the west. mom needs someone to pay the bills when she is older, having a child is the insurance plan. having a mixed child is an even better plan.

gl.

Yes, and whilst the world is the way it is we should not frown upon it. We really can't expect Thailand to take the moral high ground whilst the elderly starve to death. Iincrease salaries, tax fairly, set up a welfare state, then watch birth rates come down. Dont expect birth rates to go down before people can be sure of their care when they are unable to take care of themselves. We have seen a century of state care in Europe, what precceded that was centuries of what goes on here in Thailand.

i am not complaining. i am just hoping they dont get thing right before i die.

[Westerner]

a mixed child will generate more income in the future for the family... i hope thats not what they/she is thinking.

how so? it's not guaranteed that all mixed kids are attractive and can be models. are u refering to bilingualism or something?

on average, mixed kids are more attractive thus are more likely to make a higher salary have more options than a Thai child. just think of the sin sot she could command from guys like me in 20-30 years when we turn 50, or how much she could make in working in the upper class bars in bangkok. plus, you never know she could be the next tata young/leuk male pop sensation.

Don't agree. I think full Thai kids are far more attractive.

[Westerner]

I have a question regarding having a baby here in Thailand with a Thai lady I've known for a few years now. I am an American, over 60 years old, with two grown children back in the States. Haven't been married for many years. I am retired with zero assets, but a nice monthly pension check coming in every month. I'm not a rich man (in the money sense, anyway). She stays with me whenever I come to Bangkok for 5 months at a time, so we've gotten to know each other some. Our relationship has had it's share of ups and downs, believe me. However, at this point, we totally enjoy being together.

She has recently started asking me to have a baby with her. Never brings up marriage, and says she will move back with her Mom when she gets pregnant. Her family wants me to come live with them, also. She is 36 now, and has been a working girl for some time. That's how we met.

Yes, there are many other considerations, but I'm just asking what are the legal issues, if any, with this. I am a responsible person, and she knows this. Anyone have any experience with something like this?

You are not a responsible person if you have a child in this relationship!!

I appreciate the response, but I wasn't asking for your opinion. I'm also not exactly sure why you say that. You know me?

Don't need to know you, I've read your post. I happen to think the reason for conceiving a child is because the parents love each other and genuinely want to raise a child together in a loving environment where the child feels wanted and secure. Perhaps I am just old-fashioned.

[YoungFarang13]

a mixed child will generate more income in the future for the family... i hope thats not what they/she is thinking.

how so? it's not guaranteed that all mixed kids are attractive and can be models. are u refering to bilingualism or something?

on average, mixed kids are more attractive thus are more likely to make a higher salary have more options than a Thai child. just think of the sin sot she could command from guys like me in 20-30 years when we turn 50, or how much she could make in working in the upper class bars in bangkok. plus, you never know she could be the next tata young/leuk male pop sensation.

Don't agree. I think full Thai kids are far more attractive.

some men prefer women who weigh twice as much of them. it just means your taste differs from the norm. it does not change the norm.

[Shotime]

a mixed child will generate more income in the future for the family... i hope thats not what they/she is thinking.

That would be a really good reason to bring a kid into this world.

You brought up the one thing that concerns me most. Not being here when he needs me most, and thanks for the above.

[clausewitz]

some men prefer women who weigh twice as much of them. it just means your taste differs from the norm. it does not change the norm.

You mean 140kg women are not considered the norm for beautiful? Hmm, may have to reduce the mia noi's salary this month.

[Shotime]

I have a question regarding having a baby here in Thailand with a Thai lady I've known for a few years now. I am an American, over 60 years old, with two grown children back in the States. Haven't been married for many years. I am retired with zero assets, but a nice monthly pension check coming in every month. I'm not a rich man (in the money sense, anyway). She stays with me whenever I come to Bangkok for 5 months at a time, so we've gotten to know each other some. Our relationship has had it's share of ups and downs, believe me. However, at this point, we totally enjoy being together.

She has recently started asking me to have a baby with her. Never brings up marriage, and says she will move back with her Mom when she gets pregnant. Her family wants me to come live with them, also. She is 36 now, and has been a working girl for some time. That's how we met.

Yes, there are many other considerations, but I'm just asking what are the legal issues, if any, with this. I am a responsible person, and she knows this. Anyone have any experience with something like this?

You are not a responsible person if you have a child in this relationship!!

I appreciate the response, but I wasn't asking for your opinion. I'm also not exactly sure why you say that. You know me?

Don't need to know you, I've read your post. I happen to think the reason for conceiving a child is because the parents love each other and genuinely want to raise a child together in a loving environment where the child feels wanted and secure. Perhaps I am just old-fashioned.

You're not old-fashioned, just a little presumptive. I assume that's the environment you were raised in. Maybe, in that light, you can explain what you mean by Love.