Aloe Vera - Miracle Plant?

[awakened]

I'm one of those fortunate to live close to Aloe Vera farms and have for the last month been taking fresh aloe vera juice, blended with a little fresh ginger to assist repair of my intestines. I was given 6 large plants to put in my garden.

I came across this article COMMERCIAL LINK DELETED which claims wonderful results for Aloe Vera and noted that I'm probably not drinking enough to have the effect I was hoping for and can also improve the taste!

I post this since the author states that Aloe Vera drinks in stores are unlikely to have any beneficial effect and can instead be harmful.

The proof of the pudding is in the eating so I'm trying it out for myself.

Will post if anything happens.

[duceahearts]

looks interesting, how long will the 6 plants last you? will they regenerate the lost leaves and in what time frame?

[awakened]

looks interesting, how long will the 6 plants last you? will they regenerate the lost leaves and in what time frame?

They are so cheap in Thailand you can buy more when needed.

I started today drinking 16oz for breakfast which is roughly one large outer leaf. 6 mature plants would be consumed in about a month, which is enough I believe to see positive results. We shall see.

I am leaving enough of the inner leaves, which I can't utilize effectively anyway, to allow the plants to survive and grow.

More info here (Commercial Link to sigter selling aloe vera products deleted)

[kat]

Thanks for the info on Aloe Plants. Very helpful.

[RouxTheDay]

Please do exercise some caution in the oral use of aloe vera. Just because a substance is "natural" does not make it automatically safe (e.g., hemlock is natural but consumption is generally not advisable ). Here are just a few bits of information regarding consumption of aloe vera:

From the Mayo Clinic:

• Ingestion of aloe for over one year has been reported to increase the risk of colorectal cancer. Individuals with severe abdominal pain, appendicitis, ileus (temporary paralysis of the bowel), or a prolonged period without bowel movements should not take aloe.
  
  
• There is a report of hepatitis (liver inflammation) with the use of oral aloe.
  
  
• Electrolyte imbalances in the blood, including low potassium levels, may be caused by the laxative effect of aloe... Low potassium levels can lead to abnormal heart rhythms or muscle weakness. People with heart disease, kidney disease, or electrolyte abnormalities should not take aloe by mouth. Healthcare professionals should watch for changes in potassium and other electrolytes in individuals who take aloe by mouth for more than a few days.
  
  
• Aloe taken by mouth may lower blood sugar levels. Caution is advised in patients with diabetes or hypoglycemia, and in those taking drugs, herbs, or supplements that affect blood sugar. Serum glucose levels may need to be monitored by a healthcare professional, and medication adjustments may be necessary.
  
  
• People with thyroid disorders, kidney disease, heart disease, or electrolyte abnormalities should also use oral aloe only under medical supervision.
  
  

From the National Institutes of Health:

• In 2002, the FDA required that all OTC aloe laxative products be removed from the U.S. market or reformulated because the companies that manufactured them did not provide the necessary safety data.
  
  
• Abdominal cramps and diarrhea have been reported with oral use of aloe vera.
  
  
• Diarrhea, caused by the laxative effect of oral aloe vera, can decrease the absorption of many drugs.
  
  
• People with diabetes who use glucose-lowering medication should be cautious if also taking aloe by mouth because preliminary studies suggest aloe may lower blood glucose levels.
  
  
• Tell your health care providers about any complementary and alternative practices you use. Give them a full picture of what you do to manage your health. This will help ensure coordinated and safe care.
  
  

From Memorial Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center:

• Aloe vera gel should not be confused with aloe juice or aloe latex, both of which contain anthraquinone, a cathartic laxative.
  
  
• Oral and parenteral [e.g., intravenous, etc.] administration of aloe vera should be avoided due to potential toxicities and lack of clinical efficacy demonstrated in humans. The FDA rules that aloe is not safe as a stimulant laxative.
  
  
• Oral consumption of aloe vera has been linked to thyroid dysfunction, acute hepatitis, and perioperative bleeding
  ...
  
  

Considering the various health concerns the OP has described in another thread, I'd be especially cautious using aloe internally. Not to say there isn't any value in it... just please do a lot of good homework from scientifically reliable sources. And be sure your medical providers are fully aware of your consumption practices.

[kat]

Wow! Definitely didn't know this about aloe consumption. Thanks very much for the warning.

[Mosha]

All I've heard about is shampoo and rubbing the juice from leaves on cuts.

[samran]

good for soothing the skin after being out in the sun too long.

[awakened]

Please do exercise some caution in the oral use of aloe vera. Just because a substance is "natural" does not make it automatically safe (e.g., hemlock is natural but consumption is generally not advisable ).

Many thanks for providing this. A quick response...

I have already said that OTC Aloe is suspect for a number of reasons. When they raise issues with Aloe it seems to be Over The Counter (OTC) rather than fresh raw Aloe.

Since Aloe is claimed to prevent colon cancer, it's surprising to hear claims it causes it. They also state 'There is early evidence that oral aloe may reduce the risk of developing lung cancer'. So it causes one cancer and prevents another? Studies show Aloe is beneficial in preventing Colon Cancer. http://www.mnwelldir.org/docs/cancer2/colon.htm

There is 'a report' of Aloe causing hepatitis..

I read the report. The lady concerned took an OTC extract of Aloe Vera which was assumed to have caused hepatitis. 'One swallow doesn't make a summer.'

Yes, in large doses Aloe can cause 'diarrhea'.

According to the Wat Po texts... 'Aloe Vera is a gentle detoxifying laxative'. In larger doses it is a purgative for worms and parasites.

THAILAND

Wat Po texts state 'Aloe is a bitter tonic used to treat liver disease and is beneficial to spleen, uterus and blood. The gel of the Aloe is taken internally to regulate menstruation, detoxification, clearing up lingering illness, for liver disease and chronic constipation.'

The texts have 'Aloe recipes for parasites, vomiting, diarrhea, dysentry, constipation, mucous in the digestive tract, flatulence, fever, blood in breast milk, and infected or stagnant blood.'

A dab on each temple is great for tension headaches and most people know Aloe is good topically.

The recommended intake is 2 tbs gel mixed with liquified palm sugar or 1 cup 250ml sweet fruit juice 1-3 times daily. Or make tea from dry aloe leaves. This is a much more conservative regimen than the original article.

I take 8oz with fresh ginger and a little water in the morning and don't blend for longer than 10 secs and will continue doing so. Others will prefer it sweeter.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

I have no confidence in attacks on natural remedies by tyrannical outfits established, it is claimed, to create a monopoly (for one powerful family) and bury competition. The U.S. FDA, AMA, CDC and NIH form this cartel.

The FDA suppresses natural products since nature cannot be patented. Drug trials cost millions that only the wealthy pharmas can afford. They recoup the costs through the patent system. Natural remedies cannot gain approval despite thousands of years of anecdotal evidence. The FDA uses this failure to go through their rigged system to claim that alternatives are 'untested' or 'not proven' and shuts companies down with midnight raids by armed SWAT teams. Particularly if they are curing people.

[JSixpack]

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

I have no confidence in attacks on natural remedies by tyrannical outfits established, it is claimed, to create a monopoly (for one powerful family) and bury competition. The U.S. FDA, AMA, CDC and NIH form this cartel.

The FDA suppresses natural products since nature cannot be patented.

What's a religion without demons?

Newbies, beware the quackery on our beloved forum. Sincere, well-meaning quackery to be sure.

Edited May 11, 2008 by JSixpack

[kat]

I have no confidence in attacks on natural remedies by tyrannical outfits established, it is claimed, to create a monopoly (for one powerful family) and bury competition. The U.S. FDA, AMA, CDC and NIH form this cartel.

The FDA suppresses natural products since nature cannot be patented. Drug trials cost millions that only the wealthy pharmas can afford. They recoup the costs through the patent system. Natural remedies cannot gain approval despite thousands of years of anecdotal evidence. The FDA uses this failure to go through their rigged system to claim that alternatives are 'untested' or 'not proven' and shuts companies down with midnight raids by armed SWAT teams. Particularly if they are curing people.

I don't think the above statements are quackery or ill-informed. In fact, I think they are right on target and there is a lot of truth behind them. However, the question here is: does raw aloe vera raise a cancer risk if ingested? I don't yet know the answer or fully understand the claim, and will take a look at both sides. However, if the conventional studies are using an absurdly high measurement, then Awakened is making a valid point from a research perspective.

[awakened]

What's a religion without demons?

Newbies, beware the quackery on our beloved forum. Sincere, well-meaning quackery to be sure.

A smear wrapped up in honeyed coating? Shame on you.

Thank you, Kat.

This 'quack' puts it far more eloquently than I...

'The medical monopoly or medical trust, euphemistically called the American Medical Association, is not merely the meanest monopoly ever organized, but the most arrogant, dangerous and despotic organization which ever managed a free people in this or any other age. Any and all methods of healing the sick by means of safe, simple and natural remedies are sure to be assailed and denounced by the arrogant leaders of the AMA doctors' trust as fakes, frauds and humbugs. Every practitioner of the healing art who does not ally himself with the medical trust is denounced as a 'dangerous quack' and impostor by the predatory trust doctors. Every sanatorium who attempts to restore the sick to a state of health by natural means without resort to the knife or poisonous drugs, disease imparting serums, deadly toxins or vaccines, is at once pounced upon by these medical tyrants and fanatics, bitterly denounced, vilified and persecuted to the fullest extent.'

- J.W Hodge, M.D.

JSixpack. You are correct. I am very sincere. We all seek to help each other do we not?

I still await a rebuttal of the articles that I posted regarding the industry manipulation of studies, the poor methodologies used and the use of ghostwriting by drug companies who write the 'science' then pay eminent doctors or scientists to put their names to it. Perhaps you can do so?

I press on this point since the use of 'published studies' seems to be just another game the industry plays. If two scientists look at the same data and come to different conclusions it is no longer science. It has become politics or business. Orthodox 'science' has the edge since it can say 'my science is right because I have the money and the power and it's my train set' and 'your science is wrong and I am now withdrawing your funding for daring to rock the boat.'

You do raise a good point about quackery. You can always tell the quacks, they are the ones saying everyone else is a quack.

In Medicine, just as in politics, there are 'weapons of mass deception.'

'Quackwatch' is a perfect example. Dr. Stephen Barrett, funded by big pharma, isn't even a doctor, he's a failed psychiatrist. Yet he poses as a medical authority and polices the alternative medicine scene, appealing to unwary readers to report anyone who may be administering to the sick. This is sinister IMO since it turns the public into spies for the industry, who then shut the 'charlatans' down. His remit is to prevent the public from investigating non-toxic and non-invasive alternatives.

The beliefs I hold have been put there by courageous doctors and scientists within the profession who unlike some, do not rely on arrogance, pseudo science (which can be made to show anything) or their 'high priest' status to mock dissenters, no matter how gently. They have put their concerns into the public domain. They don't blindly serve their medical masters. They serve humanity. Thank God for them, I say.

Yes, there are some blatant scams. I remember ordering an expensive and useless hair tonic when I was in my twenties. They used clever marketing and I fell for it. Thankfully, I didn't bother with the (ahem... ) penis enlarger.

Isn't giving me a placebo a scam? If a doctor tells me it is medicine and it isn't, and charges me for it, hasn't a fraud taken place? Does that make him a 'quack'? How is this different to someone selling me coloured water and calling it a tonic? Both may induce a placebo effect. The former is a healer while the latter goes to jail.

Why do drug companies scour the world for healing plants and herbs, isolate the active ingredient, synthesize and patent it, then charge mega bucks for what is in effect an inferior product without the protective effect the rest of the whole plant provides? Why do they then harass healers using the real plant or herb and charge them with practicing medicine without a licence? Are they protecting the public? Or their monopoly?

Whether you believe in the vitalist approach or the mechanist approach, or conspiracies or otherwise, you cannot deny that far more people are harmed by drug medicine, medical malpractice, incorrect diagnosis, unnecessary surgery, wrong nutritional advice, Iatrogenic causes, etc... (These ARE in published studies) than are harmed by eating more broccoli, less meat and going to the gym. You don't see the same witchhunts conducted against the drug companies, who have harmed millions, as say against St.John's Wort. That disparity speaks volumes and people are wising up.

One of the problems today is that most Doctors are no longer prepared to challenge. Those that do suffer the scorn of their colleagues, a loss of status and other consequences designed to keep them in line.

When the Industry starts healing the sick instead of simply profiting from treatments. Focuses on prevention and cures and stops suppressing them to protect profits, then a disenchanted public won't need to seek alternatives or guzzle potentially harmful thickening agents called 'Aloe Vera'.

And trying to silence dissenters will not restore public trust. That's not free speech, freedom of choice or democracy.

It's fascism.

I will continue to try the fresh aloe vera.

Quack!

[AmeriThai]

Isn't giving me a placebo a scam? If a doctor tells me it is medicine and it isn't, and charges me for it, hasn't a fraud taken place? Does that make him a 'quack'? How is this different to someone selling me coloured water and calling it a tonic? Both may induce a placebo effect. The former is a healer while the latter goes to jail.

Giving a patient a placebo without the patient knowing would certainly be a deceptive and unethical practice, and could result in the physician receiving some kind of fine or even losing his licence. However, in clinical tests where placebos are given, the patients usually know that some patients will be given the said medication and others will be given a placebo. The patient doesn't know which he or she will receive. In other clinical studies, a new type of medication may be administered for study purposes and in the hope that it will help the patient, but the patient is aware of it and has the option to refuse to participate in the study.

[Crushdepth]

When the Industry starts healing the sick instead of simply profiting from treatments. Focuses on prevention and cures and stops suppressing them to protect profits, then a disenchanted public won't need to seek alternatives or guzzle potentially harmful thickening agents called 'Aloe Vera'.

And trying to silence dissenters will not restore public trust. That's not free speech, freedom of choice or democracy.

It's fascism.

I will continue to try the fresh aloe vera.

Good for you. However, it disturbs me that so many alternative medical practitioners recommend treatments, even for life threatening illnesses, without any real knowledge of their effectiveness (or not). The lack of objective evidence does open things up for a horrendous amount of quackery which unfortunately gives the whole 'alternative' approach a bad name. Application of a few standards, regulation or just some quality controls might be beneficial with time (remember Pan Pharmaceuticals?).

I don't really believe the drug-company conspiracy theory. They would be the first to isolate, patent, package and profit from alternative medicines!

[Samuian]

How many years does so called "modern medicine" exist?

Natural Medicine, Chinese, Ayurveda?

And for how long did Mankind survive without the Alchemists of "modern Medicine?

Why are the "alternative methods of healing" in some kind of a renaissance?

If there never ever would have been a medicine taken off from the market because it proved harmful and not safe AFTER it has been released on to the market, I would agree with those who herald "modern medicine" as the non plus ultra!

It's a well established, state protected Monopoly!

None else!

Not to start with how many millions of people are "hooked" on "the achievements" of "modern medicine", like uppers, downers, antidepressants, and painkillers, not to mention all the other "medications" (like insulin) administered, instead a proper therapy - but as long as those "legal drugs" line the pockets of the shareholders and company owbners, it is all well and fine!

Never heard that someone died curing a cold with chamomile tea....

[JSixpack]

I have no confidence in attacks on natural remedies by tyrannical outfits established, it is claimed, to create a monopoly (for one powerful family) and bury competition. The U.S. FDA, AMA, CDC and NIH form this cartel.

The FDA suppresses natural products since nature cannot be patented. Drug trials cost millions that only the wealthy pharmas can afford. They recoup the costs through the patent system. Natural remedies cannot gain approval despite thousands of years of anecdotal evidence. The FDA uses this failure to go through their rigged system to claim that alternatives are 'untested' or 'not proven' and shuts companies down with midnight raids by armed SWAT teams. Particularly if they are curing people.

I don't think the above statements are quackery or ill-informed. In fact, I think they are right on target

Of course you do, dear Kat. Allow me to indulge you.

Yes, the FDA is engaged in massive conspiracy to suppress aloe vera! Aloe vera manufacturers and distributors have been, and are being, shut down "with midnight raids by armed SWAT teams." Hence it is only to be found on the black market at exorbitant prices. Books and pamphlets full of incredibly valuable totally believable anecdotes have been systematically confiscated and burned! It may even be part of the Bush-Cheney-Rumsfeld-Illuminati plan for world domination! And so ostensibly independent countries like China, Cuba, North Korea, Iran, Venezuela are in fact bowing to the gestapo USA FDA and even they are not claiming that aloe vera anecdotes are in fact real science!

Hence many in dire need of aloe vera, unable to bear world black market prices, with "medical" aloe vera treatments still illegal everywhere and not covered by health insurance, are forced in secret to grow their own plants in basements and closets.

DARE we even speak of it here under the cloak of cyberspace anonymity?

I love religionists! But one just can't argue with them.

Edited May 12, 2008 by JSixpack

[toptuan]

I have no confidence in attacks on natural remedies by tyrannical outfits established, it is claimed, to create a monopoly (for one powerful family) and bury competition. The U.S. FDA, AMA, CDC and NIH form this cartel.

The FDA suppresses natural products since nature cannot be patented. Drug trials cost millions that only the wealthy pharmas can afford. They recoup the costs through the patent system. Natural remedies cannot gain approval despite thousands of years of anecdotal evidence. The FDA uses this failure to go through their rigged system to claim that alternatives are 'untested' or 'not proven' and shuts companies down with midnight raids by armed SWAT teams. Particularly if they are curing people.

I don't think the above statements are quackery or ill-informed. In fact, I think they are right on target

Of course you do, dear Kat. Allow me to indulge you.

Yes, the FDA is engaged in massive conspiracy to suppress aloe vera! Aloe vera manufacturers and distributors have been, and are being, shut down "with midnight raids by armed SWAT teams." Hence it is only to be found on the black market at exorbitant prices. Books and pamphlets full of incredibly valuable totally believable anecdotes have been systematically confiscated and burned! It may even be part of the Bush-Cheney-Rumsfeld-Illuminati plan for world domination! And so ostensibly independent countries like China, Cuba, North Korea, Iran, Venezuela are in fact bowing to the gestapo USA FDA and even they are not claiming that aloe vera anecdotes are in fact real science!

Hence many in dire need of aloe vera, unable to bear world black market prices, with "medical" aloe vera treatments still illegal everywhere and not covered by health insurance, are forced in secret to grow their own plants in basements and closets.

DARE we even speak of it here under the cloak of cyberspace anonymity?

I love religionists! But one just can't argue with them.

And...what's your views on the Illuminati, the JFK Assassination and 9/11, just out of curiosity?

[ZZZ]

Isn't giving me a placebo a scam? If a doctor tells me it is medicine and it isn't, and charges me for it, hasn't a fraud taken place? Does that make him a 'quack'? How is this different to someone selling me coloured water and calling it a tonic? Both may induce a placebo effect. The former is a healer while the latter goes to jail.

Giving a patient a placebo without the patient knowing would certainly be a deceptive and unethical practice, and could result in the physician receiving some kind of fine or even losing his licence. However, in clinical tests where placebos are given, the patients usually know that some patients will be given the said medication and others will be given a placebo. The patient doesn't know which he or she will receive. In other clinical studies, a new type of medication may be administered for study purposes and in the hope that it will help the patient, but the patient is aware of it and has the option to refuse to participate in the study.

Most illnesses and symptoms are to a greater or lesser degree psychosomatic. If the doctor diagnose you with something that is not very serious, something that he know your body will take care of by it self, you are much better of if he gives you a placebo and tells you that this pill will sort you out in a few days. This way your body will be put in the right frame of mind to fight off the problem and you immune system will be stronger.

The alternative would be to prescribe something that would probably only relieve the symptoms and thereby weaken your immune systems response to fight the illness. In addition there are very few medicines without a lot of side effects that could cause more problems.

Naturally there needs to be a follow up on any treatment to make sure it works.

After all, most medicines are approved after just narrowly beating a placebo in clinical trials.

In the end, if the placebo cures you what's the problem? Do you go to the doctor to get a bag of pills or to get cured

[awakened]

More verbal diarrhea from me (must be the Aloe Vera)

Please read my story of how a complaint made a difference...

20 years ago I initiated a change in the Royal Navy pregnancy tests after they gave my wife a D&C when she was 8 weeks pregnant, arrogantly dismissing her claim that she WAS pregnant and the 3 OTC tests that had confirmed it. On investigation it came out the Navy's test was less sensitive.

What horrified both of us was not just the faith shown in an inferior test but the incredible arrogance exhibited. They just wouldn't LISTEN. The only reason this came out is that our daughter SURVIVED. So not only was the test suspect but the surgeon had botched the D&C. I can't begin to describe the trauma we went through after she was born prematurely but it was the trigger for a lot of the stress that followed.

15 years ago my mother was mercy killed with a dose of morphine at home after suffering years of pain from a form of arthritis. She was deeply saddened when she became overweight through steroid use. The NSAIDs and 'gold' injections, the botched bowel operation that left her needing a colostemy bag and intensive care, the MRI that terrified her, rough handling from a cold unfeeling nurse and many other incidents like this left her humiliated and in despair. What kind of healing is this that inflicts even more suffering in its attempts to bring health? When I asked the hospital's senior physician if he knew what was wrong and how to cure her, he said 'No'. We got her out of there the next day.

I could recount several other examples but you get the picture.

People desire some honest self-appraisal from the mainstream medical world and an acceptance that it doesn't have a monopoly on either health or truth. The battle raging between natural and alternative approaches and Allopathic medicine isn't just about medicine. It's about politics, corporate exploitation and social control.

Enlightened Doctors and Nurses who care about humanity dare to question the data they are presented with and don't indulge in the stupid arrogance that has been deliberately cultivated in them to close them off to alternatives and their own Industry failings. With a few more of them, what a difference they could make!

When it comes to our health there is more than one way to skin a cat. There are some therapies which are worth investigation. When I was in India years ago, I experienced the 'Nature Cure' centres, Ayurveda and Homeopathy. I was the only foreigner. All are government approved and popular. A little sunshine, rest, peaceful surroundings, nutritive and herbal support for the bodies own healing attempts can go a long way. There, food IS medicine. No poisons (drugs), burning (radiation), cutting (surgery) or diabolical and harmful machines to be found.

It's notable that the AMA was setup primarily to destroy homeopathy in the U.S. which at the time was widely used and respected. It would have been banned in the UK as well except the Royal Family promote it. http://www.darshem.org/sys-tmpl/homeopathy/

I have noted the growing interest in 'energetic medicine'.

Pharmaceutical companies ARE heavily involved in alternative medicine. This is a concern. Will try to find the links.

More FDA failure to protect the public

http://www.newmediaexplorer.org/sepp/2005/...d_both_eyes.htm

Sites of Interest

Drug Side Effects. Reports from users. http://www.medications.com

and 'Corrupt Pharma'... http://www.naturalnews.com/020345.html

[AmeriThai]

Isn't giving me a placebo a scam? If a doctor tells me it is medicine and it isn't, and charges me for it, hasn't a fraud taken place? Does that make him a 'quack'? How is this different to someone selling me coloured water and calling it a tonic? Both may induce a placebo effect. The former is a healer while the latter goes to jail.

Giving a patient a placebo without the patient knowing would certainly be a deceptive and unethical practice, and could result in the physician receiving some kind of fine or even losing his licence. However, in clinical tests where placebos are given, the patients usually know that some patients will be given the said medication and others will be given a placebo. The patient doesn't know which he or she will receive. In other clinical studies, a new type of medication may be administered for study purposes and in the hope that it will help the patient, but the patient is aware of it and has the option to refuse to participate in the study.

Most illnesses and symptoms are to a greater or lesser degree psychosomatic. If the doctor diagnose you with something that is not very serious, something that he know your body will take care of by it self, you are much better of if he gives you a placebo and tells you that this pill will sort you out in a few days. This way your body will be put in the right frame of mind to fight off the problem and you immune system will be stronger.

The alternative would be to prescribe something that would probably only relieve the symptoms and thereby weaken your immune systems response to fight the illness. In addition there are very few medicines without a lot of side effects that could cause more problems.

Naturally there needs to be a follow up on any treatment to make sure it works.

After all, most medicines are approved after just narrowly beating a placebo in clinical trials.

In the end, if the placebo cures you what's the problem? Do you go to the doctor to get a bag of pills or to get cured

A patient with psychosomatic symptoms may be given something that has no real effect, but the inert "medication" is likely to have a name that sounds like a medication. That's a bit different, but yes, I agree with you on that point. The real problem however is when fake or unknown "medications" are provided which claim to cure everything under the sun for real medical conditions. It's not uncommon for people with serious medical conditions to desparately seek any kind of alternative and for scammers to take advantage of them by claiming they have something that can cure anything from the common cold to cancer to AIDS.

I also agree that some (not necessarily most) medications are made available by pharmacutical companies that haven't had certain potentially serious or deadly side effects disclosed for various preventable reasons, including limited testing. Sales representatives can share the blame in that because of aggressive promotion in distributing samples or supplies physicians. In such cases, many general practice doctors simply take the word of the reps because they lack the knowledge about new pharmecuticals that aren't tried and true - they aren't all specialists.

But if you had a real and serious condition, would you want a placebo, or a real solution?

[ZZZ]

Isn't giving me a placebo a scam? If a doctor tells me it is medicine and it isn't, and charges me for it, hasn't a fraud taken place? Does that make him a 'quack'? How is this different to someone selling me coloured water and calling it a tonic? Both may induce a placebo effect. The former is a healer while the latter goes to jail.

Giving a patient a placebo without the patient knowing would certainly be a deceptive and unethical practice, and could result in the physician receiving some kind of fine or even losing his licence. However, in clinical tests where placebos are given, the patients usually know that some patients will be given the said medication and others will be given a placebo. The patient doesn't know which he or she will receive. In other clinical studies, a new type of medication may be administered for study purposes and in the hope that it will help the patient, but the patient is aware of it and has the option to refuse to participate in the study.

Most illnesses and symptoms are to a greater or lesser degree psychosomatic. If the doctor diagnose you with something that is not very serious, something that he know your body will take care of by it self, you are much better of if he gives you a placebo and tells you that this pill will sort you out in a few days. This way your body will be put in the right frame of mind to fight off the problem and you immune system will be stronger.

The alternative would be to prescribe something that would probably only relieve the symptoms and thereby weaken your immune systems response to fight the illness. In addition there are very few medicines without a lot of side effects that could cause more problems.

Naturally there needs to be a follow up on any treatment to make sure it works.

After all, most medicines are approved after just narrowly beating a placebo in clinical trials.

In the end, if the placebo cures you what's the problem? Do you go to the doctor to get a bag of pills or to get cured

A patient with psychosomatic symptoms may be given something that has no real effect, but the inert "medication" is likely to have a name that sounds like a medication. That's a bit different, but yes, I agree with you on that point. The real problem however is when fake or unknown "medications" are provided which claim to cure everything under the sun for real medical conditions. It's not uncommon for people with serious medical conditions to desparately seek any kind of alternative and for scammers to take advantage of them by claiming they have something that can cure anything from the common cold to cancer to AIDS.

I also agree that some (not necessarily most) medications are made available by pharmacutical companies that haven't had certain potentially serious or deadly side effects disclosed for various preventable reasons, including limited testing. Sales representatives can share the blame in that because of aggressive promotion in distributing samples or supplies physicians. In such cases, many general practice doctors simply take the word of the reps because they lack the knowledge about new pharmecuticals that aren't tried and true - they aren't all specialists.

But if you had a real and serious condition, would you want a placebo, or a real solution?

I agree there are many "snake oil" salesmen out there with unsubstantiated claims. The thing is that most people with serious problems trying these have usually tried the "real solution" without solving the problem. Many of these "snake oils' work, not because of their ingredients but because of the placebo effect. If you really truly believe in something your body can work miracles, there are masses of cases where people were considered terminally ill who later recovered after going off the "real solution"

If I had a serious condition like blood poisoning I would not wait to see if my body would take care of it, I would go for antibiotics. If I was given six months to live I would probably try anything I could think of to get my own body to fix it, I would not subject myself to all sorts of medicines that only offered an additional month extension at the cost of possibly shutting down the body's own system completely. (This is easy to say when you are not in that situation but that's how I feel about this now)

The thing is that your body can cure/prevent just about any illness. There has been numerous plagues over the ages caused by bacteria and viruses and there has always been many survivors. Not all smokers get lung cancer, not all drinkers get liver cancer. All this can only be explained by as a healthy immune system can cure or prevent most illnesses.

It's not the bacteria, virus, parasite or fungus that kills it's a malfunctioning immune system.

[Crushdepth]

When it comes to our health there is more than one way to skin a cat. There are some therapies which are worth investigation.

Well, I agree. I have no doubt that some alternative medicine works and works well. What I'm saying is that without science-based investigation there is no way to sort out the 'real' remedies from the voodoo chicanery and folklore that is just plain wrong. And without regulation of the 'industry' you end up with companies like Pan Pharmaceuticals sticking cattle cartalige in your shark cartalige tablets and similar gross things.

Never heard that someone died curing a cold with chamomile tea....

Never heard of anyone's cold being cured that way either, either although I admit chamomile strepsils give good symptomatic relief to a sore throat :-) Anyway, just as I am sure some alternative medicine must work, I am equally sure that some of it is dam_n dangerous. I take a dim view of practitioners that prescribe alternative treatments for serious situations (bite by suspect rabid dog is one that leaps to mind) when safe and scientifically validated conventional treatments are available.

Pharmaceutical companies ARE heavily involved in alternative medicine. This is a concern. Will try to find the links.

Hardly suprising. Targeting traditional knowledge is a good way to increase the strike rate of bioprospecting for useful substances. Some of them are even involved in projects to document and preserve indigenous medical knowledge that is in danger of disappearing (including in Thailand).

[kat]

I have no confidence in attacks on natural remedies by tyrannical outfits established, it is claimed, to create a monopoly (for one powerful family) and bury competition. The U.S. FDA, AMA, CDC and NIH form this cartel.

The FDA suppresses natural products since nature cannot be patented. Drug trials cost millions that only the wealthy pharmas can afford. They recoup the costs through the patent system. Natural remedies cannot gain approval despite thousands of years of anecdotal evidence. The FDA uses this failure to go through their rigged system to claim that alternatives are 'untested' or 'not proven' and shuts companies down with midnight raids by armed SWAT teams. Particularly if they are curing people.

I don't think the above statements are quackery or ill-informed. In fact, I think they are right on target

Of course you do, dear Kat. Allow me to indulge you.

Yes, the FDA is engaged in massive conspiracy to suppress aloe vera! Aloe vera manufacturers and distributors have been, and are being, shut down "with midnight raids by armed SWAT teams." Hence it is only to be found on the black market at exorbitant prices. Books and pamphlets full of incredibly valuable totally believable anecdotes have been systematically confiscated and burned! It may even be part of the Bush-Cheney-Rumsfeld-Illuminati plan for world domination! And so ostensibly independent countries like China, Cuba, North Korea, Iran, Venezuela are in fact bowing to the gestapo USA FDA and even they are not claiming that aloe vera anecdotes are in fact real science!

Hence many in dire need of aloe vera, unable to bear world black market prices, with "medical" aloe vera treatments still illegal everywhere and not covered by health insurance, are forced in secret to grow their own plants in basements and closets.

DARE we even speak of it here under the cloak of cyberspace anonymity?

I love religionists! But one just can't argue with them.

Well, first of all, you quoted me out of context. Secondly, when you put words in other people's mouths simply to help your one-sided view without consideration of all that they have said, nor making any attempt to understand alternative sides, YOU are the one thinking like a "religionist". I quoted and specified in my words the "above statements" as those with which I agree. I think the other examples are extreme, but I am not in a position to affirm or deny that large pharmaceutical corporations do not suppress information alternative knowledge that directly challenge their income streams. Based on what I know about the associated tactics of Health Management Organizations, I am inclined to believe that they are all invested in their own interests above those of widely accessible health remedies and care.

[RouxTheDay]

Wow. So much vitriole in response to genuine concern and an attempt at being helpful.

As I said before, I recommend people do good quality, scientifically/medically sound homework, and be aware that there are potentially serious risks in the use of this and other "natural" substances. Although I did not read every study relied upon for the recommendations I found, I did find the risks I posted to be those that were most frequently cited by a number of medical schools, research publications, medical journals, etc. There were many, many sources in agreement; I simply posted a representative sampling from what most people would call reasonably reliable sources. I agree that they aren't always right, and errors are made. However, I'm much more confident in a source that has relied upon some documented science-based research, than I am in one that provides no information as to its volunteers' authority, that proudly claims to be able to tell people whatever it wants because its not subject to FTC regulations, and lists "everyone...absolutely free" who wishes to be in the directory it's offering for sale, with no indication of any sort of due diligence on its part (e.g., mnwelldir.org, etc.).

I am not a fan of big pharma, per se; but I do use its products. I also have no objection, in general, to alternative or old medicine -- I use some these, too. Anybody who accepts one-sided information as gospel is taking risks. I don't rely only on doctors for information on conventional treatments; nor do I accept that "natural" is automatically safe and/or better. I do my own research and make my own risk-benefit analysis. I would encourage everyone to be a well-informed healthcare consumer.

The fact that aloe is undeniably a cathartic/laxative would give me cause for concern if I had the sorts of undiagnosed GI problems the OP has described, particularly if taking meds or relying upon other alternative remedies. I certainly hope, for your sake, that you've at least discussed your use of this substance with your MD. I sincerely wish you the best of luck.

BTW, in case you're interested in knowing why I was a bit alarmed, I first became aware of aloe risks through firsthand experience with a family member. Suffice to say, it wasn't a pretty situation, but fortunately, it all worked out fine in the end.

p.s., the argument that "funded" studies are always agenda-driven or inherently flawed is a myth propagated by fearmongers and/or paranoids. Likewise, a person who believes that researchers whose studies are not funded by a government, corporation, trade association, etc. are somehow free from personal agendae, operating without bias, purely altruistic, or whatever, is a person who probably never took a logic course in college. For the record, my professional background involves research and evaluation of medical information, including validation of health claims, so I do have somewhat of a clue. Again, I was interested in being helpful.

[Dingojoe]

Please do exercise some caution in the oral use of aloe vera. Just because a substance is "natural" does not make it automatically safe (e.g., hemlock is natural but consumption is generally not advisable ). Here are just a few bits of information regarding consumption of aloe vera:

From the Mayo Clinic:

• Ingestion of aloe for over one year has been reported to increase the risk of colorectal cancer. Individuals with severe abdominal pain, appendicitis, ileus (temporary paralysis of the bowel), or a prolonged period without bowel movements should not take aloe.
  
  
• There is a report of hepatitis (liver inflammation) with the use of oral aloe.
  
  
• Electrolyte imbalances in the blood, including low potassium levels, may be caused by the laxative effect of aloe... Low potassium levels can lead to abnormal heart rhythms or muscle weakness. People with heart disease, kidney disease, or electrolyte abnormalities should not take aloe by mouth. Healthcare professionals should watch for changes in potassium and other electrolytes in individuals who take aloe by mouth for more than a few days.
  
  
• Aloe taken by mouth may lower blood sugar levels. Caution is advised in patients with diabetes or hypoglycemia, and in those taking drugs, herbs, or supplements that affect blood sugar. Serum glucose levels may need to be monitored by a healthcare professional, and medication adjustments may be necessary.
  
  
• People with thyroid disorders, kidney disease, heart disease, or electrolyte abnormalities should also use oral aloe only under medical supervision.
  
  

From the National Institutes of Health:

• In 2002, the FDA required that all OTC aloe laxative products be removed from the U.S. market or reformulated because the companies that manufactured them did not provide the necessary safety data.
  
  
• Abdominal cramps and diarrhea have been reported with oral use of aloe vera.
  
  
• Diarrhea, caused by the laxative effect of oral aloe vera, can decrease the absorption of many drugs.
  
  
• People with diabetes who use glucose-lowering medication should be cautious if also taking aloe by mouth because preliminary studies suggest aloe may lower blood glucose levels.
  
  
• Tell your health care providers about any complementary and alternative practices you use. Give them a full picture of what you do to manage your health. This will help ensure coordinated and safe care.
  
  

From Memorial Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center:

• Aloe vera gel should not be confused with aloe juice or aloe latex, both of which contain anthraquinone, a cathartic laxative.
  
  
• Oral and parenteral [e.g., intravenous, etc.] administration of aloe vera should be avoided due to potential toxicities and lack of clinical efficacy demonstrated in humans. The FDA rules that aloe is not safe as a stimulant laxative.
  
  
• Oral consumption of aloe vera has been linked to thyroid dysfunction, acute hepatitis, and perioperative bleeding
  ...
  
  

Considering the various health concerns the OP has described in another thread, I'd be especially cautious using aloe internally. Not to say there isn't any value in it... just please do a lot of good homework from scientifically reliable sources. And be sure your medical providers are fully aware of your consumption practices.

Note these words in the above

"increase the risk" - by how much? is it 0.001% increase??

"there is a report" - what report and who by?

"maybe caused by" - lots of things may cause lots of things

"may lower blod sugar levels" - may lower who said may lower

I have been reading stuff about my medical condition which is heart related and its always increase risk by .007% in such in such patients, this type of talk is insignificant and not substantiated.

Drink as much as you feel you need and dont believe this above bull.

Last year i had some very bad sun burn like 2nd degree burns, rubbed the aloe vera plant on my skin 3 times a day and the cell rejuvinating effects of aloe vera kept my skin alive for 4 days, then it peeled off, but you could see that it was trying to revive burnt dead skin, amazing stuff.

[kat]

I am not a fan of big pharma, per se; but I do use its products. I also have no objection, in general, to alternative or old medicine -- I use some these, too. Anybody who accepts one-sided information as gospel is taking risks. I don't rely only on doctors for information on conventional treatments; nor do I accept that "natural" is automatically safe and/or better. I do my own research and make my own risk-benefit analysis. I would encourage everyone to be a well-informed healthcare consumer.

p.s., the argument that "funded" studies are always agenda-driven or inherently flawed is a myth propagated by fearmongers and/or paranoids.

I agree with your comments above on your approach to healthcare. However, I think the cynicism toward the pharmaceutical industry's tendency to place profit over health and safety are well founded.

http://ahrp.blogspot.com/2007/06/drug-tria...scrupulous.html

http://www.ahrp.org/cms/content/view/341/29/

http://www.naturalnews.com/022045.html

http://www.karlloren.com/healthinsurance/p45.htm

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_...icle3441583.ece

http://www.cepr.net/index.php/op-eds-colum...king-the-habit/

[JSixpack]

And...what's your views on the Illuminati, the JFK Assassination and 9/11, just out of curiosity?

There can be NO doubt whatsoever that the Illuminati were behind the JFK Assassination (the Cuban missle bungle) and 9/11. I can also reveal to you now for the first time that the Loma Prieta earthquake on October 17, 1989, at 5:04 p.m., was caused by the detonation of an experimental Illuminati device secretly buried 10000 meters beneath the earth along the San Andreas Fault. This is just the beginning!!! I know absolutely because I KNOW--period. Besides, I've also HEARD.

I don't really believe the drug-company conspiracy theory. They would be the first to isolate, patent, package and profit from alternative medicines!

So very true. And it's surprising how often that, after an alternative medicine or miracle vitamin gets "discovered" and touted by its growers and herbalists and alternative medicine practitioners and shareholders who stand to profit, later scientific experiments prove the claims false and even discover some dangers. No need to give examples here, some quite recent, since the science will be deemed "flawed" and, being part of the FDA conspiracy, will have discounted the crucial anecdotal evidence given by trusted anti-conspirators who KNOW.

"I WANT TO BELIEVE"

[kat]

http://www.healthfreedomusa.org/index.php?page_id=205

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detai...nce&s=books

The Cancer Conspiracy: Betrayal, Collusion and the Suppression of Alternative Cancer Treatments (Paperback)

5.0 out of 5 stars Clear, concise overview of medical suppression, racketeering, November 24, 2003

By Jed Shlackman (Miami, FL United States) - See all my reviews

(REAL NAME)

Lynes does a solid job of looking at the history of allopathic medical racketeering in the USA, focusing on cancer treatments that have been suppressed because they are safe, natural, cheap, and effective. The history of Royal Rife is impressive and well documented, and his proven electromagnetic treatments remain suppressed, with practitioners persecuted by the established allopathic medical cartel and their allies. Lynes documents his research well, and offers enlightenment to those seeking to understand the history of the bogus war on cancer and medical racketeering. The only major aspect of the topic not discussed is evidence that certain elements of global oligarchic powers see allopatic medical control and practices as a means of population control or population reduction.

[kat]

http://www.shirleys-wellness-cafe.com/vaccines.htm#1

October 2007 New England Journal of Medicine - Vaccine Damage: Parents receive $2B compensation pay-outs - Vaccine manufacturers have paid out nearly $2B in damages to parents in America whose children were harmed by one of the childhood jabs such as the MMR (measles-mumps-rubella) or DPT (diphtheria-pertussis-tetanus). In all, around 2,000 families have received compensation payments that have averaged $850,000 each. There are a further 700 claims that are going through the pipeline. None of the claims is for autism as medical researchers say they have failed to find a link between the disease and the MMR vaccine, despite the initial findings made by Dr Andrew Wakefield. Instead they are for a wide spectrum of physical and mental conditions that are likely to have been caused by one of the vaccinations. Around 7,000 parents have filed a claim of an adverse reaction with America's Vaccine Injury Compensation Program (VICP). To win an award, the claimant must prove a causal link to a vaccine. As the medical establishment has refused to recognise any link to autism, the VICP has so far rejected 300 claims for this outright. (Source: New England Journal of Medicine, 2007; 357: 1275-9). U.S. Government Concedes That Mercury Causes Autism

US senators fast-track a bill to protect vaccine manufacturers from litigation - Seven US Senators introduced a bill to protect vaccine manufacturers from thousands of pending federal lawsuits filed by parents of vaccine-damaged children. On the eve of an historic, billion-dollar world vaccination campaign, a leaked transcript ignites questions of vaccine safety and research corruption. Meanwhile, US senators fast-track a bill to protect vaccine manufacturers from litigation. With millions of lives at stake, and billions of dollars to lose, will a merger of philanthropy, big business and compromised science win an epic race between corporate agendas and medical ethics? In this world exclusive report, byronchild exposes how the most powerful medical research bodies in the United States compromise their vaccine safety research for vested interests, as they assist in a global vaccine policy, while a bill looms in the background to protect it all.

*added: BTW - a gluten/casein free diet is now a recognized dietary intervention for children with autism and "leaky gut" syndromes.

Edited May 13, 2008 by kat

[Sheryl]

[

Since Aloe is claimed to prevent colon cancer, it's surprising to hear claims it causes it. They also state 'There is early evidence that oral aloe may reduce the risk of developing lung cancer'. So it causes one cancer and prevents another? Studies show Aloe is beneficial in preventing Colon Cancer. http://www.mnwelldir.org/docs/cancer2/colon.htm

Sorry, but this link does not provide any studies. It simply makes claims and cites names of people with no reference to documentation of studt methodology or results.

AFAIK there have not been any studies on the effect of aloe vera juice on the incidence of any type cancer. Such studies are exteremely hard to do and require many, many years of prospective follow up.

Since aloe vera joice is a laxative and habitual long term use of laxatives -- of any type -- are known to carry risks, no one is likely to do a study that involves long term use of it.

It is certainly true that the financial source for a study and any afvfiliations of its researchers need to be taken into account when considering its results. So must its methodology.

The same is true of claims made for the health benefits of herbal or other "natural"treatments.

What I find odd is the uncritical acceptance of wide-sweeping claims made on websites of companies who make their money selling the product. (I would also say uncritical acceptance of their studies except that there don't seem to be any actual studies, at least none that can be verified as actaully existing).

A healthy degree of scepticism towards the pharmaceutical inductry is reasonable. Complete disregard for scientific studies isn't. Neither is a blind trust in claims made by the also very lucrative and equally profit-driven industry of "natural" cures.

The first 2 links posted in this thread proved to be sites selling aloe vera juice.. Do you really think it reasonable to accept their claims at face value simply because they aren't part of the established medical profession?

The simple reality is that the "established"medical profession is not part of a vast evil conspiracy but rather a diverse group of professionals many (but not all) of whom are to various degrees influenced by profit considerations. The exact same (except the group also including a fair number of non-professionals) is true of the "alternative" health field.

Whole-sale acceptance or rejection of what either group says wqithout cirtical assessment of the basis for what they say is just plain foolish.

Regarding aloe vera:

1) The gel and the juice of the plant are 2 different matters.

2) The gel has been extensively tested and shown to have beneficial properties in relieving inflammation when used topically. It's also very widely used in cosmetics.

3) The juice has laxative properties. Regular use of laxatives is never a good idea. Beyond this (or, for example, taking it in smaller doses that don't produce a laxative effect) there is no scientific evidence AFAIK of its effects, positive or negative. There have been reports of adverse effects and interactions with other drugs but it cannot be proven that these were due to the aloe. There are slews of unsubstantiated claims for a very wide range of supposed health benefits. Most of these are posted on websites that sell the product.