Abhisit Vejjajiva

[jdinasia]

No they are useless and won't get involved. Remember - no involvement in politics and civil matters. So you are saying if the reds blockade the airport - the military and police will prepare to spill blood??? This happens there will be civil war for certain.

I am saying they (the reds) won't risk it.

while I love Brit more than my luggage, he just doesn't have any clear picture of things in Thailand it seems!

Will the police crack down on the reds if needed? yes. Will they get away with it? sure. They (the police) will certainly bot resort to an unannounced attack with military ordinance like they did on Oct 7th. Instead they will warn the reds "if needed" and then break up any unruly rally with teargas etc .. and then when the reds start tossing grenades or shooting again .. will back up .. give another warning and send in the army.

I am hoping the reds have a leader or two that are smart enough to negotiate and get their violent groups under control. I kinda doubt it though.

[gpdjohn]

Well, they did it.

The man ( The Fugitive) no longer has a diplomatic passport from Thailand.

He as other's, one from the Bahamas I believe...

Do they have a extratdition(sp) treaty with Thailand?

There is hope.

[catmac]

I wager he won't last 2 months, yellows opened up a can of worm with circus and I believe its the reds turn now.

So I take it you don't think the military will answer Abby's call? I think they will and the redcoats know it.

It won't be Abby calling the military, but the same voice that told them to disobey the lawful call of the last government. Abhisit is just a puppet, the power lies as always with the military/elite and their backers at the very top. To have to rely on people like Newin for his majority bodes ill for the future. Abhisit is from the elite and will serve the elite - his Eton/Oxford education would make him unacceptable in the UK, that is an education BOUGHT not EARNED.

We'll see what the results of the forthcoming byelections show, to see the feelings of the ordinary Thai electorate.

I don't know what circles some of the posters here move in, but I've found a strong pro-Thaksin sentiment among the Thais that I know and talk with. Maybe I'm more at home with ordinary Thais who work for a living, and not the "chattering classes".

[Jingthing]

don't know what circles some of the posters here move in, but I've found a strong pro-Thaksin sentiment among the Thais that I know and talk with. Maybe I'm more at home with ordinary Thais who work for a living, and not the "chattering classes

It's largely regional. I think most Thais don't like the reds or the yellows, and I think that is a hopeful thing. BTW, Thakky still holds a regular Thai passport and there are certain mostly Caribbean countries that will sell anyone a new valid passport.

Edited December 16, 2008 by Jingthing

[Ulysses G.]

The last thing they want is him in Thailand and putting him in jail might make him a martyr figure even bigger than before.

That may seem superficially logical but I am not convinced it is true. As long as he is on the run, he is scheming and agitating and buying support. Locked up and stripped of MONEY, that could be stopped, and its possible over time people will accept that the con will NEVER be dictator for life, which is obviously what he and his redcoats want.

Did you see how much profit he made off the sale of his English football team? I'm afraid that there is no way to take anywhere close to all his money away, and as long as he has it, he has a good chance of finageling his way back into power.

[Lordfoul]

The 'Circles' I move in mostly consist of Middle class Tax paying Thais who resent a man who took the tax money they paid in and used it as bribe money (no Payback loans) for his base.

How about you?

I don't know what circles some of the posters here move in, but I've found a strong pro-Thaksin sentiment among the Thais that I know and talk with. Maybe I'm more at home with ordinary Thais who work for a living, and not the "chattering classes".

[WinnieTheKhwai]

For anyone who hasnt heard him: http://www.abhisit.org/EuromoneyHK5july2007.wma

Sounds like a decent enough guy, just needs a decent PR team now (and i dont mean the brown yellow shirts)

sounds very wishy washy, not at all like a potential dictator.

Reading between the lines, that states "the Perfect Puppet".

Interesting because most of the Thais that I know in Chiang Mai like Thaksin because of all the things he did to promote Chiang Mai.

Of course. People who don't see the huge support he has among common folks must live a very sheltered life. There are relatively more Democrat leaning Thais in the *city* of Chiang Mai though; for the province of Chiang Mai (and the North generally), support for Dr. Thaksin is huge.

Lordfoul wrote:

The 'Circles' I move in mostly consist of Middle class Tax paying Thais

So do I, but that does not make me blind for the plight of the less fortunate, who are still in the (electoral) majority in Thailand.

who resent a man who took the tax money they paid in and used it as bribe money (no Payback loans) for his base.

Typical. Rich Thais can be such selfish people; Keep the rich rich, and the poor poor. Keep the poor down.

How about you?

That's very nice. Please realize that this paragraph shows the same selfish arrogance that's so prevalent among *SOME* [new] middle/upper class Thais. It's not called for, and I am a part of many 'circles' of various social standing thankyouverymuchforasking.

I do find myself getting more and more left-wing the longer I stay in Thailand. The Times (UK) quoted dr. Giles Ungpakorn with some very good comments, among which was calling the Democrats the 'cockroach party'. Google it.

Edited December 16, 2008 by WinnieTheKhwai

[tigerbeer]

Abhisit is from the elite and will serve the elite - his Eton/Oxford education would make him unacceptable in the UK, that is an education BOUGHT not EARNED.

thats news to me. so how much does it cost to buy a degree from the Oxford? If they do sell it, then UK should accept him with open arms.

[cmsally]

Often real opinions and vocalised opinions can differ.

The further down the pecking order the less they have to lose, so you are more likely to hear the real opinions.

The more the person has to lose or protect then the closer they are watching the political ball and will respond to the score accordingly. This doesn't always reflect what their real feelings are. There are a lot of pragmatists out there.

People at the moment are watching and waiting. Not many people like to shoot themselves in the foot, when they might need a good pair of legs to make a run for it.

[Lordfoul]

Right Wing ?? Hah! This wasn't a welfare program that was set up to help the poor. These were loans extended to people who could not afforded to pay them back and when they came due they were forgiven. This is not a responsible way to run a government. But it is a great way to 'legally' bribe people.

I supposed as a self described left winger you supported Taksins 'war on drugs' where the Police (Thaksins Military) murdered hundreds of people. No trials just bullets to the head. Just one of his many 'left wing' policies

You better look down. I think you are wearing your shoes on the wrong feet.

The 'Circles' I move in mostly consist of Middle class Tax paying Thais

Well, that explains a lot. Actually, so do I, but that does not make me blind for the plight of the less fortunate, who are still in the (electoral) majority in Thailand.

who resent a man who took the tax money they paid in and used it as bribe money (no Payback loans) for his base.

Typical right wing statement.. Keep the rich rich, and the poor poor. No spreading the wealth, keep the poor down.

How about you?

I finds myself getting more and more left-wing the longer I stay in Thailand. The Times (UK) quoted dr. Giles Ungpakorn with some very good comments, among which was calling the Democrats the 'cockroach party'. Google it.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Right Wing ?? Hah! This wasn't a welfare program that was set up to help the poor. These were loans extended to people who could not afforded to pay them back and when they came due they were forgiven. This is not a responsible way to run a government. But it is a great way to 'legally' bribe people.

I agree with that. There we many other programs too though, in the areas of education, (road) construction, local product development, small business incentives, affordable healthcare and so on.

But no matter what anyone's opinion is on those projects -for sure many had flaws- finally the poor were taken serious and given respect. That, in a democracy, earns you votes. The Democrat party never really bothered with doing anything for the rural poor and paid a severe price for it. They are now put back in power, so let's see if they have learnt from past mistakes. (I'm an optimist, too)

I supposed as a self described left winger you supported Taksins 'war on drugs' where the Police (Thaksins Military) murdered hundreds of people. No trials just bullets to the head. Just one of his many 'left wing' policies

I said I'm getting more and more left wing, not that I actually arrived there. It's relative to where I started out. Anyway I don't think my opinion on drugs matters much and would probably not be in line with forum rules anyway. Objectively there was indeed a huge problem with cheap meth everywhere, which got solved. I also think it was Thaksin's biggest flaw, but that's personal opinion. Most people (friend and foe) thought it was an excellent thing to do, especially because it was largely successful.

You better look down. I think you are wearing your shoes on the wrong feet.

I'll grant you that right-left isn't really a useful scale to debate Thai politics.

[Lordfoul]

I agree that most people were for the drug war, But I disagree that it was successful. Drugs are as free flowing as ever. The popularity seemed to be based on what people thought was happening and not what was actually happening.

Getting rid of hard drugs does 'sound' like a good idea.

Murdering people who have been labeled as 'Dark influences' does not.

Most people (friend and foe) thought it was an excellent thing to do, especially because it was largely successful.

[Jingthing]

I think getting obsessed with right wing/left wing labels as westerners do (with different meanings in different countries) is not very helpful in looking at a Peronist type totalitarian populist like Thaksin. Look instead to his obvious desire to be dictator for life and his famous "democracy is not my goal" quote. Political villains occur on the right and left.

[Lizphuket]

My Thai friend (who was pro Taksin for a long time) thinks this new guys will be good for ex-pats living here as he is more farang friendly. Any views/comments on that?

[Jingthing]

My Thai friend (who was pro Taksin for a long time) thinks this new guys will be good for ex-pats living here as he is more farang friendly. Any views/comments on that?

Thats interesting but he has to be very careful about appearances. A move to allow farangs to own land would be politically suicidal. Also a very low priority when the country faces both economic and division crises. I can imagine pro business/pro investment policies that would be foreign business friendly if they could be sold as part of an economic stimulus package. He will be lucky to serve a year. I wouldn't expect any miracles.

[Ulysses G.]

Some of the Thais that I have met who lived in Western countries were bullied in school and are not that crazy about us. One fellow who should not be named is way up the ladder went to the same school in the UK as one of my best friends and the bullying there was rampant.There are lots of rumors around that he does not like our kind.

Edited December 16, 2008 by Ulysses G.