snuggzzz Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 There have been good posts in reply to the OP, I would Go to British Embassy to record your problem, if they have a note of it, them it's on record. Ask them their advice, this happens mant times in Thailand. They may well have necessary connections within the Police Service to sort out these issues. I would carry this out prior to your meeting, I personally wouldn't attend. I mean he isn't going to be there with a happy smile holding packed lunch for you is he...?? He is hoping to 'Blackmail' you, he's bereft of money, as you said he cannot pay you for 6 months. Go to British Embassy, seek advice and guidance...............Good Luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffphuket Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 ...4. The police rings you to tell you not to ring the police? This one beat me on the head telling me this post is somehow fishy... and you have a friend at the police that can verify the existence of a report against you, but you still don't believe you should report this to the police??... If Boater had only a few posts then this thread might sound a bit dodgy....but he hasn't. Now if someone, say, with 13 posts had made it.....hmmmm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vespajw Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 If Boater had only a few posts then this thread might sound a bit dodgy....but he hasn't. Now if someone, say, with 13 posts had made it.....hmmmm It's one of the great conceits of the internet that quantity somehow equals quality. The number of messages someone has posted is not an absolute indicator of their expertise or their ability to analyse a situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boater Posted February 15, 2009 Author Share Posted February 15, 2009 If Boater had only a few posts then this thread might sound a bit dodgy....but he hasn't. Now if someone, say, with 13 posts had made it.....hmmmm i am personally known to the Admin who if anyone would like to check they can Go to British Embassy, seek advice and guidance...............Good Luck i have already and i am waiting back for them to call me money 5. Despite a few requests, you are still reluctant to give the name of the company? what is your risk?Defamation is the risk and is not taken lightly in Thailand. This is correct, i would like to get everything cleared up first so i can move on with my life with no worries, naming and shaming could also bring me more damage and agro... would really just like to forget that part of my life Go to police now what are you waiting for ????????? Huh !!! a member who works at the Lumpinee police station next to the British Embassey has PM me and i have spoken to him on the phone, i will also go down there this afternoon to cover myself.... but the Embassey mention just to wait till Monday and see what happens... Again thank you everyone for your help Boater Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkady Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Sorry to hear you have been treated like this. It is illegal under the Labor Code to make deductions from employees' salaries. In your case the employer is deducting 100% and trying to force you to stay. In the late 90s financial crisis firms reduced salaries and some even got staff to stay on for free temporarily or for deferred salaries that would be paid sometime in the future, if the company ever recovered. I worked for a listed Thai company at the time and remember a board discussion about a proposal to reduce salaries. The conclusion was that it could rebound on the company as we would have had to get staff to sign a consent form agreeing to the salary reduction and any that refused would be entitled to claim constructive dismissal and force us to pay full severance pay. So instead we opted to let go the non-performers with full severance pay, instead of peeing off all the good performers. I think you should go to the Employment Dept of the Labor Ministry with your complaint. It sounds as if the case involves them anyway, due to the work permit issue. You are entitled to 6 months' severance pay after 3 years' service. If any Thai staff have received the same treatment, the Labor Ministry will be doubly interested in the case but they are obliged to look after the rights of foreign workers as well. I have seen a law firm called Mackenzie Smith www.macsmlaw.com advertising that they work on a contingency fee basis on labor dispute cases i.e. no fee charged but they take 20-30% of the settlement, if successful. I have no connection with them but once consulted them for advice on a non-labor issue and they were not outrageously expensive and quite helpful. There are probably others who work on a contingency fee basis too. Unless the complainant insists on going to the Labor Court first off, the Labor Ministry usually undertakes a mediation process to try to solve the dispute by talking to the two parties to try get an out of court agreement. This will involve an investigation by the Labor Ministry who will send staff to the company to investigate labor conditions at the company in genaral as well as the specific case. They will interview staff at random and try to establish whether the company is in compliance with all aspects of the Labor Code including salary payments, annual leave, maternity leave, social security payments, whether the company has a proper staff rule book and disputes arbitration procedure. I would think this not something that most employers would welcome. Re the passport. You seem to be on the right track. It is obviously theft of a passport which should be notified to the police and a new one applied for, if it can't be recovered. Remember it is illegal for a foreigner to walk around in Thailand without a passport, so the police obviously have to be notified. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoorSucker Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Remember it is illegal for a foreigner to walk around in Thailand without a passport Wrong, It's illegal to not have any ID, a Thai driving license is OK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyc2006 Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 I have just recieved an email now from the Embassey explaining not to worry and that they will deal with everythingDear xxxxx, Please try not to worry, technically if your someone withholds your passport from you, it is theft. He is at fault. As the discussion between you and him unfortunately didn't resolve the problem, it's now out of your hands and an issue between us and him. This means that when we get it back we'll probably need to issue you a new passport. And, as I said if he doesn't give it back to us we'll cancel the current one and issue you a new passport. I hope this makes sense? If we issue you with a new one, we'll need to ask you for normal application fee I'm afraid, and it takes 10 working days. So either way, you'll have a passport in about two to three weeks time. As you know we have officially asked him to return it and he told us he would. He could hand it to immigration office or to immigration at an airport, and he said he'd do so on Monday. We'll have to wait until we hear from Immigration. I hope you have a good weekend. best wishes, You cut and pasted this email, from a person who works in your Embassy? Why is his English exactly like yours, including the grammatical errors? I'm in the same camp as one of the other people who've replied... you've asked questions to which the answers are so obvious ("Go to your Embassy. File a police report. No, don't give him your personal laptop."), and posted a supposed communication from your Embassy that just doesn't look official. It's hard to take this topic seriously. My apologies if it's all real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puipuitom Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 i also have sms from the company threating me to leave the country ect ect ....... should i also give this to the embassey in case something does happen to me? MY opinion: keep YOUR embassy posted for everything, every detail. Same, file it at the Thai police, with the remark, all is also at your embassy This is typically a Thai national, thinking can threaten a farang as he is familiar with Thai habbits, rule, laws etc. When you can get YOUR embassy to give your Thai boss a phone call, telling he will be accused of stealing a foreigners passport... this will help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boater Posted February 15, 2009 Author Share Posted February 15, 2009 You cut and pasted this email, from a person who works in your Embassy?Why is his English exactly like yours, including the grammatical errors? I'm in the same camp as one of the other people who've replied... you've asked questions to which the answers are so obvious ("Go to your Embassy. File a police report. No, don't give him your personal laptop."), and posted a supposed communication from your Embassy that just doesn't look official. It's hard to take this topic seriously. My apologies if it's all real. it is actually a She and yes this is all real ( i wish it wasnt ) but just to update, i have been down to Lumpinee Police station today, i they did a check just to make sure there is no warrent out and there isnt.... they have been informed of my situation and are going to fully support me i will wait to see if my passport is returned tomorrow, if not the station will ring and ask for it back tomorrow . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maestro Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 An off-topic post and replies to it have been deleted. -- Maestro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrWizard Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Ok your complaint has been noted by British Embassy and The Police, now get to a lawyer for information. Also if your lawyer agrees go to immigration and explain the situation. There are more farangs who have this situation. Only immigration can give you a letter of passage to not pay any overstay. My guess is that immigration will extend you visa if you can show them a new contract of your new employer. Also your contract is due if your employer cannot pay your salary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelepulse Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 I feel so much stupider from reading this post. And why are you stupider? Is that even a word? I have met the OP and there is no reason at all for him to make this story up. I think that he's just intimidated and feels threatened, as we all might be if you thought your boss was a big mafia connected guy and could make you disappear for 20K baht. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tywais Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Flame deleted. Any further attempts to disrupt this topic will be dealt with accordingly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankthetank Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 can they do this and who do i get hold of as i have done NOTHING wrong ! i think your avatar is reason enough to cancel your visa And you're judging his avatar????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crocodilexp Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 (edited) Immediately report the theft of your passport to the police and get a new one from the embassy. Then, get the appropriate visa sorted with your new employer. That's the minimal solution. If you want to do more, first get a competent lawyer. Your lawyer can advise you what to do and immediately write a nice letter to inform your employer that you would: File a case regarding theft of your passport (since this is what it is). File the case for blackmail/extortion regarding their request for your personal laptop in exchange for the passport. File for back wages/commissions (if you have anything to prove it) File a wrongful lawsuit case regarding the claim you stole company property. You never signed anything for it, so they may well claim you stole an army tank. File a complaint with labor department (possibly preventing them from obtaining further work permits). Publicize the case to their competitors and future job applicants. They don't have to actually go through any of this, I think just a letter would be enough to make your employer change their mind about your passport and withdraw their police complaint. Your lawyer could advise whether you also have a chance of some sort of settlement (e.g. 100k out of those 300k claimed) -- probably should demand it as a starting point. Note that a letter from yourself instead of a lawyer, even similar contents, will not have the same effect. Legal costs should not be too high unless you actually go on to sue (if you want your 300k and think you have a chance). Note: I am not a lawyer, and don't like them much personally. Edited February 16, 2009 by crocodilexp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astor Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Your passport does not belong to you, it belongs to your country of origin. Go talk to your home country embassy, they will know what to do. No sir. I had to pay my passport , they didn't give me it for free. I paid 80 euro (it's not a cheap price) my passport book, and then the passport is mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonrakers Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Your passport does not belong to you, it belongs to your country of origin. Go talk to your home country embassy, they will know what to do. No sir. I had to pay my passport , they didn't give me it for free. I paid 80 euro (it's not a cheap price) my passport book, and then the passport is mine. A passport is never (As far as I know) the property of the holder, look inside your passport an you should find something that says just that. When you pay money for a passport you are paying for the priviledge of being allowed to use it, it still does not belong to you though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boater Posted February 16, 2009 Author Share Posted February 16, 2009 File a case regarding theft of your passport (since this is what it is).File the case for blackmail/extortion regarding their request for your personal laptop in exchange for the passport. File for back wages/commissions (if you have anything to prove it) File a wrongful lawsuit case regarding the claim you stole company property. You never signed anything for it, so they may well claim you stole an army tank. File a complaint with labor department (possibly preventing them from obtaining further work permits). Publicize the case to their competitors and future job applicants. 1) I will wait till the end of the Day, if the passport is not back, then this is what i will have to do, as i have given sufficiant time for it to be given back 2) I only have the developer who can vouch that i made the sale, i hightly doubt the company would provide anything 3) This has already been noted by the Police 4) The labour department is my next port of call to get everything sorted I have also heard that if i do make the police report, immigration will not charge me if i am overstay????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astor Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Your passport does not belong to you, it belongs to your country of origin. Go talk to your home country embassy, they will know what to do. No sir. I had to pay my passport , they didn't give me it for free. I paid 80 euro (it's not a cheap price) my passport book, and then the passport is mine. A passport is never (As far as I know) the property of the holder, look inside your passport an you should find something that says just that. When you pay money for a passport you are paying for the priviledge of being allowed to use it, it still does not belong to you though. Anything thing that I get by payng money, becomes of my property. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maestro Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 A passport is never (As far as I know) the property of the holder, look inside your passport an you should find something that says just that. Not all passports have that clause. My Swiss passport does not have it, only instructions that if I lose it I must report it immediately to the nearest police station. -- Maestro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonrakers Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Going by Maestro's reply above, it depends on where you are from. If you are the U.K. for example however, then your passport is definitely not your property. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astor Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 A passport is never (As far as I know) the property of the holder, look inside your passport an you should find something that says just that. Not all passports have that clause. My Swiss passport does not have it, only instructions that if I lose it I must report it immediately to the nearest police station. -- Maestro In my italian passport doesn't exists that clause too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phrikpon Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Passports are government property. Typical laws about passports declare that passports are government property, and may be limited or revoked at any time, usually on specified grounds. A limitation or a revocation is generally subject to judicial review. Btw Boater, don't forget to make a copy of your new passport ( including the page of your new visa ) in case of trouble you can prove your identity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abdulrahman Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Passports are government property.Typical laws about passports declare that passports are government property, and may be limited or revoked at any time, usually on specified grounds. A limitation or a revocation is generally subject to judicial review. I'm sure you are right.In regard to YOUR Country.Nuff said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astor Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Passports are government property.Typical laws about passports declare that passports are government property, and may be limited or revoked at any time, usually on specified grounds. A limitation or a revocation is generally subject to judicial review. Btw Boater, don't forget to make a copy of your new passport ( including the page of your new visa ) in case of trouble you can prove your identity I'm aware that the passport my be revoked , but I couldn't give it to them. The passport was revoket Also to Bettino Craxi but he didn't give back it to the italian autorities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trihent Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 A visit to the police is due.Also I think it's time for lawyer. Agree on both of the above. Appears they are effectively trying to blackmail you into staying. And as joe mentioned, was there any check in list that identified what you were given for use? Extremely sure. 1. Notify your embassy that your passport is missing, stolen lost 2. Call TAT Police and have them meet you at Royal Thai Police headquarters BKK 3. Take all the police reports your going to fill out and go down to the labour commision and file a with them The potential fines (not to mention possible jail time) against your employer far exceed what they owe you. good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boater Posted February 17, 2009 Author Share Posted February 17, 2009 well the passport still isnt back.... but the Embassey will call again today, otherwise i have to report it to the police.... which i really didnt want Boater Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samran Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 consider it gone. Bite the bullet, get a new PP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boater Posted February 17, 2009 Author Share Posted February 17, 2009 consider it gone. Bite the bullet, get a new PP. I will just have to wait for the Embassey to get back to me... then i will take it from there but not looking forward to the hassle of getting a new passport Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loaded Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 The boss wants you out of the country because you know too much about his operations and may be a threat to future business and he is obligated to pay your back salary and severance for 3 years employment. Both of the above reasons have been sufficient for a Thai to do very nasty things to people. Negotiate with him - it's the Thai way. People sitting safely at keyboards may disagree but I was in a similar situation to you a few years back. I stuck it out but am still suffering from the consequences of not 'compromising'. Life would have been simplier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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