Suvarnabhumi PAD Protest Continues

[dtarasin]

If they keep fighting like this, there will be nothing left to rule. Can't we just send these "protesters" from both sides to someplace where they won't do any damage? I'm thinking Wasilla, Alaska.

Post of the day right there!

Oh, this is a classic. Anyone have Sarah Pailin's tel. no.?? She'll sort them out.

[robee]

more bad press for thai on BBC network. i have no dog in this fight. just seems that the ripple effects of this "protest" is going to outweigh any perceived changes...

[NanLaew]

Hey guys - ease up on Nampeung - and at least she adds some colour and entertainment to the forum.

She does? If you say so... I guess.

[Jupiter99]

Hey guys - ease up on Nampeung. She's clearly a fully paid up member of People Against Democracy and just doing her job by pushing its arguments in an attempt to justify its illegal and violent activities. She has a hard job given 99% of the forum users don't share her view - and at least she adds some colour and entertainment to the forum.

Agreed! :rolleyes:But a real activist would be out in the front lines along with the children and the grannies protecting Adolf and Josef!

[KireB]

Hey all of you complainers - Thai tourism will not take a knock except for this immediate few weeks. There's no way all the back packers, package holidayers and se* tourists are concerned -

this won't affect them travelling to Thailand at all. Grow up and realise that Thailand needs change, a lot of change. Mega change...

Your dreaming... the knock on effects for tourism are huge. The tourists are loosing confidence in Thailand fast, watch as bookings for 2009/2010 drop significantly

They were already dropping, with or without the airport siege.

Recession remember?

[cmsally]

Hey all of you complainers - Thai tourism will not take a knock except for this immediate few weeks. There's no way all the back packers, package holidayers and se* tourists are concerned -

this won't affect them travelling to Thailand at all. Grow up and realise that Thailand needs change, a lot of change. Mega change...

If that's your point of view obviously you haven't talked to anyone in the tourist industry. Talk to a few hotel GM's and see what they say.

[dtarasin]

Hey all of you complainers - Thai tourism will not take a knock except for this immediate few weeks. There's no way all the back packers, package holidayers and se* tourists are concerned -

this won't affect them travelling to Thailand at all. Grow up and realise that Thailand needs change, a lot of change. Mega change...

Your dreaming... the knock on effects for tourism are huge. The tourists are loosing confidence in Thailand fast, watch as bookings for 2009/2010 drop significantly

They were already dropping, with or without the airport siege.

Recession remember?

So that makes it alright? I guess everyone who didn't like George Bush should've just taken over airports instead of putting up with the elections. I mean, there's a recession in the US too.

[robee]

If they keep fighting like this, there will be nothing left to rule. Can't we just send these "protesters" from both sides to someplace where they won't do any damage? I'm thinking Wasilla, Alaska.

Post of the day right there!

Oh, this is a classic. Anyone have Sarah Pailin's tel. no.?? She'll sort them out.

wish i had said something like that. great quotes...

[robee]

Hey all of you complainers - Thai tourism will not take a knock except for this immediate few weeks. There's no way all the back packers, package holidayers and se* tourists are concerned -

this won't affect them travelling to Thailand at all. Grow up and realise that Thailand needs change, a lot of change. Mega change...

Your dreaming... the knock on effects for tourism are huge. The tourists are loosing confidence in Thailand fast, watch as bookings for 2009/2010 drop significantly

They were already dropping, with or without the airport siege.

Recession remember?

So that makes it alright? I guess everyone who didn't like George Bush should've just taken over airports instead of putting up with the elections. I mean, there's a recession in the US too.

dropping from recession is economics. only history will tell, Q1, Q2 of 2009 will be the "tale of the tape" so to speak.

[Wolfie]

Hey all of you complainers - Thai tourism will not take a knock except for this immediate few weeks. There's no way all the back packers, package holidayers and se* tourists are concerned -

this won't affect them travelling to Thailand at all. Grow up and realise that Thailand needs change, a lot of change. Mega change...

Your dreaming... the knock on effects for tourism are huge. The tourists are loosing confidence in Thailand fast, watch as bookings for 2009/2010 drop significantly

They were already dropping, with or without the airport siege.

Recession remember?

So Recession + Airport siege = NO Tourists (or at best, very little) for the foreseeable future...

Is will be the icing on the cake that is already falling tourism in Thailand. I feel sorry for all those people affected by it.

[GlenOrd]

If/when police are planning to storm the facilities, here's some unsolicited advice from afar;

Allow those protesters who want to stay non-violent - to escape the ensuing melee. If mobilizing at night, have a place for them to walk/run to. Suggest; a bank of bright blue lights at a major exit portal, with the assurance that all who exit there will be allowed to go unscathed. another way, is the more common method, used at Entebbe, where everyone is told by authorities to stay prone on the ground. Those protesters who choose to fight with weapons will more likely stand-out - and can more readily be disabled and/or arrested. Regardless, it should be made clear that all those offering no armed resistance will be allowed to go home - whereas any who fight (or are otherwise violent) will be dealt with dynamically.

Police should consider a multi-pronged mobilization, starting with one or two large frontal assault used as feigns (to draw many of the armed fighters from the PAD) - while simultaneously having other groups of cops forcibly enter the premises from other places to actually do the dirty work - (the tarmac, the sides, rappelled to the roof, workers' entrances, etc). The cops used as feigns in the initial assault - can be mobilized for action later -if needed. Also have back-up troops - to deploy as needed.

It's a dire shame that protesters allow children and elderly in their midst. It is quite possible that many will be injured if/when an assault takes place. Tear gas and stray bullets don't discriminate about age.

If the Thai military and police aren't willing to take back the airports and Gov't House - then they're directly or indirectly complicit in the protests - and if so, they're partially responsible for the harm to Thailand's economy.

Unless Somchai and his ilk step down, it's doubtful the protesters will voluntarily split from the scene. I don't agree that a Court decision on Tuesday will clear out the PPP. If the PPP are required to formally, disband, they'll reform in another name - they've already started the organization and have its name. It they're banned for 5 or so years, they'll put proxies in their place. Regardless, they'll appeal any unfavorable verdict. Thaksin is still rich and as eager as ever - to bankroll his minions to further his plans of controlling Thailand (directly or indirectly) - regardless of whatever else happens in the next week or so.

Your theory is perfect.

In reality, Sondhi will call the children, woman and elderly to march toward to police. "Don't be afraid, this is our final final final final fight". The children, woman and elderly march toward the police. What the police going to do?

1. Shoot

2. Run away

My guessing,

American police will choose option 1.

Thai police will choose option 2.

[Maestro]

My wife just had a phone call from a friend who have satelite TV and she said that Channel 5 told that all stranded tourist will get 2000 baht a day from the government, can somebody confirm this?

From the website of the Tourism Authority of Thaitland (TAT):

On the basis of assistance, for tourists and travellers who cannot travel to their destination as of 25 November, 2008, till the airport reopens, TAT and the Ministry of Tourism and Sports have provided accommodation and meals, as well as facilitated tourists as much as possible until they are able to return to their destination.

Conditions of Accommodation

1. Tourists cannot reimburse the accommodation and meals for cash.

2. Tourists can stay in the accommodation under the condition that their costs do not exceed 2,000 Baht per day. For any excess, tourists must be responsible and pay themselves.

3. Tourists can only change the place of accommodation that has been arranged by THA and ATTA.

Source: www.tatnews.org/tat_release/detail.asp?id=4071

--

Maestro

[Roachiebkk]

Hey all of you complainers - Thai tourism will not take a knock except for this immediate few weeks. There's no way all the back packers, package holidayers and se* tourists are concerned -

this won't affect them travelling to Thailand at all. Grow up and realise that Thailand needs change, a lot of change. Mega change...

Your dreaming... the knock on effects for tourism are huge. The tourists are loosing confidence in Thailand fast, watch as bookings for 2009/2010 drop significantly

They were already dropping, with or without the airport siege.

Recession remember?

So Recession + Airport siege = NO Tourists (or at best, very little) for the foreseeable future...

Is will be the icing on the cake that is already falling tourism in Thailand. I feel sorry for all those people affected by it.

Working in the travel field and been here for 8 years I've seen Thailand bounce back incredibly after the tsunami and last coup, this situation has dragged on for so long that I think tourists are becoming annured to the whole thing. Recession is goingto be the killer here not these idiots (red or yellow) Our company is already (and only) down 25% on bookings so far for 2009. Some other companies I deal with are down 50% on bookings for 2009. A lot of local tourism providers are surviving on only 3% margin to keep inbound operators happy. The airport and government situation will have a short term effect but lets not kid ourselves all over the world there are tourists who just took their hands out of their pockets and are leaving their money where it is.

[phupaman]

Hi .

Nathan,, Remember not so long ago the opening of terminal 5 at Heathrow, How many flights canceled how many thousands of travelers inconvenienced, how much baggage lost,how many weeks to sort that little lot out, In Thailand they stop the airport to stop tyrant Proxy Goverment turning into an even more corrupt dictatorship,what was the reason for the chaos at Heathrow?,Come to Thailand and enjoy.

phupaman

[Nampeung]

Wolfie, Jupiter, CM Sally et al... in the south ie: Samui, Phang Nga, Phuket, Phi Phi, Krabi, Koh Yao, there are more tourists than ever. The type of tourist this current situation will scare off are investors and people with mega budgets who can afford to change destination at a moment's notice. I reiterate, back packers, package holidayers and se* tourists will not let this current scenario put them off aftaer the few weeks of airport troubles go away

[waldwolf]

If that's your point of view obviously you haven't talked to anyone in the tourist industry. Talk to a few hotel GM's and see what they say.

In Los Angeles, I know of one small Travel Club that cancelled two scheduled trips to Thailand, one this coming February the other in March. Unfortunately, even if the situation improved, the earliest those trips could be rescheduled would be early 2010.

The turmoil is definately effecting tourist travel to Thailand.

Edited December 1, 2008 by waldwolf

[tropo]

The turmoil is definately effecting tourist travel to Thailand.

Are you sure?

[koosdeboer]

Hey all of you complainers - Thai tourism will not take a knock except for this immediate few weeks. There's no way all the back packers, package holidayers and se* tourists are concerned -

this won't affect them travelling to Thailand at all. Grow up and realise that Thailand needs change, a lot of change. Mega change...

Honey I agree, the tourist will come back, many of my friends and family are ready to book. If there are tourist who don't come back it's because of the economic problems in their countries. Thai people are strong survivors.

Taksin and his cronies have to go. I've much respect for the yellow protesters still going to protest while it's dangerous but they are willing to give their lives. I had to stop my wife to go, she is prepared to give her life and she is not aggressive at all.

The reds are terrible and dangerous, they are the killers. It's now too dangerous to wear yellow in Chiang mai. They even won't allow you to watch ASTV if they find out. They only talk about killing. And they show they are willing.

Shame to this aggressive government supporters which you even find here in TV

[tropo]

Hey all of you complainers - Thai tourism will not take a knock except for this immediate few weeks. There's no way all the back packers, package holidayers and se* tourists are concerned -

this won't affect them travelling to Thailand at all. Grow up and realise that Thailand needs change, a lot of change. Mega change...

Your dreaming... the knock on effects for tourism are huge. The tourists are loosing confidence in Thailand fast, watch as bookings for 2009/2010 drop significantly

They were already dropping, with or without the airport siege.

Recession remember?

Yes of course, it's the recession. This airport closure will have no effect on tourism.

Take your blinders off.

[LaoPo]

My wife just had a phone call from a friend who have satelite TV and she said that Channel 5 told that all stranded tourist will get 2000 baht a day from the government, can somebody confirm this?

From the website of the Tourism Authority of Thaitland (TAT):

On the basis of assistance, for tourists and travellers who cannot travel to their destination as of 25 November, 2008, till the airport reopens, TAT and the Ministry of Tourism and Sports have provided accommodation and meals, as well as facilitated tourists as much as possible until they are able to return to their destination.

Conditions of Accommodation

1. Tourists cannot reimburse the accommodation and meals for cash.

2.Tourists can stay in the accommodation under the condition that their costs do not exceed 2,000 Baht per day. For any excess, tourists must be responsible and pay themselves.

3. Tourists can only change the place of accommodation that has been arranged by THA and ATTA.

Source: www.tatnews.org/tat_release/detail.asp?id=4071

--

Maestro

In 2007 the average tourist spent Baht 4,120 per day/per head themselves.....the TAT gives them Baht 2,000;

I wonder how much of that Baht 2,000 is for hotel accommodation and how much is allowed to spend on meals -in those same hotels I assume-.

May I assume also that the TAT negotiated the room prices ?..and if so: how much for a room (split by two) ?

Any -stranded- passengers out there who know ?

LaoPo

[PeaceBlondie]

I see that PB is online.

I am hoping for some potential sound bites for future posts, or some song lyrics maybe.

Here ya' go, globali, some church poetry that I stole from Dylan, used in my first sermon in Texas, and put into a certain unpublished but copyrighted novel - live from Rangoon,

“How many deaths will it take, until we know, that too many people have died?”

As he began the opening chords, the crowd raised their hands in a peace sign, and the cameraman broadcast it. Around the world, Bob Dylan, Neil Young, Bill Clinton, Joan Baez, George W. Bush, and millions more stood and raised the peace sign. As a cliché that suddenly is reborn, the peace sign wasn’t corny anymore. TV stations mixed the scene in Rangoon with the responses in countless countries. It was a church poetry:

"How many years can a mountain exist, before it’s washed to the sea?

And how many years can some people exist, before they’re allowed to be free?

And how many times will a man turn his head, pretending he just doesn’t see?

The answer, my friend, is blowing in the wind….."

The original title of the novel was "Pray and Work for Peace."

[tig28]

Condo-bk...

regarding the 'creative thinking' comment do you have any facts to call upon that show corruption was higher under Thaksin? Don't get me wrong, I can't stand the guy, but so far we've just got that corruption index and that goes contrary to what you're saying. Obviously if you've nothing concrete to call upon your comment holds no weight whatsoever.

Do you really asking for corruption statistics?

"we've just got that corruption index" - come on, be real. How many PMs were convicted on corruption charges?

Well ........ not Thaksin actually ---- do you really imagine he was????

Thaksin was convicted (5 for -- 4 against) for signing a document acknowledging his wife's purchase of land (as must all Thai husbands)

Thus allowing a charge of conflict of interest to be brought against him --- as he was a government member.

The crime of the century!!! ..... I love it when the calls go out for INTERPOL ---- track this man down before he does it again !!!!!

[GlenOrd]

Your theory is perfect.

In reality, Sondhi will call the children, woman and elderly to march toward to police. "Don't be afraid, this is our final final final final fight". The children, woman and elderly march toward the police. What the police going to do?

1. Shoot

2. Run away

My guessing,

American police will choose option 1.

Thai police will choose option 2.

No I don't think the US would choose option one, the US would have cleared the airport long before it got to this level.... Also when you cut off a snakes head the rest falls, a simple sniper while the PAD leaders are on stage would send every one running out of the airport.

Just like a bank robbery in US movies. The sniper across the building shoot as soon as the robbers step out.

In this situation, who can or will give the order to shoot? Thaksin? Somchai? Police chief? I don't think anyone dare to give that order, as he/she will have to face public enquiry later. Unlike the US, the PM here cannot pardon himself.

The PAD has been bomb almost on a daily basis lately. Yet they are still there. I don't think any shooting will send every one to run out of the airport (remember, they are there at will, not be held there against their will as in the movies). It is more likely that they will be running toward the police for revenge.

[GlenOrd]

Condo-bk...

regarding the 'creative thinking' comment do you have any facts to call upon that show corruption was higher under Thaksin? Don't get me wrong, I can't stand the guy, but so far we've just got that corruption index and that goes contrary to what you're saying. Obviously if you've nothing concrete to call upon your comment holds no weight whatsoever.

Do you really asking for corruption statistics?

"we've just got that corruption index" - come on, be real. How many PMs were convicted on corruption charges?

Well ........ not Thaksin actually ---- do you really imagine he was????

Thaksin was convicted (5 for -- 4 against) for signing a document acknowledging his wife's purchase of land (as must all Thai husbands)

Thus allowing a charge of conflict of interest to be brought against him --- as he was a government member.

The crime of the century!!! ..... I love it when the calls go out for INTERPOL ---- track this man down before he does it again !!!!!

Just to add.

The court also find his wife innocent of all count for buying that land. Sound ironic? At least to me.

[RenzoInOz]

This just released by Australian Govt. (t has been constantly updating its travel advisory for Thailand but this is a new development - singling out Bangkok and indirectly advising people not to go there. There are five levels of warnings about any destination the Govt uses in these advisories: Be alert to own security * Exercise caution * High degree of caution * Reconsider your need to travel * Do not travel. )

Summary

* We advise you to exercise a high degree of caution in Thailand because of the uncertain political situation and high threat of terrorist attack. We continue to receive reports that terrorists may be planning attacks against a range of targets, including tourist areas and other places frequented by foreigners.

* Pay close attention to your personal security at all times and monitor the media for information about possible new safety or security risks.

* We advise you to reconsider your need to travel to Bangkok at this time due to the continued closure of Suvarnabhumi International and Don Muang Airports and the very limited availability of flights from Utapao Airport. Phuket and Chiang Mai airports continue to operate.

* There have been large-scale political demonstrations and related incidents resulting in fatalities and injuries in Bangkok and other parts of Thailand. The strong divisions between pro- and anti-government groups have become more pronounced in recent days. In light of the high level of political instability and reports of military reinforcements, you should avoid demonstrations, political rallies, military deployments and concentrations of security personnel because of the ongoing political unrest. Demonstrations have occurred at a number of government buildings including Government House, the Parliament building, Police Headquarters and at airports.

* Demonstrations and violent incidents at Suvarnabhumi International Airport and Don Muang Airport in Bangkok have disrupted services and both airports are currently closed. The duration of the closures is not known at this stage.

* Late on 27 November the Thai Prime Minister announced an emergency decree for Suvarnabhumi and Don Muang Airports in Bangkok. In light of this decree, you should stay away from these airports until further notice.

* Before travelling to any airport in Thailand, Australians should check with their airline on the status of their flights and the situation at these airports. They should closely monitor developments and follow any instructions issued by local authorities.

* If you are in Bangkok and do not have accommodation you should first contact your airline for assistance. If they are unwilling or unable to help, you should contact the Tourist Authority of Thailand for advice. There hotline numbers are 02 356 0720 and 02 356 0729. Australians in Thailand in urgent need of consular assistance should contact the 24-hour Consular Emergency Centre on +61 2 6261 3305.

* Australians scheduled to travel to Thailand should contact their airline to confirm their travel plans. (see Civil Unrest/Political Tension).

* You should avoid unnecessary travel to the area around Government House and other demonstration sites. Several attacks, including with hand grenades and explosive devices resulting in some fatalities and a number of injuries have occurred. Further violence cannot be ruled out.

* There is an ongoing border dispute between Thailand and Cambodia relating to land adjacent to the Khao Pra Viharn temple (Preah Vihear in Khmer). There were instances of fighting between Thai and Cambodian military troops in October 2008 resulting in some injuries and fatalities. The temple is currently closed to tourists. Australians are urged to avoid travel to the area and to monitor local media.

[Nampeung]

PB you rock ... the answer is blowin in the wind

[henryalleman]

i really dont understand why the UN has not step in sorry i'm only 26

First of all its not their business, because its an internal Thai problem. Secondly what you expect the UN can do. The UN is completely useless, look Darfour, East Congo etc.etc.

[Kerryd]

If the PAD does get their way, Somchai resigns, and the PAD supporters get the government they want, what's gonna stop the redshirts from closing down airports and taking over government house to bring Somchai and the PPP back?

I don't think the reds have the same kind of "behind the scenes" support that PAD does. If they were to try the same thing, I think who ever is in authority at the time would be quick to crack down on them.

They would use the current crisis as an example and note that they couldn't let events like this to keep happening. The main difference is that next time the police and/or army would be more likely to act when ordered to do so.

I wonder though, how many anti-yellows on TV would become anti-reds if that were to happen and they were "inconvenienced" again ?

[madi]

Condo-bk...

regarding the 'creative thinking' comment do you have any facts to call upon that show corruption was higher under Thaksin? Don't get me wrong, I can't stand the guy, but so far we've just got that corruption index and that goes contrary to what you're saying. Obviously if you've nothing concrete to call upon your comment holds no weight whatsoever.

Do you really asking for corruption statistics?

"we've just got that corruption index" - come on, be real. How many PMs were convicted on corruption charges?

Well ........ not Thaksin actually ---- do you really imagine he was????

Thaksin was convicted (5 for -- 4 against) for signing a document acknowledging his wife's purchase of land (as must all Thai husbands)

Thus allowing a charge of conflict of interest to be brought against him --- as he was a government member.

The crime of the century!!! ..... I love it when the calls go out for INTERPOL ---- track this man down before he does it again !!!!!

No matter what side, if any, you are on, you all know this airport thing has Thailand looking like a complete joke to the rest of the world.

The BBC spends a lot of time on the topic too.

Now that the India thing is fading away, Thailand can go back to the front page again for the international news.

OK--a Supreme court put into office by an illegal-unelected Coup, will throw out an elected government? I know ,most of you here are unaware of how a democracy works but NO COURT can remove a leader in a real democracy. Only the congress in America can do that and only the Parliament can do it in most others.

Who elected the court?

HAAAA HAAAA

Comical here.

Well anyway--Thailand is in meltdown and most of you, even the hardcore bar lovers, will leave if the shooting gets to your area.

Can we say MELTDOWN?

[Tonycheston]

OK As from yesterday I am one of those stranded. I just tried to find out about any compensation. It works this way:-

Conditions of Accommodation

Tourists cannot reimburse the accommodation and meals for cash.

Tourists can stay in the accommodation under the condition that their costs do not exceed 2,000 Baht per day. For any excess, tourists must be responsible and pay themselves.

Tourists can only change the place of accommodation that has been arranged by THA and ATTA.

http://www.tourismthailand.org/news/content-1380.html

Because I was staying private, looks like I get nothing.

Today I read somewhere that a dutch person and some germans got a rebooking for their flight (due yesterday). They will be flown out 09.01.09 YES 9th January 2009. Not sure I can believe that.

(also posted yesterday in a different forum)