LivinginKata Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 Let's stick to the OT. Debate about land ownership and property contracts has it's own sub forum in the Business section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaiwanderer Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 (edited) If the property investor is willing to take high risks, he can purchase a nice unit on preconstruction. The risk one takes if the project will ever start and more importantly, will it ever finish. If the project sells well and finishes within a year or two of planned completion date, the investor was lucky and has a nice unit to be proud of. from: note both this and main lersuang site link to infinity etc. and Hua Hin CC but only the HHCC link appears bad on both Edited May 9, 2009 by LivinginKata Blog link removed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LivinLOS Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 Let's stick to the OT. Debate about land ownership and property contracts has it's own sub forum in the Business section. OK sure. My point was less the standard land debate than it was dont complain that agents are not totally honest, when their whole purpose is fundamentally circumventing laws. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatinBKk Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 Press like this certainly is not a positive for the Phuket market and there have historically been few project defaults in Phuket in the past. This looks to be a developing story as the UK news has given only Joe Cole's side of the story. There needs to be a balance in the sources for the story and certainly a statement from the Phuket group would be helpful. But that is only because we have had the good times...now the world economy is in freefall.....much much more of this will be happening..anybody buying in Thailand now needs to have their head examined Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaiwanderer Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 were there not problems for this developer before recent world economic issues? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaiwanderer Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 were there not problems for this developer before recent world economic issues? think to late to edit and add to that? anyhow see joe's 'patter' for his investment http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/English-Foot...ua-t130824.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baabaabobo Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 This is not even a Gazette story! Pagallim simply copy/pasted the so-called "gazette story" into the forum without even noticing that the story came from thephuketinsider.com – not from any Gazette reporters. The gazette very clearly indicates that fact on their Website. As a close observer of the Phuket property market I looked back on past issues of PG and found Lersuang has not run any ads in the phuket gazette for at least the past 7 or 8 months, so it's silly to suggest that the gazette is trying to stall for time to protect an "advertiser". It's equally silly to suggest that all Thai newspapers lack objectivity when it's precisely objectivity that the gazette is seeking to achieve by balancing the Daily Mirror story. The gazette merely wishes to get comments from the developer. That's basic fairness. I look forward to the gazette's special report due next week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LivinLOS Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 http://www.phuketgazette.net/dailynews/ind...5&display=1 NOTE: The Phuket Gazette had no difficulty in reaching management at Lersuang's Phuket office for comment yesterday. Seems like they sure reprinted it.. The source may have been the insider but they added and embellished the defense.. Plus its not like the insider and the gazette dont have a relationship between them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steadfast Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 The Phuket Gazette will not print anything which might upset their sponsors/advertisers. I wrote a letter to them pointing out that whilst they were reporting on the killing of the dugong/manatee, Tops in Central were selling 'dugong parts in oil'. Never got printed and never heard anything back. Shills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sungsom Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 For any of those who know lersuang and the rumors that surround them ,it's about time someone with influence to investigate , then if need be come down hard on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaiwanderer Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 This is not even a Gazette story! Pagallim simply copy/pasted the so-called "gazette story" into the forum without even noticing that the story came from thephuketinsider.com – not from any Gazette reporters. The gazette very clearly indicates that fact on their Website.As a close observer of the Phuket property market I looked back on past issues of PG and found Lersuang has not run any ads in the phuket gazette for at least the past 7 or 8 months, so it's silly to suggest that the gazette is trying to stall for time to protect an "advertiser". It's equally silly to suggest that all Thai newspapers lack objectivity when it's precisely objectivity that the gazette is seeking to achieve by balancing the Daily Mirror story. The gazette merely wishes to get comments from the developer. That's basic fairness. I look forward to the gazette's special report due next week. PG published the story, credited bill barnett (who is a 'guest columnist' or whatever) and added to it they have got comment from lersuang but need a week to work on a special report (for 'balance and objectivity')- so why bother with a stalling piece? its not like PG have never had a relationship with lersuang or that PG has an interest in defending the property market in phuket generally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LivinginKata Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 Monday, May 11, 2009 More than rooms on sale at Thai hotels PHUKET: More than 100 hotels and resorts in Thailand are now for sale, as operators succumb to the impacts of the economic crisis and political unrest, industry insiders say. The number is expected to rise if the situation does not improve within two years, said Chanin Donavanik, chief executive officer of one of Thailand's largest hotel chain operators, Dusit International. "This year is the worst for our hotel industry in 20 years," he said. As if the worsening global economy and domestic political unrest weren't enough, Thailand's hotel and tourism industry now faces the threat of swine flu. A property sales representative in Samui, who declined to be named, said most of the hotels being sold are in the major centres and provinces of Bangkok, Phuket, Koh Samui, Hua Hin, Pattaya and Chiang Mai. "They include not only small hotels but also five-star hotels," she said. Hotels in famous destinations such as Samui and Phuket have been the first to feel the pinch of the economic and political problems, as their local economies mainly rely on tourists, whose numbers have declined continuously since November's temporary seizure of Suvarnabhumi and Don Muang airports by opponents of the then government. Phuket's visitor numbers have declined by 60 per cent in the high season from November to March. Koh Samui benefited after The tsunami wrought its destruction on the Andaman coast in 2004, which saw many foreign tourists opt not to visit Phuket. Hotels mushroomed on the island in subsequent years. "But the situation has changed. Many new hotels on Samui are suffering from waning tourist numbers. Some owners have decided to sell as they cannot make any income from tourism, while still being saddled with loans," said the sales representative. Forward bookings for Koh Samui's high season at the end of this year has been very slow, as tourists seek to avoid turbulence in Thailand. According to the anonymous property agent's firm, Samui Buri Resort and Spa is selling for 1.1 billion baht, while newly opened Villa Lawana wants 1.5 billion. Meanwhile, Ban Taling Ngam is being sold at public auction, listed at 1.8 billion baht, and Nora Beach Resort and Spa is offered at 2 to 2.5 billion. Some hotels in Chiang Mai have suffered the same fate. Unlike Phuket or Samui, Chiang Mai's tourism sector relies mainly on Thai visitors. The province has witnessed shrinking domestic tourist numbers this year, as Thais are hardly in the mood to spend and travel amid the gloomy economic conditions. As a result, one of the top luxury hotels in the province is reportedly being put up for sale, along with three other hotels in Chiang Mai. In the capital, 24 hotels are reportedly on the market, including the Millennium Hilton, Swissotel Le Concorde and The Emerald Hotel. Prakit Chinamourphong, president of the Thai Hotels Association, said many hotels have struggled to survive the impacts of the economic and political unrest, offering heavy room discounts, making staff cuts and selling off businesses. Up to 70,000 hotel employees are expected to lose their jobs if the problems are not solved, he said. To deal with the crisis, the Tourism Authority of Thailand (TAT) and the private sector are preparing a series of tourism promotions. The agency also plans to venture overseas to rebuild confidence, joining the Arabian Travel Mart in Dubai this month. Moreover, the TAT is revising its marketing strategies to encourage non-high season tourism. Nonetheless, the agency has revised downward its projected number of tourist arrivals for this year from 14.8 million to approximately 12 million. -- Phuket Gazette 2009-05-11 – The Nation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Burr Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 (edited) No worries. As soon as the tourists hear about "Summer" season in Phuket, they'll be back in droves. Edited May 11, 2009 by Sir Burr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenwood01 Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 Wow at that articles. It's sad when you know that thailand could fix ALL of his problem by canceling one of the major soap shows and having some kind of guy wearing a ton of color to keep attention telling every thai. "Do not openly scam the tourist, he is your money and will not give you money twice if you do so" "Do not be an annoying ass to the tourist, he wont come back" "Do not liter so much in ex-paradise spots" "Do not murder farangs, for each 1 of them dead thousands are staying home" "Do not block means of transportation for farangs, if you want to rebel against our country do it where thais go, or you will lose money again" Add a couple more and the country is saved + 555 at the hotels thinking anyone would pay 1bil baht for their spa that gets 1 client a month. Always wondered who decided to launch new 1million star spas every single week when most of them are always empty when you pass by them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Burr Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 We are going to enter a period of intense competition for businesses. Hotel against hotel, bar against bar, restaurant against restaurant etc. Probably no bad thing for tourists and residents. Competition will up quality and value for money and weed out those that don't come up to par. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huggybear Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 (edited) sarcasm from SB, say it ain't so ! Edited May 11, 2009 by huggybear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Burr Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 sarcasm from SB, say it ain't so ! This time (believe it, or, not) no sarcasm. I mean every word. It's inevitable. Too many businesses fighting for market share in a shrinking market results in fierce competion and/or bancruptcies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boater Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 This time (believe it, or, not) no sarcasm. I mean every word.It's inevitable. Too many businesses fighting for market share in a shrinking market results in fierce competion and/or bancruptcies. very very true, but no bangruptsy i think, more just a runner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Somtamnication Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 Not only will we see more and more hotel and resort sales, unemployment for THAI staff, etc etc., but also more business to business assassinations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boater Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 but also more business to business assassinations. ah , the good old thai way of sorting distbutes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenwood01 Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 but also more business to business assassinations. ah , the good old thai way of sorting distbutes more like http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_Selection As with the driving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
83110pkt Posted May 15, 2009 Share Posted May 15, 2009 Very sad that the Phuket Gazette comes up with such responses to stories such as this. Instead of pressing the developer for an immediate response, they accept this 'coming soon' kind of attitude. Don't they realise that most countries recognise this kind of response as being corrupt in the sense that they do not want to upset their sponsors!!!! Shame on the Phuket Gazette. Get the facts and print them, otherwise keep taking the advertising money and admit you are not a NEWSpaper anymore. People are not interested in 'managed' responses i.e. we'll talk about it again next week/preparing a special report! Either the story is true, or not. Print it, and stand by the principle of honest reporting. The very fact that they reported it as a 'One sided news report' is a joke, the opportunity is there to make it a 'two sided news report' and only the Phuket Gazette failed to make it such. As a very close friend of the Lersuang group and a buyer of one of their homes, I will answer this for them (hope they dont mind). from what I have heard The Phuket Gazette contacted Lersuang late last week, they spoke over the telephone and Lersuang answered their questions although, they decided to do a face to face interview to get out the full story to everyone and to show proof of any of the answers to the phuket gazette, the interview didn't take place until earlier on this week (I believe it has already been done), the reason being is that the story is quite complex as everything in the Mirror has been totaly fabricated probably because THEY DIDN'T EVEN TRY TO CONTACT LERSUANG!!! (hence the phuket gazette saying one side story!) In fact Lersuang didn't know anything about the article until it came out! I dont think that the mirror even contacted Joe Cole as it doesn't say they did, it was more than likely a story built up by angry buyers and investors, who dont actually know the truth. (which unfortunately is Lersuangs fault for not putting it straight in the first place, but im sure they have their reasons and hopefully all will tell in the next phuket gazette issue.) I dont know everything although I do know that Joe Cole did not put a penny into the project in the first place and I dont think he would say he did (hence the article couldnt have come from Joe Cole). I think it is common knowlege in companies that work with Lersuang around here that they are not the owners of Hua Hin Country Club they are actually just shareholders (but the buyers couldnt possibly have known this as it has never been told and after all Lersaung were promoting it). Before I go off the TOPIC I think the answer to the questions on why the phuket gazette didnt write up the story last week is possibly because they just couldnt do it in time and wanted the face to face interview to ge the truth, they probably just wrote that brief explanation so people knew they were following up on it although maybe they should have just left it until they wrote the article. I dont think it is fair for people to say that the gazette is protecting their advertisers because as someone who follows properties in phuket I haven't seen an adverisment in the Phuket Gazette from Lersuang in a very long time! I hope that Lersuang gives their full side of the story as it is only fair and I will be looking foward to reading it.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaiwanderer Posted May 15, 2009 Share Posted May 15, 2009 (edited) As a very close friend of the Lersuang group and a buyer of one of their homes, I will answer this for them (hope they dont mind). (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) i will take you on your word that that is the extent of your connections with them and sufficiently motivates you to join TV and defend them with your first post from what I have heard The Phuket Gazette contacted Lersuang late last week, they spoke over the telephone and Lersuang answered their questions although, they decided to do a face to face interview to get out the full story to everyone and to show proof of any of the answers to the phuket gazette, the interview didn't take place until earlier on this week (I believe it has already been done), the reason being is that the story is quite complex sure - has a single brick been laid, will any ever be laid, is HHCC and or lersuang solvent and viable moving forward, can and will investors receive refunds and or additional compensation ad infinitum? So many issues as everything in the Mirror has been totaly fabricated everything? so buyers are happily in situ in what they bought? probably because THEY DIDN'T EVEN TRY TO CONTACT LERSUANG!!! you know this for a fact do you? I assume you will be equally sceptical of the reporting standards of the Gazette? (hence the phuket gazette saying one side story!) In fact Lersuang didn't know anything about the article until it came out! I dont think that the mirror even contacted Joe Cole as it doesn't say they did, it was more than likely a story built up by angry buyers and investors, who dont actually know the truth. I imagine at the very least they know whether they have received what was promised (which unfortunately is Lersuangs fault for not putting it straight in the first place, but im sure they have their reasons I’m sure they have their reasons too and hopefully all will tell in the next phuket gazette issue.) I live in that hope also I dont know everything surely not? although I do know that Joe Cole did not put a penny into the project in the first place and I dont think he would say he did (hence the article couldnt have come from Joe Cole). HHCC own website has a PDF article stating ‘Cole has invested in a luxury apartment in the HHCC' with an attributed comment to Mr Cole ‘I’m very happy I invested here’. That article also states HHCC is developed by the Lersuang Group and there is comment attributed to their employees. Are you going to suggest THIS was a one sided story also? (well it is but not in the same way I think it is common knowlege in companies that work with Lersuang around here that they are not the owners of Hua Hin Country Club they are actually just shareholders (but the buyers couldnt possibly have known this as it has never been told and after all Lersaung were promoting it). So what exactly is the distinction you are trying to make and what is its relevance? Also the buyers will know with whom their contracts are with. Before I go off the TOPIC I think the answer to the questions on why the phuket gazette didnt write up the story last week is possibly because they just couldnt do it in time and wanted the face to face interview to ge the truth, they probably just wrote that brief explanation so people knew they were following up on it although maybe they should have just left it until they wrote the article. yep, as I posted earlier headless chicken time – better to say nothing until full truth available I dont think it is fair for people to say that the gazette is protecting their advertisers because as someone who follows properties in phuket I haven't seen an adverisment in the Phuket Gazette from Lersuang in a very long time! I hope that Lersuang gives their full side of the story as it is only fair and I will be looking foward to reading it.......... they have heavily advertised in the past, Gazette has advertising revenue generally from phuket property - beyond that I will not speculate here on potential motivations for earnestly striving for ‘balance’ (as an side do you also go by the name sweetpea on another forum?) Edited May 15, 2009 by thaiwanderer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LivinLOS Posted May 15, 2009 Share Posted May 15, 2009 I think it is common knowlege in companies that work with Lersuang around here that they are not the owners of Hua Hin Country Club they are actually just shareholders Erm.. What the hel_l is a shareholder then ?? A shareholder IS a partial owner.. Nice try Lersuang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
83110pkt Posted May 16, 2009 Share Posted May 16, 2009 you to join TV and defend them with your first post If you would check better you would see that I didnt just join! probably because THEY DIDN'T EVEN TRY TO CONTACT LERSUANG!!! you know this for a fact do you? I assume you will be equally sceptical of the reporting standards of the Gazette? As I said I am a close friend and what have the Gazette done wrong???? They did contact them after all! what do you mean by sweat pea....???? its not up to me to defend them, im sure they can defend theirselves... Id keep this clean if I was you otherwise the post will be removed by the gazette. I dont think they want their story here before people have read it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LivinLOS Posted May 16, 2009 Share Posted May 16, 2009 Id keep this clean if I was you otherwise the post will be removed by the gazette. I dont think they want their story here before people have read it! Is that a threat ?? Are you insinuating the gazette will lean on ThaiVisa to control the content of forum posts they dont like ?? If so source please.. if not what do you mean ?? A very interesting post.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loverboy44 Posted May 16, 2009 Share Posted May 16, 2009 Fact 1: HHCC was promoted heavily scince 2006 and scince then not 1 brick was laid. Fact 2: Customers bought off plan and money was paid. Fact 3: The project is stopped and noone got 1 penny back. Fact 4: Joe Cole promoted this and, at least one i personally know, bought because of this. Fact 5: Someone found this out and made an article about it. Who did wrong now? The one who wrote the article or the people that cheated on the customers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaiwanderer Posted May 16, 2009 Share Posted May 16, 2009 you to join TV and defend them with your first postIf you would check better you would see that I didnt just join! ----please accept my massive apologies you joined as long ago as 22nd feb and waited until this thread to make your first post, which was in defence lersuang and the phuket gazette probably because THEY DIDN'T EVEN TRY TO CONTACT LERSUANG!!! you know this for a fact do you? I assume you will be equally sceptical of the reporting standards of the Gazette? As I said I am a close friend and what have the Gazette done wrong???? They did contact them after all! ----so you do know this as a fact (must also be a friend of the mirror then by your reasoning of knowledge and facts). The Gazette published a half hearted 'rebuttal' that was essentially a holding article 'until next week' even though they had spoken with lersuang already. As I said earlier why the need for a special report to clear things up - oh i forgot its 'complex' according to you. what do you mean by sweat pea....???? ------sweetpea is a member of another forum who like you magically leapt to lersuang's defence for purely altruisitc reasons - oh to have friends like these its not up to me to defend them, im sure they can defend theirselves... Id keep this clean if I was you otherwise the post will be removed by the gazette. I dont think they want their story here before people have read it! I too am interested in this threat. I have kept this clean (hence my stated refusal to post unsubstantiated speculation - unlike you). Are you 'friends' with the Gazette also and can therefore (by your reasoning) state this as FACT. So what about the other comments I raised in response to your first post seeing as you know the facts so well and are keen to rebutt any possiblility lersuang are at fault? (I am particularly interested in the 'just shareholders' comment - can we expect lersuang to say they aren't responsible for the problems in HHCC (if their are any) and its not just a misunderstanding and or they are in dispute themselves with 'other shareholders' who are the real baddies ) I would love to hear your response however 'complex' it all is (seems pretty simple to me). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatinBKk Posted May 16, 2009 Share Posted May 16, 2009 sarcasm from SB, say it ain't so ! This time (believe it, or, not) no sarcasm. I mean every word. It's inevitable. Too many businesses fighting for market share in a shrinking market results in fierce competion and/or bancruptcies. But Thai logic is, put prices up to compensate for the loss of customers...ists a sad fact but true.....if anything prices will increase Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaiwanderer Posted May 16, 2009 Share Posted May 16, 2009 sarcasm from SB, say it ain't so ! This time (believe it, or, not) no sarcasm. I mean every word. It's inevitable. Too many businesses fighting for market share in a shrinking market results in fierce competion and/or bancruptcies. But Thai logic is, put prices up to compensate for the loss of customers...ists a sad fact but true.....if anything prices will increase accept your point generally but would draw a distinction between Lersuang and THAI logic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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