Thong Lo Police Still Conducting Their Stop And Frisks

[sassienie]

walked outside of my apartment building at around 6:00pm, bad luck as the standard 2 cops on a motorbike were driving by, and must have realized that the street was dark and quiet with nobody around. i gave them my Thai drivers license which they passed back and forth for thirty seconds and then they physically frisked my pockets and then quickly moved onto demanding my passport which i did not have on me. not sure where it was headed from there, probably a "fine" but a friend intervened much to their dismay and they left shortly after. of course the scary thing is what if they just decided to claim i had drugs on me? pretty depressing to just be standing somewhere and have a cop come and stick his hands in your pockets but i guess that is just the price of living in the land of smiles.

Yeah right

Do you have anything good to say about your Thailand experience? Thought snot....

Yes, I agree.

Below is a photo of the OP that took a couple of months ago:

[JohnGotti]

And that bust with the dodgy DVDs was completely legit...you were in possession of contraband goods.

Except the part where they accepted his bribe and previously illegally searched him.

[BigSnake]

walked outside of my apartment building at around 6:00pm, bad luck as the standard 2 cops on a motorbike were driving by, and must have realized that the street was dark and quiet with nobody around. i gave them my Thai drivers license which they passed back and forth for thirty seconds and then they physically frisked my pockets and then quickly moved onto demanding my passport which i did not have on me. not sure where it was headed from there, probably a "fine" but a friend intervened much to their dismay and they left shortly after. of course the scary thing is what if they just decided to claim i had drugs on me? pretty depressing to just be standing somewhere and have a cop come and stick his hands in your pockets but i guess that is just the price of living in the land of smiles.

Yeah right

Do you have anything good to say about your Thailand experience? Thought snot....

Gay cops???

[aussiejosh]

walked outside of my apartment building at around 6:00pm, bad luck as the standard 2 cops on a motorbike were driving by, and must have realized that the street was dark and quiet with nobody around. i gave them my Thai drivers license which they passed back and forth for thirty seconds and then they physically frisked my pockets and then quickly moved onto demanding my passport which i did not have on me. not sure where it was headed from there, probably a "fine" but a friend intervened much to their dismay and they left shortly after. of course the scary thing is what if they just decided to claim i had drugs on me? pretty depressing to just be standing somewhere and have a cop come and stick his hands in your pockets but i guess that is just the price of living in the land of smiles.

Yeah right

Do you have anything good to say about your Thailand experience? Thought snot....

Yes, I agree.

Below is a photo of the OP that took a couple of months ago:

Obviously a dangerous criminal out to do harm to the good citizens of Thailand, who are completely innocent and unaware of evil foreigners and their 'tricks' as some police put it.

Just to confirm the stop and searches are illegal right? What would happen if you were to ask for the officers name in order to make a complaint? (I have a feeling only bad things, small minds and huge egos come into play and they will try and prevent losing face i suspect)

[bonobo]

Just to confirm the stop and searches are illegal right? What would happen if you were to ask for the officers name in order to make a complaint? (I have a feeling only bad things, small minds and huge egos come into play and they will try and prevent losing face i suspect

Is a random serarch illegal in Thailand? I don't know if it is or not, myself. It may be illegal in the US, but here?

I have never been stopped, but I was wondering about this after reading this thread, and I also wondered about asking for the officers' names. I have to agree that this would probably also result in "bad things."

Edited June 12, 2009 by bonobo

[MeetJohnDoe]

And that bust with the dodgy DVDs was completely legit...you were in possession of contraband goods.

Except the part where they accepted his bribe and previously illegally searched him.

I don't know what the state of the law is in Thailand regarding search and seizure and the concept of a right to privacy. My guess is that they are not as developed as they are in many Western countries. There is also the question of probable cause (for the initial stop) and it's interpretation in Thai jurisprudence.

Edited June 12, 2009 by MeetJohnDoe

[Moonrakers]

Asking for their names is only likely to get their backs up and potentially inflame the situation.

Just be polite and move on once they have played their little game.

[JohnGotti]

And that bust with the dodgy DVDs was completely legit...you were in possession of contraband goods.

Except the part where they accepted his bribe and previously illegally searched him.

I don't know what the state of the law is in Thailand regarding search and seizure and the concept of a right to privacy. My guess is that they are not as developed as they are in many Western countries. There is also the question of probable cause (for the initial stop) and it's interpretation in Thai jurisprudence.

Yeah, and what about the part of accepting/negotiating/extorting the bribe? Another grey area?

[JohnGotti]

Asking for their names is only likely to get their backs up and potentially inflame the situation.

Just be polite and move on once they have played their little game.

I think a better plan would be to go to the police station the next day and be like:

"This is what happened yesterday and I just want to make sure that these were real cops because my Thai friend told me that sometimes there are fake cops (a lie obviously but it gives you a reason to question them while at the same time non directly criticizing their action) and I just wanted to make sure that this was a legal practice because they stopped without having any sort of reason and were not polite with me? I know this type of thing is illegal in most countries so I just want to clarify what the laws are here..."

Something along these lines might work out positive in the end, whereas asking their names will likely get you in trouble.

[oldsparrow]

Just to confirm the stop and searches are illegal right? What would happen if you were to ask for the officers name in order to make a complaint? (I have a feeling only bad things, small minds and huge egos come into play and they will try and prevent losing face i suspect

Is a random serarch illegal in Thailand? I don't know if it is or not, myself. It may be illegal in the US, but here? I have never been stopped, but I was wondering about this after reading this thread, and I also wondered about asking for the officers' names. I have to agree that this would probably also result in "bad things."

Ramdon search without warrant in public place is "legal" when:

1. By responsible officer at the check points ie. check point at the airpot, custom or traffic check point on the road. But for traffic check point there must be commissionned officer (Lt.+) in charge of the check point etc.

2. By reponsible officer who had prior investigation of the specific suspect.

3. By specially authorised officer such as narcotics law enforcement officer with proper reason or prior investigation. Not all police are this kind of officer, they are commissionned officer only. Other officers can be authorised to be this narcotics officer such as Custom, Dept of Justice, Provincial admin and military.

Apart from these. They can search only upon your cooperation.

For the judicial system. The law enforcement officer send evident and arrest note to the attorney to charge the suspect. Sometime the attorney simply order "no charge" if the case synopsis is weak, even if there is the evidence.

Anything happen, get a good lawyer, it means a lot of difference.

[StreetCowboy]

----- X8 Snip

....

Yes, I agree.

Below is a photo of the OP that took a couple of months ago:

He appears quite smartly dressed....

SC

[Jimjim]

I'm not aware of any 5000 baht fine if you don't have your passport on you. Anyone? I've heard they require it but the only time I heard of anyone having problem was right before the APEC meetings in 2003. They went to bars frequented by foreigners and anyone that didn't have their passport on them was taken to jail immediately.

[aussiejosh]

I'm not aware of any 5000 baht fine if you don't have your passport on you. Anyone? I've heard they require it but the only time I heard of anyone having problem was right before the APEC meetings in 2003. They went to bars frequented by foreigners and anyone that didn't have their passport on them was taken to jail immediately.

I am not sure if I should look down on the fact that these institutions actually exist and operate here and laugh, or feel bad. This place can be the biggest joke at times, but the worst kind of joke at others.

Excuse my ignorance, but what is the difference between commissioned and non-commissioned officer?

[oldsparrow]

non com. Thai police = rank from Police Private to Police Master Sargeant

The non com. insignia

no extra insignia to the uniform = Police Private

1 chevron on the sleeve = Police Lance Corporal

2 chevrons on the sleeve = Police Corporal

3 chevrons on the sleeve = Sergeant

3 small chevrons with base on the shoulder = Senior Sergeant

Cross swords on the shoulder = Master Sergeant

The Com. officers = Sub Lt.++

All police with star on the shoulder

Sub Lt. = the position varies

Lt. = Assistant Inspector

Capt. = Deputy Inspector

Maj. = Inspector

Lt.Col. = Senior Inspector

Col. = Superintendent or Deputy Division Commander

Maj. Gen. = Division Commander/Cheif of Provincial Police or Deputy Bureau Commissionar

Lt.Gen. = Bureau Commander or Assistant Commissioner General

Gen. = Deputy Commissioner General or Commissioner General

On the road the com. officer wear cap not white ping pong helmet

[oldsparrow]

The police organisation is centralised. All 230,000 - 240,000 policemen all Thaailand is under one boss.

So from the military style ranking, the non com. have limited authorities in judicial process.

The documenting/authority on different matters depend on ranks. ie. This rank can request arrest warrant from the court, this rank can lead a search party, this rank can approve the arrest record, this rank can inspect and approve evidence transfer etc.

In Thai นายตำรวจ (Nai Tam-reud) = Com. Officers in general.

ร้อยเวร (Roi Wane) = Com. Officer on duty at the police station. The person who takes note of the complain into the log book.

PS: I will post on Thai language forum on how to address the officers in local style for better communication.

Edited June 12, 2009 by oldsparrow

[oldsparrow]

.

Edited June 12, 2009 by oldsparrow

[filingaccount]

Interesting. I never, even once, got stopped on Thonglor during my 4+ years there or even eyed wrong by any police and I was out walking daily several times at all hours (admittedly weekend late night/early morning walks were fun). Many times drove through the check points outside the police station in a car, never even an attempt to stop me. I wave, smile, roll down window and offer my encouragement... not once stopped nor any other response except a wave to go by.

I dressed in a variety of ways, "comfortably" (eg. shorts, t-shirt, slippers) and other times "smart casual" (eg. trousers, shirt, shoes) and yet other times in a variety of suits.

Maybe I'm one of those people who just looks dumb enough not to be up to any foul play. Or maybe they check up on you "from a distance" and make their "educated guess" over a period of time as to who you are (place of residence, vehicle, reputation at your place of residence and surrounding areas, your known habits, etc) and if you might be up to no good.

On the other hand, another resident in my condo building was regularly stopped by the police, even when dropping by the local 7-Eleven for a bottle of water. He always dressed "smart casual", and never was up to "bad stuff" (as far as I know), had a good reputation in the area for being helpful, funny, hard working and honest. Picked up at least thrice a week.

Who knows how they "operate". Maybe they pick up the ones that look like easy pickings?

I even was apologized to, by the police and the royal guard, when one day one of the princess' arrived at a restaurant and the walking path was blocked off for a minute so the entourage of cars could pass. I just nodded and responded with "mai phen rai". They open the walk path and salute me as I pass...

Edit: added experiences.

Edited June 12, 2009 by filingaccount

[oldsparrow]

PS:

There is absolutely no fine for not carrying a passport. However, photo copies of passport and visa page in your wallet should be a good practice.

Any cop try to charge anything on passport just say you want to talk to the ร้อยเวร (Roi Wane), Officer on duty, at the police station and make record in the official log book if there is any charge.

[MKAsok]

PS:

There is absolutely no fine for not carrying a passport. However, photo copies of passport and visa page in your wallet should be a good practice.

Any cop try to charge anything on passport just say you want to talk to the ร้อยเวร (Roi Wane), Officer on duty, at the police station and make record in the official log book if there is any charge.

Where are you getting this information? According to the UK FCO, 'By law tourists are expected to carry their passports with them at all times in Thailand.' Okay, so perhaps the law means just tourists, not residents, but this seems unlikely: the advice is, after all, specifically aimed at tourists, so the language used may well just be reflecting that. A more likely interpretation would be any foreigner, particularly since anyone who could not produce a Thai ID card would need to produce their passport to establish their status anyway. Presumably breaking this law leads to some kind of consequences i.e. a fine or imprisonment. This is not to say the law will necessarily be enforced (most people know it generally isn't), but it could be. Speaking in terms of there being 'absolutely no fine for not carrying a passport,' seems, from the information available, just plain wrong.

[brownlegs]

[

So somebody wants pics of bent thai cops shaking down foreigners? No prob. Check out the links on The big mango Blog which has a link to a site with dozens of pics of cops on Soi 11 following and fining tourists for dropping a cigarette butt in a filthy rubbish strewn soi 11. The cops in third world countries like Thailand can do what they want including assasinating political disidents and dealing drugs.

[JohnGotti]

link?

[sanook2me]

[

So somebody wants pics of bent thai cops shaking down foreigners? No prob. Check out the links on The big mango Blog which has a link to a site with dozens of pics of cops on Soi 11 following and fining tourists for dropping a cigarette butt in a filthy rubbish strewn soi 11. The cops in third world countries like Thailand can do what they want including assasinating political disidents and dealing drugs.

Police fining litter droppers so this is only in Thailand

As i remember England has some very strict rules on littering the street and fines to match the fines given out here.

[Jimjim]

MKasok, what you cited said nothing about a fine, just a declaration that passports should be carried, by law. So, talking about things that are untrue, why not go ahead and find something to say that there is a fine.

[MKAsok]

MKasok, what you cited said nothing about a fine, just a declaration that passports should be carried, by law. So, talking about things that are untrue, why not go ahead and find something to say that there is a fine.

If you've read the relevant part of the FCO website, you would have noticed it states: 'There have been incidents where tourists have been arrested because they were unable to produce their passport.' What do you suppose this entails? I would suppose at the very least it must mean detention until your passport is produced otherwise there would be little point in having a law concerning this matter. I'd be extremely surprised if there was no at least potential fine involved (I can't think of one law I've ever encountered in this or any other country for that matter, the breaking of which doesn't involve at least a fine), but you're correct, it's supposition on my part, albeit based on logic, probability and the absence of any credible source of information whatsoever from the guy that made this claim. You'll notice I wrote, "Speaking in terms of there being 'absolutely no fine for not carrying a passport,' seems, from the information available, just plain wrong." I didn't frame it in absolute terms. I framed it in those terms in anticipation of a smartarse just like you coming along with all the facts. So go ahead and produce something of substance yourself or at least make some kind of cogent argument as to the probability of this assertion being true. I'd be happy to be proven wrong, since I'm actually interested in a definitive answer to this question.

[JohnGotti]

[

So somebody wants pics of bent thai cops shaking down foreigners? No prob. Check out the links on The big mango Blog which has a link to a site with dozens of pics of cops on Soi 11 following and fining tourists for dropping a cigarette butt in a filthy rubbish strewn soi 11. The cops in third world countries like Thailand can do what they want including assasinating political disidents and dealing drugs.

Police fining litter droppers so this is only in Thailand

As i remember England has some very strict rules on littering the street and fines to match the fines given out here.

Except in England the fine does not go in the policeman's pocket... It sounds like perhaps you have some sort of sexual attraction to the BIB. Is it that tight uniform that has got you all riled up?

[sanook2me]

[

So somebody wants pics of bent thai cops shaking down foreigners? No prob. Check out the links on The big mango Blog which has a link to a site with dozens of pics of cops on Soi 11 following and fining tourists for dropping a cigarette butt in a filthy rubbish strewn soi 11. The cops in third world countries like Thailand can do what they want including assasinating political disidents and dealing drugs.

Police fining litter droppers so this is only in Thailand

As i remember England has some very strict rules on littering the street and fines to match the fines given out here.

Except in England the fine does not go in the policeman's pocket... It sounds like perhaps you have some sort of sexual attraction to the BIB. Is it that tight uniform that has got you all riled up?

Never mind your wild imagination with my supposed attraction to the BiB

You should look up the acronym DiD i'll help you out Dissociative identity disorder (DID) how many TV ID's have you had/got and post against?

So its okay for British MP's, Bankers, Councillors etc to have their snout in the public trough and these people already have generous salarys pensions and expenses but a man(BiB) who probably earns less in a month than the rent on your condo or beer bill and has to support a family too cannot have a little bonus from you when you commit a crime.

I know whose pocket I would rather have my money go into!

[JohnGotti]

Well, atleast you abandoned your silly arguments about them maintaining the law and trying to do good for Thailand.

Edited June 14, 2009 by JohnGotti

[oldsparrow]

PS: There is absolutely no fine for not carrying a passport. However, photo copies of passport and visa page in your wallet should be a good practice. Any cop try to charge anything on passport just say you want to talk to the ร้อยเวร (Roi Wane), Officer on duty, at the police station and make record in the official log book if there is any charge.

Where are you getting this information? According to the UK FCO, 'By law tourists are expected to carry their passports with them at all times in Thailand.' Okay, so perhaps the law means just tourists, not residents, but this seems unlikely: the advice is, after all, specifically aimed at tourists, so the language used may well just be reflecting that. A more likely interpretation would be any foreigner, particularly since anyone who could not produce a Thai ID card would need to produce their passport to establish their status anyway. Presumably breaking this law leads to some kind of consequences i.e. a fine or imprisonment. This is not to say the law will necessarily be enforced (most people know it generally isn't), but it could be. Speaking in terms of there being 'absolutely no fine for not carrying a passport,' seems, from the information available, just plain wrong.

By law the responsible officer can REQUEST foreigners to show their passport. But there is no FINE PENALTY for the one who doesn't has passport on him/her self at the time of request. If the officer realy want to he can even follow them to the hotel etc. to see the passport, that's it. If the foreigners can't produce passport AT ALL all there is penalty for illegal entry/stay.

[TheLaughingMan]

There might not be a legit fine but they do scam several thousand baht out of tourists regularly for not having thier passport which is the whole point right? Doesn't really matter what "by law" really is if the gangster cops are taking peoples money for bogus charges.

[oldsparrow]

There might not be a legit fine but they do scam several thousand baht out of tourists regularly for not having thier passport which is the whole point right? Doesn't really matter what "by law" really is if the gangster cops are taking peoples money for bogus charges.

For any gangster behavior it can be anything. If you have PP with proper VISA, you may be forced to pay for anything as well. No need to talk about carrying passport in this consideration at all.

The matter is that you should know what law is so you know what REALLY happened to you.