I Will Return To Post Of Prime Minister: Thaksin

[ham]

Thaksin should shut his big mouth and let Thailand heal itself. While he keeps making these nonsense calls, he is only making things worse. What a horribly selfish man.

....could not agree more.

horrible selfish greedy man...who exploits and cheats his people.

if only the red shirts could see they are just being used....

and the yellow shirts aren't??

A faint parallel was Northern Ireland: Too many Catholics, Too many Protestants, Not enough Christians.

Some points in this forum are too extremist and vindictive. Think a middle way.

and here it fit with: "not enough walking on Gautama's path"

[JoeThePoster]

I understand there are some echelons in which he has cultivated good relations that could be fruitful in 5-10 years.

You may be very spot-on there. A request for pardon followed by a quick homecoming and a nominal period of monkhood - voila, he's as good as new.

Edited February 3, 2009 by JoeThePoster

[khunchin]

So in Thailand we allow convicted criminals to govern the country then ?

Are you referring to the current goverment?

[Samuian]

I am not an expert in all this kind of political stuff. But all I know is that many people from my neighborhood, and surrounding neighborhoods, support Thaksin. The teenagers now get brainwashed by their parents and they speak without having a real view of the things that happen in their country. That's something really sad to see. But the workers, the "low class" hard workers that work at schools, or that have their onw little shops and dont own any company or are not rich, think that Thaksin was someone who helped the poor people, and besides of having his problems, like any politician, he did good things for the country and for them. As a foreigner I cannot give my opinion, I was not here when everything happened. But I can say what I hear from Thai people, and so far, the only things I've heard from him (again, besides the problems and stuff that every person in the goverment have) were good.

This people, especially the "redshirt fraction", the Taxinista camp, claim!

I haven't met ONE yet, except taxi drivers in Bkk from rural isaan, they have been brainwashed by radio, what else do they do whilst riding the cab - they are MADE to believe that he did "much good" and was "the best the country has ever seen" - all just marketing heaps and heaps of PR - none of it holds the water!

The "populist policies" he claims the democrat led government is "copying", he has adopted himself and simply revived them but just to be the "Honey bunny" NOT tot genuinely help the poor, he needed them so much to vote for and applaud him, which some of the poor fellas still do, maybe because direct profiteering from handouts... the PR Machine is still roaring!

He doesn't care, he "activated" them, with promises and bright smiles, yes and his "field tours", but he would, if he could have stayed home!

See his phone-in's!

If he would become silent for several month, nobody would ever mention "TaxSin"!

Edited February 3, 2009 by Samuian

[dinthailand]

He is absorbing and charismatic and thoroughly entertaining. I miss, and still enjoy hearing about and from Thaksin. However, I rue the day he ever comes back to Thailand. Not one man is worth the trouble we have all gone through for. As someone mentioned he is the most divisive polititian this country has seen at at this time we don't need that, or him. He is a criminal, let him make his little rambling phone calls from abroad, we can discuss and disect and get all riled up, but after we leave this forum we will return to our busy lives and slowly forget about him. I hope.

"trouble we have all gone through"

the germans backed down from stopping hitler; ditto, italy, mussolini.

did the french back or back down when they wanted greater democracy

[misterman21]

every taxi driver, shopkeeper, massage therapist and all other people I talk in bangkok would like to see taksin's come back - so he is better than the other lot

So nobody with any political knowledge or understanding then

[dinthailand]

A self-made millionaire. He won two elections comfortably. It took a military coup to get rid of him. An anti-establishment maverick.

Nearly three years to come up with a hatful of charges, which whilst not trivial, ....were not exactly the unveiling of a secret Holocaust.

He and his party pursued by a judiciary for whom stamping the conviction sheet appeared to be a pre-ordained conclusion.

Of course people are still interested in him. He'll be front page news in Thailand till the day they put him in the ground !

<edit: cremate him >

Exactly. you make the point without invective, without flaming, and by sticking to facts.

a model for other posters - of both persuasions?? i hope so

[dinthailand]

He could have been mother Theresa, but he is still a convicted criminal. And he wasn't mother Theresa. Doesn't matter what your wife or friends think of him. He is a criminal. The man deserves to be in jail.

He also is not Barack Obama, Joan of Arc, Mandela, me, you, or the guy that delivers then water each week

Do you have something constructive and relevant to, add to this forum?

What does this poster maen?

[hammered]

He could have been mother Theresa, but he is still a convicted criminal. And he wasn't mother Theresa. Doesn't matter what your wife or friends think of him. He is a criminal. The man deserves to be in jail.

He also is not Barack Obama, Joan of Arc, Mandela, me, you, or the guy that delivers then water each week

Do you have something constructive and relevant to, add to this forum?

What does this poster maen?

Edited to add content! : I think it was another poster who made a point without flaming. The simple point of this poster seems to be a criminal is a criminal and cannot be excused. A pure black and white statement or that is how I read it. It is not necessarily my opinion, but it there and a valid opinion, and surely deserves the praise that was given to another poster for making a point without flaming.

Edited February 3, 2009 by hammered

[sriracha john]

Wear a helmet after you sneak back in, Thakky...

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ousted Thai PM Thaksin vows comeback: reports

BANGKOK (AFP / 1 hour ago) — Thailand's exiled former premier Thaksin Shinawatra has pledged to fight to clear his name and said he is ready to the lead the country again after his 2006 ouster, Thai media said Tuesday.

Convicted of corruption in absentia last year and still facing a raft of other charges, Thaksin reportedly spoke Monday to supporters by phone. "I want to tell you now that I am ready to return to the political arena once again," the Bangkok Post quoted him saying from an undisclosed location abroad.

"I will fight on no matter what happens. I'm ready to be prime minister again if people support me," he said. "If people voice their call that they want me, I will come back to carry out my duty."

Despite being toppled in a coup more than two years ago, the billionaire former businessman remains an influential but divisive figure in Thai politics -- and one who has cast a long shadow over every subsequent government.

Deputy Prime Minister Suthep Thaugsuban accused Thaksin of trying to stoke tensions in the kingdom with his latest comments. "It's normal for Thaksin to provoke people," he said, warning of movements afoot "to overthrow this government and try to create chaos."

Suthep said the government found the situation "very difficult", adding that Thaksin will be dealt with under Thai law and must serve his prison term.

Thaksin's supporters -- known as the "Red Shirts" because of their clothing -- held a massive rally in Bangkok's historic district on Saturday, and have vowed to return later this month unless the government dissolves parliament. Pormpong Noparit, spokesman for the party which organised Monday's phone-in, confirmed the comments made by Thaksin, told AFP that his remarks had been intended to boost the morale of his political allies.

"He said he's ready to come back. He cannot come back openly, but he wants to slip into the northeast so he can die in his homeland," Pormpong said.

Thaksin has spent most of his time in self-imposed exile and was last October sentenced to two years in prison for abuse of power linked to a 2003 land deal. Other corruption cases against him are moving through the courts.

[sabaijai]

Is beyond my comprehension why so many english speaking TV people are so excited about Thaksin and his impossible return to Thailand.

Because it brings up horrific flashbacks of early bar closings, their only contact to Thai society.

[Samuian]

every taxi driver, shopkeeper, massage therapist and all other people I talk in bangkok would like to see taksin's come back - so he is better than the other lot

So nobody with any political knowledge or understanding then

Despite the cheap polemics used: "EVERY" - most: NO!

In fact here is very, very common that the mentioned "labor folks" are rather low educated and very few show a genuine interest other then "what's in for me then"? !

edit: to correct..

Edited February 3, 2009 by Samuian

[hansnl]

What just a month ago everyone was going on about how it was looking up that British born Abhisit was to be PM. Now, everyone is slagging him off - is it soemthing to do with the fact that he doesn't like College girls earning extra income by selling their bodies on the internet?

I don't think we can expect him to be puking out new policies left, right and centre as Obama is, Obama has a h3ck of a lot more money behind him - another post here was stating that he was handed a reserve less than a month's worth of civil servant wages! Not a lot to build on. Thaksin made no end of promises, predictions and policy statements - mostly to fool the rural vote into thinking he was a savior that loved the struggling underclasses. Many promises and predictions turn out as hot air, and many of the policies he did put in '30 baht medical' etc sounded good, but never worked - many of the others helped him and his family and companies, but not many others - and certainly not the working classes and below.

I think we need to give him more time before we make a judgement and give him enough rope - this country really doesn't need more change that's for sure.

I guess this reaction could be classified as well balanced?

Compliments.

[Sparkles]

Thailand: A country where anyone can be PM (and they don't even have to grow up)!

I certainly didn't care much for Thaksin, but Abhisit isn't quite the shining star I thought he would be.

What is is with you people ? he's been there 5 mins ,there is world wide financial meltdown and you want everything rosy in the garden overnight. Its not going to happen no matter who is running the country.

[SmugFarangBore]

Thailand: A country where anyone can be PM (and they don't even have to grow up)!

I certainly didn't care much for Thaksin, but Abhisit isn't quite the shining star I thought he would be.

What is is with you people ? he's been there 5 mins ,there is world wide financial meltdown and you want everything rosy in the garden overnight. Its not going to happen no matter who is running the country.

Abhisit has already had some 500 killed on his watch thanks to human rights violations by the military. Unfortunately the real numbers are probably far higher.If he continues in this vein he'll surpass the human rights violations by the Thaksin administration within weeks.

This unelectable Oxford-educated puppet has obfuscated and denied at every opportunity without effectively dealing with the military showing it is he that is answerable to the military, and not the other way round.

Reminiscent of the good ol' boy Prem's words that the military were only controlled and answerable to one Institution.

So don't bother telling me to "give him time" when hundreds are being towed out to sea and left to die while he ponces about in Switzerland pushing the great Sufficiency Economy lie.

[Samuian]

Thailand: A country where anyone can be PM (and they don't even have to grow up)!

I certainly didn't care much for Thaksin, but Abhisit isn't quite the shining star I thought he would be.

What is is with you people ? he's been there 5 mins ,there is world wide financial meltdown and you want everything rosy in the garden overnight. Its not going to happen no matter who is running the country.

Abhisit has already had some 500 killed on his watch thanks to human rights violations by the military. Unfortunately the real numbers are probably far higher.If he continues in this vein he'll surpass the human rights violations by the Thaksin administration within weeks.

This unelectable Oxford-educated puppet has obfuscated and denied at every opportunity without effectively dealing with the military showing it is he that is answerable to the military, and not the other way round.

Reminiscent of the good ol' boy Prem's words that the military were only controlled and answerable to one Institution.

So don't bother telling me to "give him time" when hundreds are being towed out to sea and left to die while he ponces about in Switzerland pushing the great Sufficiency Economy lie.

So if in one Company a new Boss moves in and just then in the time of the takeover, someone from the staff kills with the delivery van because of a blast tyre it skidded into a crowd of people, and in the process several get killed, the newly appointed boss is responsible!?

The killing wasn't made deliberately, there are only 2 "Witnesses" who told their story to people from the "Arcan Project" and yes later to everyone else...very strong "Facts" indeed!

Varying records on numbers, "missing people", what actually happened, lets wait and see what the investigations will bring!

There are reports that people jumped the ship.....

So far it wouldn't be enough to prosecute anyone, but here it is done free handed!

[Samuian]

Thailand: A country where anyone can be PM (and they don't even have to grow up)!

I certainly didn't care much for Thaksin, but Abhisit isn't quite the shining star I thought he would be.

What is is with you people ? he's been there 5 mins ,there is world wide financial meltdown and you want everything rosy in the garden overnight. Its not going to happen no matter who is running the country.

Abhisit has already had some 500 killed on his watch thanks to human rights violations by the military. Unfortunately the real numbers are probably far higher.If he continues in this vein he'll surpass the human rights violations by the Thaksin administration within weeks.

This unelectable Oxford-educated puppet has obfuscated and denied at every opportunity without effectively dealing with the military showing it is he that is answerable to the military, and not the other way round.

Reminiscent of the good ol' boy Prem's words that the military were only controlled and answerable to one Institution.

So don't bother telling me to "give him time" when hundreds are being towed out to sea and left to die while he ponces about in Switzerland pushing the great Sufficiency Economy lie.

So if in one Company a new Boss moves in and just then in the time of the takeover, someone from the staff kills with the delivery van because of a blast tyre it skidded into a crowd of people, and in the process several get killed, the newly appointed boss is responsible!?

The killing wasn't made deliberately, there are only 2 "Witnesses" who told their story to people from the "Arcan Project" and yes later to everyone else...very strong "Facts" indeed!

Varying records on numbers, "missing people", what actually happened, lets wait and see what the investigations will bring!

There are reports that people jumped the ship.....

So far it wouldn't be enough to prosecute anyone, but here it is done free handed!

[MaiChai]

People have such short memories. Does anyone remember what Taksin was like before the coup? Would not listen to anyone/reason, in the middle of another corruption scandel, very much hated? Any person who craves so much power is someone you need to be wary of. Almost like any other dictator from history. What would have happened if he wasn't toppled? Where would Thailand be now? Run like a dictatorship with Taksin controlling everything and unimaginable wealth amassed with corruption? Buying votes in the countryside is not democracy!

[Ga-gai]

Thaksin is like the vampire in the movie "The Vampire Chronicles", who just refuses to die.

Hear him talking about a comeback, only gives me the image of an desperate person who tries to flame every instance with his presence. I'm just worried about what will happen the day when the beloved Thai King dies. Will there be open fights between yellow and red shirts fighting for power? Civil war? All these things around Thaksin makes me really worried about the future stability of this country. It's all about power and greed.

Edited February 3, 2009 by Ga-gai

[h90]

People have such short memories. Does anyone remember what Taksin was like before the coup? Would not listen to anyone/reason, in the middle of another corruption scandel, very much hated? Any person who craves so much power is someone you need to be wary of. Almost like any other dictator from history. What would have happened if he wasn't toppled? Where would Thailand be now? Run like a dictatorship with Taksin controlling everything and unimaginable wealth amassed with corruption? Buying votes in the countryside is not democracy!

What he made with the media, not to forget the War against Drugs. If in power he would shoot everyone who does not agree with him.

[h90]

Thaksin is like the vampire in the movie "The Vampire Chronicles", who just refuses to die.

Hear him talking about a comeback, only gives me the image of an desperate person who tries to flame every instance with his presence. I'm just worried about what will happen the day when the beloved Thai King dies. Will there open fights between yellow and red shirts fighting for power? Civil war? All these things around Thaksin makes me really worried about the future stability of this country. It's all about power and greed.

Many in the south would, with a Thaksin government, agree to split the country at Chumphon.

Others are ready to take the gun.

Outcome: Anarchy or civil war or coup (and what than???)

[samgrowth]

The killing wasn't made deliberately, there are only 2 "Witnesses" who told their story to people from the "Arcan Project" and yes later to everyone else...very strong "Facts" indeed!

Only 2 witnesses left. The remaining 500 is already dead.

[animatic]

I guess Thaksin is banned from politics for years ahead, and have to serve a jail term as well. Until then it's unlikely IMHO.

The coup-makers of the 2006 takeover "convicted" Thaksin. As soon as they are on the run, which shouldn't be long now, no jail term will be necessary. Neither Thaksin nor the leaders of the PAD will rot in jail.

apparently you missed the court cases and the broken laws .... and remember he has to appear in court at least once for the next cases to be brought against him! (Meaning he'll have to stay away for another 9 years)

But wait.

Wasn't Thaksin's jail time conviction done during SAMAK and PPP's time in power?

Right yes it was.

The 2006 coup makers only got a prosecutable case together. And passed it along

He was tried and convicted while his OWN puppet government was in power.

Even with that home court advantage he still got convicted.

Yellow card

Ok they did find ALL of the TRT heirchy guilty of elections fraud

and Thaksin got a 5 year ban from that. And that HAS NOT BEEN OVER TURNED.

But they still put in PPP and won an election, which was basically trown out AGAON<

for SAME INFRACTION by PPP Heirchy... they couldn't learn.

And yet they ALSO couldn't save tahksin from HIS OWN MISTAKES.

Red card.

He is preaching to the choir, not to the country.

He is preaching to his own ego, but not reality.

[animatic]

every taxi driver, shopkeeper, massage therapist and all other people I talk in bangkok would like to see taksin's come back - so he is better than the other lot

?

But seriously though, compare Thaksin (and Obama for that matter) to Abh(ph)isit. The first two were pumping out real policies that led to real differences from the moment they got into office. Admittedly Thaksin's policies always had a self-enriching aspect as well. But my point is they are real politicians. Anyone can see Abhisit is floundering. What real initiatives has he started working on? It's beginning to look like he is nothing but a pretty face. He's had years in opposition to formulate his policy ideas.

Thaksin inherited an economy that was beginning to see light (thanks to the Democrats), while Abhisit has inherited a complete economic mess that is part of an even bigger global economic mess.

Also, Thaksin's TRT enjoyed an absolute majority in parliament, while Abhisit's government is a coalition government, meaning Abhisit can't jump in and put things in place until he has an agreement from the other coalition partners. It slows things down.

Note, re your inclusion of Obama, the US doesn't have a coalition government either.

Abhisit doesn't have the freedom to throw out policies at will because of the coalition environment,

and doesn't have the freedome of action because the economy is tanking world wide, right on both points.

But what he IS doing is right for the situation when most things would be hard choices.

Somchai or Samak would be clueless in his chair at this time.

[animatic]

People have such short memories. Does anyone remember what Taksin was like before the coup? Would not listen to anyone/reason, in the middle of another corruption scandel, very much hated? Any person who craves so much power is someone you need to be wary of. Almost like any other dictator from history. What would have happened if he wasn't toppled? Where would Thailand be now? Run like a dictatorship with Taksin controlling everything and unimaginable wealth amassed with corruption? Buying votes in the countryside is not democracy!

Gotta ditto here.

His mental deterioration in 2006 was palpable and obvious.

He's not gaining any ground nowadays either.

[SmugFarangBore]

Thailand: A country where anyone can be PM (and they don't even have to grow up)!

I certainly didn't care much for Thaksin, but Abhisit isn't quite the shining star I thought he would be.

What is is with you people ? he's been there 5 mins ,there is world wide financial meltdown and you want everything rosy in the garden overnight. Its not going to happen no matter who is running the country.

Abhisit has already had some 500 killed on his watch thanks to human rights violations by the military. Unfortunately the real numbers are probably far higher.If he continues in this vein he'll surpass the human rights violations by the Thaksin administration within weeks.

This unelectable Oxford-educated puppet has obfuscated and denied at every opportunity without effectively dealing with the military showing it is he that is answerable to the military, and not the other way round.

Reminiscent of the good ol' boy Prem's words that the military were only controlled and answerable to one Institution.

So don't bother telling me to "give him time" when hundreds are being towed out to sea and left to die while he ponces about in Switzerland pushing the great Sufficiency Economy lie.

So if in one Company a new Boss moves in and just then in the time of the takeover, someone from the staff kills with the delivery van because of a blast tyre it skidded into a crowd of people, and in the process several get killed, the newly appointed boss is responsible!?

The killing wasn't made deliberately, there are only 2 "Witnesses" who told their story to people from the "Arcan Project" and yes later to everyone else...very strong "Facts" indeed!

Varying records on numbers, "missing people", what actually happened, lets wait and see what the investigations will bring!

There are reports that people jumped the ship.....

So far it wouldn't be enough to prosecute anyone, but here it is done free handed!

Ask yourself: do you think the Thai authorities will investigate thoroughly and come to the just and correct conclusions? They have already been caught outright lying about these incidents. Abhisit, the Prime Minister included.

You also compare the atrocities by the Thai military against the Rohingyas to a traffic accident???

These were deliberate, cowardly and disgusting acts; overseen by a General who was already responsible for atrocities and Muslim deaths in human rights abuses in the South.

Of course the current Government has to take responsibility, because they are meant to be running the country, but my point, which you conveniently missed, is that they can't, as they have no real authority over the military.

[SmugFarangBore]

People have such short memories. Does anyone remember what Taksin was like before the coup? Would not listen to anyone/reason, in the middle of another corruption scandel, very much hated? Any person who craves so much power is someone you need to be wary of. Almost like any other dictator from history. What would have happened if he wasn't toppled? Where would Thailand be now? Run like a dictatorship with Taksin controlling everything and unimaginable wealth amassed with corruption? Buying votes in the countryside is not democracy!

A lot of what ifs.

I feel I need to point out the obvious irony in celebrating a military coup and subsequent military junta in removal of a man who maybe would have become or possibly would have become (however ridiculous and unlikely) "like a dictator".

[Scott]

I hope he isn't sitting somewhere reading TV each day and making a list of posters who have 'defamed' him. I would rather be flying under the radar with things if he returns!

[SmugFarangBore]

Varying records on numbers, "missing people", what actually happened, lets wait and see what the investigations will bring!

Under intense international pressure, the Thai prime minister, Abhisit Vejjajiva, promised to investigate the scandal. But he gave the task to the very unit accused of the abuses, the controversial Internal Security Operations Command (Isoc).

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/feb/0...t-people-rescue

[animatic]

A self-made millionaire. He won two elections comfortably. It took a military coup to get rid of him. An anti-establishment maverick.

Nearly three years to come up with a hatful of charges, which whilst not trivial, ....were not exactly the unveiling of a secret Holocaust.

He and his party pursued by a judiciary for whom stamping the conviction sheet appeared to be a pre-ordained conclusion.

Of course people are still interested in him. He'll be front page news in Thailand till the day they put him in the ground !

<edit: cremate him >

Exactly. you make the point without invective, without flaming, and by sticking to facts.

a model for other posters - of both persuasions?? i hope so

I agree Jounalist makes his points calmly and with out bile.

I don't always agree, but like his style and methods.

I am always leery of 'Self Made Milionaires'. The ones I have met ,

several, were overdriven ego maniacs with constricted moral compasses.

"Hey, no hard feelings, it's just business."

Granted Thaksin started with his daddy's smaller, but not inconsequencial, pile,

and turned it into a MUCH bigger one. Ah, but the METHODS of doing that

in such a s SHORT time make him quite suspect.

The hat-full of charges are on hold because of arcane Thai laws

about actually showing up in court personally. He doesn't,

and so several cases are on hold till he sets foot on thai soil and gets brought to court.

You can say it is 'pre-ordained convictions' by a pursuing judiciary.

But you can't just easily make convictable charges from thin air, ever here.

There is FAR more than enough questionable dealings out in the open to easily

and fairly question how he did business while in office.

Not looking at these highly questionable dealings would ALSO be

dereliction of duty to the people for sweeping it under the table. Even here.

If he is actually INNOCENT of any charge, I am MORE than happy to see him aquitted.

But for that he must show up and face the charges, not slink in the shadows as a fugitive.

Does he so fear loss of his perks of life, to prefer life on the run and clandestine

radio shows to zeolots to keep his ego floating, to actually clearing his name in open court??

Or does he, as plausibly, truely fear what they ALREADY know about him,

and the time he would be likely to serve,

if ALL facts came to light.

It could be BOTH,

not wanting to die as a caged pauper when he can live 5 Stars now,

and he wouldn't be able to get the ego strokes from fans from the jailhouse.

He can still convince himself he is a big man while on the run,

in jail his whole imagined universe severely constricts to and mentally diminuative state.