Robby nz Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 Rarely watch Tele at all but it would seem many who have posted here not only do but believe everything they see. I have been wondering what motives those who believe in murder can see that would have prompted such an act? We are told not only in the official version but by a poster on this forum who had met with and talked to the man recently that he was without money, without a place to stay, without work, without hope and apparantly without Cath, possibly without a visa (he came from Cambodia by land, 15 day visa on arrival?) and maybe no way of getting back to his own country, if he in fact wanted to go. He had said he wanted to kill himself and had tried it before. Who would want to take the risk of killing such a man especially in such an attention grabbing way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neverdie Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 ^ Robby, take the rest of the nite off mate, you'll still get full pay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tw25rw Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 It shouldn't matter that the rope came from 7-11 or wherever. The energy was transfered to his neck which was obviously less resilient than the rope. In the picture at this site, the head appears to be much closer to the bridge than in the previous photo. Maybe the other was taken as it was being lowered to a boat? You can clearly see the blood. I would suggest that when the knot pulled tight around his neck, the tissues were pulled taut until they ripped. As he swung, the open artery splashed the bridge. The head still looks pink suggesting the rope had "sealed" the damaged neck to stop the blood draining. On the other hand, the arms on another photo I saw were white suggesting his heart pumped for some time, draining his system, maybe even under the water. So he was clearly alive as he went off the bridge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brahmburgers Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 xbones,You are a classic, instead of looking at the simple explanation for these things you go to the hard option.....of course the crime scene was tampered with....it couldnt be the lighting in the pictures that cause the discrepancies you are seeing, could it, that would be too easy. You are entertaining tho. Thanks. Look a the pictures! A difference in lighting can not make 3 street lamps "move". You can clearly see where the rope is attached to the railings and in one picture there are 2 lamps attached to the railings themselves which couldnt be missed in any picture - and there is another larger streetlamp which i admit could be out of sight of the angle of the other picture! Anyway I am glad to be of entertainment! Crossbones, I'm with you bro. There have been a lot of discrepancies with this macabre death. We still don't know whether the head was in a plastic bag (as reported for the first few days, but refuted by photos which showed up later). Could it be the first person(s) to pull the head up - found it in a bag, then took the bag off - then some folks reenacted the activity at a different spot along the bridge (Thai cops are big on reenactments and photo ops)? Ok, several questions within one sentence, katot kap. Thai people in general don't have a clue about maintaining the integrity of crime scene, and Thai cops are not much better - so any cleaning / rearranging or tampering with things at the scene - even by cops - should not come as a surprise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neverdie Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 (edited) ^^ sure they love the reneactments....but changes of bags, heads, rope, light poles.....rumour has it they even flew the head to a few other citys and dangled it off other bridges, eiffel tower etc....GREATS STUFF Edited February 27, 2009 by neverdie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Checker Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 O-K wise up everyone. This has been entertaining if nothing else. This poor soul has very tragically departed this world. May he rest in more peace then he found on earth. He had a troubled mind. There is absolutley no doubt that he took his own life. He cannot live with this however we must. End of story . . . May his family and loved one's celebrate his life and not his death . . . Now let this poor soul sleep . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robby nz Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 Pay Neverdie, what the hel_l is Pay? If I have some coming to me please let me know where I can pick it up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtp Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 Pay Neverdie, what the hel_l is Pay? If I have some coming to me please let me know where I can pick it up "Pay" refers to how much money you are owed for work that you have done. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madjbs Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 Thai people in general don't have a clue about maintaining the integrity of crime scene, and Thai cops are not much better - so any cleaning / rearranging or tampering with things at the scene - even by cops - should not come as a surprise. How do you know? I have witnessed a shooting before in Bangkok, the police were there in minutes and had sealed the area off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groongthep Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 (edited) I haven't read this entire thread because it is 20 pages long so forgive me if someone else has already posted this. It does appear however that decapitation as a result of hanging using a rope that is too long is not uncommon. The pictures of this poor guy's head, the length of the rope, the blood spattered on the side of the bridge, and most importantly a suicide note, would indicate to me that the police's determination of suicide is probably correct. I have cut and pasted below a wikipedia entry on hanging. The link to the entire artcle is Here. Official Table of Drops From Wikipedia · v • d • e The Official Table of Drops, published by the British Home Office, is a manual used to calculate the correct length of rope for the long drop hangings. Following a series of failed hangings including those of John 'Babbacombe' Lee, a committee led by Henry Bruce was formed in 1888 to discover and report on the most effective manner of hanging. The results of the committee's report were first published that year, with a significantly revised edition published in 1913, with the length of rope previously used for a 14 stone individual now used for an 8 stone individual. The humane purpose is to ensure the right length of rope is used, so that the prisoner's neck breaks at the end of the drop, causing instant death. Too short a rope and he will slowly strangle, a process that could take 10 minutes; too long a rope and his head may become severed from his body. Edited February 27, 2009 by Groongthep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tw25rw Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 The humane purpose is to ensure the right length of rope is used, so that the prisoner's neck breaks at the end of the drop, causing instant death. Too short a rope and he will slowly strangle, a process that could take 10 minutes; too long a rope and his head may become severed from his body. Not just that but in this case the noose was just a loop with a slipknot around his neck. That would have put extra stress on the soft tissue in his neck causing it to tear. A proper noose has a different knot which is positioned in such a way as break the neck rather than strangle. My work internet blocks the picture hosts used for most images posted about this so I haven't seen any pics of his head in a bag if they exist, but it would be a really weird thing to do. Behead someone, through the torso in the river and hang his head off a bridge in a shopping bag. Sorry, don't believe it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pimfram Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 (edited) Somebody mentioned in the closed thread about suicides not being reported in other countries and it made me think if the same thing from Westminster bridge or London bridge, would it be on the BBC and the Sun? i think it would because this story made it to the sun newspaper. Edited February 27, 2009 by pimfram Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetsetBkk Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 Actually, I said that "a hanging occasionally results in decapitation". That's a lot more than once in a thousand. Once in a thousand is a hanging that results in a decapitation AND the head stays attached to the rope in that weird way. You want data? I don't have it. But even without the numbers, I humbly think it's counter-intuitive to hold that more likely to happen than someone severing someone else's head off and dropping it from a bridge. My mistake JG - I misread your 'once in a thousand' part. I think a lot of people went for the 'murdered and head hung over the bridge' theory because the title of this thread was taken from the news story in post #1, and can be inferred as 'head was hung beneath the bridge' implying by someone else. It's a very clever headline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imaneggspurt Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 Well its all in todays thai news, he was an italian gay, topped himself for sure, just recently come from cambodia staying in a hotel, 2 weeks behind with rent, couldnt pay his katoey boyfriend,.R.I.P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 (edited) He was Irish, not Italian. There are no specific reports that he was gay. There are no specific reports that he had a katoey boyfriend. The Link to the above story's thread is below. The thread has has been closed, apparently due to volumes of idle speculation and unsubstantiated reports (akin to the previous post). http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Irishman-Com...&hl=suicide Irishman Commits Suicide At Suvarnabhumi Airport Note: Do not move the discussion of that case to this thread. This post was made for informational purposes only. Edited February 28, 2009 by sriracha john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imaneggspurt Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 He was Irish, not Italian.There are no specific reports that he was gay. There are no specific reports that he had a katoey boyfriend. The Link to the above story's thread is below. The thread has has been closed, apparently due to volumes of idle speculation and unsubstantiated reports (akin to the previous post). http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Irishman-Com...&hl=suicide Irishman Commits Suicide At Suvarnabhumi Airport Note: Do not move the discussion of that case to this thread. This post was made for informational purposes only. john i was talking about the jumper off the bridge, not the flier at the airport !,. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 I apologize for the misunderstanding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannork Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 Mods,as it seems like a suicide surely the title of this thread should be changed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 (edited) Waiting for a definitive and unequivocal official statement as such, issued by the responsible authorities, would perhaps be the prudent way to proceed prior to any thread title change. I've seen several "it looks like" or "most likely" reports from the authorities, but to date, nothing that would meet the aforementioned criteria as are done in other suicides. If one has been made or issued, anyone please post and then a thread title change should be made. Edited February 28, 2009 by sriracha john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siamiam Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 "I do agree that people could be bit more considerate before posting on these threads but take a look on some of the other recent threads regarding suicides. There we are shooting away and speculating on physics of decapitation and making jokes about the poor lad and here we call closure... Strange huh" The above is from the now closed thread on the Irish man who died recently at the airport. It was posted by Thaivisa member MJo and it made me concerned that some of my recent posts regarding the death being discused on this thread may have seemed insensitive to some. My posts regarding ropes and the "physics of decapitation" were made in the best of intentions and it never occured to me that anyone would be hurt or offended by them, even a loved one of the deceased. I only meant to contribute in a possitive way. I appologise to MJo and anyone who may have been hurt by my words. I would certainly never want to write anything that could possibly hurt someone close to the deceased. Sincerly, Kevin (siamiam) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
on-on Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 (edited) It was awful inconsiderate of him to do it on a large public bridge given the superstitious nature of common Thai beliefs concerning death, suicide and ghosts, heh. It would be to the benefit of the Thai people who are superstitious of course to stop believing such things, but given that this isn't going to happen the least the guy could have done is offed himself somewhere private. Can you imagine how many people are busy changing their routes to work and will refuse to cross that bridge for the next few months? This is not a major concern, of course, so I'm not actually banging on about it, but it occurred to me as a somewhat unintentional and lightly humorous offshoot of the event (having seen the ramifications of a recent jumper at a condo here in Bangkok where friends live). Edited February 28, 2009 by on-on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neverdie Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 Pay Neverdie, what the hel_l is Pay? If I have some coming to me please let me know where I can pick it up "Pay" refers to how much money you are owed for work that you have done. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pay Robby, You've obviously been on the NZ Welfare too long, or have you moved to the great land of Oz where you get free money too....perhaps you've got a claim going in both countries. As Trix pointed out, Pay for doing work....you can collect the monies owed to you at the Detectives Office in Bkk central Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrossBones Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 (edited) 1) You will not use thaivisa.com to post any material which is knowingly or can be reasonably construed as false, defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, referencing prostitution (including bargirls and barboys), referencing suicide, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise in violation of any law. You also agree not to post negative comments criticizing the legal proceedings or judgments of the Thai Court of Law. I guess we should all shut up now Edited March 1, 2009 by CrossBones Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robby nz Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 Well Neverdie I have tried to ask serious questions about things that have in some cases been ignored and to tried to clarify things from my own experience. I have never put forward theories to try to uphold a personal piont of view nor have I slagged off at other posters or for that matter the Thai Police who in my few dealings with them over 4 years have been both curtious and helpfull, but then I have never broken any law. As for pay; I have rerely in my 50 odd years of working for a living had a boss to pay me as I have been mostly self employed, a situation where you have no one to hide behind and are accountable (financialy) for any mistake you make. And no I am on no welfare as yet but I hope in the next year to change that as the present economic situation is eating into my investment savings and making it more difficult to live in this country. My last post on this subject. Robby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seehow Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 Forgive me if I missed it I tried to read as much of the thread as possible but it is rather very long. Has anything further ever come out about this? Also in some of the beginning posts there was a lot of speculation about the bad and why he would have it on, my thoughts where anyone standing on a bridge might not go through with it if they where looking out because of the height so put a bag on plus he might have felt he didn't want his last views to be that of the fall, just black it all out with the bag. Just my thoughts if any of this has been answered sorry for a duplicate post but really wanted to know if anything came of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tropo Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 The humane purpose is to ensure the right length of rope is used, so that the prisoner's neck breaks at the end of the drop, causing instant death. Too short a rope and he will slowly strangle, a process that could take 10 minutes; too long a rope and his head may become severed from his body. Not just that but in this case the noose was just a loop with a slipknot around his neck. That would have put extra stress on the soft tissue in his neck causing it to tear. A proper noose has a different knot which is positioned in such a way as break the neck rather than strangle. My work internet blocks the picture hosts used for most images posted about this so I haven't seen any pics of his head in a bag if they exist, but it would be a really weird thing to do. Behead someone, through the torso in the river and hang his head off a bridge in a shopping bag. Sorry, don't believe it. In addition to the length of the rope and the way it's tied, one must also consider the guage of the rope. The rope used in this hanging was of a much smaller guage than traditional rope used in official executions. This would add considerably to the slicing effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maigo6 Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 Why hasn't the title of this thread been changed ? It wasn't a murder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayfarer108 Posted March 8, 2009 Share Posted March 8, 2009 Wasn't there also a story not too long ago where another Italian man committed suicide by taking a skydiving lesson and then refusing to pull the ripcord? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeaceKay Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 This was proven by the FBI and the FBI equivalent of Italy to have been a suicide. Same same the incident with David Carradine involved no one other than himself. I cannot mention anything else about these cases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Datsun240Z Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 (edited) I remember a quote from The Joker in The Dark Knight: " Guns are to quick, you can't saviour all the little emotions, in their last moments, people show you who they really are, so in a way I knew you friends better, than you ever did" What I want to say is that how good you know a person, you never really know the real person, even if your married with. Same goes for Carradine and this guy. Edited July 7, 2009 by Datsun240Z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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