Are Tourist Police Still Engaging In Torture Of Farang Prisoners

[britmaveric]

Warren Fellows believed admitted he was guilty and deserved what he got. He just wanted to warn any would be criminals to stay above board in Thailand and SEA in general because the consequences are rather severe.

[Prakanong]

Warren Fellows believed admitted he was guilty and deserved what he got. He just wanted to warn any would be criminals to stay above board in Thailand and SEA in general because the consequences are rather severe.

He was also a bit "self pity city" too even though he had been a drug runner for years - he gets a slagging too over the Rugby players of Aussies

He still tells porkies too - you reckon they brought in elephants to play football with prisoners?

[Prakanong]

"There was an article in the Bangkok Post or the Nation this past week describing the inhumanity of all the jails in South East Asia."

Of course they are - we are disputing the tourist police being involved in a murder case not conditions in a Thai jail.

Then there is the fact of the multiple stabbing which he amazingly has amnesia about and thus has the logical jump to his innocence and it was all the nasty Thai's - he remembers fighting with the guy though - someone else must have popped out the jungle and stabbed the guy and run off eh?

The whole story has a million holes in it - yes people back in the UK were ripped off - just who was involved? My cynical view is above

[faranglandoz]

Any proof of this ?

It is a non-fiction account. You would have to believe the author. I find him very credible.

Sorry but I do not - there are so many holes in his account.

He never admits killing the bloke when they rolled down the embankment - who did?

Why would the Tourist Police be involved in this type of criminal investigation - it wouldbea matter for the ordinary police.

Another thing - he is allegged to reurn to Thailand and is seen in Pattaya according to reports - how does he get back in and why not PNG - and more to the point after all that would you return?

This book belongs alongside Warren Fellows and "hel_l's Prisoner" in the book of south east Asian prison fairy tales.

I met a farang who was in prison with Martyn, and evidently it was his Thai wifes brother that did the killing, but he got the blame. Martyn obviously changed the story for his book. Some of the conditions he described are quite true, so I have been told, so I believe the book is based on fact.

Faranglandoz

[Prakanong]

"I met a farang who was in prison with Martyn, and evidently it was his Thai wifes brother that did the killing, but he got the blame. Martyn obviously changed the story for his book. Some of the conditions he described are quite true, so I have been told, so I believe the book is based on fact."

Yes its based on facts - there was a murder, there was a guy who fiddled a lot of British workers out of large sums

There is a lot to fill in though

I thought they were travelling in a car from Pattaya to Bangkok - three of them in the car - the Kiwi, Martyn and the body guard - never any mention of the brother

I also (please correct me if I am wrong) also seem to remember it was a random piss stop - where was the brother hiding?

Condition described - yes i can well accept that - its the other <deleted> I am not convinced about.

[DB84]

I actually quite enjoyed the book, it was a good read despite the somewhat simple way in which it's written.

If every word is true or not, I guess nobody will ever know. However, most people who live here know of and/or experience some of the horrible things that go on in LOS.

To the people who denounce the book as mostly being fiction - do you really gather that the incidents that happen in LOS are extraordinarily dissimilar to the majority of the scenarioes from the book?

What's stuck in my mind from the book is the torture of the patients at the prison hospital - utterly inhumane.

Cheers

[britmaveric]

Warren Fellows believed admitted he was guilty and deserved what he got. He just wanted to warn any would be criminals to stay above board in Thailand and SEA in general because the consequences are rather severe.

He was also a bit "self pity city" too even though he had been a drug runner for years - he gets a slagging too over the Rugby players of Aussies

He still tells porkies too - you reckon they brought in elephants to play football with prisoners?

Creative writing!!!!

[Kerryd]

I don't believe everything I read. Of course, nothing is 100 percent truth. But this torture happened or it didn't happen. How can you be so sure it didn't happen?

The book was published in 2005. The author had served 8 years for his "crime" at the Bangkok Hilton. So subtract 8 years from 2005. BTW, Wiki claims he works today as a welder. I hope he reads Thaivisa and will post.

Apparently the events occurred in 1997. I've just spent the last hour googling his name. 415 hits, almost all of them about the book (selling it, reviewing it, etc).

Very little about the actual crime and trial itself. Did find an Irish news article from January 1998 though: Accused Irishman is chained for 24 hours a day in Thai jail

Oddly enough, the story from back then seems to be somewhat different that what is published now wouldn't you say ? Back in '98 the article says he was accused of murdering a New Zealand sea captain. No mention of bodyguard, or being swindled out of money.

(But apparently he was able to survive without food for 26 days.)

Stephen Cleary made this comment last year in a blog that reviewed the book:

"Comment from: Stephen Cleary

Interesting. But again, this book seems to tell a far more horrifying story than what some other prisoners have written. Richard here, just recently interviewed David McMillan the author of 'Escape' and his story of incarceration was nothing as bad as this.

Since Richard has been back home in England we haven't heard any update on Gor's sitution but from what we know he hasn't been witness to such unimaginable condition as potrayed in this book. Let's wait for Richard's feedback on this.

We have to keep an open mind to the actual realities, remembering that both Colin and the publishers wanted to 'sell' the book. 26/08/07 @ 12:23" Hmmm, sounds similar to the comment I made previously (only Stephen made it a year earlier).

Now I haven't managed to put $500,000 US in the bank yet, but tell me. How does one who does manage to do that, hand over the entire amount to someone he apparently doesn't know well, with (apparently) little or no documentation/contracts etc ?

It seems this was every penny he had on earth at the time, and he just hands the entire amount over ?

I'm just curious, because he goes from $500,000 in the bank, to being broke, to spending 2 years travelling from country to country tracking down the conman, then, when facing a murder charge, can't come up with $12,000 to save his skin ?

(oops. got to run. visitors at the door)

[onnut]

Any proof of this ?

It is a non-fiction account. You would have to believe the author. I find him very credible.

Sorry but I do not - there are so many holes in his account.

He never admits killing the bloke when they rolled down the embankment - who did?

Why would the Tourist Police be involved in this type of criminal investigation - it wouldbea matter for the ordinary police.

Another thing - he is allegged to reurn to Thailand and is seen in Pattaya according to reports - how does he get back in and why not PNG - and more to the point after all that would you return?

This book belongs alongside Warren Fellows and "hel_l's Prisoner" in the book of south east Asian prison fairy tales.

Colin has a child in Thailand dont forget, thats why he comes back to Thailand every now and then. and for the record, I think he did stab the guy, but I think in self defence so it should have been manslaughter not murder. after what these <deleted> did to him, I think I would of stabbed the lot of em.

[onnut]

I don't believe everything I read. Of course, nothing is 100 percent truth. But this torture happened or it didn't happen. How can you be so sure it didn't happen?

The book was published in 2005. The author had served 8 years for his "crime" at the Bangkok Hilton. So subtract 8 years from 2005. BTW, Wiki claims he works today as a welder. I hope he reads Thaivisa and will post.

Apparently the events occurred in 1997. I've just spent the last hour googling his name. 415 hits, almost all of them about the book (selling it, reviewing it, etc).

Very little about the actual crime and trial itself. Did find an Irish news article from January 1998 though: Accused Irishman is chained for 24 hours a day in Thai jail

Oddly enough, the story from back then seems to be somewhat different that what is published now wouldn't you say ? Back in '98 the article says he was accused of murdering a New Zealand sea captain. No mention of bodyguard, or being swindled out of money.

(But apparently he was able to survive without food for 26 days.)

Stephen Cleary made this comment last year in a blog that reviewed the book:

"Comment from: Stephen Cleary

Interesting. But again, this book seems to tell a far more horrifying story than what some other prisoners have written. Richard here, just recently interviewed David McMillan the author of 'Escape' and his story of incarceration was nothing as bad as this.

Since Richard has been back home in England we haven't heard any update on Gor's sitution but from what we know he hasn't been witness to such unimaginable condition as potrayed in this book. Let's wait for Richard's feedback on this.

We have to keep an open mind to the actual realities, remembering that both Colin and the publishers wanted to 'sell' the book. 26/08/07 @ 12:23" Hmmm, sounds similar to the comment I made previously (only Stephen made it a year earlier).

Now I haven't managed to put $500,000 US in the bank yet, but tell me. How does one who does manage to do that, hand over the entire amount to someone he apparently doesn't know well, with (apparently) little or no documentation/contracts etc ?

It seems this was every penny he had on earth at the time, and he just hands the entire amount over ?

I'm just curious, because he goes from $500,000 in the bank, to being broke, to spending 2 years travelling from country to country tracking down the conman, then, when facing a murder charge, can't come up with $12,000 to save his skin ?

(oops. got to run. visitors at the door)

his wife/girfriend ran off with the money.

[Prakanong]

"Colin has a child in Thailand dont forget, thats why he comes back to Thailand every now and then. and for the record, I think he did stab the guy, but I think in self defence so it should have been manslaughter not murder. after what these <deleted> did to him, I think I would of stabbed the lot of em."

Yes of course - I forgot about the child and he would come back to vist

But

How is he not PNG after being done and convicted of murder - I thought you got the black mark for even small offences?

Yes it may well have been a stabbing in a fight where it was the other guy or him - what was the defence though - murder may have been the only option to convict him of if the mystery stabber was the only defence? (I am trying to recall the book - its in storage in the UK and not with me in Singapore)

[Prakanong]

"Written from his cell and smuggled out page by page, Colin Martin’s autobiography chronicles an innocent man’s struggle to survive inside one of the world’s most dangerous prisons."

Is this true from the books blurb then?

Was it smuggled out page my page . hmmmm

Innocent - who killed the bodyguard then - the Bugis man? - might have been manslaughter in another country and not murder but still

[onnut]

"Colin has a child in Thailand dont forget, thats why he comes back to Thailand every now and then. and for the record, I think he did stab the guy, but I think in self defence so it should have been manslaughter not murder. after what these <deleted> did to him, I think I would of stabbed the lot of em."

Yes of course - I forgot about the child and he would come back to vist

But

How is he not PNG after being done and convicted of murder - I thought you got the black mark for even small offences?

Yes it may well have been a stabbing in a fight where it was the other guy or him - what was the defence though - murder may have been the only option to convict him of if the mystery stabber was the only defence? (I am trying to recall the book - its in storage in the UK and not with me in Singapore)

is it not once you have done the time for a crime that you can then come back? or maybe because of family being Thai that he was able to re,enter, I am not sure how he got back in. but I did have a meeting with him when he re-entered. at that time i was working for one of the guys that took care of him while he was inside, sponsorship type help for prisoners. I remember the first time I met him, his eyes were very cold and sharp looking, I had never seen anything like that before. for sure he had a hard time.

and was there not something about not being able to find a body? i am sure the body was missing for a while?

[Jingthing]

Why dose this sounds like a copy of 12 years in hel_l” Damage done” book by that Australian guy. Imo I think its fake and his copied for just money. It sound like it worked as well. Capturing the imagination. If it is true then they have broken the agreement between the UN. Also I think the tourist police can’t handle shit. Try getting in to a fight with a bib. You want to see my scar??

You are talking (I think) about the self admitted Aussie drug runner. I don't recall he mentioned torture to get a confession as he was caught red handed.

In the book I am talking about, the author claims innocence of a murder (so far in the book, there was no actual DEAD BODY but I will let you know, still reading it) and being tortured to obtain a false confession. There are alot of farangs in Thai prison. Sorry if this is too confusing for you. BTW, interesting point, that the author says a regular Chonburi police official (not tourist police) offered to get him off early in the process for 300K baht, but the author didn't have the money at the time (as his forture had been stolen by a farang scam artist whose bodyguard was the alleged murder victim) and he didn't really didn't know whether paying off would have worked or not. Chonburi was involved because the fight occurred in Chonburi province.

I do wonder why this account wasn't made into a movie?

So the ordinary police were involved in Chonburi first - how the hel_l did this get passed to Tourist Police - just would not happen - get real

"

Note to Prakanong: the book is presented as a true life account of what happened to the author. It is NOT a novel. Comparing this to a novel or expecting great literary ability from a person who doesn't normally write books is absurd."

Yes the book is absurd I agree.

Wrong. Tourist police FIRST. At a later stage, the author did speak to Chonburi police.

[Jingthing]

'm just curious, because he goes from $500,000 in the bank, to being broke, to spending 2 years travelling from country to country tracking down the conman, then, when facing a murder charge, can't come up with $12,000 to save his skin ?

All such details of this man's total ruin are fully explained in the book.

The rose colored glasses brigade are out in full force today, I see!

[Maigo6]

Jingthing's favourite pastime is to publish in Thaivisa anything negative about Thailand, poorly disguised in polls and questions. i hope to see the day when he finally gets a life (working as a baht bus driver in Pattaya)

Asia Books published this. Not me. I am asking if people believe the story

No, it's rubbish, same as the Warren Fellows book.

But these guys would never have a book published if they in fact told the truth would they ?

[Prakanong]

"and was there not something about not being able to find a body? i am sure the body was missing for a while? "

I think it was just that the place where they had the fight could not be found - not like the body was missing then put back - I am having trouble recalling exact details from a book I think I read in one sitting with a hangover ;-)

Its not like having to remember my school books for my MBA ;-)

[Jingthing]

A body was found (finished reading the book). The account of the years his "trial" went on were actually almost as horrifying as the account of his torture. He spent the time in both Chonburi prison (he claims was worse) and Lard Yao. He also contracted severe TB in prision which he was lucky to survive.

Let the author speak for himself:

But the single most disgusting, most appalling and saddest thing I encountered was indifference.

...

It was an indifferance that's a disgrace to the human race.

....

I've written this book to try and put a stop to this indifference.

....

Most people will find it hard to take in; some won't even believe it. But it's all true, and I've written it so that the abonimanable brutality and injustice people like me are being subjected to every day will be known and acknowledged.

Edited August 13, 2008 by Jingthing

[Prakanong]

"A body was found (finished reading the book). The account of the years his "trial" went on were actually almost as horrifying as the account of his torture. He spent the time in both Chonburi prison (he claims was worse) and Lard Yao. He also contracted severe TB in prision which he was lucky to survive."

So - do you think he killed the guy?

Never mind the horrendous conditions in the prison - we have heard enough of that elsewhere although Sandra Gregory said it was worse in the UK but for different reason ie psychological brutality of the guards

[Jingthing]

So - do you think he killed the guy?

No!

(I assume by kill you mean intentionally murdered. I told you I believe his account which was that the dead man violently attacked him with a knife (and the motivation was explained) and then the author fought back and the dead man disappeared into the night. At the scene, nobody saw a body. He possibly died hidden in a ditch, or died later of trauma, or the rich scam artist and/or police might have finished him off (my guess).

Never mind the horrendous conditions in the prison

Easy for you to say!

[stickman]

Anyone who is genuinely friendly with local Thai policemen knows that what is in this book is not just plausible, it probably happened pretty much exactly as it was written.

[Jingthing]

Anyone who is genuinely friendly with local Thai policemen knows that what is in this book is not just plausible, it probably happened pretty much exactly as it was written.

Thank you Stickman. A voice of reason.

[Prakanong]

"(I assume by kill you mean intentionally murdered. I told you I believe his account which was that the dead man violently attacked him with a knife (and the motivation was explained) and then the author fought back and the dead man disappeared into the night. At the scene, nobody saw a body. He possibly died hidden in a ditch, or died later of trauma, or the rich scam artist and/or police might have finished him off (my guess)."

No I mean did he kill the guy in a fight or whatever - could have been manslaughter but it was him in the fight and it was him with a motive.

Look at this with a bit of critical thinking and rationality - prison is full of innocent men and the story of a innocent man in a horrid Thai jail sells much more than one of a violent killer who got done abroad.

This book sounds exactly like all the others, Warreen Fellows, The other Aussie guy in Indonesia, The lone Brit in "Spains Toughest jail" and on and on - its all self pity city - are they all from Liverpool?

[Jingthing]

God forbid you might have to read it yourself and THINK for yourself. Easier just to batch his story with all the others. Would it kill you to read a book? With good reason because of his horrible experiences, the author developed a very dark vision about humanity in general. His pessimism would be well reinforced reading most of the posts here. I think I need a strong drink now. Bye.

Edited August 13, 2008 by Jingthing

[Prakanong]

God forbid you might have to read it yourself and THINK for yourself. Easier just to batch his story with all the others. Would it kill you to read a book? With good reason because of his horrible experiences, the author developed a very dark vision about humanity in general. His pessimism would be well reinforced reading most of the posts here. I think I need a strong drink now. Bye.

I have read the book -quite some time ago

Toys out the pram again are they and spitting the dummy - same as the other threads you start and whinge like a little girl when someone disagree's with you?

[Buckwheat]

Please remain on topic and refrain from any personal attacks on fellow posters.

Thank you for your anticipated cooperation.

[Maestro]

A defamatory post and replies thereto have been deleted.

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Maestro

[faranglandoz]

"I met a farang who was in prison with Martyn, and evidently it was his Thai wifes brother that did the killing, but he got the blame. Martyn obviously changed the story for his book. Some of the conditions he described are quite true, so I have been told, so I believe the book is based on fact."

Yes its based on facts - there was a murder, there was a guy who fiddled a lot of British workers out of large sums

There is a lot to fill in though

I thought they were travelling in a car from Pattaya to Bangkok - three of them in the car - the Kiwi, Martyn and the body guard - never any mention of the brother

I also (please correct me if I am wrong) also seem to remember it was a random piss stop - where was the brother hiding?

Condition described - yes i can well accept that - its the other <deleted> I am not convinced about.

I don't think the part about the car trip, and the 'piss' stop is true, a bit of hollywood for the book.

Faranglandoz

[Maestro]

More off-topic posts and replies thereto have been deleted. Topic now closed as there has been too much off-topic posting.

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Maestro