Ex-thai Pm Attempts To Block Govt Led By Opponents

[citizen33]

As an American who is disgusted with what my country has become, I won't offer an opinion to the current situation. The USA has lost a great deal of its' moral authority. The US' exporting of toxic paper is an obvious stark example. How my fellow countrymen can stand by and continue to elect the same Usual Suspects from both sides of the aisle, is beyond me. There are third parties in the US that really want to revert back to the basic fundamentals of the Constitution, but even if they manage to gain traction, they get spiked and in the end, it is the Big Money that wins. I don't see Obama being much different.

Blah, blah, blah, Benedict Arnold.

This is not the place for your wacky Anti-American diatribes. Try the Bear Pit forum to share with others of your ilk.

Interesting to see the views of some of the PAD cabal on the Western democracies. Would a tad to the right of Genghis Khan just about sum up their position?

[cmsally]

Not to mention the fact ,that the present Constitution was drawn up under a non elected military govt.

[wrecker]

The pressure should be very public. Name and shame the lawmakers who change sides. It is very easy a democracy means that money will shift from the haves to the voters, that is happening all around the world. The bizar idea that unity must be preserved i order to satisfy a clique of people who have taken for hundred and fifty years and never given anything is ridiculous. Of course the elite should be worried. People who do not need to worry about healthcare, whose children can get to school and get an college education and who get a decent minimum wage will come out to vote. They will no longer take the shit from the clique anymore. That is a good thing and that is the way Western countries went 60 years ago. Thailand is just a little behind and the elite is just a little bit too spoiled here. ONE MAN ONE VOTE! That is the way to go.

[MaxLee]

Wonderful... really wonderful,... after the PAD won the Suvarnabumi spectacle,... of course a counter would occur from the f&%/cking opposition drawing innocent people into the mess. It's not even safe to be a student anymore very soon....

[growe237]

don't be so surprised to see all of his "supporters" from all over issarn and the nothern region..... what a deal ... show ur presence, sit down and u get a brand new red shirt and an extra 1500 baht in ur pocket. thats what they're handing out... and free transportation, and if ur lucky enough to be the driver , u get gas money (how ever much that is now.. used to be 2000)

Source?

[george]

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[animatic]

Just back from the rally at the National Stadium and have been watching an endless row of pro-government supporters

streaming in to the facility all day.

A police commander estimated more than 30,000 people were inside the stadium as of an hour ago (5.30pm). There were still many thousands outside and police have had to close off one side of the road due to the high pedestrian traffic.

All of the seating except for the far end of the stadium behind the stage was full, as was the entire playing area.

The turn-out will I'm sure have an affect on those politicians who have joined the Democrats and is an indication that in the event the Democrats do form a coalition government that Thailand's political problems are far from over.

Those attending came from as far as Udon Thani and comprised a broad cross-section of ages and professions.

Why does this read more like a press release than a typical TV forum post?

[growe237]

Paying elected politician 50 million baht to switch sides and vote for Pueh Thai nominees.

Source?

[baht&sold]

Thaksin records speech near Thailand

No doubt from Koh-Kong Cambodia as Thai Rath reported Mr Thaksin's whereabouts last week.

Hun Sen's golfing buddy (and proposed casino partner) Thaksin would be as welcomed as his mate Vatana Asavahame, himself on the run from corruption charges and 'holed up' at his cambo-casino (but just can't seem to be found somehow). Then again, Mr Thaksin himself similarly on the run can't even seem to get arrested whilst getting a divorce within the Thai Embassy in Hk...

Note Dr Weng was adressing the red-rally - he would be the same UDD leader whom also led red-protests to the UK Embassy in Bangkok, denouncing their democracy and demanding Thaksin's visa be re-instated... The same UDD leader Dr Weng coincidentaly introduced the bill to remove vote-fraud rules from Thailand's constitution (the one approved by a referendum) and really escalted the ensuing mess...

Meanwhile, both the Thai and Foreign Chambers of Commerce have come out twice last week in favour of a new Govt in the thin hopes of a change. The Thai Federation of Business went further and outright threw their support behind the Democrats with the same hope.

There's still a couple days (or more) to go before the new Govt is decided by majority MP's after carefully considering what is best for Thailand (like offers of 55 million baht per MP from Thaksin's Puea Thai to return)... As Chalerm chillingly warned the Dems on Dec 8: "He who laughs last laughs the loudest"... Laughing proud Papa Chalerm's message is clear, however, if it ever came to a PM Chalerm, few would likely be laughing... except the outside world perhaps (but then The Economist would likely devote a special Asian edition).

Speaking of which, wonder if Dr Thaksin will mention the Economist article? Probably no need to as this was designed for outside publicity/deflection of blame. His PR man and long-time Economist collaborator Sam Moon have already seen to that.

As one whom neither supports reprehensible airport occupations nor convicted corrupt politicians, it doesn't surprise that some justify almost anything as long as it supports their narrow ideology (the needs of the country be damned, thus it is).

Ultimately, for many, this is all getting rather old and most (including me) would simply like to see Thailand go forward before even more damage is done. Unfortunately, there's a man on the phone determined to protect his personal 'return on investment' at all costs, even a nation's...

[wayfarer108]

Is it just me, or does this get more pathetic everyday?

I agree. I think it's disgusting that a mob of anti government protestors should be allowed to hold the country to ransom the way they did.

Democracy my a*se! This is no way to behave in a Democratic society. All you yellow shirts should be ashamed of how you have behaved. You behaved like the baby who never got his chocolate!

When a government is voted in Democratically then you should abide by this government and accept that your side lost. Next election time you make a better case for your party and try and win.

Thank god civilized countries don't behave like this. Western countries like the USA and Great Britain would never behave like this, nor would they allow this to happen.

I think I speak for a lot of the democratic countries across the world when I say that we look upon your actions with shame and disgust. There is no glory in the way you have (and are) behaved.

Many European political systems have a bicameral legislature structured much like that proposed in the later versions of Pad's new politics.

[pammy123]

Thaksin your country needs you, it has been nothing but turmoil without you.

[Pierrot]

Not to mention the fact ,that the present Constitution was drawn up under a non elected military govt.

Absolutely. I'm surprised that some people who called themselves "veterans" of Thai politic have such a short memory. Actually I believe more selective than short.

People were at that time offered the deal : if you want a democratic election, you have to accept the new constitution. No constitution, no election. Ok, then the people (at least those who believe in democracy) thought we accept the constitution, we elect our free government, everything is back to normal and we then revise the constitution. As usual, it didn't really worked as planned ...

Edited December 13, 2008 by Pierrot

[wayfarer108]

20,000 sheep all led by the deviant shepherd Thaksin, the pervert of Thai justice supported of course by his vitriolic mouthpiece supporters on this forum. Still we all now what suits sheep don't we - carved up with mint sauce on a plate. Let's hope that the wiser factions of Thai society do all they can to protect the metaphorical from becoming factual.

The main problem with Thaksin was his corrupt practices. Most of his policies seemed to be what this country needs, and at least he followed what could be seen as the best democratic practices this country is currently capable of. The previous governments and the current alternatives are none of these and are unlikely to change things for the better.

No. The main problem with Thaksin was his understanding of Democracy and law and order: The elected as the absolute ruler, tolerating no dissent. And death squads killing over 2000 "drug suspects", as well as the abduction and murder of a prominent muslim lawyer. The problem with Thaksin is that there is blood on his hands.

Even if you believe the - rather absurd - official story that drug dealers turned on each other, I can very well remember Thaksin's public statements even as the killings commenced. Those statements were nothing short of absolute support for the murders, as well as veiled threats against those in the police who might have second thoughs... it was made abundantly clear that a quota of suspects must be killed. And killed they were.

Yes, as documented by Amnesty International in their 2003 and 2004 human rights reports on Thailand and this announcement:

AI Index: ASA 39/001/2003 (Public)

News Service No: 037

20 February 2003

The effect of the government's campaign against drugs trafficking has been a de facto shoot-to-kill policy of anyone believed to be involved in the drugs trade.

"It is a sad fact that after 10 years of significant improvement in Thailand’s human rights record, the government has now taken a big step backwards. Encouragement for extrajudicial killings has been given at the highest level with law enforcement personnel under heavy pressure to "produce results" or lose their jobs," Amnesty International said.

The government claims that only 15 of the almost 600 shot dead in the past three weeks were killed by the security forces, and the rest were as a result of drug dealers shooting one another. The authorities are not permitting pathologists to perform autopsies and bullets are reportedly being removed from the corpses.

[rayw]

Is it just me, or does this get more pathetic everyday?

I agree. I think it's disgusting that a mob of anti government protestors should be allowed to hold the country to ransom the way they did.

Democracy my a*se! This is no way to behave in a Democratic society. All you yellow shirts should be ashamed of how you have behaved. You behaved like the baby who never got his chocolate!

When a government is voted in Democratically then you should abide by this government and accept that your side lost. Next election time you make a better case for your party and try and win.

Thank god civilized countries don't behave like this. Western countries like the USA and Great Britain would never behave like this, nor would they allow this to happen.

I think I speak for a lot of the democratic countries across the world when I say that we look upon your actions with shame and disgust. There is no glory in the way you have (and are) behaved.

Would agree WHEN the Thai Government IS elected in democratically. The last election like those before it was yet another farce and an insult to democracy with vote buying and rigging so I cannot see how anyone can honestly recognise them as being fairly and honestly elected by the people. As I keep keep saying you wont have democracy here with so many corrupt bully boy type school children holding so much power and not until anew election is properly monitored and observed by the UN or similar external international recognised body. When the incumbent Government is seen to be in power by rigged elections and vote buying (vote buying is a fact not fiction) then of course there is little alternative to what the PAD did to get things moving, and so far it worked whether or not you believe in what PAD stand for is irrelevant for the moment. We urgently need here new proper democratic and monitored elections ASAP so we have a Government that all democratically free thinking folk can accept, whichever party get elected they then can be recognised as an elected Government and should be able to serve their term as long as you do not get corrupt bastards like Thaksin caught feathering his own nest like the selfish criminal he is.

[kalbo123]

Does anybody know if and where the current red-shirts gathering can be viewed online? Incl. the phone-in speach of the fugitive mafiosi?

We (our family) like to see live what he is up to trying to destroy the country.

NBT won't broadcast it.

opalhort

Mafiosi? you must be kidding.... the PAD those are the destroyers.....

[h90]

Not to mention the fact ,that the present Constitution was drawn up under a non elected military govt.

And you forgot to mention that the majority vote for that constitution in the referendum.

[angiud]

Paying elected politician 50 million baht to switch sides and vote for Pueh Thai nominees.

Source?

bulls_t news.

Still I don't understand why so many farangs love so much Thaksin.

Go Abhisit!!!

[Journalist]

The coming government....lets wait and see. I don't expect big jumps forward, but if being honest and without major corruption than I am already happy.

Are you really serious?

'Friends of Newin' will support anyone who doesn't cancel the contract for the 4000 buses that they want to see bought ....buses for the exclusive good of the commuter of course.....

Oh yes the new coalition will be squeaky clean. Especially with General Sanan Kachornprasart at the forefront and holding the loofah.

Poor Abhisit, having to herd this array of cats.

[Moebius87]

With all of these events politic gripping the entire nation, Thais are getting polarized and end up participating in one form of mass action or another... what happens to the day-to-day business of actually getting any work done. Provided you've still got a job, wouldn't it be best for yourself, your family and in some good measure for the country if you simply went and did your job?

Any updates to the scheduled phone-in? My wife's family said that it didn't happen? Another rumor has the ex-PM in Indonesia?

Edited December 13, 2008 by Moebius87

[wackysleet]

Apparently pretty much the whole of the road in front of Nat. Stadium closed and inaccessible to pedestrians unless you follow the tide into the stadium. My condo is opposite to the stadium and apparently the only way to get in, is to follow the red shirts and try to hang a right against the crowd who are going left.

6.30pm apparently almost pedestrian deadlock there as so many people.

Would someone refresh my memory as to which party the recently disgraced Governor of BKK represented, not being one who particularly cares who is in power as after living here for 20 yrs it is the rule rather than the exception that politicians are corrupt, it would appear that a large number of the electorate know and expect this, unfortunately but frequently view these things as fairly normal in this part of the world but as long as they are getting a slice of cake however small, I was reading comments about payments being made to supporters, a couple of weeks ago we ordered several trees from the local garden centre which failed to turn up on said day {nothing unusual in that you may say} well after four days we popped in to see him and he told me that he was working alone as his wife and another worker had gone to BKK to support the yellow shirts for 1000baht a day plus free travel, who knows what is the truth, I see and read people talking and posting in support of the yellows that believe everything THEY read and anyone else is being lied to by the media, it really surprises me that all the so called experts have not yet realised what this country is really all about, as far as I'm concerned we as westerners are not going to fundementally alter their attitudes.

[kalbo123]

Paying elected politician 50 million baht to switch sides and vote for Pueh Thai nominees.

Source?

bulls_t news.

Still I don't understand why so many farangs love so much Thaksin.

Go Abhisit!!!

Most Farangs believe in democracy... PPP won...(Thaksin won) the elections... one man one vote... sounds fair to me...

[wineaux]

I am surprised that the red shirts did not start their own annoying things after the yellow left the airports & government buildings

Wasn't the brutal murders of PAD by the red shirts enough for you ? shame on you promoting more conflict that is being promoted by Toxin.

you must have had too much sangsom again. it was the yellows killing the reds (and anyone else that wouldnt do what they wanted)

You seem to be the one trying to fuel the fires of conflict and im not surprised

[Pierrot]

Did someone notice this latest BBC blunder?

They have now regrouped under new names, but the opposition People's Alliance for Democracy says it has won over enough defectors and unaligned MPs to lead the new government.

Opposition protests

The Democrats, who were defeated in the last general elections in December, will propose to parliament that Abhisit Vejjajiva becomes the next prime minister.

From Wiki.

Opposition (politics), a party with views opposing those of the current government.

As the democrats rarely formulate any opinion, it's easy to forget who they are. Honestly, Thailand is somehow an oddity , with an "opposition" that is not interested in forming a government, and a party that wish to head the country having no opinion whatsoever on what's going on..

[angiud]

Paying elected politician 50 million baht to switch sides and vote for Pueh Thai nominees.

Source?

bulls_t news.

Still I don't understand why so many farangs love so much Thaksin.

Go Abhisit!!!

Most Farangs believe in democracy... PPP won...(Thaksin won) the elections... one man one vote... sounds fair to me...

[Steve2UK]

Not to mention the fact ,that the present Constitution was drawn up under a non elected military govt.

And you forgot to mention that the majority vote for that constitution in the referendum.

And I seem to remember something about "no approval of the constitution, no election" ?

[Pierrot]

Actually, I suggest we stop referring to Abhisit Vejjajiva as the next prime minister. First it's not yet a done deal and then it will be at best a caretaker.

A prime minister is a political leader. We all know that if Mr Abhisit is handled the job, it’s because he has none of the qualities of a political leader.

[oosik]

Perhaps it would be worth considering to place a circle of security around the TV station(s) and tower(s) scheduled to broadcast Thaksin's call.

[animatic]

I am surprised that the red shirts did not start their own annoying things after the yellow left the airports & government buildings

Wasn't the brutal murders of PAD by the red shirts enough for you ? shame on you promoting more conflict that is being promoted by Toxin.

you must have had too much sangsom again. it was the yellows killing the reds (and anyone else that wouldnt do what they wanted)

You seem to be the one trying to fuel the fires of conflict and im not surprised

Clearly lost the plot.

[Pierrot]

Perhaps it would be worth considering to place a circle of security around the TV station(s) and tower(s) scheduled to broadcast Thaksin's call.

I've been told it won't be broadcasted as it may content some elements not suitable for public broacast in Thailand.

Or is it just an excuse from my wife to keep on watching her favorite programme ?

Edited December 13, 2008 by Pierrot

[Koo82]

Not to mention the fact ,that the present Constitution was drawn up under a non elected military govt.

And you forgot to mention that the majority vote for that constitution in the referendum.

We did not vote for it. Back then PAD and other people were on tv saying "Please vote. It's not complete and we will adjust later". Since Khun Samak's time, PAD didn't want to adjust. In Khun Somchai's time, they said they would have protested if Khun Somchai had adjusted.

Now if the handsome Ab- becomes the PM, PAD will allow him to adjust