Kingpower Talks Back!

[caf]

For a member who's new (since 2 weeks) on Thaivisa you're quite busy, defending Kingpower

But, let me repeat what I wrote:

""It's also not the point; the point is -guilty or not guilty- the extortion of enormous amounts of money from the people involved, apart from the fact that they were kept against their will, missed their plane and the amounts are not proportionate to the products involved, whether KP is/was involved or not.""

LaoPo

Yep You've got me, I'm obviously a Farang employee of Kingpower planted here to wait for two weeks to strike in their defense, more tin foil hat stuff.

Anyone who gets caught stealing is kept against their will by the police - that's the point.

Wow, Bengie. You love to be judge and jury, don't you

You obviously see no other person's point of view, only look at the posts that support your prejudged views, and selectively quote, ignoring anything supporting the alleged victims.

So if you were on a jury - and with people like you around I can see the reasons why some people are against a jury system - you would not question the timing of the kp letter, take no account of kp's history, would not question the video, would ignore the letters showing innocence given to them by the police ( and reproduced on this forum for all to see); but you would consider anything that you could twist to justify " hanging them high"

In a live debate you would be roasted alive by a ten year old schoolboy if you used the debating skills you are showing on this forum.

[gmac]

Typical Thai Police.

They exploit the law for personal gains.

The way this was handled is outrageous and State Departments owe their citizens a travel warning on Thailand until something changes with the cops in this country.

If you can't trust the Police where you holiday, best stay away.

You don't need to trust the police if you don't do something wrong to get involved with them in the first place! Unless you are driving a car or motorbike of course.

[dttk0009]

I apologize to King Power for my thoughts.

Looks like professional crooks to me.

Did you read about how they changed clothes, sat separately, and he had the stolen goods on him although she took it??

I find it weird that they'd go so far for a simple wallet. Either they're kleptomaniacs or they had some other agenda. Could also be that they're just plain dumb.

Edited July 8, 2009 by dttk0009

[Pierrot]

I apologize to King Power for my thoughts.

Looks like professional crooks to me.

Did you read about how they changed clothes, sat separately, and he had the stolen goods on him although she took it??

I find it weird that they'd go so far for a simple wallet. Either they're kleptomaniacs or they had some other agenda. Could also be that they're just plain dumb.

So far it seems the main crime K P is responsible of is poor PR. And probably also bad judgment in the choice of their security company.

Then we have the "victims'. First they are not the innocents people some would like us to believe. Actually they look much more like a bunch of professional thieves than some occasional offenders victim of a momentary lapse of judgment, which probably explain the exceptional treatment they had to endure. I guess we will learn more about them in the near future.

[dttk0009]

I apologize to King Power for my thoughts.

Looks like professional crooks to me.

Did you read about how they changed clothes, sat separately, and he had the stolen goods on him although she took it??

I find it weird that they'd go so far for a simple wallet. Either they're kleptomaniacs or they had some other agenda. Could also be that they're just plain dumb.

So far it seems the main crime K P is responsible of is poor PR. And probably also bad judgment in the choice of their security company.

Then we have the "victims'. First they are not the innocents people some would like us to believe. Actually they look much more like a bunch of professional thieves than some occasional offenders victim of a momentary lapse of judgment, which probably explain the exceptional treatment they had to endure. I guess we will learn more about them in the near future.

That was what I was insinuating. It seems odd that professional thieves would go for something as simple as a wallet. Regardless, good work and action on behalf of the staff. I must say I was skeptical about KP as well after the initial articles, though the evidence presented by KP is undeniably solid. Goes to show how unreliable some media sources can be as far as the truth is concerned.

[Gary A]

A thief is a thief. They are obviously thieves. No sympathy here.

[pettergaga]

From the video of the British couple it would appear that in my opinion KP are vindicated.

However, for the conspiracy theorists:

2. KP states several things which would need to be further verified to fully back up their version of events. How do we know for certain that the alleged perps had changed clothes and were sitting apart at the cafe ? Where is the video footage of the cafe to support this version ? The video would be readily available.

...and if they were changing their clothes, where did the outfit they had on during the 'shoplifting' go? Did they dispose of those as well? Must have been a very well planned heist this...

I say if they were in posession of the clothing worn by the people on the CCTV video they are guilty, if not the CCTV does not prove anything unless we can get a version with a clearer image showing their faces. I am sure those should be available from Kingpower? Would they not have shown those or a clear still image of the couple's faces if everything is as clearcut as Kingpower claims?

[Benjie]

For a member who's new (since 2 weeks) on Thaivisa you're quite busy, defending Kingpower

But, let me repeat what I wrote:

""It's also not the point; the point is -guilty or not guilty- the extortion of enormous amounts of money from the people involved, apart from the fact that they were kept against their will, missed their plane and the amounts are not proportionate to the products involved, whether KP is/was involved or not.""

LaoPo

Yep You've got me, I'm obviously a Farang employee of Kingpower planted here to wait for two weeks to strike in their defense, more tin foil hat stuff.

Anyone who gets caught stealing is kept against their will by the police - that's the point.

Wow, Bengie. You love to be judge and jury, don't you

You obviously see no other person's point of view, only look at the posts that support your prejudged views, and selectively quote, ignoring anything supporting the alleged victims.

So if you were on a jury - and with people like you around I can see the reasons why some people are against a jury system - you would not question the timing of the kp letter, take no account of kp's history, would not question the video, would ignore the letters showing innocence given to them by the police ( and reproduced on this forum for all to see); but you would consider anything that you could twist to justify " hanging them high"

In a live debate you would be roasted alive by a ten year old schoolboy if you used the debating skills you are showing on this forum.

If I selectively quote, its only to keep the size of the post down.

I don't understand the other point of view, they stole something, got caught and luckily were able to bribe their way out of it. They then proceeded to claim their innocence, shout about their unfair treatment and how they were scammed. Everyone had condemned KP until the video showing them stealing shows up, and people continue to condemn them.

I would have thought it pretty obvious (Yes, even to a 10 year old) that the 'letter showing their innocence' is what they paid the money for.

In terms of the timing of the release of the video, the internet moves fast, large corporations, especially in Thailand don't. I'm sure there was quite a few meetings whilst they decided on releasing the video.

[stumonster]

...and if they were changing their clothes,

outerwear clothing

cardigan and sportsjacket probably - the air conditioning might have been working well

[pettergaga]

...and if they were changing their clothes,

outerwear clothing

cardigan and sportsjacket probably - the air conditioning might have been working well

So then they must still be wearing the same clothing at the time, and it should be pretty easy to prove the case for Kingpower from other CC videos or stills. Why did they even bother to mention anything about the clothing (outwear) in the press statement then?

I do not say they are innocent, but if they infact are guilty it would be pretty easy for Kingpower to come forward with more evidence (other CC videos etc) to close the case.

[delmersomsri]

Due process was denied. Instead they were handed over to extortionist. The involvement in the extortion by King Power may never be known. Better publicity for KP would be to help shut down this extortion ring. I hate thieves also. Prosecution to the fullest extent of the LAW should be the rule. Sorry. Lost my head. Forgot where I was at.

[caf]

For a member who's new (since 2 weeks) on Thaivisa you're quite busy, defending Kingpower

But, let me repeat what I wrote:

""It's also not the point; the point is -guilty or not guilty- the extortion of enormous amounts of money from the people involved, apart from the fact that they were kept against their will, missed their plane and the amounts are not proportionate to the products involved, whether KP is/was involved or not.""

LaoPo

Yep You've got me, I'm obviously a Farang employee of Kingpower planted here to wait for two weeks to strike in their defense, more tin foil hat stuff.

Anyone who gets caught stealing is kept against their will by the police - that's the point.

Wow, Bengie. You love to be judge and jury, don't you

You obviously see no other person's point of view, only look at the posts that support your prejudged views, and selectively quote, ignoring anything supporting the alleged victims.

So if you were on a jury - and with people like you around I can see the reasons why some people are against a jury system - you would not question the timing of the kp letter, take no account of kp's history, would not question the video, would ignore the letters showing innocence given to them by the police ( and reproduced on this forum for all to see); but you would consider anything that you could twist to justify " hanging them high"

In a live debate you would be roasted alive by a ten year old schoolboy if you used the debating skills you are showing on this forum.

If I selectively quote, its only to keep the size of the post down.

I don't understand the other point of view, they stole something, got caught and luckily were able to bribe their way out of it. They then proceeded to claim their innocence, shout about their unfair treatment and how they were scammed. Everyone had condemned KP until the video showing them stealing shows up, and people continue to condemn them.

I would have thought it pretty obvious (Yes, even to a 10 year old) that the 'letter showing their innocence' is what they paid the money for.

In terms of the timing of the release of the video, the internet moves fast, large corporations, especially in Thailand don't. I'm sure there was quite a few meetings whilst they decided on releasing the video.

Not only are you still being judge and jury, you now clearly show you are taking the brief for the prosecution. By selectively quoting you are not showing or admitting all the other facts. Exactly what prosecution lawyer would do of course. To say you only show one side because you need to keep the podt size is down won't fool many.

For a balanced and less naive view look at citizen33 serpico and petterrgaga's posts. No bias. No histrionics. Just giving their personal opinions having lived here a while.

[stumonster]

I do not say they are innocent, but if they infact are guilty it would be pretty easy for Kingpower to come forward with more evidence (other CC videos etc) to close the case.

a comment from Andrew Drummond on his blog talking about this case

Yes. I have seen this video and one other. Also clips from the arrest of the Irish woman. I believe the people are the same people.

so it does seem there are other pieces of video available.

just to add a thought - KP now has the issue that if they publicly prove this case now they have to deal with what it means about the district police process - I would expect nothing to happen till all the ducks are in a row on the police side.

Edited July 8, 2009 by stumonster

[caf]

I apologize to King Power for my thoughts.

Looks like professional crooks to me.

Did you read about how they changed clothes, sat separately, and he had the stolen goods on him although she took it??

I find it weird that they'd go so far for a simple wallet. Either they're kleptomaniacs or they had some other agenda. Could also be that they're just plain dumb.

So far it seems the main crime K P is responsible of is poor PR. And probably also bad judgment in the choice of their security company.

Then we have the "victims'. First they are not the innocents people some would like us to believe. Actually they look much more like a bunch of professional thieves than some occasional offenders victim of a momentary lapse of judgment, which probably explain the exceptional treatment they had to endure. I guess we will learn more about them in the near future.

Pierrot, you normally don't take such pre-judged views in your posts. You are normally logical and fair. If you look at ALL the evidence, accept that there are both truths and lies, and look at the motivation of both parties, I think you would not come to such an automatic verdict.

There are people who appear to have led a rather sheltered life in LOS and probably only go into KP to renew their rose coloured spectacles but I would not have counted you amongst them. It seems out of character

[Pierrot]

Not only are you still being judge and jury, you now clearly show you are taking the brief for the prosecution. By selectively quoting you are not showing or admitting all the other facts. Exactly what prosecution lawyer would do of course. To say you only show one side because you need to keep the podt size is down won't fool many.

For a balanced and less naive view look at citizen33 serpico and petterrgaga's posts. No bias. No histrionics. Just giving their personal opinions having lived here a while.

Fair and Balanced .... why do these words sound so nasty?

[loong]

I have no idea whether they are guilty or not. All I can say is that KP have released a poor quality video that apparently shows a woman stealing a wallet.

All of you that think the video proves their guilt - Do you really think that never having seen a photo of the couple or seen them face to face, that you would honestly be able to watch that video and then find the couple in a busy airport?

I reckon if they had sent 10 groups of security in 10 different directions, they'd have found 10 different suspects.

They may or may not have stolen the wallet, but the couple in the video are not clear enough to make an identification, it just looks like a typical mixed race couple. Could be anybody.

[t.s]

I apologize to King Power for my thoughts.

Looks like professional crooks to me.

Did you read about how they changed clothes, sat separately, and he had the stolen goods on him although she took it??

a ridiculous amount of effort for a wallet. nothing professional about it at all.

[samran]

Not only are you still being judge and jury, you now clearly show you are taking the brief for the prosecution. By selectively quoting you are not showing or admitting all the other facts. Exactly what prosecution lawyer would do of course. To say you only show one side because you need to keep the podt size is down won't fool many.

For a balanced and less naive view look at citizen33 serpico and petterrgaga's posts. No bias. No histrionics. Just giving their personal opinions having lived here a while.

Fair and Balanced .... why do these words sound so nasty?

cause those words are the Fox News moto?

[caf]

Not only are you still being judge and jury, you now clearly show you are taking the brief for the prosecution. By selectively quoting you are not showing or admitting all the other facts. Exactly what prosecution lawyer would do of course. To say you only show one side because you need to keep the podt size is down won't fool many.

For a balanced and less naive view look at citizen33 serpico and petterrgaga's posts. No bias. No histrionics. Just giving their personal opinions having lived here a while.

Fair and Balanced .... why do these words sound so nasty?

cause those words are the Fox News moto?

I don't understand Pierrot's post and heaven only knows what a "moto" is

I suggest Samran you read a bit more widely about the two current cases, look at other sites and read some of the more lucid comments on here. I live in a soi with no farangs for miles, and I can assure you the average Thai is very embarassed by all this.

We always have the Thai apologists on TV and no amount of logic or facts will change their posts

[stumonster]

cause those words are the Fox News moto?

I don't understand Pierrot's post and heaven only knows what a "moto" is

at a guess - motto

We always have the Thai apologists on TV and no amount of logic or facts will change their posts

well instead of hyperbole and snide remarks about naivety how about you produce some facts and logic.

so far all we hear is - everyone knows they are all scamming scum .

We always have the Thai apologists on TV

Joined: 2009-03-10

what was your previous incarnation ?

Edited July 8, 2009 by stumonster

[Pierrot]

Not only are you still being judge and jury, you now clearly show you are taking the brief for the prosecution. By selectively quoting you are not showing or admitting all the other facts. Exactly what prosecution lawyer would do of course. To say you only show one side because you need to keep the podt size is down won't fool many.

For a balanced and less naive view look at citizen33 serpico and petterrgaga's posts. No bias. No histrionics. Just giving their personal opinions having lived here a while.

Fair and Balanced .... why do these words sound so nasty?

cause those words are the Fox News moto?

I don't understand Pierrot's post and heaven only knows what a "moto" is

I suggest Samran you read a bit more widely about the two current cases, look at other sites and read some of the more lucid comments on here. I live in a soi with no farangs for miles, and I can assure you the average Thai is very embarassed by all this.

We always have the Thai apologists on TV and no amount of logic or facts will change their posts

Sorry for the trouble caused. Actually I was trying my luck at "triple entendre".

As Samran noticed, it was first a joke at Fox News expense.

Then it was an answer to caf's accusation that Benjie was partial but caf's posts too were far from "fair and balanced" .

And last, these few days we talked a lot about 70's music, these words are from "Hair", the 70's musical. I won't give the full verses because I don't want any trouble with the mods here but you can check by yourself on google if you like (Warning : Adult only rating !)

Edited July 8, 2009 by Pierrot

[samran]

Not only are you still being judge and jury, you now clearly show you are taking the brief for the prosecution. By selectively quoting you are not showing or admitting all the other facts. Exactly what prosecution lawyer would do of course. To say you only show one side because you need to keep the podt size is down won't fool many.

For a balanced and less naive view look at citizen33 serpico and petterrgaga's posts. No bias. No histrionics. Just giving their personal opinions having lived here a while.

Fair and Balanced .... why do these words sound so nasty?

cause those words are the Fox News moto?

I don't understand Pierrot's post and heaven only knows what a "moto" is

I suggest Samran you read a bit more widely about the two current cases, look at other sites and read some of the more lucid comments on here. I live in a soi with no farangs for miles, and I can assure you the average Thai is very embarassed by all this.

We always have the Thai apologists on TV and no amount of logic or facts will change their posts

the only farang in the village!! Now that is street cred? Geez, I have a Thai passport... Do I win? Can I be embassrassed about all this too?

Suggest you have a humour transplant.

Edited July 8, 2009 by samran

[jpolten]

I really don't see why this should deserve it's own topic since the video and the explanation has been showed AND discussed into great detail at the main topic.

It's also not the point; the point is -guilty or not guilty-

the extortion of enormous amounts of money from the people involved, apart from the fact that they were kept against their will, missed their plane and the amounts are not proportionate to the products involved,

whether KP is/was involved or not.

The cases are absurd and would create ENORMOUS bad publicity for the shop owners and (airport/police) staff in every other major airport in the world.

It's very bad publicity -again- for Thailand.

LaoPo

Ditto.

Whether 'some' KP staff and 'some' security staff are scamming in colusion with 'some police', or not,

or whether either of these incidents is real or the cctv contrived to save face,

this is bad PR no question.

The onnus is on KP to clean up the appearance of trouble on their turf.

Something in the way 'their security staff' is handling all these incidents,

is causing great problems of K.P. and Thailand's image.

There is the issue

Why would KP make or doctor the cctv...think about it....if they did surely they're digging a deeper hole for them self's!

If that couple didn't take the wallet and KP are fabricating evidence it surely can be proven they did make the vid??

Leaving them self's wide open for court case on fabricating evidence??

[chickenslegs]

Why would KP make or doctor the cctv...think about it....if they did surely they're digging a deeper hole for them self's!

If that couple didn't take the wallet and KP are fabricating evidence it surely can be proven they did make the vid??

Leaving them self's wide open for court case on fabricating evidence??

IMHO the cctv images could not have been made or doctored in Thailand.

Evidence: There is no laughter track and no boiiiing sound as the female puts the wallet into her handbag.

[daveh]

I hadn't heard of this story before, so I had not created any preconceptions about King Power. I watched the video and definitely saw a woman put a wallet in her purse. I wouldn't say they were professional about it, but the couple looked like they knew what they were doing. I read through this thread and came down on the side of King Power. However, after searching Google News for the original story and having read that, I am even more convinced that King Power is not in the wrong here. But that doesn't mean the couple were not victimized as well, because they most certainly were.

The couple got caught shoplifting. In any other country, they would probably have missed their flight and had to pay a legitimate fine. But in Thailand, the police held them until they came up with the bribe of 8,000GBP. After five days, they paid this amount and the police released them saying there was no evidence against them.

King Power was doing what any shop owner would do with shoplifters, bring them to the police. However, the real criminals are the Thai police. I think the police are raising their fee as tourism dwindles. Fewer tourist mean fewer shoplifters and fewer shoplifters mean fewer people to "fine". In order for the police to maintain a certain level of income, this means the fines have to increase. Soon companies such as King Power will hold the thieves and threaten to take them to the police unless they pay for the goods they stole, and the thieves will be better off doing so.

Ultimately, this will not hurt tourism at all. This is a non-story outside of Thailand. The couple think they can make a big stink about it since they have the letter from the police stating there was no evidence. But by their own admission, that letter was purchased for a price, so is completely worthless. They want to try to get their bribe money back from the police, which won't happen. In my opinion, this is just a case of one set of thieves fighting with another, and who really cares about that?

[caf]

I don't understand Pierrot's post and heaven only knows what a "moto" is

at a guess - motto

We always have the Thai apologists on TV and no amount of logic or facts will change their posts

well instead of hyperbole and snide remarks about naivety how about you produce some facts and logic.

so far all we hear is - everyone knows they are all scamming scum .

We always have the Thai apologists on TV

Joined: 2009-03-10

what was your previous incarnation ?

----------------------------------

You need to learn how to debate in a forum.

1. You guess motto. This is all you and a few others are doing in this thread - guessing.

2. There are no snide remarks, hyperbole, or mentions of naivety in my post. Learn how to post replies. And don't use words of which you do not know the meaning

3. Where do you get this from? "everyone knows they are all scamming scum".

4. I and others have provided facts and sources. You have not.

5. Thai apologists have been on TV a long time. Nothing to do with joining dates and Buddhist reincarnation. You really must try to keep up on this thread.

[caf]

Not only are you still being judge and jury, you now clearly show you are taking the brief for the prosecution. By selectively quoting you are not showing or admitting all the other facts. Exactly what prosecution lawyer would do of course. To say you only show one side because you need to keep the podt size is down won't fool many.

For a balanced and less naive view look at citizen33 serpico and petterrgaga's posts. No bias. No histrionics. Just giving their personal opinions having lived here a while.

Fair and Balanced .... why do these words sound so nasty?

the only farang in the village!! Now that is street cred? Geez, I have a Thai passport... Do I win? Can I be embassrassed about all this too?

Suggest you have a humour transplant.

---------------

Nothing to do with street cred as you quaintly put it. The point I was making was that I am getting feedback from Thais and not farang. I can't alter the fact that I am the only farang in this area - that is just a fact.

As for humour. Your comment that you are "embassrassed" had me rolling in the aisles. But the joke would have been better if you had typed "embassrarsed" would it not?

No prizes for having a thai passport but first prize for showing off.

[simon43]

I can't be asked to read all the previous pages...

One question:

The couple had already checked their luggage in (since they were in the duty free area). So they could only be carrying hand luggage. Is KP really trying to make us believe that this couple took a change of clothes in their hand luggage so that they could change clothes after stealing a solitary wallet, just in case they were caught on security cameras?

Simon

[caf]

No problems. I don't watch Fox so did not get the reference. Hair was good. Have you seen it live? The musical had great atmosphere

[caf]

I can't be asked to read all the previous pages...

One question:

The couple had already checked their luggage in (since they were in the duty free area). So they could only be carrying hand luggage. Is KP really trying to make us believe that this couple took a change of clothes in their hand luggage so that they could change clothes after stealing a solitary wallet, just in case they were caught on security cameras?

Simon

Good point.

There are a few on here who will be working overtime now and private messaging to think of a good answer. Just wait for the trolls.