No Foreigners Found Violating Law On Buying, Renting Farmland In Thailand

[Boyblue]

So...foreigners can't do that but Bahrainis can? If you come from Bahrain you're not a foreigner?

Maybe it should be Bahtrain.

BAHRAIN

A dagger pointing to the very heart of QATAR

My wifes family has around 35 acres of Rubber plantations, they make around 20,000 baht nett per month, and work extremely hard to get that much. I really cant see many farangs bustin a gut to get into farming for £50 per week, even as owners using Thai labour its just not worth the hassle. Thats probably why they didnt find any farangs involved in farming!

[asiaquakedb-tester]

Wie seuht es denn mit Investoren aus Dubai aus ?

Die muessten doch einen guten Fuersprecher haben ?

Erich,

I think the mods have overlooked your post. You are not supposed to post in any other language than English unless you also provide the translation!

Here is a translation of your post:

"How about investors from Dubai?

They must have a good promoter"

I guess you mean 'square face'?

opalhort

Dubai most likely will not invest as they are pulling out of projects they pledged on investing in previously ;-) including tourism projects in Thailand and Rwanda. That city has some financial/economic issues at home which need sorting out first.

[Dakhar]

Is this kind of protectionism really good for Thailand?

If foreign companies buy up land or rent land , doesnt that put the prices up for land and houses and make the country and the baht worth more? Why are they still using Buffalos, why dont they join the high-tech farming like the western world and make 5 times the amount of crops.. using modern equipment and chemicals. I understand then there wouldnt be so many jobs for farmers, but couldnt they find something better and more interesting to do? I am assuming it is the poor who actually own most of the country (arable areas) so wouldnt it benefit them if the land prices went up? They could just rent their land to people who use combine harvesters to do the work and sit back drink as much lao kao as they like!

It reminds me of when they closed the coal mines in Wales all the miners up in arms... but who wants to work in a bloody coal mine. People had to retrain for something better.

How can Thailand go from a third world country to be like Malaysia or other countries like Singapore?

Surely this is the way forward isnt it? If they really feel their way is superior to ours.. then why are they "scared" of us?

I cant get my head around it!

We are a mirror of their insuficiencies & and the truth hurts. So they cast stones at the mirror with the hopes this will some how make them feel better. I get it a lot here, in my occupation, in the west one must have a doctorate degree, here a bacherlors degree or a pulse will suffice..... Needless to say, I am not very welcomed...

[jantrevor]

So the farmers end up as serfs? What are they now when the farms are owned by the 6 richest families in Thailand?

[capt_canada42]

Maybe I'm a farmer and maybe I am not, but I sure wouldn't brag about it here if I was, and maybe there are many falangs who are also, but thank god there are many guys who live here a long time and know how to live here and say nothing as nothing is in there name.

[ukrules]

Well that was a complete waste of time wasn't it, I wonder how long it will be before they cook up another scheme to crack down on the foreigners who must be causing so many problems in Thailand.

[farangmal]

we are guests here

pure and simple

we will never be anything more than that

You missed the important bit...Guests with 0 RIGHTS.

[farangmal]

So...foreigners can't do that but Bahrainis can? If you come from Bahrain you're not a foreigner?

Maybe it should be Bahtrain.

BAHRAIN

A dagger pointing to the very heart of QATAR

My wifes family has around 35 acres of Rubber plantations, they make around 20,000 baht nett per month, and work extremely hard to get that much. I really cant see many farangs bustin a gut to get into farming for £50 per week, even as owners using Thai labour its just not worth the hassle. Thats probably why they didnt find any farangs involved in farming!

What happened if your Wife dies...would you be the Farmer?

[farangmal]

Is this kind of protectionism really good for Thailand?

If foreign companies buy up land or rent land , doesnt that put the prices up for land and houses and make the country and the baht worth more? Why are they still using Buffalos, why dont they join the high-tech farming like the western world and make 5 times the amount of crops.. using modern equipment and chemicals. I understand then there wouldnt be so many jobs for farmers, but couldnt they find something better and more interesting to do? I am assuming it is the poor who actually own most of the country (arable areas) so wouldnt it benefit them if the land prices went up? They could just rent their land to people who use combine harvesters to do the work and sit back drink as much lao kao as they like!

It reminds me of when they closed the coal mines in Wales all the miners up in arms... but who wants to work in a bloody coal mine. People had to retrain for something better.

How can Thailand go from a third world country to be like Malaysia or other countries like Singapore?

Surely this is the way forward isnt it? If they really feel their way is superior to ours.. then why are they "scared" of us?

I cant get my head around it!

35 Billion reasons...

[robbo1]

Is there a limit on how much land a farang can own or does this new policy mean people can lose there land???

[nakachalet]

Maybe I'm a farmer and maybe I am not, but I sure wouldn't brag about it here if I was, and maybe there are many falangs who are also, but thank god there are many guys who live here a long time and know how to live here and say nothing as nothing is in there name.

at long last, finally, at last, just when it seems hopeless.... you are so very wise.... my hat is off.... you are a very rare farang star shining brightly over thailand....

indeed there are many.... many who live here for a long while, many who own many but willing to remain nameless and faceless--yet at the same time living their life to the fullest and more importantly enriching those around them and the soil they trod on....

to those invisible benefactors, both small and large, may you live long in thailand with utmost personal happiness.... and may you reap many times what you have so graciously bestowed upon those disadvantaged people in thailand....

[lor]

we are guests here

pure and simple

we will never be anything more than that

We are not GUESTS, when I have a guest at my home I do the best I can to take care of them and make them feel welcome.

At best in Thailand we are an unwanted neccessity. If they could find a way to get rid of us they would do it in an instant.

Chris

[Considered Opinion]

2 many crooked farangs in Thailand.Its called money laundry+++.It's so ok by me they do "abit" clean up now!.Thailand should started the cleanup looong time ago.

Good luck with your new English lessons Norway ... keep trying and eventually you will be able to not only read the English, but understand it, and post appropriately...

[nakachalet]

lor / chris

perhaps a change of location might help you see many many better parts of thailand. there are much much better location for one to visit and settle than where you are now.... i guarantee it

where you are now was one of my favorites in 1980 but now pattaya is a tourist destination, not much different than phuket.... lol

chris, if you are a tourist, you are in the right place.

but if you are NOT a tourist, why remain there buddie?

pack up and go to the very eastern part of thailand where local people will welcome you and yourself instead of your euro/dollar, or

go south to songkhla or trang where southern hospitality will overwhelm you....

thailand is 1,600 miles north to south.... there are many many hospitable location for you to visit or stay or long stay like many of us.... lol

pack up and leave now.... to enrich your own life.... with the same amount of money or even less, you can live quite comfortably in many many places around thaialnd without the hassle of tourist traps like pattaya, phuket, et cetera....

thai language problem? no problem at all, in every little town where there is high school, there are kids who speak broken english to help you along the way.... try it chris, you might like it.... and you might decide to stay a while.... but whatever you do--do not get drunk too much, in the heart of genuine thai, they despite habitual drunkenness....

what sayeth thou chris? maybe seeing you in person around some parts of unspoiled thaialnd one of these days and having the pleasure and honor of shaking your hands too? lol

Edited August 8, 2009 by nakachalet

[alant]

as the world ecomomic status changes may countries will simply understand that these are simple acts of protectionism, nothing more nothing less and if thailand has protectionist policies it will be prevented from trade. the time will come

[richard10365]

Maybe this topic should be moved to the farming forum of Thaivisa. Clearly expert opinions can be found there.

[Hobox]

I'm so glad I left this country in sept 08. My Thai girl is so amazed how we treat her in Europe...

[Sisaketmike]

Oh my Buddha. I just came back from my rented rice fields where I grow pink potatoes, and I saw this ANTI FOREIGNER GROWING POTATOES article. I've tried to grow Lao Kao , but the sandy earth doesn't allow me to bypass the tax. Sheik Kitueng is the man who can help this country to solve its problems in one hour. Sorry I need to go back to my blue buffaloes now that they don't grab land.

[sassienie]

In reality, behind the scenes of many businesses in Thailand, there are Farang owners or shadow partners.

These can include massage parlours, bars, prostitution, restaurants, bookshops, Internet cafes, antiques, religious artefacts, property buying, selling, renting and the growing of foods i.e. livestock, meat products, fruit and vegetables.

I once met an American guy here in Chiang Mai who boasts earning 5 million baht a year from his lum yai lands.

The authorties are aware of the facts, but these people are difficult to identify as they use Thai associates or Thai family connections as front persons for the operation of their companies and often protected by the employees who wish to keep their jobs.

The Thai authorities if concerned about these illegal activities, could impose more severe punishments including mandatory prison sentences and fines, followed by deportation, plus mandatory prison sentences to Thais who become fronts for these businesses.

Or perhaps offer rewards to those who inform the police that lead to the conviction of the Farang lawbreakers. The funds for the rewards being obtained from the Farang criminals as part of the fines.

I for one would be more than pleased to assist the police with these matters, as I am not keen on Farang criminals gaining footholds on businesses here and especially if there were real punishment encouragements to help them cease and desist, plus a reward on offer that would ensure many more witnesses would come forward, meaning these criminals would not be able to rely on anyone to help protect their interests.

Edited August 9, 2009 by sassienie

[andrisdg]

The sad reality is that most Thai farmers are living in poverty, are heavily in debt and always the net losers, bumper harvests notwithstanding. The real beneficiaries from rice cultivation are always the middlemen and exporters.

-- Bangkok Post 2009-08-06

farm ownership,leasing share farming ,whatever the real problem is summed up in the above quote . the structural problem with a farm enterprise , be it in the developed ,developing [thailand ] or undeveloped world is that the farmer ,farm enterprise is the first step in the production chain and the last ,most squeezed in terms of financial returns . the %'age recieved by the farmer for rice or whatever has been shrinking steadily for 100/150 years and in the developed world for many commodities it is now in the low single figures

some take the view that the only long term gain in farming is on the lands capital gain and even that is subject to bubbles and dis inflation

no idea what the current annual capital gains would be in australia currently on productive farming land but 30 /40 years ago it was estimated to be no more than 2% .

why work the farm when if the capital is invested the bank interest maybe more profitable

[scania]

2 many crooked farangs in Thailand.Its called money laundry+++.It's so ok by me they do "abit" clean up now!.Thailand should started the cleanup looong time ago.

Good luck with your new English lessons Norway ... keep trying and eventually you will be able to not only read the English, but understand it, and post appropriately...

Agree with you C.O.

[spidermike007]

What these government clowns do not get is that every time they come up with another one of their harebrained "anti- fareng campaigns" they are

sabotaging the local economy. I know many people who have been here for many years, and they are starting to leave. They are traveling, and

researching alternatives to Thailand. These are people who on average, spend about $30,000 per year here (1,000,000 baht). How does that

compare to what the average Thai spends per year? Is there no regard for this contribution? I believe there are way to regulate foreigners, and

still remain respectful to them, and allow them to maintain their dignity. In Thailand it amazes me how foreigners are made to feel like 2nd class

citizens. We are not able to do anything as well as Thais, we are not as intelligent, creative, ingenious, industrious, honest, or capable as Thais.

We have not interest in building this country, nor contributing to it, and therefore we should be watched, and regulated. The Thai people cannot

seem to avoid shooting themselves in the foot, at every opportunity. Their country needs so much help at this point. Between the collapse of

the tourism industry, the appreciation of the baht, the world economy, their political problems and perceived instability, and a host of other

problems, you would think this might be the time to show more flexibility, and ease visa requirement, and maybe lower the bar for retirement

visas. While most of their neighbors are encouraging foreigners to invest, to buy land, homes, building for businesses, and offering reasonable

and flexible visa policies, what is Thailand doing? Marching vociferously in the other direction. They are digging the grave of their long term

financial well being. And as farengs, it is no fault of ours. I had a great deal of hope in Abhisit, hoping he was going to usher in a new era of

Thai politics, and progressive policy. I was sure naive about that one.

[peemailao]

2 many crooked farangs in Thailand.Its called money laundry+++.It's so ok by me they do "abit" clean up now!.Thailand should started the cleanup looong time ago.

Really, a lot of crooked farang in Thailand, i thought it was more like a lot of crooked Thais going abroad with their loot to buy property and open businesses in other countries, of course that might be the fault of the farangs also as other countries do allow Thais to buy and own property and businesses legally in their country's (Launder their money). Lets hope that other countries don't crack down on Thais aboad or there would be a huge flood of Thais pouring back into Thailand, and the ratio of farang to Thai would then decrease from 0.00002 percent to 0.0000002 percent and then the Thais would have even less to blame on farang.

But i think most would agree if Thailand want's to kick out all the farang, they would gladly leave as long as all the Thais from abroad got their behinds kicked out of other countries and all had to come home and stay here.....but that would be millions of Thais coming home and losing the billions of dollars they have made in other countries, sounds good to me.

[Thai at Heart]

In reality, behind the scenes of many businesses in Thailand, there are Farang owners or shadow partners.

These can include massage parlours, bars, prostitution, restaurants, bookshops, Internet cafes, antiques, religious artefacts, property buying, selling, renting and the growing of foods i.e. livestock, meat products, fruit and vegetables.

I once met an American guy here in Chiang Mai who boasts earning 5 million baht a year from his lum yai lands.

The authorties are aware of the facts, but these people are difficult to identify as they use Thai associates or Thai family connections as front persons for the operation of their companies and often protected by the employees who wish to keep their jobs.

The Thai authorities if concerned about these illegal activities, could impose more severe punishments including mandatory prison sentences and fines, followed by deportation, plus mandatory prison sentences to Thais who become fronts for these businesses.

Or perhaps offer rewards to those who inform the police that lead to the conviction of the Farang lawbreakers. The funds for the rewards being obtained from the Farang criminals as part of the fines.

I for one would be more than pleased to assist the police with these matters, as I am not keen on Farang criminals gaining footholds on businesses here and especially if there were real punishment encouragements to help them cease and desist, plus a reward on offer that would ensure many more witnesses would come forward, meaning these criminals would not be able to rely on anyone to help protect their interests.

You missed the most obvious issue. What fundamentally would be bad about foreigners entering the agricultural sector in Thailand?

[tracer0]

In another thread someone, maybe LaoPo was saying farangs and their enterprising wives

should create rice co ops and pool their crops and such...

I noted it was illegal work for farangs and a controlled market that would not take to well too it.

And got ridiculed as "negative" for my efforts at reality injection.

c'est la vie.

I actual DID read the lists of reserved jobs for Thais relative to ownership and work permits.

I thought that there are a lot of jobs on that list which should be illegal for farangs except if they kill all foreign land broker businesses there will be lot of thais with unsold projects...

[animatic]

It seems to come down to a generalized feeling of inadequacy in the big picture.

If you can't compete, prevent the competition totally.

Even if SOME local competition puts rice WITH gao on the table for hundreds of families.

Even if some local competition improves the industry, by globally teaching it better practice.

Even if some of it improves the lot of the under-culture that is starting to rise in political

awareness and stature, albeit sporadically and not always logically.

It is the old saw;

keep out the foreigners controlling interests, but take their money without risk.

And it is a Nationalism Card, my country must be protected,

and any one NOT US is potentially an enemy of my country.

And we know this is a new 'nation', so still trying to aggressively build an inclusive nationalism

that drags ALL ethnically regional peoples into it's maw of social homogenation.

But actively, and more aggressively, marginalizes those of different race and cast and origin,

to protect this proto-nation from dilution of those incessantly inculcated ideas of; What Is Thai.

Edited August 9, 2009 by animatic

[opalhort]

There was an entertaining editorial (My2 satangs - Landlord IV: Rise of the Rice Farmer.... by Arglit Boonyai) in the GURU magazine (part of the BKK Post) last Friday about this topic.

I can't find it on-line and I'm not sure if it would violate copyright laws if I post a scan.

Has anybody read it?

opalhort

[lannarebirth]

In reality, behind the scenes of many businesses in Thailand, there are Farang owners or shadow partners.

These can include massage parlours, bars, prostitution, restaurants, bookshops, Internet cafes, antiques, religious artefacts, property buying, selling, renting and the growing of foods i.e. livestock, meat products, fruit and vegetables.

I once met an American guy here in Chiang Mai who boasts earning 5 million baht a year from his lum yai lands.

The authorties are aware of the facts, but these people are difficult to identify as they use Thai associates or Thai family connections as front persons for the operation of their companies and often protected by the employees who wish to keep their jobs.

The Thai authorities if concerned about these illegal activities, could impose more severe punishments including mandatory prison sentences and fines, followed by deportation, plus mandatory prison sentences to Thais who become fronts for these businesses.

Or perhaps offer rewards to those who inform the police that lead to the conviction of the Farang lawbreakers. The funds for the rewards being obtained from the Farang criminals as part of the fines.

I for one would be more than pleased to assist the police with these matters, as I am not keen on Farang criminals gaining footholds on businesses here and especially if there were real punishment encouragements to help them cease and desist, plus a reward on offer that would ensure many more witnesses would come forward, meaning these criminals would not be able to rely on anyone to help protect their interests.

You missed the most obvious issue. What fundamentally would be bad about foreigners entering the agricultural sector in Thailand?

The most obvious thing I noted, was that there was a one hour and twenty minute time difference between the time I received the email from TV concerning Thai authorities initiating an investigation into foreign land ownership and the new thread stating that it has been found that no foreigner is violating the law. The rest is just blah blah.

[sibeymai]

What's the next announcement from the Ministry ?

1. They could find no evidence of foreigners in Thailand, or

2. They could find no evidence of farm land in Thailand.

[tomloughney]

And @ Wrecker: you don't have a clue.

If you bring foreign companies into thai farming, the same will happen as in India.

What's needed are cooperatives, not greedy capital.

What did happen in India? And who did it?