Doom And Dispair

[qwertz]

Will Armageddon be upon us before September, OP?

I really really hope not, I've just bought my air ticket!

[boiledegg]

I remember when I was in primary school in the 80's practising for a nuclear attack- it never happened.

Really? In the 80's? You sure about that? It was all over bar the shouting by then wasn't it?

Maybe he went to school in Chernobyl.

[garro]

I remember when I was in primary school in the 80's practising for a nuclear attack- it never happened.

Really? In the 80's? You sure about that? It was all over bar the shouting by then wasn't it?

Maybe he went to school in Chernobyl.

Perhaps you two lived in a different 1980s than I did and missed the Ronald Regan years. Not to worry. Here is a look at some of the things going on;

In May 1981, in response to President Reagan's aggressive talk about nuclear war, the Soviet Union instituted the RYAN (Nuclear-Rocket Attack) program, which created a "heightened state of intelligence alert, instructing all foreign stations to conduct a constant watch for tell-tale signs of the buildup to a Western nuclear strike."

http://www.colorado.edu/AmStudies/lewis/2010/nuclear.htm#May

"Yes, there could be a limited nuclear war in Europe."

___President Reagan, 1981

"We have contingency plans to fire a [nuclear] warning shot at the Soviet Union, warning of U.S. intentions to begin a nuclear war."

__Secretary of State Haig, 1981

Responding the United States announcement that it had plans to fire a "nuclear warning shot," Soviet leader Brezhnev said: "Even the use of one nuclear bomb would inevitably lead to an all-out nuclear exchange."

In late 1981, President Reagan approved a National Security Decision Document committing the United States to fight and win a global nuclear war.

___New York Times, Spring 1982

"There is no alternative to war with the Soviet Union if the Russians do not abandon communism."

___Richard Pipes, Top Reagan adviser, 1981

"The probability of nuclear war is 40 percent...and our strategy is winnable nuclear war."

_Richard Pipes, Top Reagan adviser, 1982

Edited June 25, 2008 by garro

[BEENTHEREDONETHAT]

I read an article the other day where it was saying that due to rising energy prices Western governments are inevitably going to have to lower the tax burden on the proles.

So things are looking up if our governments have less money to fund their phoney wars and waste billions on the scams and schemes they think up to steal money from us.

When you got guys like George W. they just go ahead and spend big time, the great grandchildren can pay the bill. War now pay later program.

[PhilHarries]

I read an article the other day where it was saying that due to rising energy prices Western governments are inevitably going to have to lower the tax burden on the proles.

So things are looking up if our governments have less money to fund their phoney wars and waste billions on the scams and schemes they think up to steal money from us.

Never forget "What the government giveth with one hand it taketh away with the other".

If any government reduces any taxation on any commodity you can bet they will increase it elsewhere - with interest.

So you see that your second statement is wishfull thinking, honourable but wishfull all the same.

To answer the OP's question "are we facing the end of days?"

Answer : Possibly. The truth is that the Earth's population is growing but the planet isn't. Maybe some of the natural disasters, epidemics etc are just mother Earth's way of thinning us out.

The threat of war, to some extent, is also aligned to overpopulation and over demand. Today we are fighting over energy resources, tomorrow it will be water.

[distortedlink]

Oh the pain, the pain.

Life is a terminal disease.

Stop the world, I want to get off.

Edited June 26, 2008 by distortedlink

[mijan24]

There was a Australian Prime Minister who said "Life wasn't meant to be easy" I think he was fired for daring to tell the truth.

Probably Mr. Howard speaking to the last batch of refugees, just before he shipped them to the camp out in the desert.

No Malcom Fraser just before he wined and dined - at McThai (look at your next receipt from the golden arches Thailand for verification of the McThai)

edit spelling slip

Edited June 26, 2008 by mijan24

[Gary A]

When I was a young man, aggressive and filled with ambition, I received the best advice I ever got. At that time I was VERY angry with that advice.

Now that I am older and my working days behind me, I recognize that the advice was sound.

"Never concern yourself with things you have no control over".

[bendix]

Garro is right. The worst of the nuclear threat wasn't over by the 80s. I worked for a while as a civvy at a US air force base in England in the 80s and I distinctly remember the reaction and the upgrade in warfare readiness when the Russians shot down the Korean airliner.

[qwertz]

When should I stop my rent and Medicare payments?

[IMA_FARANG]

With so many bad events occuring both in Thailand and around the planet mayn people i talk with - both Thais and ferangs seem to have given up hope - lost their way/purpose in life. I am not just talking about the odd pessimist - i mean people who normaly had a rosey view on life.

Earth quakes, floods, new diseases/viruses, economic doom - high oil price, food shortages, massive debt, rumours of war - Iran, dissenfranchised young - young girls and boys turning to drugs, becoming sexualized at such an early age, no respect for parents or authority - who can blame them, etc. etc.

Many of these events seem somewhat biblical in prophecy - last days!!

Or is it just me!

So what's new!

There is a an Egyptian papryrus scroll that was found some years ago sealed in a jar in one a priests tomb. It basically says this:

The young no longer obey their parents,

famine and evil spreads throughout the country

all around there is war.

Not even in the temples are the Old Gods respected.

Shurely the end of the world is at hand.

It dates back to about 1500 B.C. It just goes to show you that even then certain people were talking about the end of the world coming "soon".

I expect 2000 years from now, the same type of people will be saying the same things.

[canuckamuck]

With so many bad events occuring both in Thailand and around the planet mayn people i talk with - both Thais and ferangs seem to have given up hope - lost their way/purpose in life. I am not just talking about the odd pessimist - i mean people who normaly had a rosey view on life.

Earth quakes, floods, new diseases/viruses, economic doom - high oil price, food shortages, massive debt, rumours of war - Iran, dissenfranchised young - young girls and boys turning to drugs, becoming sexualized at such an early age, no respect for parents or authority - who can blame them, etc. etc.

Many of these events seem somewhat biblical in prophecy - last days!!

Or is it just me!

Nobody seems to be disputing all the negative conditions you are listing, nor do they seem concerned. So I guess people here feel that humanity's current path is somehow sustainable. Just imagine the crap that will be going on in 20 years.

Personally I see a huge correlation between today and the prophesied last days, especially since there is a parallel increase in large natural disasters. I cannot say however that humanity has a one week or a century to go.

All I can say is some will recognize the signs of the end, whether they feel it is biblical or man's own fatal flaws, and then work towards things that are truly important. The job of the others is to scoff. Those positions are quickly filled.

[bendix]

It's curious, though, isnt it? All those scoffers that you doomsdayers scoff at have had one thing in common over the centuries of scoffing at the armageddon fans. They've been right.

This thread is bizarre. I never knew Thaivisa harboured so many nutters.

[canuckamuck]

You knew it, don't lie

[Shotime]

In the past, talk of the end of days had to do with the hopes of oppressed, enslaved peoples. It was a prayer for retribution for their suffering and for the injustices they lived with daily. It's like wishing it would rain. Today, it's more or less the same, but it really doesn't look that good out there. I like to think most of it is just fear tactics to keep everyone in line and distracted. Food and water shortages, climatic changes, religious wars, Samak as PM, (ok) Bush as President, nuclear weapon reemergence, etc., I'm starting to scare myself.

[bendix]

Let's turn this around.

More people have more money in their pockets than ever before. According to the news last night, over 650,000 new millionaires were created last night. There are now more than 10.1 million millionnaires globally. Almost half the new millionaires are in countries which - 20 years ago - were economic basketcases (India, China and Brazil).

The standard of living for the average Joe is vastly superior to what it was even 20-25 years ago. Today, electronic goods, dvds, personal computers, labour saving devices of all sorts are found in homes which, a generation ago, couldnt have dreamed of them. Our definition of the poverty line has increased drastically.

People have much better access to healthcare, and life expectancy has increased all around the world. Techology and science have revolutionised people's lives.

Even the number of people around the world described as living in extreme poverty (under $1 a day) has decreased substantially, although at 860 million it is still too many. There is no food shortage. There is plenty of food to go around. Ridiculous situations like paying US and European farmers to destroy their produce when people in Africa go hungry is a fault of global governance, not a sign of food poverty.

Wars? What wars? The world is more peaceful today than at anytime in recent history with fewer armed conflicts. What we have, though, is a new media age which makes it seems like things are in turmoil.

Armageddon and doomsday prophesying, my arse.

We've never had it so good.

Of course there are problems. Environmental issues and the rise of Islamic jihad are two of them, but get a grip people.

[canuckamuck]

Let's turn this around.

More people have more money in their pockets than ever before. According to the news last night, over 650,000 new millionaires were created last night. There are now more than 10.1 million millionnaires globally. Almost half the new millionaires are in countries which - 20 years ago - were economic basketcases (India, China and Brazil).

The standard of living for the average Joe is vastly superior to what it was even 20-25 years ago. Today, electronic goods, dvds, personal computers, labour saving devices of all sorts are found in homes which, a generation ago, couldnt have dreamed of them. Our definition of the poverty line has increased drastically.

People have much better access to healthcare, and life expectancy has increased all around the world. Techology and science have revolutionised people's lives.

Even the number of people around the world described as living in extreme poverty (under $1 a day) has decreased substantially, although at 860 million it is still too many. There is no food shortage. There is plenty of food to go around. Ridiculous situations like paying US and European farmers to destroy their produce when people in Africa go hungry is a fault of global governance, not a sign of food poverty.

Wars? What wars? The world is more peaceful today than at anytime in recent history with fewer armed conflicts. What we have, though, is a new media age which makes it seems like things are in turmoil.

Armageddon and doomsday prophesying, my arse.

We've never had it so good.

Of course there are problems. Environmental issues and the rise of Islamic jihad are two of them, but get a grip people.

I think moral decay is the biggest indicator to me personally that things are bleak. I understand however, that humanity has always had serious trouble treating each other with respect.

As a westerner I can see our own moral codes have eroded considerably to the point where there is no longer a reference point to make policy. I feel that the rise of China among others, into the realm of super economic influence is also discouraging because of that country's stunning lack of conscience.

You mention that we have a better standard of living; I guess that is a personal bias. I prefer to feel safe from crime and jihads; I prefer to get on an airplane without being treated like a terrorist. I wish parents could send their kids out the door to play and expect that they will be fine. Sure we have more toys, more ways to pursue leisure. But is anyone happier or are they just thinking about what the next guy has.

I take several trips a year to work with people suffering serious poverty, places like Nepal. Watching kids die from simple fevers is a wake up call to any illusion of global riches. For me, wealth is related to how much I can share, how much impact I have on my neighbors. If we were truly rich, there would be more personal involvement.

Because the Bible tells me moral decay, economic crisis, wars, and natural disasters will occur in the last days. I believe that this is true. But I do not say we are there yet, it could be a lot worse. It doesn't matter when the end will come. We all die anyways and that's the end of the world too.

[bendix]

Pick any point in time. Any century. Any decade. Any year.

You will find people saying the economy is screwed, natural disasters are prevalent and the world aint what it used to be - and people don't respect each other anymore.

History provides a useful perspective.

[dave111223]

Think about if you lived like 1000 years ago, when almost everyone lived in what we now would consider squaller.

Or even if you were in WWII, or the Plague you really would have been screaming the sky is falling.

I think some people should be prohibited from watching CNN until they get a grasp on reality. Maybe there should be a question when you turn the TV on "Will a anvil potentially fall on your head", if answer is Yes then you should be restricted to the cartoon channels (or maybe the Thai news channels).

[popshirt]

I blame all the angst on Fox News

[canuckamuck]

Just for relevance to the Christian world view, which I assume was the basis for the OP's term 'Biblical'. Here is a real world paraphrase of one of Jesus' statements regarding the end.

When reports come in of wars and rumored wars, keep your head and don't panic. This is routine history; this is no sign of the end. Nation will fight nation and ruler fight ruler, over and over. Famines and earthquakes will occur in various places. This is nothing compared to what is coming. "They are going to throw you to the wolves and kill you, everyone hating you because you carry my name. And then, going from bad to worse, it will be dog-eat-dog, everyone at each other's throat, everyone hating each other. "In the confusion, lying preachers will come forward and deceive a lot of people. For many others, the overwhelming spread of evil will do them in—nothing left of their love but a mound of ashes. "Staying with it—that's what God requires. Stay with it to the end. You won't be sorry, and you'll be saved. All during this time, the good news—the Message of the kingdom—will be preached all over the world, a witness staked out in every country. And then the end will come. "But be ready to run for it when you see the monster of desecration set up in the Temple sanctuary. The prophet Daniel described this. If you've read Daniel, you'll know what I'm talking about. If you're living in Judea at the time, run for the hills; if you're working in the yard, don't return to the house to get anything; if you're out in the field, don't go back and get your coat. Pregnant and nursing mothers will have it especially hard. Hope and pray this won't happen during the winter or on a Sabbath. "This is going to be trouble on a scale beyond what the world has ever seen, or will see again. If these days of trouble were left to run their course, nobody would make it. But on account of God's chosen people, the trouble will be cut short.

Message Bible (Matthew 24:6-22)

[garro]

Garro is right. The worst of the nuclear threat wasn't over by the 80s. I worked for a while as a civvy at a US air force base in England in the 80s and I distinctly remember the reaction and the upgrade in warfare readiness when the Russians shot down the Korean airliner.

I seem to be on the same side in this argument as Bendix. Perhaps the end days are coming after all.

[grantbkk]

To the people dwelling on the negative, you've got to lighten up. Until you do, stay away from firearms and thinking too much when you are in a high rise building. One poster said something to the effect that you should not worry about what you cannot control. Sage advise! There are so many positive things in life that we take for granted. Be aware of what is going on in the world but focus on positive thoughts and deeds. Negative thoughts and vibes bring down everyone around you.

[bendix]

Just for relevance to the Christian world view, which I assume was the basis for the OP's term 'Biblical'. Here is a real world paraphrase of one of Jesus' statements regarding the end.

When reports come in of wars and rumored wars, keep your head and don't panic. This is routine history; this is no sign of the end. Nation will fight nation and ruler fight ruler, over and over. Famines and earthquakes will occur in various places. This is nothing compared to what is coming. "They are going to throw you to the wolves and kill you, everyone hating you because you carry my name. And then, going from bad to worse, it will be dog-eat-dog, everyone at each other's throat, everyone hating each other. "In the confusion, lying preachers will come forward and deceive a lot of people. For many others, the overwhelming spread of evil will do them in—nothing left of their love but a mound of ashes. "Staying with it—that's what God requires. Stay with it to the end. You won't be sorry, and you'll be saved. All during this time, the good news—the Message of the kingdom—will be preached all over the world, a witness staked out in every country. And then the end will come. "But be ready to run for it when you see the monster of desecration set up in the Temple sanctuary. The prophet Daniel described this. If you've read Daniel, you'll know what I'm talking about. If you're living in Judea at the time, run for the hills; if you're working in the yard, don't return to the house to get anything; if you're out in the field, don't go back and get your coat. Pregnant and nursing mothers will have it especially hard. Hope and pray this won't happen during the winter or on a Sabbath. "This is going to be trouble on a scale beyond what the world has ever seen, or will see again. If these days of trouble were left to run their course, nobody would make it. But on account of God's chosen people, the trouble will be cut short.

Message Bible (Matthew 24:6-22)

Oh . . right . . .

Well, that's me convinced then.

[siamamerican]

Other than the declining US dollar life is pretty rosy. The world is different than the past and not any worse. Still have those that can't be happy and those that don't see any alternative but living life to its fullest. If it all comes to end tomorrow, I'll die happy and the doom and gloomers will be right in their predictions. I can live with that.

[bonobo]

I am not getting onto the "Last Days" arguement as I pretty much don't give it any credence. As bendix (I think it was him) posted, the only thing all the end-of-dayers throughout history have had in common is that they have all been wrong.

And yes, throughout history, there have been many stresses on populations which have caused dispair and dismay. Mongols, the Mini-Ice Age, Krakatoa, the plague, the potato famine, Vikings, the Spanish Flu, Europeans invading the Americas, and on and on.So the feelings of despair are not new.

But that does not mean the feelings of pessimism and despair which are conclusivly on the rise are not valid. The rising cost of fuel and food come foremost into mind. With a 40% in fod prices in some places where the population spends upwards of 85% of their income already for food, well the math does not work out. This will cause pressure, starvation, and most likley violence. Radical Islam and Hinduism have the potential to sow more discord amongst the world population, and the potential for radical Christianity in response cannot be discarded. Fuel shortages can stymmie economic growth leading to discontent amongst populations which have seen the golden ring and now want it. Water shortages will almost certainly lead to at least small-scale wars. Global warming can have a huge impact on life as we know it.

THere have always been challenges and problems in the past, and this will probably never change. But to ignore the current and near-future challenges is like sticking your head in theh sand. I am more pessimistic now than I have been in recent years, but by understanding the challenges, I hope we can work to mitigate the unwanted consequences of these problems.

[barky]

And if indeed we are in our last days. What does it matter ? We'll ALL go together family, friends, lovers, and enemy a like. Are you ready? Ready or not, much of the angst is meaningless when viewed against time and the cosmos. Be good to yourself and others, especially your family and life partner, live peacefully, enjoy it while you have it and be as happy as you can. Avoid anyone or anything that does not fit this criteria.

[canuckamuck]

Oh . . right . . .

Well, that's me convinced then.

Just added the quote as relevant info regarding the concept of biblical endtimes. It concurred with some of what you said, had you bothered to look.

[Edonista]

With so many bad events occuring both in Thailand and around the planet mayn people i talk with - both Thais and ferangs seem to have given up hope - lost their way/purpose in life. I am not just talking about the odd pessimist - i mean people who normaly had a rosey view on life.

Earth quakes, floods, new diseases/viruses, economic doom - high oil price, food shortages, massive debt, rumours of war - Iran, dissenfranchised young - young girls and boys turning to drugs, becoming sexualized at such an early age, no respect for parents or authority - who can blame them, etc. etc.

Many of these events seem somewhat biblical in prophecy - last days!!

Or is it just me!

It is just you.

[whatsoever]

It's curious, though, isnt it? All those scoffers that you doomsdayers scoff at have had one thing in common over the centuries of scoffing at the armageddon fans. They've been right.

This thread is bizarre. I never knew Thaivisa harboured so many nutters.

Count yourself as the biggest - anyone with a Stalin avatar has serious problems!