Red-shirts Battle Blue-shirts In Pattaya

[mc2]

guilty or not, the guy in my avatar won this round, so did democracy.

Democracy is not about winers and losers, and if you think this is a victory for democracy then you are pretty blind.

democracy will always lose when military inteferes with peoples voting rights.

democracy in thailand is going through a conflict stage .... what is important is that people get the say and get to choose the government - not some pressure group or the military.

now you might say the reds are a pressure group, yes they are, but what do they want ? ELECTIONS

thats democracy.

[stevenl]

I'm waiting for the PAD leaders to come out and say that entering government and private property is not the way to do it.

the PAD have been rather quiet lately,

well, who can blame them, they have "guilty" written all over their face.havent got a leg to stand on.

Just like the guy in your avitar.

guilty or not, the guy in my avatar won this round,yes so did democracy. LOL

[LuckyFive8888]

Asian countries are not READY for DEMOCRACY!!! People cannot handle democracy and corrupt politicians are usually exploiting it to their own interests. Singapore is one the rich countries in Asia and in fact is not fully democratic. It's' time that Thailand and other Asian countries (present in the summit) to realise that they need a "HEAVY HAND" to restore orders in their countries.

Bring on the tanks and wipe all unruly people shirts on the streets no matter colour their shirt is and restore order in PATTAYA!!!

[slim]

My wife tells me that in most of Issan Thaksin is referred to as "Paw".

Your wife is from Isaan? And you support the reds? I'm shocked!

Could there be a connection?

Yes its called Thai Citizenship..............Whats yours?

Of course I support Thaksin. He's done more for the people of Thailand than the PAD whose only interest is in Bangkok. Why don't you open your eyes and try undertstand what is happening here and what Thaksin Shinawatra has done for the people of Thailand as opposed the PAD whose only interest are themselves and the other middle class and pseudo upper class people of the capital. Have you taken a look at the current Prime Minister recently?

[deprogrammed]

guilty or not, the guy in my avatar won this round, so did democracy.

Democracy is not about winers and losers, and if you think this is a victory for democracy then you are pretty blind.

democracy will always lose when military inteferes with peoples voting rights.

democracy in thailand is going through a conflict stage .... what is important is that people get the say and get to choose the government - not some pressure group or the military.

now you might say the reds are a pressure group, yes they are, but what do they want ? ELECTIONS

thats democracy.

When you have a nation of people with the mind set of 10 year old children - democracy isnt an option. Especialy when they are ruled by 14 year olds!

[slim]

My wife tells me that in most of Issan Thaksin is referred to as "Paw".

Your wife is from Isaan? And you support the reds? I'm shocked!

Could there be a connection?

Yes its called Thai Citizenship..............Whats yours?

Of course I support Thaksin. He's done more for the people of Thailand than the PAD whose only interest is in Bangkok. Why don't you open your eyes and try undertstand what is happening here and what Thaksin Shinawatra has done for the people of Thailand as opposed the PAD whose only interest are themselves and the other middle class and pseudo upper class people of the capital. Have you taken a look at the current Prime Minister recently?

[mrtoad]

guilty or not, the guy in my avatar won this round, so did democracy.

Democracy is not about winers and losers, and if you think this is a victory for democracy then you are pretty blind.

democracy will always lose when military inteferes with peoples voting rights.

democracy in thailand is going through a conflict stage .... what is important is that people get the say and get to choose the government - not some pressure group or the military.

now you might say the reds are a pressure group, yes they are, but what do they want ? ELECTIONS

thats democracy.

If it was about ideolgy then it would be different, however the people agitating are only in it as pawns of self interested parties. If Thaksin beleived in democracy, the law etc, etc then he would have returned to Thailand and fought his corner. As it is, he is nothing but a dirty little coward who has mobilised a unch of pawns to do his dirty work, whilst all of his family have ran out of the country. BTW, I support neither the YelloW or the red, they are both as bad as each other. What this country didn't need at this time, was this type of BS. This is as disgraceful as the last bunch of idiots in yellow.

[rainman]

Hmm, masked Abhisit supporters with slingshots and bats. Look how peaceful they are!

[mc2]

The PAD have been quite critical of the military and coup makers recently which is interesting.

Rumour has it , they got very little in return for their efforts.

"They are not amused" and also maybe not convinced how this will swing.

Hence protect their backs seems like a good option.

plus, without their allies .... they can't initiate things with the same level of confidence.

i suppose no surprise they are sitting still.

[jbhh]

My wife tells me that in most of Issan Thaksin is referred to as "Paw".

Your wife is from Isaan? And you support the reds? I'm shocked!

Could there be a connection?

Yes its called Thai Citizenship..............Whats yours?

Of course I support Thaksin. He's done more for the people of Thailand than the PAD whose only interest is in Bangkok. Why don't you open your eyes and try undertstand what is happening here and what Thaksin Shinawatra has done for the people of Thailand as opposed the PAD whose only interest are themselves and the other middle class and pseudo upper class people of the capital. Have you taken a look at the current Prime Minister recently?

How much time did Thaksin have to do "good" and how much of that time did he use to exploit the country for his own good? It's a bit ridiculous to try and compare Thaksin with the PAD me thinks. And to to good is to give people a couple of thousand baht to buy their loyalty... well, I would call that pure exploitation of people who have no education and can't see further than their nose.

[Robski]

Red-shirts battle blue-shirts in Pattaya

The outnumbered blue-shirted local people.

So far, the security authorities had not step in to stop the clash yet.

-- The Nation 2009-04-11

Why are local people being used as security and why aren't the real security forces stepping in?

Sounds like an engineered situation and some rather bias reporting.

[edwardmoulton]

I am not alighned with any movement, in fact I have no bias at all except for correct political democracy and rights.

However..........

The fact remains.....the DEMOCRATICLY elected overnment was brought down by a few behind the scene string pullers manipulating a few hundred yellow people for their own greed (ends) and installed a group of "puppets" to do their bidding.....

Now that the majority of people demand a new (fairly run) election, they are in the wrong??? Note.....asking for an election not a return to the previous government ....

If the present administration (if you can call it that) have confidence in their ability and believe they are right, why not hold an election???

The yellows were given free rein to kill and maime....and wreck the Thai economy......

The reds have been peacefull to date...only putting pressure to bear for a fair deal......why condemm the reds from acting withing their rights?

There's a few of you here mssing the plot (again).

1st - Remember who started the big rally chaos, anything goes, the yellows and they too were drafted in on 200bt bribes.

After the general election the counrty voted and so beit put Takins cronnies back in power, but if that was the voice of the people then that is democracy. The yellow shirts are made up of the rich, elite royalists of this country, and they were determined to take power after the last coupe. But things didn't go their way so they have done everything they can to get into office, sacking 2 cabinets (and closing them down for 5yrs), until there was no opposition left. Notice how when they took over what should be the most secure places in the country (2 international airports) there was no battles with police or armed forces, that's cos the rich have them all in their pockets, plus the top posts are filled with family members of the rich and elite.

The reds are not all Taksin supporters (I definately ain't I think he's a theiving b@st@rd that should rot in hel_l) some just want democracy, that means a vote from every corner of the country, not just the BKK elite which is what they have right now, so the red shirts should protest and upset the apple cart.

2nd - It's already been written here that all demos have been peaceful thus far, and now the Blue shirts pop up, all reports are saying the red shirts came armed and attacked the blues, yet the 2 people shot were in red. When are you gonna start reading between the lines. The reds came armed because they knew what they were going to be up against. Why not yellow shirts? cos that would be representing the government, so just dress the old gang in new colours (simple innit!).

3rd - Who are the blue shirts, DUH!! They are police and military sent in to do it dirty style with heavy handed tactics. when it gets really bloody the government can say their hands were clean, that's why there are no heavy police/military/yellow shirt presence. Come-on, get real guys, go and wash your eyes and ears out.

BUT REMEMBER THIS - FOR THE SAKE OF DEMOCRACY THE RED SHIRTS MUST PROTEST AND OUST THE GOVERNMENT

Can I just extend a big 'WELL DONE' to the Red Heroes who just pulled off a great victory!!

yes, i agree

this is a massive moral booster for the reds

i'd like to see Abhisit talk his way out of this to the foreign media. his reputation is in shambles.

its only a matter of time before he stands down. he has shown he can't anticipate , can't lead, can't manage and can't execute.

all he can do is speak good.

Spot on...

[rainman]

Thais have a choice:

1. A prime minister that pockets money for himself and does something for the country.

2. A prime minister that pockets money for himself and does nothing for the country.

Hint: (Abhisit is #2 on the ballot).

Edited April 11, 2009 by rainman

[mc2]

Red-shirts battle blue-shirts in Pattaya

The outnumbered blue-shirted local people.

So far, the security authorities had not step in to stop the clash yet.

-- The Nation 2009-04-11

Why are local people being used as security and why aren't the real security forces stepping in?

Sounds like an engineered situation and some rather bias reporting.

not only is it severely bias, its overly dramatic. they claim the local residents were "weeping with fear" at the red protesters

as for the "local" people.... i am sure they are hired thugs to cover for police/military/goverment responsibility.

notice the bandannas (yes, in this hot weather) , sunglasses, hoods ?

probably active members of the military or police looking for some work and extra money on the side, without the hassle of having to look like professionals.

[wayfarer108]

All have seen that the reds have had big meetings since late last year until now that they have no weapons. They have no back up so if they have weapons, they will be cleared by tear gas.

I don't know why The Nation had this news.

2 reds were shot this morning and were sent to hospitals.

Watch a little TV news, plenty of news video footage of reds throwing projectiles (rocks, bottles, pipes), clubbing ordinary people who resist their advances etc. Full public record now.

[Indra]

You see, democracy in Thailand will be working like this in the future (unless things change):

1. Elections are held.

2. The new government needs to be approved by the elite (now using a front called the 'PAD')

3. If the 'PAD' don't like the government, it will be removed.

4. Elections are held again

5. (Repeat steps 2. and 3. until a government is elected that the 'PAD' approves)

And there you have a brand new, democratically elected government that the people have chosen (or that the people were forced to choose because all others were removed and banned from office).

AGREE!!!

If PAD said that Thai villagers are being bought to vote Thaksin, then they should educate the villagers to vote correctly, not by putting shame to their own country by besieging the airports.

I don't say that red shirts are good people, but at least they are honest with their support to Thaksin, instead of PAD who claims that they are good people.

My friend in Indonesia called me after he read news about Abhisit giving money to Thais and said "Abhisit is no different than Thaksin and Indonesia government"

[LuckyFive8888]

Hmm, masked Abhisit supporters with slingshots and bats. Look how peaceful they are!

they don't looked like soldiers to me as suggested...

[rainman]

Red-shirts battle blue-shirts in Pattaya

The outnumbered blue-shirted local people.

So far, the security authorities had not step in to stop the clash yet.

-- The Nation 2009-04-11

Why are local people being used as security and why aren't the real security forces stepping in?

Mis-management by Abhisit? He's still guaranteeing security for foreign politicians while the Japanese minister could literally hug the red shirts on his way to the meeting. Awesome security that is.

Edited April 11, 2009 by rainman

[webfact]

Welcome Back "Monty Python's Flying Circus!

Edited April 11, 2009 by webfact

[MyphuketLife]

Red-shirts battle blue-shirts in Pattaya

The outnumbered blue-shirted local people.

So far, the security authorities had not step in to stop the clash yet.

-- The Nation 2009-04-11

Why are local people being used as security and why aren't the real security forces stepping in?

Sounds like an engineered situation and some rather bias reporting.

Could not agree more, why was the "security" forces assigned to protect the SUMMITT not part of holding them back?

Why was it all "locals" that happened to be wearing blue shirts at the time?

[rafval]

theres 60,000,000 people in Thailand, lets say 30,000,000 are voting age, that crowd at the most is 100,000, thats 0.3 of a percent of voters, Im not saying their views should be disregarded but to say they represent the majority is pure speculation, they may just have to wait for the next elections as happens in other democracies

Other democracies?

Thaksin's T.R.T. come to power - the P.A.D. call foul and have the party abolished and its members barred from office.

The P.P.P. come to power - the P.A.D. call foul, storm Suvarnabhumi Airport until the Contitutional Court (PAD) dissolves the PPP and bars its members from holding office.

"as happens in other democracies?".

Ignoring the constitutional will of the people is not democracy.

yes, thats what happens in other democracies, they operate under rule of law thru justice systems, Im not saying its perfect here but its a start

[rainman]

not only is it severely bias, its overly dramatic. they claim the local residents were "weeping with fear" at the red protesters

I bet they were watching the daily soap opera and their favorite movie star nearly kissed the girl he's been chasing for the last 500 episodes, while romantic music was playing.

[LuckyFive8888]

Thais have a choice:

1. A prime minister that pockets money for himself and does something for the country.

2. A prime minister that pockets money for himself and does nothing for the country.

Hint: (Abhisit is #2 on the ballot).

any proof about the #2 on taking money? while #1 has already been proven to take all he could. be a bit more intellectual about this topic before you post. don't mislead the forumers here....

Edited April 11, 2009 by LuckyFive8888

[NanLaew]

So as falangs we must, in order not to be making political statements, refrain from wearing yellow, red, and now blue shirts.

Or be like a Brit sexpat and go completely shirtless (head-shave and tattoo optional)?

[edwardmoulton]

You see, democracy in Thailand will be working like this in the future (unless things change):

1. Elections are held.

2. The new government needs to be approved by the elite (now using a front called the 'PAD')

3. If the 'PAD' don't like the government, it will be removed.

4. Elections are held again

5. (Repeat steps 2. and 3. until a government is elected that the 'PAD' approves)

And there you have a brand new, democratically elected government that the people have chosen (or that the people were forced to choose because all others were removed and banned from office).

Thais have a choice:

1. A prime minister that pockets money for himself and does something for the country.

2. A prime minister that pockets money for himself and does nothing for the country.

Hint: (Abhisit is #2 on the ballot).

And I am still waiting for someone, just someone to be able to say something in support of Abhisit, Suthep, Kasit or aof the other muppet show. All I see here is attacks on Thaksin to cover the pathetic rule of the current government.

Most of us here accept that Thaksin did wrong but he also did a lot of good as you say. Abhisit has no intention of doing any good as it is not in his interest or rather the interest of his backers who just want a dumbed down workforce to make them money.

This pressure on the government is about democracy. Now the ASEAN summit is over Abhisist can resign as he said last week he could not resign becasue he had to host it. No need now...

[spidercat]

Hmm, masked Abhisit supporters with slingshots and bats. Look how peaceful they are!

they don't looked like soldiers to me as suggested...

Enlighten us - What do they look like then??

[wayfarer108]

Red-shirts battle blue-shirts in Pattaya

The outnumbered blue-shirted local people.

So far, the security authorities had not step in to stop the clash yet.

-- The Nation 2009-04-11

Why are local people being used as security and why aren't the real security forces stepping in?

Sounds like an engineered situation and some rather bias reporting.

not only is it severely bias, its overly dramatic. they claim the local residents were "weeping with fear" at the red protesters

as for the "local" people.... i am sure they are hired thugs to cover for police/military/goverment responsibility.

notice the bandannas (yes, in this hot weather) , sunglasses, hoods ?

probably active members of the military or police looking for some work and extra money on the side, without the hassle of having to look like professionals.

I witnessed a scene yesterday morning myself where ordinary folks - office workers, vendors, bystanders - got fed up with the reds and successfully forced their retreat. The red mob were advancing up Narathiwat Rd with their taxi protectors, and when the taxis parked across Narathiwat to block traffic, other drivers in cars on their way to and from work or home began honking their horns fiercely, and shouting for them to get out of the way.

The reds had miscalculated timing-wise, as the ordinary cars soon had the taxis hemmed in and kept up the honking. I saw quite a few reds flee right then but most stood their ground. Office workers in buildings on either side of the road looked out their windows to see what the commotion was, and within 15 minutes the reds were completely outnumbered but shouting office workers, street vendors, virtually everyone in the immediate neighbourhood, and both taxis and pedestrian reds were forced to retreat back on Narathiwat to Sathon.

I told my wife about it when I got home last night and she said a TV news crew had captured the same incident on video and showed excerpts on the news.

[LuckyFive8888]

Hmm, masked Abhisit supporters with slingshots and bats. Look how peaceful they are!

they don't looked like soldiers to me as suggested...

Enlighten us - What do they look like then??

they looked like tuktuk drivers to me? are you enlighten now? if you are in thailand you do know what i mean...

[jbhh]

theres 60,000,000 people in Thailand, lets say 30,000,000 are voting age, that crowd at the most is 100,000, thats 0.3 of a percent of voters, Im not saying their views should be disregarded but to say they represent the majority is pure speculation, they may just have to wait for the next elections as happens in other democracies

Other democracies?

Thaksin's T.R.T. come to power - the P.A.D. call foul and have the party abolished and its members barred from office.

The P.P.P. come to power - the P.A.D. call foul, storm Suvarnabhumi Airport until the Contitutional Court (PAD) dissolves the PPP and bars its members from holding office.

"as happens in other democracies?".

Ignoring the constitutional will of the people is not democracy.

T.R.T. were foul

P.P.P were foul

so did the PAD not have the right do demonstrate and pressure the courts into making a decision, before the government was able to change the law/constitution preventing the court ruling (removing the dissolution penalty for vote buying)?

The reds want new elections, but I think everyone knows who would be elected - a Thaksin puppet government that later will be found guilty (again) of buying votes... at which point PAD will cal foul and go on the streets again.

Does anyone here have a solution to this never ending circle?!

Edited April 11, 2009 by jbhh

[Robski]

Thais have a choice:

1. A prime minister that pockets money for himself and does something for the country.

2. A prime minister that pockets money for himself and does nothing for the country.

Hint: (Abhisit is #2 on the ballot).

You must be reading the wrong paper rainman, as much as some would like to make this all about personalities,

the underlying disagreement is the right to vote and the integrity of the democratic process.