Patong Becoming Too Expensive?

[geriatrickid]

If you want to have a good shock, have a look at the notice boards in some of the condo complexes. Last month, I was visiting my friend and they had the list of condo fee arrears up and I had a good look. Alot of the farang investors that held multiple units owed big fees. There was an Italian fellow that owed3million on about 7 units, and I was thinking, someone must have been hit hard this past summer. Interesting thing though, I was in that place yesterday and the list is down. I wonder if someone ripped it off the cork board.

[logbags]

Well I am actually lying on my sofa watching the boxing day test between us Aussies and the Sth Africans. I tend to write with far more vigour than I show physically these days I was living with 8 Thais but 4 are in Thailand on holiday and my nephew, his wife and kid just moved around the corner. So there is me, my 18 year old female larn and the dog. It is like paradise.

I'll tell you something interesting and worth a thought or two, a mate in Canada who trolls this site told me. He is a bit of an egghead but would know the figures I suspect. He says by far the biggest demographic of Thai/Farang relationships is older Farang male with younger Thai Isarn girl. The friendships between Farang male and Thai male are very low. Like in Patong you see primarily older European male with younger Isarn girl. It makes up a huge % of the market for long stayers in particular.

I see a few southern girls working in bars and maybe they go elsewhere like Pattaya to work but in 25 years I have met only a handful of southern girls working in bars nationwide. Most find a guy quick, marry and disappear. I still see girls from Isarn in Patong I know have been there for 10 years or more. One Katoey more than 20 years. I am one of the few farang guys I know who actually has Thai male mates who I spend time with.

I'm not talking about people you employ or know through business or at bars etc, but just mates you hang out with. I hang out with mainly southerners however. He may be wrong but i had a bit of a look around Patong and he is pretty spot on I feel.........

[logbags]

If you want to have a good shock, have a look at the notice boards in some of the condo complexes. Last month, I was visiting my friend and they had the list of condo fee arrears up and I had a good look. Alot of the farang investors that held multiple units owed big fees. There was an Italian fellow that owed3million on about 7 units, and I was thinking, someone must have been hit hard this past summer. Interesting thing though, I was in that place yesterday and the list is down. I wonder if someone ripped it off the cork board.

This is what I have always suspected. People wanting a place, getting a bit greedy, buying 3 thinking they'll flog 2 and the profits will cover the cost of theirs. See the market has not been tested in any meaningful way has it? The new places have for sure been bought but can they be resold? I try not to be a doomsayer but the condo market in particular looks grim.......

I just saw the news here. Man, violence is running rampant, stabbings are like out of control, guy just got stabbed to death with a screwdriver to the head. Looks like a Sudanese attacker. We have a serious problem here with gangs, stabbings, drugs and general carnage. Thailand does have it's good points na.....

[sweetmusic]

Isn't everywhere getting expensive, guess it's an age thing.

Agree on the issues with violence though, that is the biggest longterm threat to tourism in my opinion, they need to get after the guns NOW.

[phuketrichard]

Ok, my $05 worth.

I lived in Phuket from '84-2008 and just left this past June for Cambodia. Had a house in Kamala for 6 1/2 years which i sold in March at a great price for both of us. Yea, I knew Brian from before he moved to Phuket and was one of the few that really knew him and DID not invest with him.

I love Phuket and expecially Kamala. Great people and great food all year round. Good surf in the low season and great small resturants in the high season on the beach where you can get a good meal for less than $3. A few bars/ few girls and good local and Farang mix.

Patong is NOT phuket and Millionairs row is not Kamala. I admit that pirces are way out of wack there but you dont have to buy/ RENT!!!

Here in Cambodia except for Beer/ladies and cigs just about everything is more expensive and the food is not nearly as good.

Guys stop crying if your there its still a great place BUT not Patong for sure.

I will be heading back in March. :-)

[pothai]

***** Total rental for the 2 offices 28,000 Baht and payroll is approximately 200,000 including the foreign sales staff. Assets included are 4 websites, all furniture and fittings for both offices, prepaid key money, and 3 vehicles, as well as all goodwill and tradenames. Highly profitable with 25 Million Baht in revenues for both 2007 and 2008, with net profits of approximately 15 million baht after payment of all expenses. This business will sell fast.*****

As above real estate agency for sale....maybe they know something......couldnt quite work out the maths though.....25mil revenue for 2 years...yet 15 mil profit....they must be taking at least 35% commission.....

...its a bargain

[phuketrichard]

Bullshit.... Real estate agency charge MAX 6%

[pothai]

Bullshit.... Real estate agency charge MAX 6%

Exactly......bet some unsuspecting idiot will buy it thogh.....

[logbags]

I lived in Phuket from '84-2008 and just left this past June for Cambodia. Had a house in Kamala for 6 1/2 years which i sold in March at a great price for both of us. Yea, I knew Brian from before he moved to Phuket and was one of the few that really knew him and DID not invest with him.

## I wonder what happened to him, a previous post said he was also in Cambodia. He started out as a reasonable guy but there was a bit of Thaksin in him and I saw this almost immediately and never ever fully embraced him as a friend. I was a few years younger than him so I guess he would be about 50 now.

He is still a young man compared with a lot of the people in Phuket these days.

I love Phuket and expecially Kamala. Great people and great food all year round. Good surf in the low season and great small resturants in the high season on the beach where you can get a good meal for less than $3. A few bars/ few girls and good local and Farang mix.

## Yes that is still there, I was passing there everynight ever in December it was very quiet. Just a few bars and restaurants. That huge development on the mountain is ugly and a new place called Kamala falls over facing the Patong side are both terrible eyesores.

Patong is NOT phuket and Millionairs row is not Kamala. I admit that pirces are way out of wack there but you dont have to buy/ RENT!!!

## That is my theory, rent and rent cheaply. If people flat out refuse to pay the high prices things must change. If people offer me something at a stupid price they just don't even get a chance to make a second offer. I don't care if it is a tuk tuk or a house. Besides, if people don't buy, maybe, just maybe they will change the laws to offer the foreign buyer some protection of his asset. The market is going to be hit hard, the top end usually gets hit the hardest. Here in Australia my friend who is an expert in these matters told me just last night the top end here in Oz is going to be hit real hard but the lower end will be ok simple because people must always have somewhere to live. The places that have been ramped and over priced must drop back to reality. He told me of a guy who paid 1.6 for a country property just a few years ago. He had to take 860,000 for it at auction recently. This he said will be normal but houses say 200 to 350 will lose less simply because the demand will be in that price range. Besides, if you do have a bit of cash, the interest will pay for a decent rental without all the hassles. If you have any problems you just move. There is this perception I sense at times where people think it is Thai versus farang but the Thais themselves suffer far more from exploitation than any farang does. We get treated very very well in general and Thais are very friendly compared to so many other countries.

Here in Cambodia except for Beer/ladies and cigs just about everything is more expensive and the food is not nearly as good.

## That is quite interesting to hear as I have never been to Cambodia and had the perception it is much cheaper all round. I for one would love to hear some more about this. For example why did you up and move after so long in Phuket and the what is the general state of Cambodia as a place to visit etc. What are the expensive things compared to Thailand, I want ot go to Angkor oneday soon.

Guys stop crying if your there its still a great place BUT not Patong for sure.

## Well for me I complain about the same things here in Oz as I do in Phuket, I love Phuket, I have spent half my adult life there since I was 21 so have a deep affection for the place. I just get filthy on these "blue sky, shit talking, greedy, parasitical" real estate salesman types. I hate them here I hate them in Phuket. I have no affection for bullshitting "middle man" types.

I will be heading back in March. :-)

## Well I won't be going back until our dollar gets better and I know a few who are thinking the same thing. That might take a while unless steps are taken to make the baht more attractive. I think a devaluation would help allround as Thailand has extensive exports and is dependant on tourism. Thailand is cheap but when your currency loses 30% against the baht staying at home becomes more attractive.

Thais are not stupid, they want farangs spending but intelligent Thais know it is all about value for baht and offer it accordingly. I remember talking to the manager of a hotel in Nakhon Sri Thammarart. They had this crappy internet connection in the lobby that never worked. I said to her, why don't you get wi-fi. Every farang wants wi-fi or some internet access to communicate with people and the cost of it is peanuts as you can make money off food and drinks while people are using it and it will be a huge attraction for farangs to come stay here. I was pleasantly surprised to see they put it in straight away after that and people were indeed flocking to the lobby or restaurant to use it........

[LivinLOS]

***** Total rental for the 2 offices 28,000 Baht and payroll is approximately 200,000 including the foreign sales staff. Assets included are 4 websites, all furniture and fittings for both offices, prepaid key money, and 3 vehicles, as well as all goodwill and tradenames. Highly profitable with 25 Million Baht in revenues for both 2007 and 2008, with net profits of approximately 15 million baht after payment of all expenses. This business will sell fast.*****

As above real estate agency for sale....maybe they know something......couldnt quite work out the maths though.....25mil revenue for 2 years...yet 15 mil profit....they must be taking at least 35% commission.....

...its a bargain

Probably means revenue not including the house sale..

Eg they grossed 25 and had costs of 10 for a net of 15..

Seems obvious.. Am I missing something ??

[geriatrickid]

Has anyone noticed how the condo developers are all over jungceylon , pushing their projects? The absolute project sticks out, if only because it looks nice on display. How could anyone consider buying those units when there is such a glut on the market?

Last month, most of the condo displays were at the doors facing the beergarden and now they are right out to the front entrance.

More staffing too of the displays, not that anyone can answer your question. I asked about services like water and electricity. I was told to come see and talk to manager . Umm no.

[Alasau]

I do not really have much experience of having lived here... however recently I was surprised to see foreigners (middle aged men) trying to sell property in Central Festival. So far, in these years I came here I only ever saw Thai's (mostly female) doing this kind of front work. I always believed that the property business was in the hands of Thai's.

It may make sense since language is key to selling... Maybe those foreigners were only been seen when actually visiting such a location in the past.

Who are all these investors and companies destroying those hills from Karon down to Kamala? Is this primarily a Thai business or not?

[MyphuketLife]

And the incredible thing is that Thai owners are actually INCREASING rents to make up for rental income losses.

Thats the thing I don't get, as things get worse allot of Thai's try to increase the prices.... As if the people that stayed must be able to pay more....

[steelepulse]

>>And the incredible thing is that Thai owners are actually INCREASING rents to make up for rental income losses.

Simple Explanation really, thai business 101.  As the supply of buyers goes down, the price goes up

[fiddlehead]

This has been a very interesting thread.

Obviously, real estate people are getting more and more desperate.

They should do what my best friend and one of the best real estate agents from our county back in the states did: He got a job working in a jewelry store for the holidays because he has no buyers, only sellers in the real estate game. (we all still have bills to pay)

Better look for alternatives as it's not going to get better anytime soon.

Also, a thing that I would like to bring out, the home insurance game is getting crazy too. My home back in the states is now worth aprox 20-30% less than it was a year or two ago. Guess what? My insurance premiums just went up 75%! Go figure.

It's a crazy world. How long will it take before new/empty rentals will outnumber existing/filled rentals on the island? Or have we reached that point already?

[MyphuketLife]

>>And the incredible thing is that Thai owners are actually INCREASING rents to make up for rental income losses.

Simple Explanation really, thai business 101. As the supply of buyers goes down, the price goes up

But that just increases the problem, as prices go up less buyers, so you increase the price, even less buyers and so on... to bring buyers back you have to decrease the pricing, as more buyers come back, you start increasing the price.....