State Of Emergency In Bangkok Lifted

[Jai Dee]

MFA reveals global community's response following the end of the Emergency Decree in BKK

Following the interim Government’s recent announcement to revoke the State of Emergency Decree, the global community has acknowledged the positive move in Thailand through messages addressed to 92 overseas offices of the Embassy of Thailand and Royal Thai Consulate.

Deputy Director-General of the Information Department, Ministry of Foreign Affairs (MFA), Thani Thongpakdee (ธานี ทองภักดี), disclosed that the MFA has telegraphed an announcement to Thai embassies and Consulates in many countries that the State of Emergency Decree in Bangkok has been lifted. The MFA is also providing the reasons why the decree was lifted. The message is expected to reach the governments of each nation with a Thai diplomatic presence.

Mr. Thani claimed that the official declaration of decree cancellation would help regain optimistic sentiments from foreign governments to Thailand. He admits that the global community is still closely following political situations and congregations in Thailand.

Thai Permanent Secretary of Foreign Affairs, Mr. Weerasak Futrakul (วีระศักดิ์ ฟูตระกูล), met with executives from the Tourism Authority of Thailand (TAT) and Thai Board of Investment (BOI) in an effort to seek measures to revive the Thai economy.

He said the TAT would invite foreign press members and tour operation companies to join a press conference in Thailand while the BOI would come up with activities to create better understanding concerning the investment situations in Thailand among foreign investors.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 15 September 2008

[kurtgruen]

will make a new link....tomorrow...if you don't hear from me PM me to kick me a bit to be faster.....

Good afternoon everyone,

>>>>>>>>kick>>>>>>>>>>>>>>kick

[h90]

will make a new link....tomorrow...if you don't hear from me PM me to kick me a bit to be faster.....

Good afternoon everyone,

>>>>>>>>kick>>>>>>>>>>>>>>kick

will be on http://www.psxtune.com/padbuyweb in approx 1 hour.....

Many things I can't find.....but I found other things my wife bought a few days ago....made a quick picture of everything I found.....

[h90]

got told PAD removes some of the land at government house, put new land and sand, to make it more comfortable for a longer stay.

[hammered]

From TOC

It's been reported that a special team has been set up to hunt down the key 9 PAD members with outstanding arrest warrants. The team has been ordered to arrest the PAD leaders as soon as they step outside Government House.

The National Police has set up a special team to bring in custody the 9 key PAD members. They have been accused of treason. But until today police have not made a serious effort in trying to use force to apprehend the members who are often camping out inside the Government House alongside other PAD supporters.

Now there is no SoE the police are no longer overseen by the military and the police have just had a rather lareg infusion of Thaksin supporters into active senior posts

Should be interesting to see if anything comes of this report.

[h90]

From TOC

It's been reported that a special team has been set up to hunt down the key 9 PAD members with outstanding arrest warrants. The team has been ordered to arrest the PAD leaders as soon as they step outside Government House.

The National Police has set up a special team to bring in custody the 9 key PAD members. They have been accused of treason. But until today police have not made a serious effort in trying to use force to apprehend the members who are often camping out inside the Government House alongside other PAD supporters.

Now there is no SoE the police are no longer overseen by the military and the police have just had a rather lareg infusion of Thaksin supporters into active senior posts

Should be interesting to see if anything comes of this report.

Before Sondhi went in and out without anyone stop him

[Jai Dee]

TAT voices support for Emergency Decree withdrawal

Governor of the Tourism Authority of Thailand, Phornsiri Manoharn (พรศิริ มโนหาญ), voices support for the government’s decision to lift Emergency Decree in Bangkok as it helps make foreign tourists understand that Thailand’s situation is not out of control.

Mrs Phornsiri says foreign tourists were concerned over security during the period when Emergency Decree was enforced in the capital and many of them canceled their trips to Thailand, especially those from China. The governor says further that TAT has informed its branches abroad to explain the country’s situation to foreign tourists and inform them of the revocation of Emergency Decree in Bangkok.

Meanwhile, the Ministry of foreign Affairs has sent faxes concerning withdrawal of the State of Emergency in Bangkok to 92 foreign embassies in a bid to boost Thailand’s image.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 15 September 2008

[permanent_disorder]

From TOC

It's been reported that a special team has been set up to hunt down the key 9 PAD members with outstanding arrest warrants. The team has been ordered to arrest the PAD leaders as soon as they step outside Government House.

The National Police has set up a special team to bring in custody the 9 key PAD members. They have been accused of treason. But until today police have not made a serious effort in trying to use force to apprehend the members who are often camping out inside the Government House alongside other PAD supporters.

Now there is no SoE the police are no longer overseen by the military and the police have just had a rather lareg infusion of Thaksin supporters into active senior posts

Should be interesting to see if anything comes of this report.

look at the source -TOC and than have a second thought on "news" starting with "It's been reported that ..."

that is nothing more than only propaganda to motivate the PAD Cult Sturmabteilung aka brownyellowshirts.

[h90]

From TOC

It's been reported that a special team has been set up to hunt down the key 9 PAD members with outstanding arrest warrants. The team has been ordered to arrest the PAD leaders as soon as they step outside Government House.

The National Police has set up a special team to bring in custody the 9 key PAD members. They have been accused of treason. But until today police have not made a serious effort in trying to use force to apprehend the members who are often camping out inside the Government House alongside other PAD supporters.

Now there is no SoE the police are no longer overseen by the military and the police have just had a rather lareg infusion of Thaksin supporters into active senior posts

Should be interesting to see if anything comes of this report.

look at the source -TOC and than have a second thought on "news" starting with "It's been reported that ..."

that is nothing more than only propaganda to motivate the PAD Cult Sturmabteilung aka brownyellowshirts.

The 101 ideas to use some German Nazi words for the PAD.....One day they are called fascists one day communists, one day monarchists one day they want only money because they are bankrupt, while the next day they are super rich and pay everyone 1000 Baht....

It is getting boring....maybe post some facts or maybe some rumors but not just brain-dead bashing....

[DP25]

Not much will change I fear. My girlfriend was shopping at MBK in Bangkok yesterday when she was hailed over by candidate for governor Chuwit Kamolvisit. Remember he made his fortune on the backs of thousands of prostitutes working in his upscale massage parlors. My girlfriend was handed Bt200 with a reminder that he was running for Bangkok Governor. Amazing Thailand!

You're claiming that Chuwit was hanging out at MBK, handing out cash to random people?

Sure dude. Would love to see the photographic evidence of this, that would be easily available from the hundreds of cameras that would have captured it had it actually taken place.

[DP25]

This whole state of emergency thing was ridiculous from the start anyway. The government hires a mob of several hundred people, to attack peaceful anti government protesters, for the sole purpose that the government could use the state of emergency to disperse the protesters and pass legislation pardoning themselves. Too bad for them no one is willing to step up for them for longer than it takes for a bottle of Leo to wear off.

[h90]

Not much will change I fear. My girlfriend was shopping at MBK in Bangkok yesterday when she was hailed over by candidate for governor Chuwit Kamolvisit. Remember he made his fortune on the backs of thousands of prostitutes working in his upscale massage parlors. My girlfriend was handed Bt200 with a reminder that he was running for Bangkok Governor. Amazing Thailand!

You're claiming that Chuwit was hanging out at MBK, handing out cash to random people?

Sure dude. Would love to see the photographic evidence of this, that would be easily available from the hundreds of cameras that would have captured it had it actually taken place.

jup 99.9 % chance that it is nonsense and grantbkk is a troll

Reason of edit: blamed the wrong person

Edited September 15, 2008 by h90

[permanent_disorder]

This whole state of emergency thing was ridiculous from the start anyway. The government hires a mob of several hundred people, to attack peaceful anti government protesters, for the sole purpose that the government could use the state of emergency to disperse the protesters and pass legislation pardoning themselves. Too bad for them no one is willing to step up for them for longer than it takes for a bottle of Leo to wear off.

do you have any prove or evidence for that? tha the govt hired them?

peaceful protesters?

another proPAD cultist troll.

[h90]

This whole state of emergency thing was ridiculous from the start anyway. The government hires a mob of several hundred people, to attack peaceful anti government protesters, for the sole purpose that the government could use the state of emergency to disperse the protesters and pass legislation pardoning themselves. Too bad for them no one is willing to step up for them for longer than it takes for a bottle of Leo to wear off.

do you have any prove or evidence for that? tha the govt hired them?

peaceful protesters?

another proPAD cultist troll.

How do they pay you per posting?

[AlKing]

Not much will change I fear. My girlfriend was shopping at MBK in Bangkok yesterday when she was hailed over by candidate for governor Chuwit Kamolvisit. Remember he made his fortune on the backs of thousands of prostitutes working in his upscale massage parlors. My girlfriend was handed Bt200 with a reminder that he was running for Bangkok Governor. Amazing Thailand!

You're claiming that Chuwit was hanging out at MBK, handing out cash to random people?

Sure dude. Would love to see the photographic evidence of this, that would be easily available from the hundreds of cameras that would have captured it had it actually taken place.

These thing happen all the time in small towns & villages. Very unusual in Bangkok. This is how the game is played:

Candidate A: Employed someone to give out money and ask them to vote for Candidate B. Initention is to get caught.

Candidate B: Accused to vote buying. With witness & evidence, Candidate B was given a red card, and banned.

Typical dirty politics played in Thailand. Costitution judge have to act based on "planted" evidences & witnesses. They are not allowed to use their brain. TIT.

Edited September 15, 2008 by AlKing

[animatic]

I'll be the one in the black "Hoffa-Baldwin-Zimmerman" Teamster shirt

jimmy hoffa and the teamsters union?

now that explains a lot why you keep glorifying those PAD cult unions and avoid any question about them.

specially unions like the teamsters and union leaders like hoffa and their history and dirty wrong doings should make anybody look twice if they read about unions involvement in situations like the current one.

And I suppose a Carlos the Jackel T-Shirt would be better?

Ya know glorify someone who has done so much good for the world.

[Plus]

do you have any prove or evidence for that? tha the govt hired them?

There were government MPs in attendance, one even got injured when it all went badly wrong.

[animatic]

MFA reveals global community's response following the end of the Emergency Decree in BKK

Following the interim Government’s recent announcement to revoke the State of Emergency Decree, the global community has acknowledged the positive move in Thailand through messages addressed to 92 overseas offices of the Embassy of Thailand and Royal Thai Consulate.

Deputy Director-General of the Information Department, Ministry of Foreign Affairs (MFA), Thani Thongpakdee (ธานี ทองภักดี), disclosed that the MFA has telegraphed an announcement to Thai embassies and Consulates in many countries that the State of Emergency Decree in Bangkok has been lifted. The MFA is also providing the reasons why the decree was lifted. The message is expected to reach the governments of each nation with a Thai diplomatic presence.

Mr. Thani claimed that the official declaration of decree cancellation would help regain optimistic sentiments from foreign governments to Thailand. He admits that the global community is still closely following political situations and congregations in Thailand.

Thai Permanent Secretary of Foreign Affairs, Mr. Weerasak Futrakul (วีระศักดิ์ ฟูตระกูล), met with executives from the Tourism Authority of Thailand (TAT) and Thai Board of Investment (BOI) in an effort to seek measures to revive the Thai economy.

He said the TAT would invite foreign press members and tour operation companies to join a press conference in Thailand while the BOI would come up with activities to create better understanding concerning the investment situations in Thailand among foreign investors.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 15 September 2008

Yeah,

I can see Dubya sending Thailand a notice that the

Houston State Of Emergency is now lifted...

[permanent_disorder]

From TOC

It's been reported that a special team has been set up to hunt down the key 9 PAD members with outstanding arrest warrants. The team has been ordered to arrest the PAD leaders as soon as they step outside Government House.

The National Police has set up a special team to bring in custody the 9 key PAD members. They have been accused of treason. But until today police have not made a serious effort in trying to use force to apprehend the members who are often camping out inside the Government House alongside other PAD supporters.

Now there is no SoE the police are no longer overseen by the military and the police have just had a rather lareg infusion of Thaksin supporters into active senior posts

Should be interesting to see if anything comes of this report.

look at the source -TOC and than have a second thought on "news" starting with "It's been reported that ..."

that is nothing more than only propaganda to motivate the PAD Cult Sturmabteilung aka brownyellowshirts.

The 101 ideas to use some German Nazi words for the PAD.....One day they are called fascists one day communists, one day monarchists one day they want only money because they are bankrupt, while the next day they are super rich and pay everyone 1000 Baht....

It is getting boring....maybe post some facts or maybe some rumors but not just brain-dead bashing....

okay, is hard to resist to not draw that card.

0.but what you say to my point that this "news" from TOC is hardly "news" you can trust.

but now some facts to prove my point about the brownyellowshirts.

it's a antidemocratic movement, would you agree with that one? they got called that way by the international press, many quotes have been posted.did you read them?

1. they got called "One day they are called fascists one day communists, one day ..." looks like a discrepance, right? but is it not, i recommend to read the studies of Hannah Arendt: The Origins of Totalitarianism and Karl Popper: The Open Society and Its Enemies on totalitarianism to understand what those society models have in common.

i don't want go any depper academic here. i just mention both names to define the origin of my point of view, i am a big fan of popper and poppers critique of platos philosopher kings or marx historicism and any political theory that promise a new and better way, the only way and comes for example with lines like Support for good people to manage the country and blocking of evil people from coming to power.

but i am open for a further discussion on this and you can throw in some other names of other so called thinkers (Carl Schmitt), so that we have a base to debate about.

2. now i want explain why i called them brownyellowshirts.

the Sturmabteilung was a paramilitary organization of the NSDAP, that helps hitler came to power, that austrian with a vision: "The Nation"

SA motto ""All opposition must be stamped into the ground" that included violent street fights with that other working class movement.

but the "conquest of the streets" (adolf hitler) was also a extraparliamentarian tactic to weaken the government.

official SA pamphlet:

"Possession of the streets is the key to power in the state-for this reason the SA marched and fought. the public would have never received knowledge from the agitative speeches of the little reichstag faction and its propaganda or from the desires and aims of the Party, if the martial tread and battle song of the SA companies had not beat the measure for the truth of a relentless criticism of the state of affairs in the governmental system.

but i think you know the history and know also that the pre1933 nazi movement devloped to a big mass movement, represent quite a big part of the "people", also a pool of different suborganisations, factions and ideas, the 100% one Führer cult came later. pre-war nobody knowed what will really follow and chaplin made a funny movie.

i don't predict a barbarian state in thailand but there a parallels that worries me.

the PAD Cult style of the "conquest of the streets". do you still believe that was and is all peaceful?

hateful language and calling opponents subhumans we hear since the beginning. mass demonstration in front of embassies with nationalistic treats, blokade airports, besiege police stations, TV stations and government house is the conquest of the street.

the have various weapens, produce makeshift weapons, fully armored "guards" and paramilitaric riot training.

i don't post the pictures of that bloody street fights again, just two others that shows the "conquest of the streets" tactic.

caption:Anti-government protesters holding home made weapons and a police shield rally in the Royal Plaza in Bangkok, Thailand, Saturday, Aug. 30, 2008. ...

caption:Anti-government demonstrators wait for riot training Saturday, Aug. 30, 2008, near Government House in Bangkok, Thailand. . ...

that a reasons for me to compare them with the Sturmabteilung and call them brownyellowshirts.

if we would see in another part of the world a similar mob on the street but maybe with a neo-maoist or trotskyist agenda, i would compare them too with the nazis. see my point 1.

3. maybe not enough facts for you, so i will just quote some academics. i have done that before but you still speaking of rumors without facts.

To PAD watchers like Professor Prabhas Pintoptang of Chulalongkorn's faculty of political science, the coalition has been seen as planting structural hatred and division in society on a scale far worse than that ever achieved by the previous government under ousted premier Thaksin Shinawatra.

In his interview with Thai Post last month, Prof Prabhas said the PAD had become ''an ultra-nationalist movement''.

He said the PAD was using the same demonisation tactics employed by the right-wing militia to crush the pro-democracy student movement in the mid-1970s, which ended in the lynching of student activists near Thammasat University on Oct 6, 1976.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/280808_News/28Aug2008_news13.php

"Most dangerously, the PAD's new turn has the potential to lend a significant social base to a conservative and reactionary form of corporatism.

In the 1980s, the semi-fascist corporatist politics of the Revolutionary Council were marginalised as Thai politics democratised. The council became a laughing stock and the organisation was dubbed the "Joke Council". Somehow, the PAD seems to have reversed Marx's dictum that history repeats itself, first as tragedy and then as farce.

How far the PAD has travelled is perhaps illustrated by reference to a rally I observed in the middle of last week. A well-known rock star called on the spirit of the 1950s dictator Sarit Thanarat to deal decisively with corruption. The best that can be said of that episode is that people were applauding on cue"

Michael Connors, teacher of politics at La Trobe University. author of "Democracy and National Identity in Thailand" (2007).

http://www.bangkokpost.com/topstories/tops...s.php?id=128765

"The PAD leaders just lead the demonstrations, but are henchmen for much more influential and higher-up people. ...

But one is made to think why there have been such concerted efforts among various bodies in shaking up and attacking the government like this. The PAD kicked the ball. The media cheered. Political parties joined in, and passed the ball to the courts. And the courts shot the goal. Do these groups just converge by pure chance or a miracle? Apart from the courts, these groups overlap with those who killed students on Oct 6, 1976. This is a historical continuity. They are the same interest groups. Some are even the same persons."

Chaiyan Ratchakul, History Department, Faculty of Humanities, Chiang Mai University

http://www.prachatai.com/english/news.php?id=707

so now you can call me brain-dead and keep it that way, but i prefer to rationalize and substantiate my points. and if others had called the PAD cult fascists and/or communists it is also justified. the accusation of being communists are special funny, because they come from both sides. antiPADists refer to tyrants like stalin, communist brainwash and a big failure in "society experiments" with all the results and suffer brought by it to the people. but i read also comments by proPAD cultists, proudly show their support because the are communist/socialists by heart, live in the illusion communism would be something good and also in the illusion the PAD cult is something like this. sad is that fellow proPAD cultists who should know it better don't enlighten them.

the PAD cult annoucment the direction of new politics for the Kingdom of Thailand as the only solution, "It is not necessary for negotiations with any group that sees otherwise.", reminds on the third way, third reich or marxism-leninism rhetoric

“But of all political ideals, that of making the people happy is perhaps the most dangerous one. It leads invariably to the attempt to impose our scale of ‘higher’ values upon others, in order to make them realize what seems to us of greatest importance for their happiness; in order, as it were, to save their souls. It leads to Utopianism and Romanticism. We all feel certain that everybody would be happy in the beautiful, the perfect community of our dreams. And no doubt, there would be heaven on earth if we could all love one another. But, as I have said before, the attempt to make heaven on earth invaliably produces hel_l."

Karl Popper

Coda: i admit, comparing with nazis is often not the best arguments. i prefer to call the PAD a cult, because of their fanaticism. they are " The True Believer" in the sense of Eric Hoffer.

but the other side also play the hitler card. i think you have seen those various thaksins-hitler posters.

for our american friends i want to show on photo that i saw on http://www.2bangkok.com/

[animatic]

Oh yeah,

they control so many streets that :

no bar girl has been able to eat all week.

Skytrain disrupted it just stopped

No one has built a single transformer or sold a IR camera in Ban Mohr

Bands have stopped gigging

Soapies are ALLL closed down

Tuk tuks all parked and not a whorehouse tout has made a sale in days

Reclining Budha is left alone

Katoeys go with out lipstick cause Robinson is closed tight

Can't get a flight to nowhere so all the airports are closed

Vegetables rotting in the street for lack of customers

Bookazine only sells Popper and Mein Kampf.

Not a toilet can flush

powers out everywhere

No cell phones

no internet

NOTHING but your gloom and doom prognostications

One ongoing demonstration pointing the mirror at totally unrepentant corruption

and you see the jackboots coming out. Yeah right. This is Thailand mate,

they don't read YOUR philisophical books.

Agenda, agenda, endless agenda, with irrelevant bile through out.

At least you could capitalize Popper's name if you adore him so much.

It's like a broken record as an ethos of life.

Nothing to add, only to tear down, and let the powers that be

ream the populace's future before their very eyes!

.

Edited September 15, 2008 by animatic

[blaze]

From TOC

It's been reported that a special team has been set up to hunt down the key 9 PAD members with outstanding arrest warrants. The team has been ordered to arrest the PAD leaders as soon as they step outside Government House.

The National Police has set up a special team to bring in custody the 9 key PAD members. They have been accused of treason. But until today police have not made a serious effort in trying to use force to apprehend the members who are often camping out inside the Government House alongside other PAD supporters.

Now there is no SoE the police are no longer overseen by the military and the police have just had a rather lareg infusion of Thaksin supporters into active senior posts

Should be interesting to see if anything comes of this report.

look at the source -TOC and than have a second thought on "news" starting with "It's been reported that ..."

that is nothing more than only propaganda to motivate the PAD Cult Sturmabteilung aka brownyellowshirts.

The 101 ideas to use some German Nazi words for the PAD.....One day they are called fascists one day communists, one day monarchists one day they want only money because they are bankrupt, while the next day they are super rich and pay everyone 1000 Baht....

It is getting boring....maybe post some facts or maybe some rumors but not just brain-dead bashing....

okay, is hard to resist to not draw that card.

0.but what you say to my point that this "news" from TOC is hardly "news" you can trust.

but now some facts to prove my point about the brownyellowshirts.

it's a antidemocratic movement, would you agree with that one? they got called that way by the international press, many quotes have been posted.did you read them?

1. they got called "One day they are called fascists one day communists, one day ..." looks like a discrepance, right? but is it not, i recommend to read the studies of Hannah Arendt: The Origins of Totalitarianism and Karl Popper: The Open Society and Its Enemies on totalitarianism to understand what those society models have in common.

i don't want go any depper academic here. i just mention both names to define the origin of my point of view, i am a big fan of popper and poppers critique of platos philosopher kings or marx historicism and any political theory that promise a new and better way, the only way and comes for example with lines like Support for good people to manage the country and blocking of evil people from coming to power.

but i am open for a further discussion on this and you can throw in some other names of other so called thinkers (Carl Schmitt), so that we have a base to debate about.

2. now i want explain why i called them brownyellowshirts.

the Sturmabteilung was a paramilitary organization of the NSDAP, that helps hitler came to power, that austrian with a vision: "The Nation"

SA motto ""All opposition must be stamped into the ground" that included violent street fights with that other working class movement.

but the "conquest of the streets" (adolf hitler) was also a extraparliamentarian tactic to weaken the government.

official SA pamphlet:

"Possession of the streets is the key to power in the state-for this reason the SA marched and fought. the public would have never received knowledge from the agitative speeches of the little reichstag faction and its propaganda or from the desires and aims of the Party, if the martial tread and battle song of the SA companies had not beat the measure for the truth of a relentless criticism of the state of affairs in the governmental system.

but i think you know the history and know also that the pre1933 nazi movement devloped to a big mass movement, represent quite a big part of the "people", also a pool of different suborganisations, factions and ideas, the 100% one Führer cult came later. pre-war nobody knowed what will really follow and chaplin made a funny movie.

i don't predict a barbarian state in thailand but there a parallels that worries me.

the PAD Cult style of the "conquest of the streets". do you still believe that was and is all peaceful?

hateful language and calling opponents subhumans we hear since the beginning. mass demonstration in front of embassies with nationalistic treats, blokade airports, besiege police stations, TV stations and government house is the conquest of the street.

the have various weapens, produce makeshift weapons, fully armored "guards" and paramilitaric riot training.

i don't post the pictures of that bloody street fights again, just two others that shows the "conquest of the streets" tactic.

caption:Anti-government protesters holding home made weapons and a police shield rally in the Royal Plaza in Bangkok, Thailand, Saturday, Aug. 30, 2008. ...

caption:Anti-government demonstrators wait for riot training Saturday, Aug. 30, 2008, near Government House in Bangkok, Thailand. . ...

that a reasons for me to compare them with the Sturmabteilung and call them brownyellowshirts.

if we would see in another part of the world a similar mob on the street but maybe with a neo-maoist or trotskyist agenda, i would compare them too with the nazis. see my point 1.

3. maybe not enough facts for you, so i will just quote some academics. i have done that before but you still speaking of rumors without facts.

To PAD watchers like Professor Prabhas Pintoptang of Chulalongkorn's faculty of political science, the coalition has been seen as planting structural hatred and division in society on a scale far worse than that ever achieved by the previous government under ousted premier Thaksin Shinawatra.

In his interview with Thai Post last month, Prof Prabhas said the PAD had become ''an ultra-nationalist movement''.

He said the PAD was using the same demonisation tactics employed by the right-wing militia to crush the pro-democracy student movement in the mid-1970s, which ended in the lynching of student activists near Thammasat University on Oct 6, 1976.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/280808_News/28Aug2008_news13.php

"Most dangerously, the PAD's new turn has the potential to lend a significant social base to a conservative and reactionary form of corporatism.

In the 1980s, the semi-fascist corporatist politics of the Revolutionary Council were marginalised as Thai politics democratised. The council became a laughing stock and the organisation was dubbed the "Joke Council". Somehow, the PAD seems to have reversed Marx's dictum that history repeats itself, first as tragedy and then as farce.

How far the PAD has travelled is perhaps illustrated by reference to a rally I observed in the middle of last week. A well-known rock star called on the spirit of the 1950s dictator Sarit Thanarat to deal decisively with corruption. The best that can be said of that episode is that people were applauding on cue"

Michael Connors, teacher of politics at La Trobe University. author of "Democracy and National Identity in Thailand" (2007).

http://www.bangkokpost.com/topstories/tops...s.php?id=128765

"The PAD leaders just lead the demonstrations, but are henchmen for much more influential and higher-up people. ...

But one is made to think why there have been such concerted efforts among various bodies in shaking up and attacking the government like this. The PAD kicked the ball. The media cheered. Political parties joined in, and passed the ball to the courts. And the courts shot the goal. Do these groups just converge by pure chance or a miracle? Apart from the courts, these groups overlap with those who killed students on Oct 6, 1976. This is a historical continuity. They are the same interest groups. Some are even the same persons."

Chaiyan Ratchakul, History Department, Faculty of Humanities, Chiang Mai University

http://www.prachatai.com/english/news.php?id=707

so now you can call me brain-dead and keep it that way, but i prefer to rationalize and substantiate my points. and if others had called the PAD cult fascists and/or communists it is also justified. the accusation of being communists are special funny, because they come from both sides. antiPADists refer to tyrants like stalin, communist brainwash and a big failure in "society experiments" with all the results and suffer brought by it to the people. but i read also comments by proPAD cultists, proudly show their support because the are communist/socialists by heart, live in the illusion communism would be something good and also in the illusion the PAD cult is something like this. sad is that fellow proPAD cultists who should know it better don't enlighten them.

the PAD cult annoucment the direction of new politics for the Kingdom of Thailand as the only solution, "It is not necessary for negotiations with any group that sees otherwise.", reminds on the third way, third reich or marxism-leninism rhetoric

“But of all political ideals, that of making the people happy is perhaps the most dangerous one. It leads invariably to the attempt to impose our scale of ‘higher’ values upon others, in order to make them realize what seems to us of greatest importance for their happiness; in order, as it were, to save their souls. It leads to Utopianism and Romanticism. We all feel certain that everybody would be happy in the beautiful, the perfect community of our dreams. And no doubt, there would be heaven on earth if we could all love one another. But, as I have said before, the attempt to make heaven on earth invaliably produces hel_l."

Karl Popper

Coda: i admit, comparing with nazis is often not the best arguments. i prefer to call the PAD a cult, because of their fanaticism. they are " The True Believer" in the sense of Eric Hoffer.

but the other side also play the hitler card. i think you have seen those various thaksins-hitler posters.

for our american friends i want to show on photo that i saw on http://www.2bangkok.com/

Good post PD- one that deserves serious consideration- maybe even debate- but certainly more than dismissive guffaws.

[permanent_disorder]

I'll be the one in the black "Hoffa-Baldwin-Zimmerman" Teamster shirt

jimmy hoffa and the teamsters union?

now that explains a lot why you keep glorifying those PAD cult unions and avoid any question about them.

specially unions like the teamsters and union leaders like hoffa and their history and dirty wrong doings should make anybody look twice if they read about unions involvement in situations like the current one.

And I suppose a Carlos the Jackel T-Shirt would be better?

Ya know glorify someone who has done so much good for the world.

did i talk in every third post about how proud i am of carlos the jackal? did grünkurt talk all the time about those unions?

i want to know what's up with those PAD Cult unions. are i am not allowed to ask? do you know more about this thai unions?

we have a topic here: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Pad-Labour-Unions-t211062.html new input is welome.

i took that avatar because that face is unique, catchy. for me, i remember a couple of other steady posters not by name, but by their avatar, the pink elephant, the angry dog, stalin, that standard lamp and so on. and of course you wouldn't start a discussion with "stalin" about avatar or discredit someone infantile because a blue smurf avatar, right? why you do it with me? it's because you have no point.

avatars are tricky, they can fool your mind. read about the Landy and Sigall experiment. but i don't want fool the subconsciousness of other TVforum members with a avatar showing something cute or attractiv. instead i used something controversial, but controversial only if you recognise the real life person behind that iconographic picture. you have been smart enough to spot it. but you fail if you judge my comments by that pic. actually i choose a controversial for exactly that reason, give the fools who have nothing to say at least the opportunity to rant pointless about my avatar or about my user name.

i will change my avatar just for you.

[kurtgruen]

I'll be the one in the black "Hoffa-Baldwin-Zimmerman" Teamster shirt

...specially unions like the teamsters and union leaders like hoffa and their history and dirty wrong doings should make anybody look twice if they read about unions involvement in situations like the current one.

And I suppose a Carlos the Jackel T-Shirt would be better?

Ya know glorify someone who has done so much good for the world.

did i talk in every third post about how proud i am of carlos the jackal? did grünkurt talk all the time about those unions?

i want to know what's up with those PAD Cult unions. are i am not allowed to ask? do you know more about this thai unions?

we have a topic here: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Pad-Labour-Unions-t211062.html new input is welome.

1. You got the wrong Hoffa, which shows that you know little or nothing about todays Teamsters

2. My talk about Unions was in response to Thaksin/TRT/PPP groupies inferring that the PAD is elitist. Todays Union movement is not elitist and the Thai Unions are in support of the PAD, so my mention of the unions supporting the PAD was rellevent to the thread.

3. Even though, I have no problem with someone having an opinion different from mine and love to discuss issues from all sides, I find your behavior in these forums quite rude and will probably just start ignoring you here.

4. If you really want to learn more about Unions, as you claim, go to labour college or google for the information. I choose to spend my time talking to people who I think are openminded.

Someone also mentioned that there are a lot of women at the PAD rally. One of the reason, I think is, that ASTV has many public service announcements, calling for equality for women. The also have many against Child Labour, Drug Abuse, family violence, etc. They had a really good one the other day, about a little boy, making shoes in a sweatshop, while at the same time showing a little boy playing with his friends in the West. They had another one about a woman trying to clean the floor, while the rest of the family sat and watched TV and then later showed a "new model", of everyone having fun helping together.

ASTV is owned by Sondhi and as long as he keeps playing such announcements on his station, he isn't such a bad guy in my books.

Anyways,

Have a good night everyone

Let's hope it will be a peaceful one again

[kurtgruen]

I'll be the one in the black "Hoffa-Baldwin-Zimmerman" Teamster shirt

...specially unions like the teamsters and union leaders like hoffa and their history and dirty wrong doings should make anybody look twice if they read about unions involvement in situations like the current one.

As I mentioned in my previous Post, you got the wrong Hoffa. (A common mistake, by people who don't know much about Modern Day Unions)

I believe, that you also wrongly claimed that the International Unions are not being supportive. Let me just quickly prove you wrong..

World Federation of Trade Unions

Solidarity with the people of Thailand

3 September 2008

The government of Thailand is trying to terrify the workers in the country, who are on an on-going strike since last week.

Yesterday, the 73-year-old Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej declared a state of emergency in the capital city of Bangkok. The army came into action. The WFTU calls upon the working class of Thailand to reinforce their struggle against privatizations, against price-rise and against unemployment. The policy of all politicians that have ruled the country until now is the reason for the problems of the Thai people. The policies of the two big political parties are different from the real interest of the people.

We express our solidarity and internationalism with the working class of Thailand for the progress of democracy and the abolition of the exploitation from man to man.

I did leave quite a few links, a few minutes ago, in the Union thread on TV, which you invited members to visit.

Once again, I never tried to make this thread about Unions. I only mentioned them, to show that the PAD is supported by all walks of society. (Not just that the elite, as some of you claim) There is a "real"Union movement in Thailand, regardless of what some people are trying to say on here and these Unions, as well as the Internationals, are supportive of what is going on right now.

I suggest, that next time, you get your information from the source. (If you really want to hear the truth)

Good night everyone

I think I already said that once...hmmmm

Edited September 15, 2008 by kurtgruen

[permanent_disorder]

I'll be the one in the black "Hoffa-Baldwin-Zimmerman" Teamster shirt

...specially unions like the teamsters and union leaders like hoffa and their history and dirty wrong doings should make anybody look twice if they read about unions involvement in situations like the current one.

And I suppose a Carlos the Jackel T-Shirt would be better?

Ya know glorify someone who has done so much good for the world.

did i talk in every third post about how proud i am of carlos the jackal? did grünkurt talk all the time about those unions?

i want to know what's up with those PAD Cult unions. are i am not allowed to ask? do you know more about this thai unions?

we have a topic here: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Pad-Labour-Unions-t211062.html new input is welome.

1. You got the wrong Hoffa, which shows that you know little or nothing about todays Teamsters

2. My talk about Unions was in response to Thaksin/TRT/PPP groupies inferring that the PAD is elitist. Todays Union movement is not elitist and the Thai Unions are in support of the PAD, so my mention of the unions supporting the PAD was rellevent to the thread.

3. Even though, I have no problem with someone having an opinion different from mine and love to discuss issues from all sides, I find your behavior in these forums quite rude and will probably just start ignoring you here.

4. If you really want to learn more about Unions, as you claim, go to labour college or google for the information. I choose to spend my time talking to people who I think are openminded.

Someone also mentioned that there are a lot of women at the PAD rally. One of the reason, I think is, that ASTV has many public service announcements, calling for equality for women. The also have many against Child Labour, Drug Abuse, family violence, etc. They had a really good one the other day, about a little boy, making shoes in a sweatshop, while at the same time showing a little boy playing with his friends in the West. They had another one about a woman trying to clean the floor, while the rest of the family sat and watched TV and then later showed a "new model", of everyone having fun helping together.

ASTV is owned by Sondhi and as long as he keeps playing such announcements on his station, he isn't such a bad guy in my books.

that is called propaganda, if i want to know more about north korea a website like http://www.korea-dpr.com/ can be a beginning but not the final clue and sould not be the only source of information.

guess what you saw was something like this "Capitalist "America", Socialist Korea" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0UNAEyqQc7Q

and i got the convicted criminal and teamsters union leader jimmy hoffa wrong?

now his only son is the teamster union president, right? that is the hoffa you are talking about, right?

specially the brave teamster union is a perfect example what is wrong with those unions. i had a look at the history and also the most recent history with the Teamstergate money laundering corruption scandal.

mafia connection, corruption, cronyism, in the teamster union.

who is gonna believe, that there will be a big difference in the thai unions of state enterprises, it is not.

[permanent_disorder]

Oh yeah,

they control so many streets that :

no bar girl has been able to eat all week.

Skytrain disrupted it just stopped

No one has built a single transformer or sold a IR camera in Ban Mohr

Bands have stopped gigging

...

.

you have humour.

[geriatrickid]

2. My talk about Unions was in response to Thaksin/TRT/PPP groupies inferring that the PAD is elitist. Todays Union movement is not elitist and the Thai Unions are in support of the PAD, so my mention of the unions supporting the PAD was rellevent to the thread.

I disagree with you and will go so far as to say your statement is a gross misrepresentation of the facts. There is limited "union" rank and file support for PAD. What has happened is that specific the leaders of government employee and regulated trade organizations have supported PAD. The rank and file were not consulted. These are the same leaders that do not promote open voting for their respective group leadership positions. Have you any idea how these leaders are appointed? If you are such a union expert you would know that the appointment process has more in common with the Teamsters of 1950 than it does of the UAW/CAW of 2008.

More specifically, the real unions that represent the "have not" workers have not endorsed PAD and have instead adopted a neutral position. Where are the fishery workers unions? The garment workers unions? I believe the labour despots you glorify are supporting PAD because the current government wanted to cut the bloated middle management workforce and to open up hiring to all Thais, not just friends and family of the well conected. Their motive is personal gain, not the plight of workers. If you knew anything about the state of worker rights and labour organizing in this country you would know that the groups supporting PAD have done nothing to help the part time workers from which fees and dues are collected but who receive no support in return. Where is the support for women workers in the unions you praise? Why have they not signed on to the literacy and human rights campaigns?

In any other country when a union called for support of a union leader that was unfairly terminated the big unions would respond. What happened recently when the lady was fired from her job at the garment factory? The union leaders you glorify did not respond. They ignored the women garment workers plight.

Please do your homework and talk to the real union organizers.

Edited September 16, 2008 by geriatrickid

[AlKing]

How could you lift the SoE when it was never really imposed upon in the first place. Soi cowboy business was never interrupted.

[AlKing]

From TOC

It's been reported that a special team has been set up to hunt down the key 9 PAD members with outstanding arrest warrants. The team has been ordered to arrest the PAD leaders as soon as they step outside Government House.

The National Police has set up a special team to bring in custody the 9 key PAD members. They have been accused of treason. But until today police have not made a serious effort in trying to use force to apprehend the members who are often camping out inside the Government House alongside other PAD supporters.

Now there is no SoE the police are no longer overseen by the military and the police have just had a rather lareg infusion of Thaksin supporters into active senior posts

Should be interesting to see if anything comes of this report.

look at the source -TOC and than have a second thought on "news" starting with "It's been reported that ..."

that is nothing more than only propaganda to motivate the PAD Cult Sturmabteilung aka brownyellowshirts.

The 101 ideas to use some German Nazi words for the PAD.....One day they are called fascists one day communists, one day monarchists one day they want only money because they are bankrupt, while the next day they are super rich and pay everyone 1000 Baht....

It is getting boring....maybe post some facts or maybe some rumors but not just brain-dead bashing....

okay, is hard to resist to not draw that card.

0.but what you say to my point that this "news" from TOC is hardly "news" you can trust.

but now some facts to prove my point about the brownyellowshirts.

it's a antidemocratic movement, would you agree with that one? they got called that way by the international press, many quotes have been posted.did you read them?

1. they got called "One day they are called fascists one day communists, one day ..." looks like a discrepance, right? but is it not, i recommend to read the studies of Hannah Arendt: The Origins of Totalitarianism and Karl Popper: The Open Society and Its Enemies on totalitarianism to understand what those society models have in common.

i don't want go any depper academic here. i just mention both names to define the origin of my point of view, i am a big fan of popper and poppers critique of platos philosopher kings or marx historicism and any political theory that promise a new and better way, the only way and comes for example with lines like Support for good people to manage the country and blocking of evil people from coming to power.

but i am open for a further discussion on this and you can throw in some other names of other so called thinkers (Carl Schmitt), so that we have a base to debate about.

2. now i want explain why i called them brownyellowshirts.

the Sturmabteilung was a paramilitary organization of the NSDAP, that helps hitler came to power, that austrian with a vision: "The Nation"

SA motto ""All opposition must be stamped into the ground" that included violent street fights with that other working class movement.

but the "conquest of the streets" (adolf hitler) was also a extraparliamentarian tactic to weaken the government.

official SA pamphlet:

"Possession of the streets is the key to power in the state-for this reason the SA marched and fought. the public would have never received knowledge from the agitative speeches of the little reichstag faction and its propaganda or from the desires and aims of the Party, if the martial tread and battle song of the SA companies had not beat the measure for the truth of a relentless criticism of the state of affairs in the governmental system.

but i think you know the history and know also that the pre1933 nazi movement devloped to a big mass movement, represent quite a big part of the "people", also a pool of different suborganisations, factions and ideas, the 100% one Führer cult came later. pre-war nobody knowed what will really follow and chaplin made a funny movie.

i don't predict a barbarian state in thailand but there a parallels that worries me.

the PAD Cult style of the "conquest of the streets". do you still believe that was and is all peaceful?

hateful language and calling opponents subhumans we hear since the beginning. mass demonstration in front of embassies with nationalistic treats, blokade airports, besiege police stations, TV stations and government house is the conquest of the street.

the have various weapens, produce makeshift weapons, fully armored "guards" and paramilitaric riot training.

i don't post the pictures of that bloody street fights again, just two others that shows the "conquest of the streets" tactic.

caption:Anti-government protesters holding home made weapons and a police shield rally in the Royal Plaza in Bangkok, Thailand, Saturday, Aug. 30, 2008. ...

caption:Anti-government demonstrators wait for riot training Saturday, Aug. 30, 2008, near Government House in Bangkok, Thailand. . ...

that a reasons for me to compare them with the Sturmabteilung and call them brownyellowshirts.

if we would see in another part of the world a similar mob on the street but maybe with a neo-maoist or trotskyist agenda, i would compare them too with the nazis. see my point 1.

3. maybe not enough facts for you, so i will just quote some academics. i have done that before but you still speaking of rumors without facts.

To PAD watchers like Professor Prabhas Pintoptang of Chulalongkorn's faculty of political science, the coalition has been seen as planting structural hatred and division in society on a scale far worse than that ever achieved by the previous government under ousted premier Thaksin Shinawatra.

In his interview with Thai Post last month, Prof Prabhas said the PAD had become ''an ultra-nationalist movement''.

He said the PAD was using the same demonisation tactics employed by the right-wing militia to crush the pro-democracy student movement in the mid-1970s, which ended in the lynching of student activists near Thammasat University on Oct 6, 1976.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/280808_News/28Aug2008_news13.php

"Most dangerously, the PAD's new turn has the potential to lend a significant social base to a conservative and reactionary form of corporatism.

In the 1980s, the semi-fascist corporatist politics of the Revolutionary Council were marginalised as Thai politics democratised. The council became a laughing stock and the organisation was dubbed the "Joke Council". Somehow, the PAD seems to have reversed Marx's dictum that history repeats itself, first as tragedy and then as farce.

How far the PAD has travelled is perhaps illustrated by reference to a rally I observed in the middle of last week. A well-known rock star called on the spirit of the 1950s dictator Sarit Thanarat to deal decisively with corruption. The best that can be said of that episode is that people were applauding on cue"

Michael Connors, teacher of politics at La Trobe University. author of "Democracy and National Identity in Thailand" (2007).

http://www.bangkokpost.com/topstories/tops...s.php?id=128765

"The PAD leaders just lead the demonstrations, but are henchmen for much more influential and higher-up people. ...

But one is made to think why there have been such concerted efforts among various bodies in shaking up and attacking the government like this. The PAD kicked the ball. The media cheered. Political parties joined in, and passed the ball to the courts. And the courts shot the goal. Do these groups just converge by pure chance or a miracle? Apart from the courts, these groups overlap with those who killed students on Oct 6, 1976. This is a historical continuity. They are the same interest groups. Some are even the same persons."

Chaiyan Ratchakul, History Department, Faculty of Humanities, Chiang Mai University

http://www.prachatai.com/english/news.php?id=707

so now you can call me brain-dead and keep it that way, but i prefer to rationalize and substantiate my points. and if others had called the PAD cult fascists and/or communists it is also justified. the accusation of being communists are special funny, because they come from both sides. antiPADists refer to tyrants like stalin, communist brainwash and a big failure in "society experiments" with all the results and suffer brought by it to the people. but i read also comments by proPAD cultists, proudly show their support because the are communist/socialists by heart, live in the illusion communism would be something good and also in the illusion the PAD cult is something like this. sad is that fellow proPAD cultists who should know it better don't enlighten them.

the PAD cult annoucment the direction of new politics for the Kingdom of Thailand as the only solution, "It is not necessary for negotiations with any group that sees otherwise.", reminds on the third way, third reich or marxism-leninism rhetoric

"But of all political ideals, that of making the people happy is perhaps the most dangerous one. It leads invariably to the attempt to impose our scale of 'higher' values upon others, in order to make them realize what seems to us of greatest importance for their happiness; in order, as it were, to save their souls. It leads to Utopianism and Romanticism. We all feel certain that everybody would be happy in the beautiful, the perfect community of our dreams. And no doubt, there would be heaven on earth if we could all love one another. But, as I have said before, the attempt to make heaven on earth invaliably produces hel_l."

Karl Popper

Coda: i admit, comparing with nazis is often not the best arguments. i prefer to call the PAD a cult, because of their fanaticism. they are " The True Believer" in the sense of Eric Hoffer.

but the other side also play the hitler card. i think you have seen those various thaksins-hitler posters.

for our american friends i want to show on photo that i saw on http://www.2bangkok.com/

Good post PD- one that deserves serious consideration- maybe even debate- but certainly more than dismissive guffaws.

Thaksin was really Bush. Hitler is still alive, and live under the name of Thaksin & Bush to avoid capture. I didn't realise these until I saw the photographic proof above. Picture don't lie.

[Plus]

Good post PD- one that deserves serious consideration- maybe even debate

I beg to disagree - it's full of nonsense, point by point. It doesn't deserve even reading it.

I gave up when he compared PAD to SA taking over the streets, it's just beyond ridiculous.