Is Thailand Getting Too Expensive?

[BigWheelMan]

Anyone can try and justify that Thailand is not expensive, if we don`t spend.

But it all boils down to quality of lifestyle.

As I quoted previously, the cost of living gap between the West and Thailand is closing. One poster mentioned that food and sex is cheap in Thailand, I would argue that point, not anymore it isn`t, a long with other things such as electrical goods, social, satelite TV, quality clothing, alcoholic drinks, cars and I could go on and on.

[mommysboy]

Anyone can try and justify that Thailand is not expensive, if we don`t spend.

But it all boils down to quality of lifestyle.

As I quoted previously, the cost of living gap between the West and Thailand is closing. One poster mentioned that food and sex is cheap in Thailand, I would argue that point, not anymore it isn`t, a long with other things such as electrical goods, social, satelite TV, quality clothing, alcoholic drinks, cars and I could go on and on.

Thailand is still good even great vlaue for the more superfluous things in life as well as housing of course. But the gap is narrowing with the west, and yes now more expensive for some electronics for instance. I'd also argue that things like healthcare end up being much more expensive for the average guy, from UK at least. Thailand's good hile the going is good! Beware.

BUT, it is getting expensive relative to Cambodia as far as I can tell, and I reckon you'll see quite an exodus, not that anyone is bothered mind - big mistake in my view.

[Heng]

The gap will of course continue to close for those who for some reason decided: "yeah, I think I'll just permanently park my income level right here."

[Pattayatony]

The last year has changed many tings for many people living in Thailand. One and maybe a key element for foreigners are our value for money. The THB is strong towards many currencies, the pund is one currency that has taken a dip over the last year. The currency I represent is the Norwegian Kroner and like the pund it has fallen dramaticlly over the last year.

Yesterday I had a meal at The Bakery near Tepprasit rd down towards Jomtien. The price used to be 105 baht for an english breakfast but is now sold at 148 baht. A quick calculation gives>

Summer 08 105 baht was 1.50 punds January 09 148 baht is 2.96 punds [/size] That is a staggering 97% increase in price for the same meal if you buy you THB using punds.

I will not be back for a while when I pay London prices for a breakfast in Jomtien!

My Answer is YES Thailand is very very Expensive now....

[Ulysses G.]

Cars and electronic goods have always been more expensive here, so they should not really count. Farang food was cheaper, but it used to be so terrible that am not sure that counts either. Foreign food is often pretty decent now, but, of course, it has also increased in price.

If you suppliment your diet with a lot of Thai food from food carts and noodle shops and are willing to live in a comfortable room with bath instead of an expensive Western style apartment, Thailand is still the deal of the century!

Edited March 16, 2010 by Ulysses G.

[balo]

First of all, apologies for not reading all posts before contributing with something that might be old news, but:

I find Thailand refreshingly cheap as long as you live a cheap life. By cheap I mean eat street food and wear non brand clothes (copies and that <deleted>). It is when you want to by any imported western product you end up at the other end of the scale. A nice Italian suite is twice as expensive as in London, you can get a nice bottle of wine from any Tesco's in UK for under 10 pounds. The same bottle in Thailand will cost you FIFTY! Cars can be three to four times as expensive. The list goes on and on. Healthcare? Anyone of you wondered what would happen if you get critically ill and had to spend, let's say 2 years to recover from cancer? It's gonna cost you, believe me.

It is possible to live cheap in this place, but try to maintain the same standard as you did in Europe and you'll get ruined, eventually and inevitably.

You must be kidding right ?

I can eat in a gourmet restaurant in Bangkok and pay 5 times lower price than in London.

Or cheaper asian restaurants with great food for 100 baht.

I can watch movies in cinemas , about 50% cheaper than Europe.

I can buy a car or a house without thinking about the high taxes.

Yes if you want western food and other items you have to pay for the imported ones and the prices are the same or higher.

But look at the total package , you can live like a king compared to Europe.

[neverdie]

Cars and electronic goods have always been more expensive here, so they should not really count. Farang food was cheaper, but it used to be so terrible that am not sure that counts either. Foreign food is often pretty decent now, but, of course, it has also increased in price.

If you suppliment your diet with a lot of Thai food from food carts and noodle shops and are willing to live in a comfortable room with bath instaed of an expensive Western style apartment, Thailand is still the deal of the century!

UG, I agree with almost everything you have said. I just wanted to point out that certain electronic goods are still cheap here in Thailand. Things like rice cookers and ladies hair straightners (of course i hear you saying) but also things like Small refridgerators and washing machines. I cannot buy a decent brand of washing machine such as a Hitachi in Australia for 10,000thb ($340)....it just wont happen, im not saying you cant get a cheap arsed job for that price, but im talking something decent.

Referring to plasma TV's and all that electronic high end stuff, seems to be a bit dearer here than in Oz. Sorry I have to refer to Oz because Ive only been to Taiwan, Singapore and Australia in recent times.

[Ulysses G.]

As per usual, you are right!

[neverdie]

^Crikey, I've been twice right now and you call that, as per usual.

Its something Ive wondered about before though, the goods that you find in just about every second thai 'room' seem to be dead cheap, I mean reasonable sized little fridges for 4000 baht but the big Euro styled flashy Stainless steel job or one with external auto ice makers and automatic hands that adjust your balls are really quite expensive. This may be a case of them selling the stuff needed by the average thai with little or no margins & tacking a bit onto the higher end stuff to make up for it.

Anyway, its not important to me because @ neverdie home we are still using foam eskies and ice

[blue eyes]

Livin in Thailand 2009 price wise,

The home that I have in the US cost about 250kUS.The same house or close to it in Thailand cost me 70kUS.Seems to be cheaper in Thailand.Oh same quality also. The food that many people call "street food".Well that is the food that our family makes in the US and Thailand.But it is cheaper to eat on the street then to make it in Thailand.Saves us time to buy the stuff and cook ourself and cheaper. To go to the doctor or dentist is 2/3 the price that we would pay in the US without insurance.Oh same quality or better. Same with the meds we may need. If we wish to travel by public transportation.A heck of alot cheaper in Thailand then US.Well sometimes not the same quality though. The clothes that we buy,much cheaper in Thailand!We are not the buy Guchi kind of people anyway.Hey, is not most of the clothes that people buy in the US made in Thailand,India,Bangladesh,Vietnam,Hati,or many other countries other then the US.So the markup of the clothes is pure profite to the big corporations and not to the little guy that made the cloths?Another one for liveing in Thailand.The frige,washer and dryer,about 3.5kUS in the US, 850US in Thailand.Little less quaility but serves our needs. Water,electric A heck of alot CHEAPER.Just depends on the family and the weather.You know the hotter it is the more baths to take.Some times you take 5 a day. But then again the rain water out of the cistern is free.The AC does cost though. The stove in the US 1kUS, in Thailand a really good one cost us 150US.Yeah lovin it! The new computer the same as the US.To go to the 7-11 or some place like that,bottle of water in US about 1.5US in Thailand .30US.And most other things the same difference.

Now to the other side.My car. In the US my Honda civic cost me about 18kUS,in Thailand it would cost me about 20kUS at the exchange at 32thb to the dollar.No I did not buy it in Thailand,Public transport suites us just fine for now.The plasma TV about 1kUS in the US same one at the mall in Korat 2.5kUS OUCH!!!!

I guess what I would like to say is that the cost to live anywhere really is dependent on the people and what they spend on to begin with from where they come from and how they already live their lives.For us it is overall half of what it would cost in the US to live,on an average.Some things cost more but most things that we live by cost much less.But that is us,and I am sure many more.

If you wish to live a "western" life like you lived in "western" town with all the bells and wistles like you were still working and pulling in the big bucks ,No you can not do that here.But then again you could not do that anywere.

Side note here,the reason for the money in US dollars is because it looks like the people looking at the post are thinking in western money and not Thai baht. 32THB to the dollar

[Forethat]

First of all, apologies for not reading all posts before contributing with something that might be old news, but:

I find Thailand refreshingly cheap as long as you live a cheap life. By cheap I mean eat street food and wear non brand clothes (copies and that <deleted>). It is when you want to by any imported western product you end up at the other end of the scale. A nice Italian suite is twice as expensive as in London, you can get a nice bottle of wine from any Tesco's in UK for under 10 pounds. The same bottle in Thailand will cost you FIFTY! Cars can be three to four times as expensive. The list goes on and on. Healthcare? Anyone of you wondered what would happen if you get critically ill and had to spend, let's say 2 years to recover from cancer? It's gonna cost you, believe me.

It is possible to live cheap in this place, but try to maintain the same standard as you did in Europe and you'll get ruined, eventually and inevitably.

You must be kidding right ?

I can eat in a gourmet restaurant in Bangkok and pay 5 times lower price than in London.

Or cheaper asian restaurants with great food for 100 baht.

I can watch movies in cinemas , about 50% cheaper than Europe.

I can buy a car or a house without thinking about the high taxes.

Yes if you want western food and other items you have to pay for the imported ones and the prices are the same or higher.

But look at the total package , you can live like a king compared to Europe.

Can you tell me where I can find these cheap gourmet restaurants?

May you be so kind and tell me what the difference in price between a BMW 535i in Thailand and UK. AND, what is the reason for the difference you claim doesn't even exist?

You claim that "Yes if you want western food and other items you have to pay for the imported ones and the prices are the same or higher", but that was exactly my point, wasn't it

I'm not complaining, I'm just highlighting the fact that on a direct comparison, LOS is more expensive. The only reason Thailand ends up being the cheaper of the two, is that you make adjustments to the comparison, exactly the way you're doing in your arguments.

Another interesting factor is the difficulties to get finance. Often you are required to make a larger down payment than you would do in your home country, obstructing your personal economy. This in itself doesn't make things more expensive, but it's a nuisance.

Needless to say, I have made the adjustments myself. As a result, I can live like a king, but an adjustment I did. For instance, I opted for a Japanese car rather than a German prestige ride. I stay away from expensive restaurants (and to be perfectly honest, I often end up disappointed when I go there anyway). I don't buy a bottle of Champagne every Friday anymore. I don't buy Italian suits or electronic in Thailand, I wait until a business trip takes me to a country where they are cheaper.

For me, the biggest damage is related to golf. The difference in that area is astronomic, I simply can't afford a membership in BKK.

I thought this was a debate regarding prices and if they have increased, not a TOP 10 list for how to live cheap in Thailand, or if it is even possible; I am confident we all agree that if that is what you seek, you certainly came the right place.

Edited March 16, 2010 by Forethat

[Gary A]

I am retired and have gotten incredibly lazy. I never liked cutting weeds, yard work, painting or general fix it up work. I can hire local people and pay them a decent wage. That wage is 300 baht per day. How much would you pay a local handyman in your country?

The local fresh market vegetables are normally MUCH cheaper than in my home country. Cigarettes are going up in price but not insanely like in most western countries. I spend about half of my pension and live exactly as I choose. Sometime back, I had a flat tire. It cost me 35 baht to have it repaired.

My wife is a great cook and I have no need, nor do I look for expensive imported food. My blood pressure has dropped considerably and even my pulse rate has gone down. I attribute that to my diet and a relaxed no pressure life style.

[Ulysses G.]

I could care less about expensive cars or champagne and I am perfectly happy living in a clean comfortable room with aircon and a bath.

I love cheap massages and am pretty happy with a lot of the foreign restaurants - although to find good ones takes some looking. Thai veggie food or street food is cheap, healthy and filling and clothing is cheap if you don't need designer names and know where to look.

It can be expensive, medium priced or dirt cheap here. It depends on what floats your boat and how willing you are to adapt to your surroundings. The good thing is that in Thailand you have a choice. Back home is expensive no matter what you do.

[neverdie]

I am retired and have gotten incredibly lazy. I never liked cutting weeds, yard work, painting or general fix it up work. I can hire local people and pay them a decent wage. That wage is 300 baht per day. How much would you pay a local handyman in your country?

Gary, you are paying too much....300 baht a day, crikey. The acutal local wage, depending on exact location is alot closer to 200 baht per day (208-220).

[Gary A]

I am retired and have gotten incredibly lazy. I never liked cutting weeds, yard work, painting or general fix it up work. I can hire local people and pay them a decent wage. That wage is 300 baht per day. How much would you pay a local handyman in your country?

Gary, you are paying too much....300 baht a day, crikey. The acutal local wage, depending on exact location is alot closer to 200 baht per day (208-220).

That's what my wife tells me. She is a really cheap Charlotte. I gave a Thai electrician 500 baht to string wire through our spider web infested and VERY hot attic. I was told that it was WAY too much. I told her that I wouldn't crawl up there for 500 baht. He worked for a day and a half.

She recently hired a guy to plow up about a rai of ground. He took out several small trees and the weeds were head high. I have a tractor but I didn't want to use mine. She gave him two big bottles of beer, a bottle of Red Bull and a hundred baht. I told her to give the guy another 200 baht but she refused. I doubt the hundred baht paid for his fuel.

I found a couple of guys to build a concrete water tank for me, a big one. They came to take a look and after they talked to my wife, they never came back.

[Naam]

I'm not complaining, I'm just highlighting the fact that on a direct comparison, LOS is more expensive. The only reason Thailand ends up being the cheaper of the two, is that you make adjustments to the comparison, exactly the way you're doing in your arguments.

Often you are required to make a larger down payment than you would do in your home country, obstructing your personal economy.

that's the claim of the usual suspects who seem to have found a way not to pay any taxes in their home countries or their income is below any tax bracket. if i lived in my home country Germany being only "semi-honest" to the taxman as far as my offshore income is concerned i'd pay 80,000 EURos income tax per annum. that's cool 3.5 million Baht which is more than my total expenses in Thailand although my lifestyle is compared to living in Europe extremely luxurious. and NO, i am not making any adjustments to the downside, au contraire!

and now please tell me again something about the fancy italian suites you wear when driving your BMW for which is was easy to obtain a large down payment which did not obstruct your personal economy

[Forethat]

I'm not complaining, I'm just highlighting the fact that on a direct comparison, LOS is more expensive. The only reason Thailand ends up being the cheaper of the two, is that you make adjustments to the comparison, exactly the way you're doing in your arguments.

Often you are required to make a larger down payment than you would do in your home country, obstructing your personal economy.

that's the claim of the usual suspects who seem to have found a way not to pay any taxes in their home countries or their income is below any tax bracket. if i lived in my home country Germany being only "semi-honest" to the taxman as far as my offshore income is concerned i'd pay 80,000 EURos income tax per annum. that's cool 3.5 million Baht which is more than my total expenses in Thailand although my lifestyle is compared to living in Europe extremely luxurious. and NO, i am not making any adjustments to the downside, au contraire!

and now please tell me again something about the fancy italian suites you wear when driving your BMW for which is was easy to obtain a large down payment which did not obstruct your personal economy

You obviously have no urge do discuss this other than being plain rude so ok, Thailand is cheap. I was stupid.

Edited March 16, 2010 by Forethat

[Naam]

it's happens quite often when somebody states hard facts and the counterpart is cornered. he withdraws leaving some totally irrelevant comments like shouting "rude" even though his own comments were quoted.

[Forethat]

it's happens quite often when somebody states hard facts and the counterpart is cornered. he withdraws leaving some totally irrelevant comments like shouting "rude" even though his own comments were quoted.

Can you give me ONE example of any "hard facts" that you have contributed with?

[Forethat]

Come on now, tough guy, give me ONE example of your so called "hard facts"!!!

[neverdie]

Come on now, tough guy, give me ONE example of your so called "hard facts"!!!

Ohh, sorry, You must be talking to me, you mentioned 'tough guy'. I use to crack heads for a living.......you couldnt possibly be talking about Naam, our resident accountant and financial wizzard, his legs often bend in the wind .

[Forethat]

Come on now, tough guy, give me ONE example of your so called "hard facts"!!!

Ohh, sorry, You must be talking to me, you mentioned 'tough guy'. I use to crack heads for a living.......you couldnt possibly be talking about Naam, our resident accountant and financial wizzard, his legs often bend in the wind .

Well, I'm sure he's a knowledgeable guy. I just wish he had provided some "hard facts".

I bet a couple of beers he'll come up with some now that someone pointed out that he actually didn't provide any. You'll see!

Edited March 16, 2010 by Forethat

[Forethat]

With regards to a BMW, the difference in price between a BMW 523i in Thailand and UK is 255,4%. I couldn’t make the comparison on a 535i since that model isn’t even sold in Thailand. As I previously said, you don’t HAVE to buy it, but if you want to drive the same car in Thailand as you did in your home country you WILL have to pay MUCH more. End of discussion.

With regards to opting for buying a car on finance vs. pay cash in full, it doesn’t require especially high level of education to figure out that anyone with excess cash who can earn a return above the finance rate probably will do better buying the car on finance. The lower the down payment, the better for your wallet. With the current interest rates and the ability to invest at 8-10% in mind, I sure as hel_l would want to increase my capital rather than spend it on a down payment that doesn’t increase any wealth. For those who agree, it WILL obstruct your wallet if you don’t have a choice as to the size of down payment. In your home country you probably have that choice. Here you don’t, making the current requirement an expensive one. Frankly, this is third grade math.

Every time I point this out I receive the argument that “it’s not more expensive, you can go for a cheaper option”, but then you would have made an adjustment to the conditions that makes up the comparison, thus obscuring the result.

I am confident there’s a wise man out there somewhere who would have the energy to enlighten everybody involved why it is not appropriate to compensate non-constant sources of conditions to reach an unverified solution. Personally, I’m getting tired trying to. But the most important thing appears to be personal success, and I’m sure you will continue to enlighten us about yours.

There’s some hard facts for you.

[Naam]

Come on now, tough guy, give me ONE example of your so called "hard facts"!!!

the main hard fact is that as a retired foreigner you don't pay income tax in Thailand if your income is offshore. that's something that those who are in favour living somewhere in Europe or a highly developed country always conveniently forget or forget to mention. i could list an additional dozen facts and allthough they are all irrelevant and not applicable to those who don't pay taxes in their home country i will list them albeit based on my personal perspectives and situation. i am well aware that my situation does not apply to all foreign residents in Thailand but it is very useful to prove that generalisations like "Thailand is expensive" are absurd.

[Forethat]

Come on now, tough guy, give me ONE example of your so called "hard facts"!!!

the main hard fact is that as a retired foreigner you don't pay income tax in Thailand if your income is offshore. that's something that those who are in favour living somewhere in Europe or a highly developed country always conveniently forget or forget to mention. i could list an additional dozen facts and allthough they are all irrelevant and not applicable to those who don't pay taxes in their home country i will list them albeit based on my personal perspectives and situation. i am well aware that my situation does not apply to all foreign residents in Thailand but it is very useful to prove that generalisations like "Thailand is expensive" are absurd.

Thank you.

Now, can you please tell me how to what extent this has an effect on the comparison between the price on an Italian suit in Europe and Thailand OR a BMW for that matter?

Edited March 16, 2010 by Forethat

[Abrak]

Thank you.

Now, can you please tell me how to what extent this has an effect on the comparison between the price on an Italian suit in Europe and Thailand OR a BMW for that matter?

Surely it would be a lot simpler for you to go and buy a calculator?

[Naam]

Now, can you please tell me how to what extent this has an effect on the comparison between the price on an Italian suit in Europe and Thailand OR a BMW for that matter?

we Klingons like sarcasm and we wear battle dresses, not italian suits but let us compare some prices Thailand vs. Europe.

-my house in Thailand which i built 5 years ago for about USD 600,000 would cost me ~€ 2.5 million anywhere in (south or western) Europe, near a beach.

-my trilingual cook/maid and the bilingual gardener/handyman draw each THB 8,000 per month. two full time employees imported from Eastern Europe ( not speaking any language my wife or me could understand) would cost me each (ten times) ~€ 1,800 per month including social and health insurance not considered vacations and flight or train rides home once a year.

-my wife's driver earns THB 8,000 per month. Europe wins hands down because she would drive her own car again, unlike Thailand where i don't allow her to drive on the wrong side of the road amongst thousands of brain-amputed traffic participants.

-the tax situation i mentioned already but you countered with the BMW. in this respect i admit that i miss my Calloway Corvette and my AMG 500 badly.

-utility prices in my home country are a multiple of those in thailand. for electricity i pay in Thailand 3.8 Baht per kWh, in Germany it's 29 c€nts = >13 Baht, water is the least in my Vaterland, "only" € 1.85 a cubic metre but they hit me with a sewage fee of € 4.55 for each cubic metre i draw even if the water is used for irrigation. best of all is garbage collection (to be sorted in 5 different containers) for which i'd pay more than the common cost i pay in a gated community in Thailand. a year before i sold my house in Germany i was hit (like all homeowners) with 3,000 EURos for a new sewage processing plant above the normal property tax. add heating cost and utilities are approximately five times what they are in Thailand. i posted a comparison only a day or two ago which can be found

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/People-Live-...43#entry3415643

-if i exceed the speed limit of 30kmh in a residential area by 16 kmh my driver's license is gone for three months, i pay a fine of 150-200 EURos and 3 points are entered in a central register. if i exceed the speed limit 5 times in a period of 3 years my license is gone for one year.

let's keep on arguing. the markets are dull and nothing much happens on the currencies front.

[Forethat]

Thank you.

Now, can you please tell me how to what extent this has an effect on the comparison between the price on an Italian suit in Europe and Thailand OR a BMW for that matter?

Surely it would be a lot simpler for you to go and buy a calculator?

As if one wasn't enough, here comes the next treasury secretary...

Now, Abrak, why would I need a calculator to realise that the price of a BMW in Thailand is exactly the same, regardless of the amount of tax you pay OR your level of financial ability? Or maybe we're arguing this beacuse you have an skewed understanding of the word "expensive". In your opinion a BMW at the price of 3,9 million THB (which is the correct price) is CHEAP for someone who earns a lot of money. If you want to claim that, I will not argue, but now we're comparing countries (in my case UK), aren't we!?

So the correct definition is that a BMW is filthy expensive in Thailand compared to UK. With or without calculator.

I certainly hope you're all pulling my leg, that this is a well executed hoax.

Or...ok ok, this is the candide camera, I get it now... LOL good one!!! For a while you all had me there!

[Abrak]

let's keep on arguing. the markets are dull and nothing much happens on the currencies front.

Ok well how about your incredibly dodgy statement that a Bt3.2m tax saving covered all your annual living expenses without you having to make any sacrifices. Au contraire.

Either that is untrue or it is based on some dodgy accounting like 'as I own my home and my cars they actually cost me nothing.'

[Naam]

Thank you.

Now, can you please tell me how to what extent this has an effect on the comparison between the price on an Italian suit in Europe and Thailand OR a BMW for that matter?

Surely it would be a lot simpler for you to go and buy a calculator?

As if one wasn't enough, here comes the next treasury secretary...

no dilly-dallying allowed, let's continue comparing prices:

-cost of curing sick buffalo in Europe vs. Thailand. from my perspective Europe wins but one might object and argue "if there were sick buffaloes in Europe...