Drop In Tourism Over Past 6 Months

[monkeytunes]

I think that its only to be expected, most people I speak to in Europe particulary the UK are having to watch the pennies, plus with the increase in fuel prices affecting airfares theres bound to be an affect on Long Haul holidays.

In terms of cost inThailand, yes for those living here like myself we see prices rising quite allot, but lets not be fool if you come here on there on Holiday once you get here it is still very very cheap.

[ace]

Low bet

5 Chinese = 1 farang …….in spending

And the chinese like to eat in group,...cuz group eating is much much cheaper!!!....unlike the farangs

Last year was running a condo restaurant in Pattya (brief adventure). Mostly Germans, Europeans. Would turn up, order some fried rice, couple of beers, profit 70 baht or so per person. Chinese group turns up for a week. Spend every evening in the restaurant (attached to condo). Lots of them, drinking, eating, having fun. Order? 7 boiled rice please Profit? 30 baht. Total.

[Edonista]

pattaya will have to be renamed "little moscow"soon.

I think "New Sevastopol" would be more appropriate

[ovenman]

If you look at higher end of the market, you should compare it to higher end market in western countries. Have you checked how much 5-star hotel costs at mediterranean? Here is one example of daily rate of almost 20000B: http://www.ghotw.com/hotel/rates/blau-porto-petro.htm , I'm sure you can find much more expensive examples.

Have you checked the rates at similar properties in Thailand? Look up Four Seasons in Chiang Mai. I'm getting quoted low season rates on 18000+ baht/night from various sources for one of their standard rooms.

Edited August 8, 2008 by ovenman

[whatsoever]

Low bet

5 Chinese = 1 farang …….in spending

And the chinese like to eat in group,...cuz group eating is much much cheaper!!!....unlike the farangs

Read an article in the Bangkok Post, sometime ago, which quoted a foreign buisness man who was doing buisiness in China. He had on occassions traveled with government officials (mid level civil servants e.g.) whom were given a daily out of pocket allowance of approx. 100 baht per day!

Edited August 8, 2008 by whatsoever

[teacup]

Low bet

5 Chinese = 1 farang …….in spending

And the chinese like to eat in group,...cuz group eating is much much cheaper!!!....unlike the farangs

Last year was running a condo restaurant in Pattya (brief adventure). Mostly Germans, Europeans. Would turn up, order some fried rice, couple of beers, profit 70 baht or so per person. Chinese group turns up for a week. Spend every evening in the restaurant (attached to condo). Lots of them, drinking, eating, having fun. Order? 7 boiled rice please Profit? 30 baht. Total.

And I will do the profiling of their activities for you

The middle east people

-Don’t eat pork, beef , but mostly chicken --duh chicken dish is cheaper, therefore quite loss of revenue there on big value plate dishes

-They pray atleast 3 or more times per day - in their room --HELLO!!!

The chineses…..if they could

Beside the already "prepaid" scheduled tour, they probably will be doing.....

-Do "tai-chi" in the morning at the park or next to the bed, after the "free" hotel breakfast

-Then off to shopping with the penny pitching budget in mind

-Then follow by the afternoon w/ a fortune teller in Chinatown or some nearby WAT - cost 40-60 bth?

-Then lounging around "free" hotel pool with bottle of H2O or simple diet Coke

-Evening with GROUP eating buffet

-May be a night in the bar with just 1 beer - all night - salivating next to the pole!!

They may have the quantity, but no quality in term of spending!!!!....you see my point now? Now who still has high hope on the chinese tourists

Edited August 8, 2008 by teacup

[NotNew2You]

To recap, there are innumerable small and medium buisinesses which have been built up and depend on the traditional ferang tourist with a high daily spend. These new groups (quality tourists - my big hairy ar-se) have low a daily spend

When traffic is as light as it was 10 years ago...then I will believe that tourist numbers are actually down. As to substituting Chinese, Koreans, Arabs, Indians, and Russians for Euro families and Euro Mongers, I don't really think the Thais distinguish between the two. If anything, most would probably see the backside of the mongers.

Those businesses that have built their model on endless sex-tourists visiting Pattaya...they may have to come up with a new business model.

Not quite which sois you cruise at nites, but most businesses seem to be doing okay for low season. One bar-keep I talk to often says his receipts are actually up slightly from last year!

[ozzydom]

Most Chinese tourists are members of group tours (not just in Los ,but everywhere) as it is extremely difficult for a sole traveller to get an exit visa from China...

As well most of their activities when overseas is based around the kick back system.

Accomodation , food, even their souvenirs purchases are all provided by suppliers associated with or controlled by the tour company.

[bkkjames]

Interesting related story on cnn http://edition.cnn.com/2008/TRAVEL/08/07/e...n.ap/index.html

[LivinLOS]

Maybe its beach scenes like these that are putting people off ??

Check that even in strongish surf, how much of a stain that is without breaking up.. Thats supposed to be one of the 'better' beaches on Phuket.

And they want to get rind of the mongers for 'quality tourists' !!! you think quality tourists want to see that kind of toxic effluent in the water.

[whatsoever]

To recap, there are innumerable small and medium buisinesses which have been built up and depend on the traditional ferang tourist with a high daily spend. These new groups (quality tourists - my big hairy ar-se) have low a daily spend

When traffic is as light as it was 10 years ago...then I will believe that tourist numbers are actually down. As to substituting Chinese, Koreans, Arabs, Indians, and Russians for Euro families and Euro Mongers, I don't really think the Thais distinguish between the two. If anything, most would probably see the backside of the mongers.

Those businesses that have built their model on endless sex-tourists visiting Pattaya...they may have to come up with a new business model.

Not quite which sois you cruise at nites, but most businesses seem to be doing okay for low season. One bar-keep I talk to often says his receipts are actually up slightly from last year!

TAT has stated numbers are down 30% However, according to you and a bar-keep everything is fine. And the Thais dont distinguish between different types of visitors. And all the Thais with interests in catering for the needs of the higher spending mongers would like to see the back of them.

Well your argument is very convincing - makes total sense

PS traffic is heavier than 10 years ago because more people have more cars

Edited August 8, 2008 by whatsoever

[chickencurry]

The TAT have announced a 30% drop in tourism over the past 6 months. Pattaya being the worst affected.

I personaly think the worst is yet to come. What do you think?

NB. Property developers and agents need not answer

Flights are now expensive so expect the trend to continue and people will take their vacation closer to home.

Absolutely correct - and it is not just tourism in Thailand that will be affected.

[wasabi]

Am thinking too thailand is n't really that cheap a place for tourists(couples,families)some of the prices for 4 and 5 star resorts,prices are western prices,same as eating out at a nice restaurant,liquor prices too are n't cheap.Holidaying in australia(apart from the cost of the flight to get there)is n't a lot more expensive.Thailand stil cheap for backpackers though and for western residents(if you eat at thai cafe's and dont go to bars every night................where is cheap these days?

I don't think it's Thailand in particular doing anything wrong. It's world wide inflation and economic slowdown. I definitely find Thailand not to be the bargain it used to be. In fact all things considered it's coming close to being on par with how i lived back home but back home there is water you can drink and air you can breathe so maybe I'll go home.

[imkoreanboy]

sars is what got me hooked on thailand. nw offered $500 roundtrip from the greatest show on earth, usa. i bought 2 tickets as i needed the miles.

Seriously , who in their right mind brings their families to vacation in thailand. This is no place for young uns!

[jumnien]

How could a downturn in tourism possibly be seen as bad news for those of us who live here or those who are considering vacationing here? This is fantastic news! Expect cheaper prices on everything from fried rice to condos. Happy days are truly coming to Thailand again!

I mean really, has any of us here in Thailand sat around thinking "gee, I wish there were more tourists about driving up prices and creating more traffic."

Edited August 8, 2008 by sunrise07

[absolutelyBangkok]

OP: Where to find this TAT announcement?

[whatsoever]

OP: Where to find this TAT announcement?

Dont you believe me My source may only be divulged on receipt of gratuity

[bkkjames]

How could a downturn in tourism possibly be seen as bad news for those of us who live here or those who are considering vacationing here? This is fantastic news! Expect cheaper prices on everything from fried rice to condos. Happy days are truly coming to Thailand again!

I mean really, has any of us here in Thailand sat around thinking "gee, I wish there were more tourists about driving up prices and creating more traffic."

Dream on, while you may get a good hotel rate, expect every tuk tuk driver to tailor to be out to take you for as much as possible. Wouldn't suprise me to see an increase in crime against tourists - thefts and the like.

[jumnien]

How could a downturn in tourism possibly be seen as bad news for those of us who live here or those who are considering vacationing here? This is fantastic news! Expect cheaper prices on everything from fried rice to condos. Happy days are truly coming to Thailand again!

I mean really, has any of us here in Thailand sat around thinking "gee, I wish there were more tourists about driving up prices and creating more traffic."

Dream on, while you may get a good hotel rate, expect every tuk tuk driver to tailor to be out to take you for as much as possible. Wouldn't suprise me to see an increase in crime against tourists - thefts and the like.

I've been here for a decade and everytime tourism drops it's happy time in the Kingdom! When there's lots of tourists, it sucks! And I haven't taken a tuk-tuk or visited a tailor for a decade anyway!

Edited August 8, 2008 by sunrise07

[absolutelyBangkok]

Be assured of my gratuity.

But please post the source, as there's nothing available on the usual sites.

[NotNew2You]

PS traffic is heavier than 10 years ago because more people have more cars

Yes...and why do more people have cars? I would submit that economic conditions are not that bad in Thailand, and particularly in Pattaya. How else could all these Thai afford to buy AND FUEL all the cars and motorbikes clogging up every road and soi in Pattaya!

Sure, things are going to slow down somewhat...especially from long-haul visitors. But as I pointed out, there are literally hundreds of millions of potential Thailand travel customers in Thailand's own backyard. I used the example of my friend only to point out that not EVERY business is suffering bad business...not that none are.

Maybe monger numbers are on a permanent declining slope due to numerous factors that have been discussed over the past few years and there are just too many bars and restaurants that cater to that tourist segment. They will have to retrench or come up with alternative business models.

[LaoPo]

OP: Where to find this TAT announcement?

Dont you believe me My source may only be divulged on receipt of gratuity

Sorry, but I for one can't take such statements for granted unless you come up with a -reliable- press-source. I just checked the TAT website and NEWS about TAT as well....zero news about a decline of -30% in the first 6 months. Those figures are not yet accessible on the TAT website; just for 2007; not even the first 3 months of 2008.

So unless your news is backed by a reliable source, it is not (yet) true.

That does not mean that it is not true at all but the problem with TAT is that they publish a lot of news-rubbish but FACTS are withheld for a long time. Nobody can tell me that it would be so difficult to publish the numbers for the first 3 months/2008 or even the first 6 months/008.

http://www.tatnews.org/index.asp

http://www2.tat.or.th/stat/web/static_download.php?Rpt=ata

Mind you, I would NOT be surprised with a decline of -30% in tourism as I feared inbound-tourism to become dramatic this year and 2009 to come as described in this topic:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/So-farang-To...nd-t194405.html

LaoPo

[LaoPo]

Low bet

5 Chinese = 1 farang …….in spending

And the chinese like to eat in group,...cuz group eating is much much cheaper!!!....unlike the farangs

You just lost your low bet...

Table_Summary_2007.xls

Chinese spend more/day (in Thailand) than the average European and just a little less than the American or Ozzie, but more than the Kiwi.

There you go....

LaoPo

[Tyke]

The TAT have announced a 30% drop in tourism over the past 6 months. Pattaya being the worst affected.

I personaly think the worst is yet to come. What do you think?

NB. Property developers and agents need not answer

Flights are now expensive so expect the trend to continue and people will take their vacation closer to home.

Yes, the main reason, plus economic gloom like potential unemployment, lack of credit based on home values that many in the west, like the UK, have been relying on to provide holiday cash. Even so, I do think high oil prices are a good thing in the long run.

[Payboy]

Low bet

5 Chinese = 1 farang …….in spending

And the chinese like to eat in group,...cuz group eating is much much cheaper!!!....unlike the farangs

You just lost your low bet...

Table_Summary_2007.xls

Chinese spend more/day (in Thailand) than the average European and just a little less than the American or Ozzie, but more than the Kiwi.

There you go....

LaoPo

well... who would have guessed - some of the euro mongers are amongst the lowest spenders....

south africa tops..followed by india....

[absolutelyBangkok]

Since some months TAT has actually been pretty stingy with releasing statistics:

http://thaicrisis.wordpress.com/2008/05/11...cs-for-january/

So OP: You may have a off-the-record source, but then please back up your claim with some facts - such as much lower airport arrivals, less planes, whatever.

It just adds to your credibiity!

[think_too_mut]

Low bet

5 Chinese = 1 farang …….in spending

And the chinese like to eat in group,...cuz group eating is much much cheaper!!!....unlike the farangs

You just lost your low bet...

Table_Summary_2007.xls

Chinese spend more/day (in Thailand) than the average European and just a little less than the American or Ozzie, but more than the Kiwi.

There you go....

LaoPo

LaoPo, as much as I would like to believe the stats you have enclosed, not sure how it was measured.

Don't know if Chinese roam Thai boards asking how to avoid paying airport fee for taxis (jump in when they drop off passengers at departures) or catch a bus or train, anything but taxi or a limo...but farangs do that in droves, right here, on this board.

Last year's results showed 45% of all international tourists were Asians.

[LivinLOS]

TAT has stated numbers are down 30% However, according to you and a bar-keep everything is fine.

Where have the TAT said this.. The OP said it, and I asked for a source..

The TAT recently did say that this years numbers are down something like 16%.. Nothing close to 30%.. so lets have some facts, or a source, or some kind of basis other than 'my mate said'..

[LivinLOS]

PS traffic is heavier than 10 years ago because more people have more cars

Yes...and why do more people have cars? I would submit that economic conditions are not that bad in Thailand, and particularly in Pattaya. How else could all these Thai afford to buy AND FUEL all the cars and motorbikes clogging up every road and soi in Pattaya!

How many of those cars are paid for..

Its the boom in cheap credit and easy money thats done it.. Thailand is your ultimate sub prime.

[LivinLOS]

I wonder if the OP read this

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Phuket-Touri...tu-t198179.html

And then just dreamt up the rest ??