Dunlop Sportmax.. Teflon Tyres ?

[LivinLOS]

Have these on the bike, I think they are 207 / 208 combos (need to look again to be 100%) but really unimpressed with the rear grip. Went for a couple of rides this weekend on my own and even after time to warm them up the rear felt very greasy leaving corners. Also thought at one point I had a slipping clutch but realized I was actually just spinning under hard acceleration (2nd), thats even once warmed up !!

The bike hasnt been used much for the last couple of years, can tyres go hard over time ??

I am not much of a sport rider, and dont think I was pushing to their limits, so was kinda surprised and unsettled to feel them being less than totally solid at the speeds I was doing.

Anyone else ran dunlops and whats your impression of them.. Theres plenty of meat on them but they are not going to stay on there if thats the feel / grip in the dry !! I realize I am less used to the forces through them on this size machine but expected much more grip than I was feeling. Maybe I just need to scrub off a layer thats hardened up ?? Not done any proper distance just a few 50 mile island rides.

[Travelmate]

Kawasaki Ninja riders would call them "Dunlop Ditchmakers" As they are standard fitment when bike is bought new.

[neverdie]

Sounds like they have also gone hard....they need to be replaced.

[LivinLOS]

So tyres do harden up if unridden ??

Wasnt sure on that but knowing this has been laid up did make me think it might be.. Even after riding they just done seem to go sticky or scrub the surface, just seem the same plasticky surface.

Will put some distance on them and see if they improve but if they dont lose a layer and start to improve they have to go.

[dotcom]

Just press the sidewalls with your fingernail. If they deflect they are still soft. If they have hardened up you will know it.

I agree with neverdie. New soft rubber tyres are cheap insurance. I would have already replaced them.

[neverdie]

So tyres do harden up if unridden ??

Wasnt sure on that but knowing this has been laid up did make me think it might be.. Even after riding they just done seem to go sticky or scrub the surface, just seem the same plasticky surface.

Will put some distance on them and see if they improve but if they dont lose a layer and start to improve they have to go.

I parked my bike for 9 months, it was stored undercover. Its tyres were only crap IRC jobs, but when I returned to it they had gone like hard plastic....much like what you described before.

I also have a couple of sets of tyres and wheels for my vehicle back home in Oz. One set were the tyres I had with the vehicle since new & I didnt use them much, actually not at all for about 4 years. Recently I went to put them on the vehicle BUT they had also gone off.....I went for a short drive in the dry before returning home and taking them back off the vehicle.

Yes tyres can go bad/off, hard and nasty.....I'm not sure what does it to the rubber, if its just age or perhaps sun, i dunno, but it definately happens.

[thaicbr]

LIVIN just do a couple of nice burn outs then see what they are like. they are a sport/touring tyre i think. funny enough i remember Tony saying some thing like this about his er6. i wonder if they are better now.

[Travelmate]

Just give it some stick and remember to avoid the ditches!

[neverdie]

Just press the sidewalls with your fingernail. If they deflect they are still soft. If they have hardened up you will know it.

I agree with neverdie. New soft rubber tyres are cheap insurance. I would have already replaced them.

After a few laps with hard tyres dotcom....ive got no nails left....scarey stuff. Theres a tiny contact patch between life as you know it and life in a wheel chair, tyre choice is so very very important. Thailand & Tyres, something which scares me constantly.

Interestingly, I tried a set of 'IRC Gold' tyres on my little bike just to see what they were like & they were suprisingly good for the first couple of months (couple of thousand km) but now they are crap like the other standard IRC's.

I have never had the displeasure of using them in the wet & plan to change them before that time comes too

[BigBikeBKK]

LIVIN just do a couple of nice burn outs then see what they are like. they are a sport/touring tyre i think. funny enough i remember Tony saying some thing like this about his er6. i wonder if they are better now.

The ER-6n comes with Dunlop Sportmax Roadsmart tires. They are what's called "dual compound" tires, which means they've incorporated a long-wearing (harder) compound in the center of the tire tread and a lateral-grip compound on each shoulder to maximize cornering performance. These tires are marketed as "Sport touring" tires, but I think they fall short on the sport side of the equation.

I remain surprised how easy it is to spin these tires, and I don't like it.

Also have to note though that it's been ages since we've had a good rain in Bangkok, and all of the roads are getting quite slick with accumulated grease/oil. Be aware, give yourself enough room, and don't hammer your brakes!

I will change to Pirelli Diablos after the SSR Epic ride and I expect they will have much better grip (and shorter life) than the Dunlops.

Happy trails!

Tony

[neverdie]

^^ One needs to be very careful in BKK and the rest of Thailand after the long dry spell because these roads get really greasy when it first rains especially if its a drizzly rain. It gets really scarey here for a couple of days....especially scarey when you consider the other idiots riding around you.

[LivinLOS]

OK well I think these have 'gone off' then and unless I can scrub a layer off and find something softer underneath then these will get binned with the rebuild.. Not sure what to go for as I dont think I want a track or full on sport / dry only tyre.. Also had a buddy say that uber sticky tyres here pick up a lot of road crud, sand and lose grit which makes them less suitable given the road conditions we face real world ??

Will hit some fireblade forums and see what people like on them.. The oddball 16 inch front can restrict some combos I hear.

[BigBikeBKK]

^^ One needs to be very careful in BKK and the rest of Thailand after the long dry spell because these roads get really greasy when it first rains especially if its a drizzly rain. It gets really scarey here for a couple of days....especially scarey when you consider the other idiots riding around you.

Be EXTRA careful if you see a nut riding the mean streets of Bangkok with this creepy looking pooch attached to his leg-

Grease and oil aren't the only things you might slip on...

[davidgtr]

Well it's hot season approaching & the asphalt roads in the North are already hot & greasy. The twisties on R118 north of Mae Suai are good for skating through, plus the roads in both Chiang Mai & Chiang Rai city are as slippery as.

Get on the gas coming out of any corner on the Chiang Mai moat & your bike will slide out nicely (if it's controlled.)

So I wonder whether some of the problem is due to the hot greasy road conditions now? It gets like this every year, and it sometimes creeps up on you as the weather warms up. A mate recently changed his tyres because they had gone off & the new ones were the same. Then he realized that the roads have gotten slippery in the heat. The asphalt is way way worse than the concrete. The concrete needs a heavy build up of rubber & oil to get greasy. Just a thought, before you totally blame the tyres.

[Zzinged]

But tires do go hard though, and hard tires combined with slippery roads = suck.

I have yet to see roads being resurfaced without it being badly damaged anyway. They don't seem to realise that roads have wear and tear like anything else that gets used.

[kottan]

Pirelli Dablo Corsa III, fantastic Tyre, on the track as well as on the road, highly recommended,

Gerhard

[kottan]

Pirelli DIABLO, of course,

you have to trust your tyes 100%, otherwise you never feel confident in any corner, .....and who really likes that feeling,

Gerhard

[LivinLOS]

Well it's hot season approaching & the asphalt roads in the North are already hot & greasy. The twisties on R118 north of Mae Suai are good for skating through, plus the roads in both Chiang Mai & Chiang Rai city are as slippery as.

Get on the gas coming out of any corner on the Chiang Mai moat & your bike will slide out nicely (if it's controlled.)

So I wonder whether some of the problem is due to the hot greasy road conditions now? It gets like this every year, and it sometimes creeps up on you as the weather warms up. A mate recently changed his tyres because they had gone off & the new ones were the same. Then he realized that the roads have gotten slippery in the heat. The asphalt is way way worse than the concrete. The concrete needs a heavy build up of rubber & oil to get greasy. Just a thought, before you totally blame the tyres.

You have a good point.. Its got really hot down here the last couple of weeks and heat does make for greasy roads.. But I think I have been allowing for that. Now others have confirmed what I thought may have been it, and that tyres do go off, unless I scrub some wear into them and they change a lot they are getting ditched.

Its not a subtle loss of grip, these feel like I am in the wet while out on a dry road. The fact I can spin in second while hard acceleration shouldnt be normal, and the last thing I need while getting adjusted to this machine is that constant fear feeling and lack of confidence in the grip when it should be a long way from its limits.

[LivinLOS]

Pirelli DIABLO, of course,

you have to trust your tyes 100%, otherwise you never feel confident in any corner, .....and who really likes that feeling,

Gerhard

Those have been mentioned by a couple of people (super corsas for really soft) along with the Michelin Pilots for more road use and the Bridgestone BT 02 ??..

[neverdie]

^^ One needs to be very careful in BKK and the rest of Thailand after the long dry spell because these roads get really greasy when it first rains especially if its a drizzly rain. It gets really scarey here for a couple of days....especially scarey when you consider the other idiots riding around you.

Be EXTRA careful if you see a nut riding the mean streets of Bangkok with this creepy looking pooch attached to his leg-

Grease and oil aren't the only things you might slip on...

Tony, thats not a pooch, thats me missus...the pooch is just outa the pitcha on the right...BUT SADLY YOU ARE RIGHT, shes a creepy lookin misses just a great root , so it dusnt matter, right?

[neverdie]

I do NOT remember everything that I learnt at Tyre School, it might be the old brain giving away or perhaps I've just loaded myself up with too much useless information over the years

Anyway, all tyres have a lifespan & depending on which product you use its manufacturer will recommend a period before the tyre is replaced (time frame not distance travelled).

When you want to check when your tyres were manufactured check the four digit code on the tyre, the first two digits is the week number and the second two is the year.

As this rear tyre I have has only just started getting a bit sloppy, I hadnt thought to check it, but just now I realise the code on the tyre is 1204, meaning it was made in the 12th week of 2004. I only just put it on the bike a few months ago, so it has sat around for many years, which probably explains why it hasnt lasted long on the bike.

The front tyre which I bought at the same time...code is 4607, so made in the 46th week of 2007 & I had mainly noticed the rear being the problem & picking at the tyre it seems softer than the rear.

Funny thing is I bought them at the same place at the same time, perhaps I should of checked the dates when I bought them.

[Bard]

Tires harden over time and heat cycles. That's why buying "discounted" tires are risky they might have been in a warehouse for a while. If your tires are 2 years old, I would change anyway.

The ditchmakers are no good as they're to hard.

Depending on your riding choose tires, if you are a sporty/hard rider the Diablo III is pretty much it for you but if you're into touring/cruising go for those tires, they're harder but they give more grip cold than supersport tires which needs to be HOT to grip good.

Cheers Bard

[kottan]

I do NOT remember everything that I learnt at Tyre School, it might be the old brain giving away or perhaps I've just loaded myself up with too much useless information over the years

Anyway, all tyres have a lifespan & depending on which product you use its manufacturer will recommend a period before the tyre is replaced (time frame not distance travelled).

When you want to check when your tyres were manufactured check the four digit code on the tyre, the first two digits is the week number and the second two is the year.

As this rear tyre I have has only just started getting a bit sloppy, I hadnt thought to check it, but just now I realise the code on the tyre is 1204, meaning it was made in the 12th week of 2004. I only just put it on the bike a few months ago, so it has sat around for many years, which probably explains why it hasnt lasted long on the bike.

The front tyre which I bought at the same time...code is 4607, so made in the 46th week of 2007 & I had mainly noticed the rear being the problem & picking at the tyre it seems softer than the rear.

Funny thing is I bought them at the same place at the same time, perhaps I should of checked the dates when I bought them.

thanks for that info, never knew that tyres got the production date on them,

Gerhard

[Thumchok]

Gerhard

Bridgestone BT 02 ??..

I run the Bridgestone BT021 on my bikes now sport/touring tyres which are supposed to be good in the wet .I feel comfortable on them and they corner good enough for my abilty .

LivinLos , Is that a CBR 900 that your talking about ? Second gear tyre spin shouldn't be out of the norm for it . Some bitumen here just has no grip at all , especially around Bangkok were it's covered in crud .

[BSJ]

Tires in storage can be good for up to 5 years. They should be sealed in a plastic bag with silica gel and kept in a cool dry place.

On the bike heat can degrade under inflated or over inflated tyres. Also ozone which causes tyres to harden up and eventually crack. Once they crack it's just a matter of time before they fail under load.

Ps: I've stuck with Continental and Michelin over the years for the road bikes. I think I've had just about every brand on the dirt bikes!

Edited February 16, 2009 by BSJ

[BigBikeBKK]

Interesting posts- perhaps there's nothing wrong with my tires, but rather it's just the accumulation of grease and oil on the Thai roads at this time of year that is making the bike feel so unsettled in the city. Now that I think about it, most of the slides and spins are on urban black top. When we rode the Loei Loop last week I got my lean on and the bike held the road just fine. Guess I shouldn't run out to buy new tires just yet!

[neverdie]

I do NOT remember everything that I learnt at Tyre School, it might be the old brain giving away or perhaps I've just loaded myself up with too much useless information over the years

Anyway, all tyres have a lifespan & depending on which product you use its manufacturer will recommend a period before the tyre is replaced (time frame not distance travelled).

When you want to check when your tyres were manufactured check the four digit code on the tyre, the first two digits is the week number and the second two is the year.

As this rear tyre I have has only just started getting a bit sloppy, I hadnt thought to check it, but just now I realise the code on the tyre is 1204, meaning it was made in the 12th week of 2004. I only just put it on the bike a few months ago, so it has sat around for many years, which probably explains why it hasnt lasted long on the bike.

The front tyre which I bought at the same time...code is 4607, so made in the 46th week of 2007 & I had mainly noticed the rear being the problem & picking at the tyre it seems softer than the rear.

Funny thing is I bought them at the same place at the same time, perhaps I should of checked the dates when I bought them.

thanks for that info, never knew that tyres got the production date on them,

Gerhard

Gerhard,

Many years ago I did a tyre technology course & I think most people would be surprised it they actually new how much went into the development of tyres. There is a shitload of information printed on the sidewall of your tyre, from it much information can be learnt.

BSJ said about tyres being good in storage for 5 years, which maybe the case depending on the type of tyre, but I would imagine that a tyre that was 5 years old when it was first fitted may start to decline in performance faster than a tyre that was manufactured one day and used the following.

For my tyres, I never bothered checking the date of manufacture when i bought them & a couple of weeks ago I got some wheels spin when going for a spin down the road after making some carby adjustments....at the time I laughed to myself how could this gutless peice of <deleted> spin its wheels with my fat arse on it - 18hp verses 90kg (plus the weight of the bike), at which time I made a small mental adjustment to the fact that the tyres were starting to go off....it wasnt until the day before yesterday when I was picking away at them with a screwdriver did I notice that the front seemed alot better than the rear & then the date proves the rear tyre is some 3 years older than the front (both having covered the same miles).

Bard also talks about heating cycles which is probably one of the most relevant things when talking about racing tyres (slicks etc) but less relevant when talking about these types of road tyres on this type of bike....the hottest they get is probably when I park it in the sun at the markets @ which time they are still crap.

Forgetting about compounds for a minute, it is absolutely amazing what a difference tyre pressure can make to a bikes performance.

I also don't think that doing a 'burn out' on a tyre is really going to expose a new stickier layer of any GREAT difference.....it also wouldnt be wise to park ur bike in a pool of greasy muck overnight either.

Maybe Tony could buy a set of really skinny wheels and tyres for his er6n for his Bkk adventures, just to fit in with the thai guys on their autos & keep a good set of standard sized tyres for the trips.

A good skinny tyre may save you some grief when running into large pools of water, as opposed to a big fat tyre & it sure would look funny....what a picture it would make, tony's face, my beautiful pootch and some skinny tyres on the er6n

[BigBikeBKK]

Maybe Tony could buy a set of really skinny wheels and tyres for his er6n for his Bkk adventures, just to fit in with the thai guys on their autos & keep a good set of standard sized tyres for the trips.

A good skinny tyre may save you some grief when running into large pools of water, as opposed to a big fat tyre & it sure would look funny....what a picture it would make, tony's face, my beautiful pootch and some skinny tyres on the er6n

Um... As tempting as that sounds... no.

And on second thought... Yeah, Still no. :jerk:

[neverdie]

Maybe Tony could buy a set of really skinny wheels and tyres for his er6n for his Bkk adventures, just to fit in with the thai guys on their autos & keep a good set of standard sized tyres for the trips.

A good skinny tyre may save you some grief when running into large pools of water, as opposed to a big fat tyre & it sure would look funny....what a picture it would make, tony's face, my beautiful pootch and some skinny tyres on the er6n

Um... As tempting as that sounds... no.

And on second thought... Yeah, Still no. :jerk:

Somehow I already knew what your answer was going to be.