"That Which Nourishes Thailand May Destroy Thailand"

[LawnGnome]

That which nourishes Thailand may destroy Thailand

The Thai culture has a wonderful side we should never discard

by Voranai Vanijaka

Recently I was invited to give a speech at a university. The students were at masters degree level and in their twenties, which means these were some of the brighter minds of the Kingdom. I asked them who the governor of Bangkok is. After a moment of stunned silence, one student started to say Ap ... Apir .. Apirak. Another quickly pitched in Apirak Kosayodhin! Everyone nodded in agreement.

Doing my best impersonation of Sidney Poitier in To Sir, with Love, with one hand on my hip, I bit my lips, shook my head, waved my index finger and said ''No''. Another student then blurted out: ''It's a Mom [meaning a Royal title] some Mom, Mom, Mom ..." But we still didn't get anywhere, so I revealed the answer, which I don't feel I need to type in this column.

On a different occasion, but also quite recently, I did an interview with a professor of economics from a prestigious university. We were discussing a government stimulus programme. Throughout our interview, the professor became quite heated and agitated, red in the face, and even refused to look at me at times. What did I do to agitate him?

Article continued here - http://bangkokpost.com/opinion/opinion/233...estroy-thailand

-- Bangkok Post September 6, 2009

[LawnGnome]

If you are Thai, you should read this, if you are a farang living in Thailand, you should read this, if you are a farang living in farangland, a little knowledge about another culture won't kill you...

Voranai at his finest. The only reason I subscribe to the BKK Post is for his Sunday column.

[Thai at Heart]

A very interesting piece indeed that cuts to the quick about the best and worst of Thai culture.

There are so many positives about Thailand that I love, will the country change slowly to improve the negatives mentioned in the article? I hope so. I'm not sure the "ajarns" could handle it though.

[Garry9999]

If you are Thai, you should read this, if you are a farang living in Thailand, you should read this, if you are a farang living in farangland, a little knowledge about another culture won't kill you...

Voranai at his finest. The only reason I subscribe to the BKK Post is for his Sunday column.

The unfortunate truth is, that very few Thais will have an opportunity to read it.

[Jingthing]

Yes, its a great article and it shows that cultural traits can be destructive and limiting to international competitiveness. However, I don't share the author's optimism. Thailand is so far behind in the global economic competition that it is destined to always be one of the bottom dogs.

I see this phenom in my own country, the USA. Americans self image of themselves as being ultra independent individualists and their phobia of "socialism" has brought them to have the most expensive and least inclusive health care system in the developed world. This has reduced the competitiveness with countries that don't have this psychological quirk.

I reckon all nations have limiting factors which begin at the root of their cultures.

Edited September 6, 2009 by Jingthing

[cmsally]

An excellent article, should be compulsory reading for government bureaucracy (at all levels); they that think they have no right to be questioned.

[JR Texas]

A very interesting piece indeed that cuts to the quick about the best and worst of Thai culture.

There are so many positives about Thailand that I love, will the country change slowly to improve the negatives mentioned in the article? I hope so. I'm not sure the "ajarns" could handle it though.

What a well-written and insightful article. The author has really gotten to the center of the problem. And it is a problem than can be addressed via altering the flow of information (i.e., education).

I have been a professor for over 20 years now......taught all over the world. The first thing I say to my students is to question everything I have to say. I tell them not to believe one word that I am about to tell them and to discover, for themselves, what is "true."

Why? Because I want them to question authority. I want them to move beyond being grinning robots in a machine that wants nothing more than to use them up for profit. I want them to think out of the box, initiate positive change, and move beyond the mental chains of the status quo.

Thailand really needs to move in this direction.............

[Pond Life]

Is there anyway I can obtain a Thai version of this ?

[webfact]

Is there anyway I can obtain a Thai version of this ?

I suggest you email the author of this article or to the editors of BP. I trust you will find some addresses on BP web site

[Felt 35]

That which nourishes Thailand may destroy Thailand

The Thai culture has a wonderful side we should never discard

by Voranai Vanijaka

Recently I was invited to give a speech at a university. The students were at masters degree level and in their twenties, which means these were some of the brighter minds of the Kingdom. I asked them who the governor of Bangkok is. After a moment of stunned silence, one student started to say Ap ... Apir .. Apirak. Another quickly pitched in Apirak Kosayodhin! Everyone nodded in agreement.

Doing my best impersonation of Sidney Poitier in To Sir, with Love, with one hand on my hip, I bit my lips, shook my head, waved my index finger and said ''No''. Another student then blurted out: ''It's a Mom [meaning a Royal title] some Mom, Mom, Mom ..." But we still didn't get anywhere, so I revealed the answer, which I don't feel I need to type in this column.

On a different occasion, but also quite recently, I did an interview with a professor of economics from a prestigious university. We were discussing a government stimulus programme. Throughout our interview, the professor became quite heated and agitated, red in the face, and even refused to look at me at times. What did I do to agitate him?

Article continued here - http://bangkokpost.com/opinion/opinion/233...estroy-thailand

In here is in fact the answer to it all. This is reformation and it will eventually change everything.

[animatic]

-- Bangkok Post 6/09/2009

It's because I asked him questions _ questions that were contrary to his beliefs; questions that made him stumble and become lost for words; questions that questioned his authority. I even asked nicely, though confidently. He expressed more than once his utter disbelief that I actually disagreed with him and questioned him.

So closely couples to my last post in Creativity Hub thread.

So spot in it's scary, HERE is a true, thoughtfully iconoclastic Thai.

We should revel in this discovery.

-- Bangkok Post 6/09/2009

Since we've gotten into the habit of not questioning, then naturally our brains have not had the practice of forming thoughts and opinions in order to pose questions. Since we're lacking in thoughts and opinions, we're easily susceptible to manipulation, exploitation and downright brainwashing. Because we're conditioned to being manipulated, exploited and brainwashed, we become very good at obeying the status quo, the powers that be. Since we are very good at obeying, we become used to it, so we rarely ever question anything, and hence we are neither worldly nor informed.

This explains many things doesn't it?

Edited September 6, 2009 by animatic

[posttenebraslux]

Rarely read such an excellent article on BP. I do insist: Progress starts at home and it is our (foreigner-long stay) duty to show our family members how to think, reflect and then decide. We must also show them how and when to take action in a polite way instead of let things pass by. It'll take time but there will be good results.

That which nourishes Thailand may destroy Thailand

The Thai culture has a wonderful side we should never discard

by Voranai Vanijaka

Recently I was invited to give a speech at a university. The students were at masters degree level and in their twenties, which means these were some of the brighter minds of the Kingdom. I asked them who the governor of Bangkok is. After a moment of stunned silence, one student started to say Ap ... Apir .. Apirak. Another quickly pitched in Apirak Kosayodhin! Everyone nodded in agreement.

Doing my best impersonation of Sidney Poitier in To Sir, with Love, with one hand on my hip, I bit my lips, shook my head, waved my index finger and said ''No''. Another student then blurted out: ''It's a Mom [meaning a Royal title] some Mom, Mom, Mom ..." But we still didn't get anywhere, so I revealed the answer, which I don't feel I need to type in this column.

On a different occasion, but also quite recently, I did an interview with a professor of economics from a prestigious university. We were discussing a government stimulus programme. Throughout our interview, the professor became quite heated and agitated, red in the face, and even refused to look at me at times. What did I do to agitate him?

Article continued here - http://bangkokpost.com/opinion/opinion/233...estroy-thailand

-- Bangkok Post September 6, 2009

[473geo]

I like the non too critical reasoning.....also the mention of falling behind Singapore and Malaysia......just enough information to encourage improvement without losing sight of the good side....good article

[Farang0tang]

Agree, a version translated into Thai, would come in very useful in my life!

Anybody?

[CelticBhoy]

Great words. . . . . . pity none of us

will see any change in the local's way

of thinking in our lifetimes.

Better to take it as it is at present. Be

honest, most of us came here as we

accepted the locals for being a simple

bunch. Made us feel that we had an edge.

[bangkokrick]

Is there anyway I can obtain a Thai version of this ?

He is on Face book. Just do a search for Voranai Vanijaka.

Cheers, Rick

[PeaceBlondie]

Excellent article in English, only preaching to the choir.

One point_when did underscore take the place of the center dash_

[TheWalkingMan]

-- Bangkok Post 6/09/2009

Since we've gotten into the habit of not questioning, then naturally our brains have not had the practice of forming thoughts and opinions in order to pose questions.

For me this line says it all. Many have never had practice in asking/answering questions so once they get that situation... anger can happen.

TheWalkingMan

Edit - wording

Edited September 6, 2009 by TheWalkingMan

[plachon]

Rarely read such an excellent article on BP. I do insist: Progress starts at home and it is our (foreigner-long stay) duty to show our family members how to think, reflect and then decide. We must also show them how and when to take action in a polite way instead of let things pass by. It'll take time but there will be good results.

Ah, the White Man's Burden perhaps? Inculcating these inferior natives with our superior thought patterns and processes. Maybe one day they can think and be successful like us too.

I must admit, I always wince when I see such posts, claiming it is "our duty" and "we must....show them". A mission perhaps, not unlike religious proselytzing in the "Third World" or Western democratising mission in Iraq/Afghanistan. And look what a "success" that is. Gordon Brown, high priest of the mission just returned from a trip to Afghanistan, with lots of "we musts" for the press. Oh dear, our PM cannot see the blindingly obvious...........

While I enjoyed Voranai's opinion, I couldn't help thinking that he used "we" a bit too much as well, and could be regarded as mildly offensive to many critical thinking Thais who might not be so denigrating of their fellow citizens as this fellow. It would also be wrong, I feel, to paint Thais as a whole as a non-progressive lot who are not quick to observe, adapt and often improve upon other's ideas and innovations. There are numerous examples of this trait of adaptability in Thailand and one could point to one neighbour mentioned in the article - Malaysia - as hardly being a glowing example of tolerance or progressiveness outside the technological sphere.

[lannarebirth]

Every form of government tends to perish by excess of its basic principle.

-- Will Durant

Applies equally to Thailand as it does to whatever country we came from.

Edited September 6, 2009 by lannarebirth

[Xangsamhua]

Knowing what the problem is and what needs to be done is good, but what will bring about the conditions that will make the solution possible? There's plenty of criticism around (e.g. against non-accountable and irresponsible use of authority), but the idea that one can publicly accept criticism and learn from it just doesn't seem to have much traction.

There may be plenty of people who can see the value in questioning, offering alternatives, etc, but public discussion and leadership don't seem to allow for it. Abhisit Vejajiwa presents himself as one who is willing to listen to and consider views opposed to his own, but many people think he displays weakness as a result (or that he speaks with forked tongue).

[Xangsamhua]

Every form of government tends to perish by excess of its basic principle.

-- Will Durant

Applies equally to Thailand as it does to whatever country we came from.

Good quote. Here's another from Will Durant:

Man became free when he recognized that he was subject to law.

[Jingthing]

Knowing what the problem is and what needs to be done is good, but what will bring about the conditions that will make the solution possible? There's plenty of criticism around (e.g. against non-accountable and irresponsible use of authority), but the idea that one can publicly accept criticism and learn from it just doesn't seem to have much traction.

There may be plenty of people who can see the value in questioning, offering alternatives, etc, but public discussion and leadership don't seem to allow for it. Abhisit Vejajiwa presents himself as one who is willing to listen to and consider views opposed to his own, but many people think he displays weakness as a result (or that he speaks with forked tongue).

Well, you brought politics into this. Abhisit may not be perfect, and he is not, but I hope you are not suggesting the elephant in Montenegro is the answer. He was the one who was actively working aggressively to stifle all press dissent and refused to take any questions that did meet his approval. So bottom line, Abhisit is better than that.

Edited September 6, 2009 by Jingthing

[Groongthep]

While I agree with the majority of posters who believe that the basic premise of this column; that more critical and independent thinking should be encouraged in the Thai educational system, I have some reservations about the author's logic and basic assumptions. I became skeptical from the beginning where he begins:

"Recently I was invited to give a speech at a university. The students were at masters degree level and in their twenties, which means these were some of the brighter minds of the Kingdom......."

Unfortunately, in my experience Thai graduate students tend to be less bright than they are spoilt and privleged. If the system encouraged equal educational opportunities to all students regardless of family and social background there may be a flood of vibrant new ideas pouring in from the classes who have been taught to mind their social place for generations, but I don't see this happening anytime soon.

Edited September 6, 2009 by Groongthep

[NUMBNUTTS]

Simply another silly, opinionated, self-aggrandizement article by someone who has way too much time waffling about facts that kids in college dont really have the time nor inkling to remember. Nor should they - too busy trying to get good grades, and staying off the dope and out of the bottle.

That would make mom & pop real happy - there will be plenty of time to remember all that nonsense after the latest governmental appointments, and after yet another coup or New York Heist whilst the duly elected Bossman is doing the people's work - when the student who did know the answer, and didnt make it in big corporate, or anywhere else, but who decided to write about it instead, and is now a full-blown, low-level lush.

Thats First Prize - Second Prize is being the understudy!!

The author may have scored a couple cheap points - Lordy - I would simply hate to have heard the rest of the opinionated nonsense that was sprouting-forth that evening. One thing is for sure - he did his vocation no favors. A bleeding-heart Tim Robbins wannabee!?

That genre - by-the-way - does produce an extraordinary amount of alcoholics, per capita.

People who make silly speeches have egos larger than any President of any major corporation - without the ambition & drive.

Presumably it was for free also - so what is the point?! That they frequent the open bar, drink real brands & day-old, finger snack circuit? Oh Man!!

The author was the only one in-step on the whole parade-ground - research a litany of facts and snare the unforewarned?!

And that diatribe created how many hi-tech jobs?! Or any jobs?!

Wonder how many folks the author really fooled?! One - maybe!!

[Galong]

There may be plenty of people who can see the value in questioning, offering alternatives, etc, but public discussion and leadership don't seem to allow for it. Abhisit Vejajiwa presents himself as one who is willing to listen to and consider views opposed to his own, but many people think he displays weakness as a result (or that he speaks with forked tongue).

Having heard Khun Abhisit speak on a US talk show, I was impressed with his flawless mastery of the English language. Having read that he studied abroad, I can only assume that he's been privileged to receive a healthy dosage of logical/critical thinking and therefore understands some of the flaws (minor as some may be) that other leaders perhaps haven't ever considered.

Considering 'listening to the other side' a weakness is, in my humble opinion, truly pathetic. It's like only watching Fox News (for example) and thinking that everything aired on that show represents the way that everything should be and, worse, that everyone in the US agrees with everything said by the hosts on that particular show. Abhisit's open-mindedness is a strong-point. Please appreciate and respect his knowledge of how to deal with people. This is how adults and leaders are supposed to act.

[Xangsamhua]

Knowing what the problem is and what needs to be done is good, but what will bring about the conditions that will make the solution possible? There's plenty of criticism around (e.g. against non-accountable and irresponsible use of authority), but the idea that one can publicly accept criticism and learn from it just doesn't seem to have much traction.

There may be plenty of people who can see the value in questioning, offering alternatives, etc, but public discussion and leadership don't seem to allow for it. Abhisit Vejajiwa presents himself as one who is willing to listen to and consider views opposed to his own, but many people think he displays weakness as a result (or that he speaks with forked tongue).

Well, you brought politics into this. Abhisit may not be perfect, and he is not, but I hope you are not suggesting the elephant in Montenegro is the answer. He was the one who was actively working aggressively to stifle all press dissent and refused to take any questions that did meet his approval. So bottom line, Abhisit is better than that.

I think Thaksin was a classic example of the old way of thinking. He resented any form of criticism and threatened or pursued those who voiced it. On several occasions, especially in 2005-6, when reporters asked him what happened at a meeting with some senior figure, he would tell them brusquely that it was a matter for their elders (ผู้ใญ่) - they didn't need to know and needn't ask.

Abhisit has a much more amenable manner, but the old school (including the PAD) thinks he's weak because of it. His red-shirted enemies think he's a snake. In the minds of old-style politicos and commentators he's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't.

[Samuian]

A very interesting piece indeed that cuts to the quick about the best and worst of Thai culture.

There are so many positives about Thailand that I love, will the country change slowly to improve the negatives mentioned in the article? I hope so. I'm not sure the "ajarns" could handle it though.

What a well-written and insightful article. The author has really gotten to the center of the problem. And it is a problem than can be addressed via altering the flow of information (i.e., education).

I have been a professor for over 20 years now......taught all over the world. The first thing I say to my students is to question everything I have to say. I tell them not to believe one word that I am about to tell them and to discover, for themselves, what is "true."

Why? Because I want them to question authority. I want them to move beyond being grinning robots in a machine that wants nothing more than to use them up for profit. I want them to think out of the box, initiate positive change, and move beyond the mental chains of the status quo.

Thailand really needs to move in this direction.............

I agree very much with the Article - but I doubt if this problem can be changed soon - it's a core ingredient of how this society is functioning, how the many, many "inactive posts" in the "Ministry of inactive Post's" is accepted and not questioned in the hope one may miss out on a neat opportunity for him/her self!

How inapt people can get into positions where only their connections and their obedience count's...the whole

fight we are currently witnesses of - is part of people are not willing to give in - or up!

It is easily formulated by some "intellectual" but brought into practice, to become a reality one day - will take tremendous effort, very smart and convinced people to go the "whole nine yards"!

It doesn't take much, for an outsider to understand why the wheels are turning here as they are, I have seen

so much injustice, taking advantage of position.... and those people who do, aren't frowned upon - nopethey are the Great guy'.... as we can see those day's!

" ...to question everything"

Core teaching of the "enlightened one" the religion of 98% of the population!

What has gone wrong here?

[Farang0tang]

I still want a copy in Thai, gonna frame it and hang it up next to the hong nam.

[norwayeagle]

I would like to say,that what "which Nourishes The World,Also destroys the World".This is a everywhere "problem".Not only in Thailand.