Will Thaksin "win"? As The Endgame Approacheth

[caf]

Just see the results of the poll. That Mr Thaksin has 30% support is absolutely fantastic given the constant brain washing from the local english press. One can expect a clear majority once a more balanced information will be available

Most of us are educated westerners here. We are quite capable of thinking for ourselves, thank you very much. Regarding your budding career as a spin doctor, may I kindly suggest you keep your day job?

Thanks for the advise

Krimson : 0.39 post / day

Jingthing : 12.29 post /day

I don't know who is the aspiring spin doctor here

Touche. Game set and match to Krimson, methinks.

[007]

To make one thing clear, I don't like him, never have. But I respect people's opinion, if they like him, like my g/f, who, strangely, changed sides a couple of months ago from being staunchly anti-Thaksin to being pro-Thaksin.

My guess is, that due to his ongoing popularity he will rise again to power, corrupt or not, a criminal or not..

[caf]

I wouldn't write Thaksin off just yet.

This is Thailand and I have learned through experience that a situation here can change by the hour.

If Thaksin does manage to gain power again, he may remember all the nations that denied him access to they're countries, then suddenly many ex-pats could find themselves unable to renew their visas. A similar scenario as to what the Israelis did to their Asian Immigrant workers. So those who voted, don`t care one way or another, should begin taking the situation more seriously.

I'm hoping that Thakisin will fade away into obscurity, but perhaps that's wishful thinking.

How you can relate the political situation in Thailand to the Asian guest worker visa situation in Israel boggles the mind.

Because us ex-pats are also guests in Thailand.

The powers that be can giveth and the powers that be, can taketh away.

The political situation in Thailand can affect the status of ex-pats in the Kingdom. So we live here and cannot ignore the political climate in Thailand as if we are immune.

I am equating what the Israelis did to a certain population in their country and the same can happen to any foreign group living in a foreign country.

I agree sassienie, but there are some very strong ties with both the USA and UK and Thailand would not want those broken.

Taksin has significant assets in the UK and the loss of his visa should not be seen as that relevant. There were wider implications in that that I am sure he understood though would not publically want to admit to.

[caf]

Love him or hate him, you have to respect him for his tenacity and willpower.

The real loser are the Thai people via the Abhisit government, which is stubbornly running around in circles, accomplishing absolutely nothing in terms of national reconciliation.

Simple fact of the matter is Thaksin will remain highly influential to millions of Thais for years to come.

Lets see if those "millions" of Thais join the redshirt rally this weekend. Remember - it is "millions" right? Because when the number is less than that, I don't want you backtracking.

You confuse "millions of Thais" with some members of the redshirt rally. Putting words into posters mouths is hardly a way to win an argument

But then how else are you going to win it.

[LawnGnome]

Love him or hate him, you have to respect him for his tenacity and willpower.

The real loser are the Thai people via the Abhisit government, which is stubbornly running around in circles, accomplishing absolutely nothing in terms of national reconciliation.

Simple fact of the matter is Thaksin will remain highly influential to millions of Thais for years to come.

Lets see if those "millions" of Thais join the redshirt rally this weekend. Remember - it is "millions" right? Because when the number is less than that, I don't want you backtracking.

You confuse "millions of Thais" with some members of the redshirt rally. Putting words into posters mouths is hardly a way to win an argument

But then how else are you going to win it.

Doesn't matter if I win - Thaksin is the only real loser around, regardless.

[Samuian]

Love him or hate him, you have to respect him for his tenacity and willpower.

The real loser are the Thai people via the Abhisit government, which is stubbornly running around in circles, accomplishing absolutely nothing in terms of national reconciliation.

Simple fact of the matter is Thaksin will remain highly influential to millions of Thais for years to come.

Lets see if those "millions" of Thais join the redshirt rally this weekend. Remember - it is "millions" right? Because when the number is less than that, I don't want you backtracking.

You confuse "millions of Thais" with some members of the redshirt rally. Putting words into posters mouths is hardly a way to win an argument

But then how else are you going to win it.

Doesn't matter if I win - Thaksin is the only real loser around, regardless.

Excerpt from post above:

Doesn't matter if I win - Thaksin is the only real loser around, regardless.

I think it's kind of really funny to watch some people here and in other Forums that they seem to post

not really their opinion, or some information but take matters somewhat personally and post, post, post "I am right, you will see!" or "no matter, I don't care what this guy is accused of, but he is the savior, he is a really good man, the best Thailand has ever seen!"

Despite all the accusations, he is (supposed) to be the best.

Seems like they have either been in the wrong movie or.....

well campaigning openly for this mans cause, not for genuine democracy, it's only the shield which is used to blind and impress the feeble, which is in all terms highly questionable - it looks to me that this bunch of people are exactly those this country needs tp get rid of!

One way or the other - they support the disease this country is riddled by, the "Puu yai", the patronizing system, which makes all this corruption, nepotism and favoritism possible through it's network of connections - not democratic at all but a politcal conspiracy set up to rule and loot this country at will!

NO matter how much money he has siphoned off, no matter how many corpses are strewn along his path, no matter that the unrest in the south flared up a new... no matter that he was very close to a "faked democratically elected dictatorship" with a one party absolute majority in parliament, no matter that the TRT was dissolved and 111 politicians from this era have been banned, one minister out of cabinet has been given the nickname "Ms.20%", his sister Yaowapa carries the Nickname "Ms.Cash on hand", nope it's all one "giant conspiracy against the good guy", no matter that all his promises, at close scrutiny, don't really hold the water.

Alright then if he is the "good guy" who or where are the bad guy's and hold your breath before any quick answer and have good look at the "bad guy's"....

[LawnGnome]

Alright then if he is the "good guy" who or where are the bad guy's and hold your breath before any quick answer and have good look at the "bad guy's"....

The bad guy is Thaksin...simple.

[Samuian]

Love him or hate him, you have to respect him for his tenacity and willpower.

The real loser are the Thai people via the Abhisit government, which is stubbornly running around in circles, accomplishing absolutely nothing in terms of national reconciliation.

Simple fact of the matter is Thaksin will remain highly influential to millions of Thais for years to come.

Lets see if those "millions" of Thais join the redshirt rally this weekend. Remember - it is "millions" right? Because when the number is less than that, I don't want you backtracking.

You confuse "millions of Thais" with some members of the redshirt rally. Putting words into posters mouths is hardly a way to win an argument

But then how else are you going to win it.

Doesn't matter if I win - Thaksin is the only real loser around, regardless.

Excerpt from post above:

"Doesn't matter if I win - Thaksin is the only real loser around, regardless."

I think it's kind of really funny to watch some people here and in other Forums that they seem to post

not really their opinion, or some information but take matters somewhat personally and post, post, post "I am right, you will see!" or "no matter, I don't care what this guy is accused of, but he is the savior, he is a really good man, the best Thailand has ever seen!"

Despite all the accusations, he is (supposed) to be the best.

Seems like they have either been in the wrong movie or.....

well campaigning openly for this mans cause, not for genuine democracy, it's only the shield which is used to blind and impress the feeble, which is in all terms highly questionable - it looks to me that this bunch of people are exactly those this country needs tp get rid of!

One way or the other - they support the disease this country is riddled by, the "Puu yai", the patronizing system, which makes all this corruption, nepotism and favoritism possible through it's network of connections - not democratic at all but a politcal conspiracy set up to rule and loot this country at will!

NO matter how much money he has siphoned off, no matter how many corpses are strewn along his path, no matter that the unrest in the south flared up a new... no matter that he was very close to a "faked democratically elected dictatorship" with a one party absolute majority in parliament, no matter that the TRT was dissolved and 111 politicians from this era have been banned, one minister out of cabinet has been given the nickname "Ms.20%", his sister Yaowapa carries the Nickname "Ms.Cash on hand", nope it's all one "giant conspiracy against the good guy", no matter that all his promises, at close scrutiny, don't really hold the water.

Alright then if he is the "good guy" who or where are the bad guy's and hold your breath before any quick answer and have good look at the "bad guy's"....and what makes the bad guy's - "bad" that they are protecting genuine democracy and the good of this country?

That they are trying to keep a man and his team at bay who are trying restlessly to realize this mans dreams - that he will be once the CEO of Thailand Inc.?

What would be his title in other terms, why he used CEO, why he avoided to use the correct title, because he may have offended and upset certain circles and shown his disrespect for the system this country is reigned under, nay not only the system but as it's premier, showed ignorance towards it's very own constitution?

He wishes nothing more than he can see himself one day as the "owner" of this country - isn't it this what he has been talking all along?

It is this what an outside observer can clearly read in his efforts, in what he does and what his mouthpieces are praying?

isn't he saying yes/no/yes/no all the way long?

Has ever anywhere on the planet a capitalist erased poverty or has it increased and caused unseen misery to many, over time and those countries did they have a suppressive government or have they all been genuine free democracies?

What did he do that he has the face to compare himself with Nelson Mandela or even Aung San Sui Kyi?

Edited November 24, 2009 by Samuian

[LawnGnome]

What did he do that he has the face to compare himself with Nelson Mandela or even Aung San Sui Kyi?

You might want to try to get your point across in one or two sentences. This diatribe is almost impossible to read unless you want a headache at the end.

Edited November 24, 2009 by LawnGnome

[Soutpeel]

Churchill said that democracy is the worst form of government except for all the others that have been tried.

And I would agree that it is not perfect anywhere, but that is not to say it should not be strived for. And the Thai people deserve better than they currently have. Democracy is relatively new here. Corruption and coups slow its movement.

I also agree with you that corruption is prevalent in all countries ( not only so called democracies) but Thailand has it in spades. And coups occur everywhere???

Caf...I purposely left out coup's in my post, as will agree that in this regard Thailand is pretty unique..

Thailand needs to find "their" interpretation/version of democracy, what ever shape or form it takes...can you transplant the so-called democratic systems from UK/USA/Aussie etc etc in Thailand ??...highly un-likely

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Alright then if he is the "good guy" who or where are the bad guy's and hold your breath before any quick answer and have good look at the "bad guy's"....

Mr. Thaksin gave a very frank interview not too long ago where he was asked that exact question. I don't like Thaksin very much, but I think his answer to that particular question was very close to the mark. (General Prem, etc.) He left out high ranking military though, but I think they should be included.

That said, I would find it a struggle to call Mr. Thaksin ' a good guy '.. Honestly, why the need to simplify things to the level of a 4 year old in good & bad, white & black? There are a lot of players out there, and very few true 'good guys'.

Edited November 24, 2009 by WinnieTheKhwai

[lovelomsak]

In all honesty I feel he crossed the line to traitor status when he took the finacial advisor job in Cambodia.I used to compare him to Tommie Douglas in Canada and his fight for medicare in that country. I used to feel he saved Thailands economy when he came into power and the baht was depreciating quickly. What I saw there remindered me of what happened in Mexico when the peso fell ,it took Mexico decades to strengthen their currency. When Thaksin took power he stabilized the baht in les than 6 months.In my mind this was no small feat.

Then he brought in 20 baht medical services that saved peoples lifes I felt Thailand had finally got leadership from a man who was willing to give back to the country that had taken him from modest wealth to riches. I really saw him as a man persuded by parties interested in their own gain.

But now he went to Cmabodia I see him as making the fight personal and wants to win at any cost. If his goals as a poitician were ever to bring real democracy to Thailand and do good things for the people as a whole I feel he has left that and now is on a path of personal revenge against the persons or parties that have attacked him in the past and present

I also wonder what has the coup accomplished?.

Edited November 24, 2009 by lovelomsak

[Kitsch22]

What did he do that he has the face to compare himself with Nelson Mandela or even Aung San Sui Kyi?

Achieved resounding victory in popular election(s).

[mahtin]

What did he do that he has the face to compare himself with Nelson Mandela or even Aung San Sui Kyi?

Achieved resounding victory in popular election(s).

Semantics perhaps, but I see a difference between achieving and buying.

[pampal]

It's gonna be interesting to see what happens over the next year or two.

[caf]

Churchill said that democracy is the worst form of government except for all the others that have been tried.

And I would agree that it is not perfect anywhere, but that is not to say it should not be strived for. And the Thai people deserve better than they currently have. Democracy is relatively new here. Corruption and coups slow its movement.

I also agree with you that corruption is prevalent in all countries ( not only so called democracies) but Thailand has it in spades. And coups occur everywhere???

Caf...I purposely left out coup's in my post, as will agree that in this regard Thailand is pretty unique..

Thailand needs to find "their" interpretation/version of democracy, what ever shape or form it takes...can you transplant the so-called democratic systems from UK/USA/Aussie etc etc in Thailand ??...highly un-likely

I completly agree. the western systems should not be copied.

[Ulysses G.]

I am equating what the Israelis did to a certain population in their country and the same can happen to any foreign group living in a foreign country.

If I remember correctly, they tried to get rid of undocumented workers - in other words, illegal immigrants. Every country tries to get rid of illegal immigrants and it has no effect on foreigners that are living somewhere legally.

[gregb]

Churchill said that democracy is the worst form of government except for all the others that have been tried.

Churchill was a moron.

I believe it was a J.F.K. who said "The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all."

Thailand has no business playing at being a democracy. The military basically runs the country anyway. Might as well make it official. At least then we could get back to normal.

[gehfab]

I hope it's the final attempt.

[Kitsch22]

What did he do that he has the face to compare himself with Nelson Mandela or even Aung San Sui Kyi?

Achieved resounding victory in popular election(s).

Semantics perhaps, but I see a difference between achieving and buying.

Such is always the response of those who are outraged that a vote can be given in return for a politician's cash but happily accept that it can be given in return for a politician's lies.

When a Thai sells his vote, who is cheated? Nobody. When a popular political party is disbanded and disqualified for doing what its opponents were also doing, who is cheated? Everybody.

The comparison question could just as well have been answered: "He was declared a criminal by a kangaroo court set up by a totalitarian and undemocratic regime" - as was Mandela; as was Aung San Su Kyi.

Everybody knows that Taksin is a corrupt self-serving politician, but the way correspondents on TV queue up to support the Generals and their works is nothing short of sickening.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Love him or hate him, you have to respect him for his tenacity and willpower.

The real loser are the Thai people via the Abhisit government, which is stubbornly running around in circles, accomplishing absolutely nothing in terms of national reconciliation.

Simple fact of the matter is Thaksin will remain highly influential to millions of Thais for years to come.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Love him or hate him, you have to respect him for his tenacity and willpower.

The real loser are the Thai people via the Abhisit government, which is stubbornly running around in circles, accomplishing absolutely nothing in terms of national reconciliation.

Simple fact of the matter is Thaksin will remain highly influential to millions of Thais for years to come.

A tourist returns.

[maahuanao]

What did he do that he has the face to compare himself with Nelson Mandela or even Aung San Sui Kyi?

Achieved resounding victory in popular election(s).

Semantics perhaps, but I see a difference between achieving and buying.

Such is always the response of those who are outraged that a vote can be given in return for a politician's cash but happily accept that it can be given in return for a politician's lies.

When a Thai sells his vote, who is cheated? Nobody. When a popular political party is disbanded and disqualified for doing what its opponents were also doing, who is cheated? Everybody.

The comparison question could just as well have been answered: "He was declared a criminal by a kangaroo court set up by a totalitarian and undemocratic regime" - as was Mandela; as was Aung San Su Kyi.

Everybody knows that Taksin is a corrupt self-serving politician, but the way correspondents on TV queue up to support the Generals and their works is nothing short of sickening.

Totally agree.

[YoonHualaan]

[dr_Pat_Pong]

PACK. Banned returnees are unwelcome.

[YoonHualaan]

I am a new member, not a banned member

[dr_Pat_Pong]

I am a new member, not a banned member

You are not a new member. no avatar this time ?

[Jingthing]

Love him or hate him, you have to respect him for his tenacity and willpower.

The real loser are the Thai people via the Abhisit government, which is stubbornly running around in circles, accomplishing absolutely nothing in terms of national reconciliation.

Simple fact of the matter is Thaksin will remain highly influential to millions of Thais for years to come.

No, we don't have to respect him. Why is he so tenacious and strong willed? To serve the Thai people and promote democracy or to grab his ill gotten riches back and wipe out his legal problem, not caring about the severe instability he has created in his country?

[YoonHualaan]

I am a new member, not a banned member

You are not a new member. no avatar this time ?

What is an avatar?

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Why is he so tenacious and strong willed?

In his fight for justice (he was outsted in a coup and from then on everything was constructed to bring about his ruin).

So love him or hate him, you have to respect his tenacity in the face of injustice, most others would have rolled over and capitulated to the so called 'elite' bullies by now.

I thought that even very low grade minor academics could spell OUSTED.