Thanks For Many Comments About The Red Lion ...

[Oneman]

.

Thanks to many people who have posted (and flamed), about The Red Lion pub.

Some posting about it, without mentioning the name.

I decided to go and see for myself what all the fussing and all the mystery was about.

Glad I did.

Here's my review:

It's is a common problem for any expats here who have friends visiting from abroad:

Where to take them in Chiangmai that has good food, polite and mature surroundings, and an upbeat atmosphere that is not loud or hectic?

Just this week, I faced -- once again -- exactly that situation with a visiting friend.

I decided to try The Red Lion pub for our supper.

Between the two of us we are a blend of Brit, Canadian, Aussie, and American.

That qualifies us to eat anything, and to have opinions about everything.

The Red Lion has a surprisingly varied menu of pub grub, plus some Thai food.

Even offers lamb chops and a substantial t-bone steak, which you are not likely to find in the average pub.

I didn't bother with the Thai food, because we can get that everywhere.

I ordered cottage pie.

Menu claimed it was home-made.

I believe it.

Generous portion of tasty mince beef with peas in a mild gravy -- not overly salty, thank you.

Mash potatoes out of a box, but of good quality, so no complaints there.

Visiting friend ordered bangers and mash, and proclaimed they were more than acceptable.

I suspect -- but don't know for sure -- that the bangers were "Waitrose" brand, which is the usual in British restaurants around the world.

Fine with me.

Waitrose (if I'm correct about that) is always good quality, if a little bland.

However, there are locally-made sausages available in Thailand.

With the high quality and delicious flavour of the pork here, I would hope for a local sausage.

But we don't go to a pub expecting gourmet grub.

For dessert I ordered apple pie and ice cream.

That was a mistake I won't repeat again.

The apple pie was so much under-cooked that the pastry had the texture of raw dough.

The ice cream was a poor choice of quality.

There are places where a restaurant can economize on food ingredients, but not on the ice cream.

Lack of quality is immediately obvious.

So don't bother ordering the apple pie or the ice cream.

Next time I will sample some other dessert.

What about the beer?

Sorry, I have no idea.

I don't drink alcohol, and visiting friend ordered fruit juice.

Atmosphere at The Red Lion was bright and lively, without being overwhelming.

Music was a delightful selection of "oldies" from the 50's and 60's -- I really enjoyed that.

A little bit too loud for relaxed conversation.

But that actually worked out to my advantage, because visiting friend is a chronic talker.

So I just pretended to pay attention, whilst really tuned into the delightful oldies music.

Other patrons seemed a blend of affluent tourists and affluent local expats.

It was a pleasure to see proper clothing, recent haircuts, and reasonably decent manners at most tables as well as at the bar.

I didn't see any singlets or dirty t-shirts.

No sullen, slovenly, backpacker-types either.

In other words, none of the riff-raff that fills such bars as Mad Dog's and John's Place.

For seating, the Red Lion offers an outside deck with an up-close view of a small soi in the heart of the Night Bazaar.

For visitors to Chiangmai, sitting out on the deck would be fascinating and exciting.

For me it would be boring.

So I headed directly inside to find the best table in the place.

It was the table right between two fans.

Fans are important, because inside is open to the outside, so there is no air conditioning.

Service was quicker than I would expect for that sort of place in that sort of location.

In most places around here, the Thai waitresses just wander off somewhere, and you don't see them when you want them.

But, at The Red Lion, the waitresses were alert, quick, and always looking around to see if customers were lacking anything.

Nice.

I could moan and complain about the location, but I won't.

The streets were crowded, of course.

The Night Bazaar at 7:30 PM during high season is not my idea of a good time.

But that wouldn't be fair.

This is Chiangmai.

One reason many people come here is to experience exactly that location.

Now, by comparison, I have been 'round to other pubs, seeking a comfortable place that is suitable for taking visitors.

The Pub, out on Huey-Kaeow Road, is pleasant, but it's very much a "local" with its own group of local customers.

The few times I've been there, it seemed that anyone who hadn't already fitted in, wouldn't fit in.

Plus, nothing exciting there, beyond the inevitable sport on television.

The Queen Vic is similar to The Pub in most ways, except with even fewer customers and less excitement.

I couldn't find any reason to return.

Mad Dog's is home to a large contingent of down-at-the-heels, Cheap Charlies.

Not a place where I'd take a visiting friend.

Not a place where I'd go myself; not again.

Chiangmai Saloon -- both locations -- does have some life in the neighbourhood, but inside the saloon is just another bar: dull.

And the food is awful -- judging from the hamburger I was served at the Loi Kroh location.

Where else might be of similar caliber and similar entertainment value as The Red Lion?

I haven't found any place with that combination of atmosphere, location, tasty food, and pleasant customers.

If someone has other suggestions, I hope you'll post here.

Thanks again, to those who have been posting about The Red Lion.

You have alerted me to very enjoyable pub in the middle of Chiangmai.

-- Oneman

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Edited November 12, 2009 by Oneman

[mickybigears]

Tried the U.N. Irish Pub?

[Oneman]

Tried the U.N. Irish Pub?

No, not yet.

Would be nice to see detailed review from you.

Or a link to a review, if already posted elsewhere.

-- Oneman

Chiangmai

Edited November 12, 2009 by Oneman

[chiang mai]

Is the Red Lion owned by a single farang or is it a partnership, just curious?

[mickybigears]

http://www.chiangmai-mail.com/322/dining.shtml

[gotlost]

Oneman you could start a weekly restaurant review on TV's CM form. Your review of the Redlion was great and your observation of other establishments were spot on. Yes Redlion is now a sponsor of TV and deserves our support and bad mouthing when the ice cream sucks and to my knowledge it is a single owner.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Was going to suggest the UN Irish Pub as well. It's also kind of rustic and unassuming, but with a full menu, and nice outside garden or upstairs seating. It's lively some of the time, but quiet at others. Plus you could go there for breakfast or lunch. This does also get a somewhat younger crowd; some teachers and so on, as well as tourists of course.

And possibly Number 1 bar. Though food options are limited, this is more of a beer drinkers places, with MANY varieties available. Riff raff are warmly welcomed however. But it's a pleasant, polite, clean and cheerful place.

[pschef]

You guys who live in the city?? wow I have no words but suck it up. What a crock, oh sso nice Other patrons seemed a blend of affluent tourists and affluent local expats.

It was a pleasure to see proper clothing, recent haircuts, and reasonably decent manners at most tables as well as at the bar.

I didn't see any singlets or dirty t-shirts.

No sullen, slovenly, backpacker-types either.

In other words, none of the riff-raff that fills such bars as Mad Dog's and John's Place

I would say get a life. Do you live in he real world???

[thecatman]

Thanks for the review Oneman.

What about the beer?

Sorry, I have no idea.

I don't drink alcohol, and visiting friend ordered fruit juice.

I notice on the Red Lion's website that there's a very good range of beers and ciders available that aren't alway easy to find elsewhere.

[KevinHunt]

Some interesting points there.

The cottage pie - mashed potato out of a box? Actually, I'm not aware of 'Instant Mash' being available in Chiang Mai, but our mashed potato is made of real potatoes.

Apple Pie - I'll look into it. It is sometimes a bit doughy.

Ice cream - I have some customers who come specifically for the ice-cream. It's made by an Italian living in Chiang Mai. You can't please them all.

Sausages- Waitrose? I've never seen them here. Mine are made locally by an English butcher and I think they're the best English sausages available. I've never had a complaint, but they are English sausages so I understand that they may not be to everyone's liking. FYI - I also sell Gunther's excellent German sausages.

The good thing from this, is that constructive criticism is always welcome - too few dissatisfied customers complain for my liking.

I think I should also point out that on the inside of the front cover of the menu (the first page) is a welcome note that clearly states that if any of the food is not to your taste we will gladly change it for something else. No quibbles. If you don't want to change, we don't charge. Fair enough?

Edited November 12, 2009 by KevinHunt

[KevinHunt]

Is the Red Lion owned by a single farang or is it a partnership, just curious?

I have a Thai partner (my wife). She deserves most of the credit. I'll take the crap!! I'm used to it.

[piercefilmlid]

Thanks, <Oneman>, interesting post.

Never been before, but will give TRL a try next time I am passing.

Rgds

Edited November 12, 2009 by piercefilmlid

[Nignoy]

we were in chiangmai last 2 weeks in october, doing the tourist bit with rellies from UK,took them to the redlion simply because we like it!! good food , good service and a great atmosphere of wellbeing and fun ,and for a group of 60 yearolds what a great choice in Music

[Blinky Bill]

I feel I and my riff-raff friends will have to start patronising the Red Lion again. We'll attempt to bring the establishment down to the level of Maddog.

Kevin, can we still park our Foretuners across the road? Will the Red Lion give a refund for the parking fee?

Edited November 12, 2009 by Blinky Bill

[ThaiPauly]

Sausages- Waitrose? I've never seen them here.

Waitrose sausages ARE available in CM.

Any branch of Tops stocks them in the freezers.

As for the OP mentioning that Waitrose stuff tends to be bland...I have to disagree, they are one of the most popular supermarkets in the UK.

Not the cheapest, they tend to compete more with M&S than Sainsbury or Tesco and they rely more on quality than price to lure their customers.

Pity the OP never tried the Fish and Chips though...I still maintain they are the best in town.....but Fish and Chips has bee discuseed on several occassions already.

[IanForbes]

Pity the OP never tried the Fish and Chips though...I still maintain they are the best in town.....but Fish and Chips has bee discuseed on several occassions already.

Nah? Really?

[caf]

Some interesting points there.

The cottage pie - mashed potato out of a box? Actually, I'm not aware of 'Instant Mash' being available in Chiang Mai, but our mashed potato is made of real potatoes.

Apple Pie - I'll look into it. It is sometimes a bit doughy.

Ice cream - I have some customers who come specifically for the ice-cream. It's made by an Italian living in Chiang Mai. You can't please them all.

Sausages- Waitrose? I've never seen them here. Mine are made locally by an English butcher and I think they're the best English sausages available. I've never had a complaint, but they are English sausages so I understand that they may not be to everyone's liking. FYI - I also sell Gunther's excellent German sausages.

The good thing from this, is that constructive criticism is always welcome - too few dissatisfied customers complain for my liking.

I think I should also point out that on the inside of the front cover of the menu (the first page) is a welcome note that clearly states that if any of the food is not to your taste we will gladly change it for something else. No quibbles. If you don't want to change, we don't charge. Fair enough?

Credit where credit is due. That is a very fair response, Mr Hunt

Let's all hope Blimey Bill does not carry out the threat in his post to bring the pub down to his riff raff level

[dave2]

kh.

re ..... Actually, I'm not aware of 'Instant Mash' being available in Chiang Mai

ohh yes it is ! ..... at rimping airport plaza ( and others probably ? ) for about 110 baht a box.

handy to keep at home in the rainy season and cooks nicely in a microwave.

enjoy .... dave2

[Ulysses G.]

Pity the OP never tried the Fish and Chips though...I still maintain they are the best in town

As ThaiPauly is renowned for his excellent taste and I have heard the same thing from several acquaintances, I plan on trying the Red Lion version of fish and chips soon.

[harrry]

Pity the OP never tried the Fish and Chips though...I still maintain they are the best in town

As ThaiPauly is renowned for his excellent taste and I have heard the same thing from several acquaintances, I plan on trying the Red Lion version of fish and chips soon.

So the diet is no more

Seriously good luck mike you got an unfair bashing here before just see to it we do not get too much ear bashing about the Red Lion now

[Ulysses G.]

I don't plan on dieting through the holidays. The Bake and Bite Thanksgiving and Christmas dinners are just too good.

Edited November 13, 2009 by Ulysses G.

[john b good]

"Mad Dog's is home to a large contingent of down-at-the-heels, Cheap Charlies.

Not a place where I'd take a visiting friend.

Not a place where I'd go myself; not again"

The OP's opening post was quite balance and factual until the comment about the Mad Dog which I believe is a long way off the mark.

I for one am not a "down at heel cheap charlie" nor are the majority of the Mad Dog's regular clientele.

Sure you get quite a number of the "down-at-the-heel" back packers there from time time but this I believe however this is more to do with it's location (close to 100 baht/night HG's) than any thing else

"Kevin, can we still park our Foretuners across the road? Will the Red Lion give a refund for the parking fee?

And the RL does give a credit on the parking but from my last visit it is only for one hour which is not really long enough for a night on the tiles

Edited November 13, 2009 by john b good

[ChiangMaiFun]

This is Chiangmai? actually it isn't it's Chiang Mai

[harrry]

This is Chiangmai? actually it isn't it's Chiang Mai

Well a lot disagree with you.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Chiang-Mai-C...mai-t12178.html

aand anyway it is pedantic and off topic.

[ChiangMaiFun]

This is Chiangmai? actually it isn't it's Chiang Mai

Well a lot disagree with you.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Chiang-Mai-C...mai-t12178.html

aand anyway it is pedantic and off topic.

Yes I know it's irritating... apologies but it's the accepted spelling - I won't bother to post the links as I've been slightly naughty mentioning it but it's Chiang Mai not one word - sorrrrrry!

[Oneman]

our mashed potato is made of real potatoes.

Thanks, "KevinHunt", for helpful reply.

I'm afraid that KevinHunt has focused only on the negative comments in my review.

If I didn't point out some shortcomings, a horde of readers here would accuse me of being in a partnership of the owners.

So, some further comments are in order to help other readers evaluate The Red Lion and my OP.

I based my judgment of the mashed potato on two factors:

1) There were no lumps at all -- perfectly smooth consistency

2) Bright, white, colour that usually comes from a package -- rather than light yellow of locally grown potatoes.

If the mash are home-made, so much the better.

Ice cream - I have some customers who come specifically for the ice-cream. It's made by an Italian living in Chiang Mai.

That explains it -- it wasn't "ice cream", it was "gelato".

Gelato is popular in Chiangmai, but very different flavour and texture than ice cream.

I didn't even think of that, and assumed the worst about the ice cream.

Well, now I know.

But, still, I didn't care for the dessert of "apple pie with gelato".

Sausages- Waitrose? I've never seen them here. Mine are made locally by an English butcher and I think they're the best English sausages available. I've never had a complaint

I believe you.

My opinion was based on shape and size: short and stubby, exactly like Waitrose brand.

Waitrose is always reliable quality, and not cheap price, either.

inside of the front cover of the menu (the first page) is a welcome note that clearly states that if any of the food is not to your taste we will gladly change it for something else. No quibbles. If you don't want to change, we don't charge. Fair enough?

Very nice sentiment, but, you know, in Thailand I would never do that.

Culturally very, very, awkward.

The cook would lose face.

The waitress would lose face for bringing the plate back to the kitchen.

The manager would lose face for having to authorize an exchange or a refund.

The owner might even lose face.

So, if food is not to my taste, or is really bad -- and I have a few times experienced that here in Thailand -- I will simply nibble around the edges, then pay and leave, never to return.

To The Red Lion, I shall return.

Now, about the "riff-raff" angle.

It is worth emphasizing that TRL is largely a riff-raff-free zone.

That's another point in it's favour.

Thailand attracts a lot of "riff-raff".

One way to avoid them is to find places which have a better atmosphere.

Perhaps fun to start a thread on how identify and how to avoid riff-raff foreigners in Thailand.

So, my next order at TRL will be non-Waitrose-bangers and made-from-scratch-mashed potatoes.

What's for dessert?

-- Oneman

Chiangmai

Edited November 13, 2009 by Oneman

[ChiangMaiFun]

Riff-raff?... how do you define riff-raff? and riff-raff don't like aircon? Jeez...

On topic I would agree that it isn't so easy if going on a nice date to find a place which is 'suitable' but I def don't go searching for the 'English experience' (TRL etc.) - if you want that stay at home.

CMF

Chiang Mai

[PeaceBlondie]

Now that I got a traffic ticket in front of Red Lion, en route to Guitar Man, I know the location. Having de-virginized my palate with my first fish and chips at West, I might try another. Of course, we should patronize ThaiVisa sponsors.

So if I approach by going south down Chan Klan (being American, I know my compass directions), where do I park my bike without getting another traffic ticket?

[paulchiangmai]

Some interesting points there.

The cottage pie - mashed potato out of a box? Actually, I'm not aware of 'Instant Mash' being available in Chiang Mai, but our mashed potato is made of real potatoes.

Apple Pie - I'll look into it. It is sometimes a bit doughy.

Ice cream - I have some customers who come specifically for the ice-cream. It's made by an Italian living in Chiang Mai. You can't please them all.

Sausages- Waitrose? I've never seen them here. Mine are made locally by an English butcher and I think they're the best English sausages available. I've never had a complaint, but they are English sausages so I understand that they may not be to everyone's liking. FYI - I also sell Gunther's excellent German sausages.

The good thing from this, is that constructive criticism is always welcome - too few dissatisfied customers complain for my liking.

I think I should also point out that on the inside of the front cover of the menu (the first page) is a welcome note that clearly states that if any of the food is not to your taste we will gladly change it for something else. No quibbles. If you don't want to change, we don't charge. Fair enough?

English bangers? You have just signed up another customer.

[caf]

Riff-raff?... how do you define riff-raff? and riff-raff don't like aircon? Jeez...

On topic I would agree that it isn't so easy if going on a nice date to find a place which is 'suitable' but I def don't go searching for the 'English experience' (TRL etc.) - if you want that stay at home.

CMF

Chiang Mai

You have a good point. I don't live in Thailand to enjoy a farang like existence. But there are many who don't learn the language. People who have been here years saying "Thankyou" and who would not dream of apologising in Thai. A poster recently commented not eating any Thai food.

In other countries expats to a lesser or greater extent make attempts to integrate a little.

Generalising of course but the attitude is more prevalent here than other expat destinations ( eg Malaysia, France) Maybe mainly the tourist areas.