Let's Form An Expats' Association Of Thailand

[Godders]

No, I'm not barmy, as some of you may be thinking after reading the headers on this posting. Perhaps I have just read one fruitless complaint too many in the Forum

True, many of the grumbles and grouses are trivial. But many are serious and raise genuine concerns about the way we expats are sometimes treated by Thai government agencies and their employees.

A recent case in point is the decision to close the busy Hua Hin immigration office, forcing expats from Hua Hin and Cha Am to use the former immigration office in distant Prachuab Khiri Khan for all their visa requirements and 90-day reports.

Posters are rightly dismayed at the prospect of having to make a round trip of over 250 kilometres for a service that is currently virtually on their doorstep. But unfortunately, as with so many other issues, all the hot air being ventilated is going nowhere helpful.

We don't know why "they" have taken the decision and "they" don't know why we are unhappy with it. That's because neither side talks to the other. I believe they should.

Which brings me to my point. Instead of simply crying on each other's shoulders through the forum, perhaps we need to form a pressure group (an Association of Expats in Thailand or something similar) to represent our interests and redress our grievances.

The first task of such a body should be to try and open cordial lines of communication with those Thai agencies, such as Immigration, responsible for for policing our activities. There are ways in which we could make their lives easier and we might be able to avoid Ruritanian farces of the Hua Hin immigration closure kind.

We should not, however, fall into the trap (which so many of us do as individuals) of simply being reactive. The Association would need to be proactive in demonstrating its care and concern for its adopted country.

One way would be to follow the lead of the Hua Hin expats, who have earned brownie points by putting money and resources into a number of projects designed to benefited indigenous Thais as well as resident foreigners. Expats in other large Thai towns have also been active on behalf of both communities.

An national expats' association could play a crucial role in coordinating effort, raising funds, proposing projects and liasing with national and local government agencies to ensure a successful outcome.

Thais generally might then take a kinder view of us - and be more inclined to listen to what we have to say on issues affecting our lives in their country.

Still think I'm barmy? In addition to providing a platform for discussion of the merits of my idea, perhaps the Forum's fathers would consider sponsoring such an association. They clearly have the talent on tap to get it up and running.

[bkkjames]

Not bad in theory, but in practice could end up looking like the Pattaya Volunteer Police Department?

Need to get your head around the fact that we are welcome here as visitors / tourists and tolerated as workers and retirees.

[samuibeachcomber]

yep not a bad idea,local expat business people in their local community forming a type of rotary club to assist the local thai communities with parks and playground for thai families might be a good start to show the locals the club is serious in helping,then later, issues affecting local farangs could be raised with the thai authorities and the club by then would have a lot of "good face" with the authorities.

[petecooper]

This is about the most sensible post I've read on TV for ages! Well done for coming up with a good idea and some intelligent suggestions. Count me in!

[dave9988]

where will your political power to get things done come from except perhaps via donations used to bribe officials?

ok, the Hua Hin office is closing. What will your organization do to stop that? Protests? Bribes? Will you threaten to leave Thailand... lolz?

[grandslam]

Wouldn't throw cold water on the suggestion just yet.

Could lead to some idea of how it would be received by some Thai TV members

[bkkjames]

Wouldn't throw cold water on the suggestion just yet.

Could lead to some idea of how it would be received by some Thai TV members

More importantly, is how it would be recieved by local authorities. In practical terms, what's in it for them?

[chiang mai]

Barmy or a near newbie, don't know, pretty clear that you don't know a lot about the workings of Thailand and all that entails. But hey, if you feel strongly about things, determined and want to do it, go for it and I wish you good luck, good health and a longer life.

[dave9988]

i guess if you have a 1000 members giving a 1000 baht a month that is a ton of bribe money at your disposal. that's the plan right? buy some Benz for the Puu Yais?

[kiakaha]

No, I'm not barmy, as some of you may be thinking after reading the headers on this posting. Perhaps I have just read one fruitless complaint too many in the Forum

True, many of the grumbles and grouses are trivial. But many are serious and raise genuine concerns about the way we expats are sometimes treated by Thai government agencies and their employees.

A recent case in point is the decision to close the busy Hua Hin immigration office, forcing expats from Hua Hin and Cha Am to use the former immigration office in distant Prachuab Khiri Khan for all their visa requirements and 90-day reports.

Posters are rightly dismayed at the prospect of having to make a round trip of over 250 kilometres for a service that is currently virtually on their doorstep. But unfortunately, as with so many other issues, all the hot air being ventilated is going nowhere helpful.

We don't know why "they" have taken the decision and "they" don't know why we are unhappy with it. That's because neither side talks to the other. I believe they should.

Which brings me to my point. Instead of simply crying on each other's shoulders through the forum, perhaps we need to form a pressure group (an Association of Expats in Thailand or something similar) to represent our interests and redress our grievances.

The first task of such a body should be to try and open cordial lines of communication with those Thai agencies, such as Immigration, responsible for for policing our activities. There are ways in which we could make their lives easier and we might be able to avoid Ruritanian farces of the Hua Hin immigration closure kind.

We should not, however, fall into the trap (which so many of us do as individuals) of simply being reactive. The Association would need to be proactive in demonstrating its care and concern for its adopted country.

One way would be to follow the lead of the Hua Hin expats, who have earned brownie points by putting money and resources into a number of projects designed to benefited indigenous Thais as well as resident foreigners. Expats in other large Thai towns have also been active on behalf of both communities.

An national expats' association could play a crucial role in coordinating effort, raising funds, proposing projects and liasing with national and local government agencies to ensure a successful outcome.

Thais generally might then take a kinder view of us - and be more inclined to listen to what we have to say on issues affecting our lives in their country.

Still think I'm barmy? In addition to providing a platform for discussion of the merits of my idea, perhaps the Forum's fathers would consider sponsoring such an association. They clearly have the talent on tap to get it up and running.

on the third day the lord created the Hua Hin foreign pensioners association...haha.

hey, thats the spirit, go get em

Edited March 6, 2009 by kiakaha

[henryalleman]

I lived in an European country for more than 60 years where foreigners of all kind complain about our laws, the crime rate amongst them is sky high. They demand special rules for them, have no respect what so ever for our culture, traditions and social rules and behaviour, violating our immigration laws, demand to vote even they don't have my nationality, if we complain about this they call us racists, the list of their grievances is endlessly.

Therefore the public in general has a genuine dislike of them.

So I promised myself that if I ever move to another country or culture I will not do and act like them.

So I can only give an old quote ' when you are in Rome act like the Roman and accept Roman laws' because its their country and their rules, if you have problems with it, move out or go back home.

This is not meaning I'm happy whit all rules and regulations in Thailand, but as long I'm not a citizen or have the Thai nationality I'm only a guest, I should accept them and act accordingly.

TV is an excellent forum to explain everything about Thai immigration laws and help people to understand and advise them, but they should never step out of that lines, to be involved in criticizing Thai immigration laws or form pressure groups to change them.

I Think some people not yet realise that Colonial times and attitudes are a thing of the past. Why in heaven name a country should change his immigration laws to please you. They seems to forget that immigration laws are made to protect the country, not to please foreigners of all kind.

OK I prepare myself for all the flaming and personal attacks

Edited March 6, 2009 by henryalleman

[H2oDunc]

Great idea in principle but it aint ever going to work. The best you are going to get is as far as the rotary club gets. In HH they had a good liaison with the Immigration office and it still closed. We have to admit that we as Farang do not come high on the Thai political scene and never will

[mogoso]

TV is an excellent forum to explain everything about Thai immigration laws and help people to understand and advise them, but they should never step out of that lines, to be involved in criticizing Thai immigration laws or form pressure groups to change them.

I Think some people not yet realise that Colonial times and attitudes are a thing of the past. Why in heaven name a country should change his immigration laws to please you. They seems to forget that immigration laws are made to protect the country, not to please foreigners of all kind.

OK I prepare myself for all the flaming and personal attacks

I agree with you. Some people that move to Thailand want things to be as it is where they came from. With laws and attitudes to go with their home countries mores.

I grew up in Florida and the tourists and newbies would come down and continuely tell us what we should be doing, how its done in NY or Mass ect. My favorite bumber sticker was if you don't like how we do things here take I-95 north (large highway)

Sure its a pain in the tukass at times, but the difference in life is why you live in Thailand and not your home country.

[Jingthing]

Lets face it, if there was such an organization, they would move to the top of the line of the whinge targets. I also think we should be careful what we wish for. I wouldn't assume that the people who would end up as leaders of such a scheme would actually be acting in the best interest of all of us. There are always winners and losers in any political game. Sorry to have to use this example as I know many will find it offensive, but I will anyway. There were Jewish leaders in the Warsaw ghetto who negotiated with the Nazis and history does not look kindly on their actions.

Edited March 6, 2009 by Jingthing

[sassienie]

No, I'm not barmy, as some of you may be thinking after reading the headers on this posting. Perhaps I have just read one fruitless complaint too many in the Forum

True, many of the grumbles and grouses are trivial. But many are serious and raise genuine concerns about the way we expats are sometimes treated by Thai government agencies and their employees.

A recent case in point is the decision to close the busy Hua Hin immigration office, forcing expats from Hua Hin and Cha Am to use the former immigration office in distant Prachuab Khiri Khan for all their visa requirements and 90-day reports.

Posters are rightly dismayed at the prospect of having to make a round trip of over 250 kilometres for a service that is currently virtually on their doorstep. But unfortunately, as with so many other issues, all the hot air being ventilated is going nowhere helpful.

We don't know why "they" have taken the decision and "they" don't know why we are unhappy with it. That's because neither side talks to the other. I believe they should.

Which brings me to my point. Instead of simply crying on each other's shoulders through the forum, perhaps we need to form a pressure group (an Association of Expats in Thailand or something similar) to represent our interests and redress our grievances.

The first task of such a body should be to try and open cordial lines of communication with those Thai agencies, such as Immigration, responsible for for policing our activities. There are ways in which we could make their lives easier and we might be able to avoid Ruritanian farces of the Hua Hin immigration closure kind.

We should not, however, fall into the trap (which so many of us do as individuals) of simply being reactive. The Association would need to be proactive in demonstrating its care and concern for its adopted country.

One way would be to follow the lead of the Hua Hin expats, who have earned brownie points by putting money and resources into a number of projects designed to benefited indigenous Thais as well as resident foreigners. Expats in other large Thai towns have also been active on behalf of both communities.

An national expats' association could play a crucial role in coordinating effort, raising funds, proposing projects and liasing with national and local government agencies to ensure a successful outcome.

Thais generally might then take a kinder view of us - and be more inclined to listen to what we have to say on issues affecting our lives in their country.

Still think I'm barmy? In addition to providing a platform for discussion of the merits of my idea, perhaps the Forum's fathers would consider sponsoring such an association. They clearly have the talent on tap to get it up and running.

I have been suggesting something like this on a similar basis for years.

My line of thinking is:

To form an ex-pat committee of advisers for ex-pats who live or work here legitimately or are considering living in Thailand, probably excluding visa runners and tourists.

Such as, advice about investments, doing business in Thailand, Thai law, marriage, visa, property rights & ownership, form ex-pat social meeting places and to how best comply with the system rather than complain about it and much more.

The idea you propose is very good but as some posters correctly point out, we are still only permitted to live here as a privilege of the Thai authorities and can be thrown out at the stroke of a pen within 7 days.

Many including myself would be too afraid to put their names up front for any discrepancies we may have with the authorities, but I believe there is a need for the sort of ex-pat support as I mention above.

Very interesting thread and want to hear what others think.

[MrHammer]

Wouldn't throw cold water on the suggestion just yet.

Could lead to some idea of how it would be received by some Thai TV members

More importantly, is how it would be recieved by local authorities. In practical terms, what's in it for them?

I don't know what the current rate of bribe is for a provincial official, but I am sure we can find out?

Lets play by the rules no?

[JetsetBkk]

...we need to form a pressure group (an Association of Expats in Thailand or something similar) to represent our interests ...

You mean like the Association of Foreigners in Thailand?

[CWMcMurray]

...we need to form a pressure group (an Association of Expats in Thailand or something similar) to represent our interests ...

You mean like the Association of Foreigners in Thailand?

I took a look at the website and couldn't find anything talking about this being an off-line group that meets and does things in the real world.

Unless I am missing something, it is just an internet forum???

If this does happen I think it could be interesting. I like the idea of a non-profit group focused on assisting foreigners and helping the local community. If this does actually gets off the internet and out into the real world I would be interested.

[robblok]

Thai politicians seldom do something for their own people for free, why would they do anything for a farang if there is no gain for them. I dont see how this could work.

[patklang]

I lived in an European country for more than 60 years where foreigners of all kind complain about our laws, the crime rate amongst them is sky high. They demand special rules for them, have no respect what so ever for our culture, traditions and social rules and behaviour, violating our immigration laws, demand to vote even they don't have my nationality, if we complain about this they call us racists, the list of their grievances is endlessly.

Therefore the public in general has a genuine dislike of them.

So I promised myself that if I ever move to another country or culture I will not do and act like them.

So I can only give an old quote ' when you are in Rome act like the Roman and accept Roman laws' because its their country and their rules, if you have problems with it, move out or go back home.

This is not meaning I'm happy whit all rules and regulations in Thailand, but as long I'm not a citizen or have the Thai nationality I'm only a guest, I should accept them and act accordingly.

TV is an excellent forum to explain everything about Thai immigration laws and help people to understand and advise them, but they should never step out of that lines, to be involved in criticizing Thai immigration laws or form pressure groups to change them.

I Think some people not yet realise that Colonial times and attitudes are a thing of the past. Why in heaven name a country should change his immigration laws to please you. They seems to forget that immigration laws are made to protect the country, not to please foreigners of all kind.

OK I prepare myself for all the flaming and personal attacks

No Flaming or attacks,you wrote good sense.Thats oneof the reasons i moved from the UK,so i couldnt support these actions,but good luck to the ones that might.

[Jimjim]

For that 90-day report, instead of forming an association, just mail it in.

[JohnC]

hmmm try google:

Expats' Association of Thailand

10/5 Sukhumvit Soi 33 Bangkok 10110 Thailand

T : (661) 285 4078

F : n/a

W : n/a

E : exat AT thai.com

[teacup]

Forming the association might work, and your voice might be heard, , only if….

You all can make the “positive contributions” toward the local area where you live as a whole, not just for the specific sectors of your community.

“In times”, the immigration policies might be altered favorably toward you.

But sadly “most” expats are here and in it only for themselves.

And

How the thais vs. the expats define the word/act of “positive contributions” is up for a debate.

Just my thought

[Soutpeel]

My line of thinking is:

To form an ex-pat committee of advisers for ex-pats who live or work here legitimately or are considering living in Thailand, probably excluding visa runners and tourists.

Any why exclude those parties..??? do they have any less rights to be here ??

All this is has a nice sentiment, but when I see comments like this, I understand why I have never gotten involved with any form of Expat association where ever I have worked long term in the world...

New Expats Association of Thailand

Tourist Police voluteers etc etc

All fukcing...self serving, who only have their own interests at heart.....

Not trying to be cynical....but the Thai authorities dont give a sh*t what any farang thinks or would like...

Unless you have PR or citizenship....We are all "tourists" here whether working here legally, or OAP's etc

[Markaew]

Those that believe that the Thai immigration is to protect their country are a bit naive. This whole process of making runs to the border and keeping people in a panic of the next hoop they need to jump through is purely revenue generating. Thailand makes a ton of money off this process directly for the government and indirectly through the economy. They have this process tweaked perfectly to generate revenue at what can be afforded by expats and not making you say screw it I'm going home.

As for this association, how do you expect to negotiate with corruption? What is going to motivate them to listen? They don't care if you leave because another is waiting to take your place. In another country this might make sense, but for now it gets no traction from my point of view.

The organization would have to generate funds because the only way to gain any ground is for the organization to hire a lawyer and stay in court. Then again, I am being naive because the courts could care less as well.

[PeaceBlondie]

In six years here, I've seen leading TEFL directors make an appointment with a poo-yai at the Ministry of Education, and the guy never showed up. No officers call these guys for advice, either. Our local expat groups are rife with internecine warfare. In this culture, we have no voice unless we put up 50 million baht in publicity first, to drown out the lese majeste cases committed by farang, the pedos, the drug dealers, etc.

I will not even suggest you have six luk krung children who might change Thailand in 100 years. Just fit in as best we can, fade to gray or fade away.

[capco1]

I keep hearing a song in my head while reading this post...........Dream......the impossible dream!

[ozzieovaseas]

Not a bad idea in theory,

but when the Thai authorities hear of this they will surely legislate a fee of 20 million baht to licence the association,

then 5 million to renew licence every three months at office at Prachuab, Khiri Khan

[henryalleman]

I like to point out that normally immigration rules can be different for different nationalities, just look to the Visa costs in Laos. As Fleming I paid 30$Us, An American pay 35 $US, I remember correct there are about 5 or 6 different prices.

Such differences are normally negotiated by bilateral agreements between countries. So the only ones who can discus and negotiated this rules is your own government, not some pressure group.

[Heng]

In six years here, I've seen leading TEFL directors make an appointment with a poo-yai at the Ministry of Education, and the guy never showed up. No officers call these guys for advice, either. Our local expat groups are rife with internecine warfare. In this culture, we have no voice unless we put up 50 million baht in publicity first, to drown out the lese majeste cases committed by farang, the pedos, the drug dealers, etc.

I will not even suggest you have six luk krung children who might change Thailand in 100 years. Just fit in as best we can, fade to gray or fade away.

Two mice fell into a bucket of cream...