New 5 Years Visas For Long Term Residents

[astral]

Thanks for the address..

I'm going to write him a letter and if the seven and a half thousand others that have viewed this thread write as well, our views may be looked at in a different light.   

cc:

The Right Honourable Paul Martin

Office of the Prime Minister

80 Wellington Street

Ottawa

K1A 0A2

If we all work together we should be able to see some movement in Immigration policy by exerting a bit of pressure.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

He also has an e-mail address

[email protected]

[sabaijai]

Isn't permanent residency initially given for five years, as a sort of probationary period? And you have to check in every year for five years till they give you a more 'permanent' PR? Wonder if this is what the colonel was trying to describe and it got misquoted ...

[camerata]

Isn't permanent residency initially given for five years, as a sort of probationary period? And you have to check in every year for five years till they give you a more 'permanent' PR? Wonder if this is what the colonel was trying to describe and it got misquoted ...

I think you're thinking of the stamp you get in your residency book each year at the local police station. From what I've heard, you normally start off doing it once a year and later can get to do it every five years. But when you actually get onto the five-year deal varies from police station to police station.

[boris]

Isn't permanent residency initially given for five years, as a sort of probationary period? And you have to check in every year for five years till they give you a more 'permanent' PR? Wonder if this is what the colonel was trying to describe and it got misquoted ...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think you're thinking of the stamp you get in your residency book each year at the local police station. From what I've heard, you normally start off doing it once a year and later can get to do it every five years. But when you actually get onto the five-year deal varies from police station to police station.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I only obtained PR in 2004 so have yet to renew the red cover police book (5year period) at my local nick (Thonglor).However I have an American friend who did so recently and he said it obtaining the renewal was a pain free 10 minute job, with no sense of evaluation or probation in respect of his first 5 years.

[IsaanAlex]

Canada like U.S.-UK-E.U.-Aus-Nz.- are FIRST world countries with balanced,secure,stable,democratic mult-cultural-racially mixed and prosperous backgrounds and economies, while albiet Thailand is developing and forward looking,its still a THIRD world country/economy with different traditions,social orders,values and expectations that that of the west.

Vivre la dif-fer-once

Gotta give them time 

I don't have time for their shit.

I'm 31 years old with a Thai wife and 2 kids and I'd like a bit of stability if I'm to remain in Thailand.

I think our country's need to do some sort of reciprical deal with all of these countries...where any country that does not give us permanent residence or citizenship has their nationals likewise barred from these things in our countries...

Alex you forgot to mention that as soon as she cleared immigration she could work, go buy a chunk of land so she could build her dream house as well as everything else you have stated.

I'm well aware. I just shake my head when I think of what we give to others and what we get in return.

... the process of immigrating to Canada is also time consuming, stressful and the costs add up but once our wifes have it and Canadian Citizenship it really frees up your options in regard to Thailand.

Given the enormous benefits that a person and all their spawn recieve they are lucky that they get what they do as quickly as they do; that said, it's never an easy process in human terms...

If you are serious about your future position in Thailand and not just blowing smoke. Then send him a letter politely outlining the changes to Thai Immigration Policy that you personally would like to see implemented and what it would mean to you and your family.

I think that doing something like this, if you were squeeky enough might just cause Visa problems. At worst, bcoming a vocal opponent of regimes in these countries tends to get people killed.;farangs aren't likely to get co-opted into the Thai system.

IA

[Digger]

I think this visa is a mis-quote but it really does highlight a desire from many expats for a firmer footing in Thailand.

Personally, I think that Thaivisa.com should make contact with other vested interest groups such as assorted Chambers of Commerce and try and establish a roadmap for how to make a compelling case to the Thai government. The additional page hits alone would allow you to increase advertising rates considerably. This would need to involve a PR firm well connected with government officials and capable of putting across a set of clear and well reasoned why foreigners would be an asset to Thailand and how the country could benefit by amending the requirements for longer term stays. I would actually suggest that one of the key planks would be an option for an Elite card light programme - The government need a way out of this mess and this could be timely. Suggestions might include:

5 year visas - the category has already been passed and exists already. Also make this category able to apply for a work permit and to count ultimately to a residency certificate.

Easier requirement for work permit with the light elite card, particularly where investment comes into the country, but not as large as typically the BOI are involved in. Again Taksin has stated that SME's will be the growth of Thailands economy. Play up to this and highlight why foreigners can assist. By declaring the level of income tax a foreigner would pay over 5 years multiplied by number of foreigners can create a large amount of interest in a country desperate to increase its tax revenues for the benefit of the country at large. An investment of XXX or the employment of YYY people would "automatically" qualify you for a work permit in a clean business. The automatic element would be a big draw I suspect.

Ability to own land in certain areas of the country up to 1 rai for example. Certain areas are already too expensive for many Thais such as Phuket so this would not be a negative. Opening up areas in Central BKK, Pattaya, Phuket, Hua Hin etc spring to mind. That way the poor areas remain protected. An additional carrot could be that any foreign owned property has a tax element payable every year to the local Tambon along the lines of say 20 baht per Talang Wah to pay for communal improvements - again with a positive positioning, this will benefit local areas to improve schools, infrastructure etc.

You dont need any of the other bells and whistles such as airport goldfish bowls, golf tours, transfers etc.

Notional price of say 100,000 baht as a one off entry fee for the card would add substantial revenue to administer the programme and the tax benefits alone would add millions of baht every year in incremental tax revenues.

Just my ideas but with the right positioning, I think the government would be interested in considering this.

[lukamar]

I think this visa is a mis-quote but it really does highlight a desire from many expats for a firmer footing in Thailand.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree with a lot of what you have to say. This thread shows that there is a very strong interest in a longer term visa of some kind. Although it seems that the focus has changed from the initial post. It was exciting that Thailand would consider a 5 year visa after 3 years of residency, this would be a boon to people with families and give some much needed security. Now the focus seems to have changed to how to get Permanent Residency, own land, get work permits and other assorted goodies like the countries we come from. From working a few years as a national Union negotiator, if you ask for everything you will get nothing. You have to take small steps before you can run.

If they would grant a 5 year visa, don't push for PR or anything else, let them set the rules. That could fit with ther current thinking as well but give some of us added security as long as they don't want some ridiculous amount transferred into the country every month. I don't see a lot of us wanting PR I see a lot of us wanting some realistic security for ourselves and our family.

I like your idea about the Elite Card lite and I think that they might just find that workable although I think you will find they want substantially more than 100,000Bt. More stability for the foreign community would definitely be good for Thailand and that is what should be pushed to the government. Because the majority just wants to work or live quietly with their family they do not get the publicity, it's the drunken SOB chasing the BG and creating problems that gets it and unfortunately a lot of Thai look at us all in that light.

I think you can be vocal without being abrasive and demanding.

[Abandon]

Well I went to soi suan plu this morning and asked around. I was Pinballed around different offices and no one had heard of the 5 year visa until I got sent up to the PR (permanent resident) office. There an officer explained that the article had been a mis-quote by the reporter who had gotten the wrong idea.

The December applications relate to the permanent residency, which requires a minimum of 3 years in Thailand to qualify. It costs almost 200 000 for most ppl, and 100 000 for Foreigners married to a Thai (as many of you know)

She added that the 5 year thing was a new provision for people who had a PR visa for 5 years already; they could apply for citizenship (her word - citizen) I double checked with her - so they can become thai people?? And she confirmed. My Thai is pretty fair and we spoke in Thai and she was familiar with the article. It seems to make sense, except that I don't believe that they are slackening the rules for citizenship.....

But anyway, definitely no 5 year visa for us....

[danone]

tks pandit for the research:

as a PR holder, did she say what obstacles one would face applying for citizenship after 5 yrs?

is there a new short-cut-version to the citizenship?

[Ajarn]

First it's five year driving licences (great move) and now it's five year visas. I won't hold my breath on this one as it has been proposed several times already. Let's have some more details George, as they come to hand. Cost being the main one Pro-rata on the one year visa would place it around 37.000 Baht

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Errrrr...... One Year Non-Imm extension is 1,900 Baht x 5 = 9,500

How'd you reach 37,000?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Gaz...I was just going by the cost of a one year non immigrant "B" application fee, currently around 7500 baht (A$250) which in five years comes to 37500 baht, and non extendable in Thailand, except for a short period.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Where did you get the idea a "B" visa couldn't be extended except for a short time? I've been getting extensions on the same "B" visa now for a couple of years already....

[Abandon]

tks pandit for the research:

as a PR holder, did she say what obstacles one would face applying for citizenship after 5 yrs?

is there a new short-cut-version to the citizenship?

I feel a bit silly now. I was so intent on the 5 year visa that I didn't think to ask for details on the fast track citizenship. I was also a bit taken aback as I understood that only Royal or hevenly intervention could secure such. I guess that a call to the PR department would be the thing to do. But she seemed quite clear on the matter.

[techmo]

Hello All

I just visited the Bangkok Immigrations HQ this morning 20 Dec,about the subject Visa. They never heard of such, and sent me upstairs to Resident visa section. They were interested in the printed copy of the Memo, which caused a few people to want to know what was happening. Well the end result was wait till next year when they had more information. Sounds like top management is not passing the word down to the ladder.

[Abandon]

You lot arn't reading the above posts. And please no one else post that new article .....

I posted that:

Well I went to soi suan plu this morning and asked around. I was Pinballed around different offices and no one had heard of the 5 year visa until I got sent up to the PR (permanent resident) office. There an officer explained that the article had been a mis-quote by the reporter who had gotten the wrong idea.

The December applications relate to the permanent residency, which requires a minimum of 3 years in Thailand to qualify. It costs almost 200 000 for most ppl, and 100 000 for Foreigners married to a Thai (as many of you know)

She added that the 5 year thing was a new provision for people who had a PR visa for 5 years already; they could apply for citizenship (her word - citizen) I double checked with her - so they can become thai people?? And she confirmed. My Thai is pretty fair and we spoke in Thai and she was familiar with the article. It seems to make sense, except that I don't believe that they are slackening the rules for citizenship.....

But anyway, definitely no 5 year visa for us....

cheers

[lukamar]

You lot arn't reading the above posts. And please no one else post that news article .....

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks.. I have been thinking the same thing.

This is a bit off topic but read this thread...

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=22996

NOW.. if you are like me and can't easily show 100,000bt a month income you don't have any chance of ever getting PR or becoming a citizen of Thailand. If you can become a PR then as from the above posts, it looks like you can apply for citizenship after 5 years.

Taking all that into account we need to get back to the original idea... Some sort of longer term Visa that would allow more stability while in the country. I have mentioned small steps and i think that is what we should do. If we could get a visa change for one group then we could concentrate on getting changes for other groups.

The other day Thai Immigration had no idea that the Pattaya article even existed. Now they have an explanation as to the miss quote. Already they have shown that they are listening and acting because of the few that have ( a big thank you to you all) taken the time to visit with immigration and ask the questions. I will state again, if we as a group write to a specific person in Government there is a good chance that some of the visa laws will be revamped. Maybe not overnight but in time.

I've given this a lot of thought and the way to get a visa change is to appeal to something that benefits the government as much as the visa holder. Sort of a win win situation. So tell me what you think of this. It would not benefit all of us initially but it would be a first step if we could get it implemented.

We appeal to the Thai Government to change the visa for Married to a Thai or supporting a Thai child. We argue that it is in the best interest of Thai society and the family unit that the Thai government raise the time limit on visa renewals to 5 years for this group to provide stability to their lives. The same criteria for the 5 year visa be used as the now existing 1 year visa. That the 90 day reporting stay the same. That the visa fee be increased to take into account the longer time (+/-10,000Bt). That once a year you report with your wife/child to prove you are still married for the first 5 years (this helps to cut out the marry for visa they worry about).

From my point it's very simple if you don't ask for everything at once this only entails one change the visa time period from 1 to 5 years.

If we can get this group changed then we can work on other groups that need visa changes as well.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

You lot arn't reading the above posts. And please no one else post that new article .....

I posted that:

Well I went to soi suan plu this morning and asked around. I was Pinballed around different offices and no one had heard of the 5 year visa until I got sent up to the PR (permanent resident) office. There an officer explained that the article had been a mis-quote by the reporter who had gotten the wrong idea.

The December applications relate to the permanent residency, which requires a minimum of 3 years in Thailand to qualify. It costs almost 200 000 for most ppl, and 100 000 for Foreigners married to a Thai (as many of you know)

She added that the 5 year thing was a new provision for people who had a PR visa for 5 years already; they could apply for citizenship (her word - citizen) I double checked with her - so they can become thai people?? And she confirmed. My Thai is pretty fair and we spoke in Thai and she was familiar with the article. It seems to make sense, except that I don't believe that they are slackening the rules for citizenship.....

But anyway, definitely no 5 year visa for us....

cheers

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

They don't want to believe you

[abdulrahman]

Agree with lukamar;hope someone knows how to influence the Thi immigration!

(not very easy IMHO)

[adjan jb]

What's going on ?

Thai rak farang or what ?

[dr_Pat_Pong]

What's going on ?

Thai rak farang or what ?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It ain't gonna happen

[boris]

What's going on ?

Thai rak farang or what ?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It ain't gonna happen

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Dr P, you're almost certainly right of course.Although I am lucky enough to have PR, I have much sympathy for those working in the Kingdom, who don't meet PR criteria but have a Thai spouse and children to support.Actually there is a forum, namely the joint Chambers of Commerce, which has a dialogue with Government from time to time.The first step however would be for nationals of the different affected countries to approach the individual Chambers -American,Australian,Canadian,British, Indian,French etc.

Some co-ordination would be required, specifically to address the likely reasonable question from the Government side viz what EXACTLY do you want that is consistent with your requirements (better security of tenure) and our requirements (to vet all foreigners in the Kindom from time to time) and is not already available.If the chambers were interested (and that's a very big if) a working group could be set up to deal with these preliminary questions.

[samran]

Fight the fights that you have a chance of winning.

I think that any immenent reform in visa laws will come from the work permit side. As we have seen with the Australian/Thai FTA, there has been a slight easing in how work permits will be issued to Australian executives (and their spouses allowing them to work) and how immigration will define the concept of 'work' and if work permits will be needed in certain situations.

If you are going to focus pressure on the Thai government, then I would look at those things first. You'll find that if you are a citizen of the US or NZ, there will be a series of consultantive sessions held by your respective governements with locally based expats in due course to talk about possible issues that need to be negotiated in the forthcoming FTA negotiations.

This will be the best forum to put forward any proposals that you may have. My experinece is that the Australian negotiators paid significant attention to proposals put forward by locally based expats during the FTA consultative sessions.

I'm afraid though that getting the RTG to relax their approach to residency, especially for sposues of Thai citizens, won't be high on the agenda.

[camerata]

I only obtained PR in 2004 so have yet to renew the red cover police book (5year period) at my local nick (Thonglor).However I have an American friend who did so recently and he said it obtaining the renewal was a pain free 10 minute job, with no sense of evaluation or probation in respect of his first 5 years.

That's good to know. I've been told that at police stations like Lumpini and Thonglor a bottle of Johnny Walker is required to smooth over any "problems" the cops can think up.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

I only obtained PR in 2004 so have yet to renew the red cover police book (5year period) at my local nick (Thonglor).However I have an American friend who did so recently and he said it obtaining the renewal was a pain free 10 minute job, with no sense of evaluation or probation in respect of his first 5 years.

That's good to know. I've been told that at police stations like Lumpini and Thonglor a bottle of Johnny Walker is required to smooth over any "problems" the cops can think up.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That'd be the black one I think It'll work

[Abandon]

I only obtained PR in 2004 so have yet to renew the red cover police book (5year period) at my local nick (Thonglor).However I have an American friend who did so recently and he said it obtaining the renewal was a pain free 10 minute job, with no sense of evaluation or probation in respect of his first 5 years.

That's good to know. I've been told that at police stations like Lumpini and Thonglor a bottle of Johnny Walker is required to smooth over any "problems" the cops can think up.

Friend of mine has had a PR visa for 20 years and says he always sends a kid with his stuff to the police station report - he never goes in person. Guess you should go in person the first ime of course.

[SiamPhil]

Just sounds like a quick and easy alternative to Permanent Residence...which, from a Thai point of view is smart...as this way (as opposed to PM) will never (even in theory) lead to citizenship for the farang.

IA

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Was at Suan Phlu this morning. Officials said there was no such thing as a 5 year visa. Said is was all a "mistake". This entire subject is a joke!

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Just sounds like a quick and easy alternative to Permanent Residence...which, from a Thai point of view is smart...as this way (as opposed to PM) will never (even in theory) lead to citizenship for the farang.

IA

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Was at Suan Phlu this morning. Officials said there was no such thing as a 5 year visa. Said is was all a "mistake". This entire subject is a joke!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

As some of we longer serving members said

[Artisan]

I asked my brother-in-law, who is a senior officer in the Royal Thai Police HQ in Rama I Road about this. He leads the laison function between the Tourist Police, the Immigration Police, the Border Divison, the Traffic Police and the bobby on the beat.

He said that he is not aware of any such proposal to introduce this 5-year visa. He considers that it is crucial that the Immigration Police see the face of anyone who is staying in the Country on an extended basis; five year intervals are "not on".

Looks like the whole issue is pure make-believe; maybe gossip that the newspaper has latched on to without any substance behind it.

However, I tend to believe that there is no smoke without fire....or as the Thais say "If you can smell dog shit then you will find dog shit!" There could be something in the wind (no pun intended).

[LivinLOS]

Having read this thread from start to finish I have come to the obvious conclusion that its simply the Pattaya press miss interpreting some of the Pr rules into 'new' visa rules..

That said it made me aware that I have now lived in the kingdom for 2 and 3/4 years.. In that time I have been on non imm 0 (arrival).. some 30 day runs.. a 1 year non imm B (in the old days when looking for work was acceptable, no WP and 90 day runs).. some more 30 day'ers.. currently a triple entry tourist..

I would assume that this hodge podge of visa's, even though I have only spent one night outside the kingdom since my permanent arrival in spring 02 would count for squat in the eyes of continual 3 year stay ?? Correct ??

Another obstacle for the retired, unmarried, under 50's to even get on the ladder...

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Having read this thread from start to finish I have come to the obvious conclusion that its simply the Pattaya press miss interpreting some of the Pr rules into 'new' visa rules..

That said it made me aware that I have now lived in the kingdom for 2 and 3/4 years.. In that time I have been on non imm 0 (arrival).. some 30 day runs.. a 1 year non imm B (in the old days when looking for work was acceptable, no WP and 90 day runs).. some more 30 day'ers.. currently a triple entry tourist..

I would assume that this hodge podge of visa's, even though I have only spent one night outside the kingdom since my permanent arrival in spring 02 would count for squat in the eyes of continual 3 year stay ?? Correct ??

Another obstacle for the retired, unmarried, under 50's to even get on the ladder...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That ladder starts after 3 continuous years of the one year extensions of any class of Non-Immigrant visa's. Thus, I'm afraid that your own assessment, " squat " is the real outcome.

[george]

Just had a phone chat with the Deputy Commander of Royal Thai Immigration.

The article from Pattaya Today is completely wrong, the Colonel was "misquoted" in that "newspaper", and the Immigration Bureau have no plans to give us any 5 year visas. Period.

Case closed.

Merry Christmas from all at Suan Phlu as well!

/George

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Just had a phone chat with the Deputy Commander of Royal Thai Immigration.

The article from Pattaya Today is completely wrong, the Colonel was "misquoted" in that "newspaper", and the Immigration Bureau have no plans to give us any 5 year visas. Period.

Case closed.

Merry Christmas from all at Suan Phlu as well!

/George

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

And a Happy Colonel to you too George.

/All us at Suan Phlu