What Happened This Songkran?

[Thomas_Merton]

There could be a few TVs who are experiencing Songkran for the first time.

It would be interesting to read what you have experienced throughout this unique Thai festival.

Even the old boys and professional cynics out there may have experienced something new this year that might be worth sharing with us.

Perhaps we could find:

• The funniest

• The most stupid

• The most exiting

• The most rewarding

• The wettest

My wife has scoured the sheep farms and hills of this part of Northern Lancashire for the few Thais who are living in this cold part of the world. They are invited to our house.

She has just told me, “First the food will be cooked, then the Buddha will be blessed. We open the whiskey and the fun will begin.”

There is a chance you will read later, what this fun turns out to be.

[taxexile]

i saw a young thai man kicked and beaten to death about 10 feet in front of me at about 4.30 yesterday afternoon by a group of other thais during the celebrations in soi cowboy.

it was disturbing to say the least and the images are hard to erase from my mind.

the police were on the scene before the thugs had left but they (the police) didnt seem interested in either catching them or taking control of the situation.

life is very cheap in this country.

[bkkmadness]

What exactly happened? I just saw on another forum a ref to this posting and was searching some info on it but none available yet.

It must have been something pretty severe to warrant such a beating? Or maybe just the booze?

[taxexile]

it was a great days water throwing down the cowboy yesterday , a great atmosphere of laughter , the whole street singing along to isaan songs blasting out of loudspeakers , kids playing , pick-ups coming through loaded with people all getting into the fun.

although there was a lot of drinking and most of the girls were legless there was none of the menace you can get in crowds such as you do at english soccer matches or rowdy concerts , no hint that violence might make an appearance.

suddenly from out of nowhere a group of about 6 drunk thai youths jumped down off the pickup that was passing just where i was stood and laid into a thai youth.

punching him and hitting him with beer bottles , soon he was down and then they really got going on him , kicking him very hard in the face and head. looked like a rag doll being kicked around . it was relentless ultra - violence. they were on him like a pack of wild dogs. others joined in either to stop the assault or attack the downed mans friends.

a big falang went ballistic too and had to be held back by thais after he punched a thai man in the face.

by now a policeman had arrived and within a couple of minutes a police pickup was on the scene , the guy was still on the ground. the police didnt so much as look at him or offer any assistance in getting him into their vehicle to take him to hospital.

he was being given mouth to mouth and chest thumping by some thais.he was unconscious with wide staring eyes.

eventually a car pulled into the soi and he was bundled in and the car drove off.

the pickup containing the gang was still down the other end of soi cowboy when the police arrived and it was pointed out to them but they didnt seem to want to know.

within 10 minutes the police had left.

i heard today that the man died later in hospital , he never regained consciousness , and he was part of a crew delivering beer to the bars.

nobody seemed to know what sparked it off.

as i said it was truly disturbing to see , you read about mob violence , but to see it from close up like that was something else and knowing that a young mans life was taken from him in a couple of minutes without warning , well you see it in films but to see it like that ..... i cant really find the words for it.

the disinterest shown by the police was something else too.

i guess he was just some unknown delivery boy , at the bottom end of the social ladder , and not worth investigating fully in order to bring justice to his family.

this indeed is the real unseen thailand.

Edited April 14, 2005 by taxexile

[McAttack]

Going further along this morbid path...My wife read a Thai newspaper I think called "Thairat" on the net and she said there were a few people caught in Patani with acid in their water guns shooting it at people. Face and eye injuries were received by a few people that alerted the police to the idiots.

[Thaiboxer]

taxexile...I'm sorry to hear of such a disturbing incident and that you had to witness it. It's sad to see what is normally a fun celebration being spoiled by drunkeness and violence. It's one thing to see it on TV in an action film; I can only imagine how it must have been to see something like that in real life.

I have heard of people getting angered by the water throwing and powder smearing to the point of punches being thrown but this is the worst I have heard thus far. This reminds me of the countless incidents involving those vocational students having gang type fights with students from other schools which often result in injuries and deaths. At least some folks tried to stop the attackers but it obviously wasn't enough. I'm shocked that the police didn't take any interest in getting the wounded guy to the hospital or at least going after the bad guys in the truck. Maybe the guys in the truck are related to some big police chief or something; like those mafioso losers who do whatever they want to whomever they want and never receive any punshiment for it.

The incident you witnessed is one of the reasons why I prefer to stay away from scenes involving loads of drunk Thai guys. Songkran has lost it's cultural appeal and is now just an outlet for these lowlifes to cause trouble.

I hope you can still enjoy the rest of your holiday

[Thomas_Merton]

...this indeed is the real unseen  thailand.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

...and the most horrible. So sad.

Our pleasures pale into insignificance.

Edited April 14, 2005 by Thomas_Merton

[mike_l]

Going further along this morbid path...My wife read a Thai newspaper I think called "Thairat" on the net and she said there were a few people caught in Patani with acid in their water guns shooting it at people.  Face and eye injuries were received by a few people that alerted the police to the idiots.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I was just reading about this, there's an English language article about it here http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/newsArticl...ND-SECURITY.xml

BANGKOK (Reuters) - Six teenage Thais have suffered major facial and body burns after being sprayed by hydrochrolic acid mixed in water at a public park during the Songkran water festival in southern Thailand, police said.

Two Muslim teenage suspects were held in Pattani town near the Malaysian border late on Wednesday after they were identified by witnesses as having fired toy guns containing the water- diluted acid on festival celebrants in the park, police said. The two denied committing the act which police suspected might have been linked to sustained bloody violence in three southern Thai provinces in the past 15 months during which about 600 people have died.

Police said the suspects would face a charge of physical assault with intent to harm.

Among the six injured was a boy hospitalised with serious eye burns.

Songkran is a regional annual New Year water festival celebrated widely in Thailand, Myanmar, Laos and Cambodia.

[sua yai]

Two rather unsavoury incidents which dampen the festivities - no pun intended.

For the first time in 7 years, I remained totally dry. Still got a leg wound from a motorcycle accident two months ago. Parts are not fully healed. After that length of time, I wasn't taking any chances with getting dirty water on it.

Still, the gf came around in the evening and we had a pleasant time together. I even remained sober. Unbelievable.

[jayenram]

I managed to stay relatively dry. On the outside!

[marquess]

I had to go out yesterday to buy a new fridge, having punctured a hole in my old one. Even though the Tescos, is only about 5km from my house, it took ages. I must says that the atmosphere looked dangerous, three sometimes four people on a motorbike. Drunk, rowdy and not a police man in sight. No wonder there are some many accidents at this time of the year. I should not care to have someone lay their hands on me, thus I always stay at home.

As to the other incident, I read with incredulity, about how the police just walked away, what are they paid for? Could no one intervene to try and save this poor unfortunate boy?

[bkkmadness]

Sad sad story, one of the reasons I left the UK to get away from that kind of mindless violence.

I have to say Bangkok songkranm leaves a lot to be desired, people just lose control over the period. I had an early songkran in my gfs hometown of Tak, a lot more fun and a lot more chilled out, and anyone that didn't want to get wet that was just passing by just had to say so and no one soaked them just because it was sonkran.

[taxexile]

Could no one intervene to try and save this poor unfortunate boy?

the initial altercation that involved say 6 to 8 onto the one victim , soon , (within 10 seconds or so ) escalated to about 20 or more people , full force kicks and punches and bottles , it happened so fast and was extremely violent.

it would have been a very brave man or a very foolish man to intervene either during the attack or in the minutes after the attack when peoples emotions were very unstable due to what they had just seen and the alcohol they had consumed.

only bullets could have stopped them once they got started.

about how the police just walked away

they arrived within about 30 seconds of the end of the attack , and all they did was to try and calm down a lot of drunks who were screaming and trying to drag the police in the direction of the gang of attackers. they paid no attention at all to the victim or the efforts at resuscitation.

one policeman actually pulled out his gun and pointed it at one guy to get him to calm down and keep his hands to himself.

the gun was wrapped in a plastic tesco bag to keep it dry and it looked quite comical , an overweight policeman pointing a gun shaped tesco bag at a drunken thai man.

[JemJem]

Gees.....what a terrible incident !

With so many witnesses around, it will be amazing if none of the attackers is brought to justice !! Then again, it wouldn't be TOO MUCH of a surprise to us 'old hands' !

Regards,

Jem

[siamesekitty]

I am actually feeling physically sickened by this.

I hope the whole "karma" thing is for real.

[The_Moog]

amazing if none of the attackers is brought to justice !!

Welsome to 'Amazing Thailand'.

This sort of brutality happens a lot - but just not under farang noses.

[bkkmadness]

Does it not tend to be more brutality for a reason over here though ie. girls/money/face disagreements as oppose to in the west where it often happens as part of the Friday night pissup package?

[ProfessorFart]

Its strange that over the past few years there seems to be a sinister edge creeping into Songkhran.

I wonder if all of the clampdowns on Thai society in recent years has anything to do with it?

Songkhran usually a time for letting off steam and even settling scores in a fun way.

When you clampdown and restrict the people far more than they are used too, when they are given the chance to let off steam, they will do with more and more vigour.

[Thaiboxer]

More and more restrictions have been introduced, but that of course does not excuse people from senseless, violent acts against others. I agree that a sinister edge has made its way into the Songkran celebration. Combine this aggressive attitude with some whiskey and it's a recipe for disaster. Young men are not the only victims; many ladies have had guys grab them and rub that white powder all over their bodies. Then you have those two punk teens down south who were shooting people with acid water causing some severe facial/eye injuries. The police are very keen to catch people dropping cigarette butts around JJ but they can't be bothered to protect people from senseless violence. They should be fired an made an example of.

[thaihome]

I spent both Wednesday and Thursday enjoying and actively participating in the Songkran fun, along with probably several thousand other people, around the Silom/Soi Thaniya area. It was the typical madness and chaos we have missed living away from Thailand the past 2 years and it was great to be here.

The incident at Soi Cowboy is very unfortunate but I did not see anything close to that where we were and I believe that it is fairly isolated incident. On the whole, the atmosphere was one of great fun and general joy at being alive.

TH

PS - If you happened to one of the people not real happy with getting wet, I suggest next time you take a taxi.

TH

[Shola]

Well on a more cheerful note, I popped down to the end of my soi and played Songkhran with some kids and my hubbys friend and wife!

I was quite a novelty to the peeps stopping on the trucks, I had so much powder paste caked on my face that I couldn't see and then preceded to lob a plastic container of water at a car, unfortunatly the container went to! Whoops! No damage though! (Except to the container which the guy ran over )

I was force fed watery bear through a straw and all in all a good afternoon!

[lopburi3]

I spent both Wednesday and Thursday enjoying and actively participating in the Songkran fun, along with probably several thousand other people, around the Silom/Soi Thaniya area.  It was the typical madness and chaos we have missed living away from Thailand the past 2 years and it was great to be here.

The incident at Soi Cowboy is very unfortunate but I did not see anything close to that where we were and I believe that it is fairly isolated incident.  On the whole, the atmosphere was one of great fun and general joy at being alive.

TH

PS - If you happened to one of the people not real happy with getting wet, I suggest next time you take a taxi.

TH

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Unfortunately it does not appear to be an isolated incident. We have heard reports of four attack/deaths on Wed and several more yesterday here on one kilometer of Chok Chai 4: and yesterday there was very heavy police presence (Commando Unit HQ is here). This is a time of fear for many adult Thai here in Bangkok. It has always been bad but this appears to be worse than previous years.

[thaihome]

Unfortunately it does not appear to be an isolated incident.  We have heard reports of four attack/deaths on Wed and several more yesterday here on one kilometer of Chok Chai 4: and yesterday there was very heavy police presence (Commando Unit HQ is here).  This is a time of fear for many adult Thai here in Bangkok.  It has always been bad but this appears to be worse than previous years.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

All I can say, as person that was out in the middle of one the major areas, I did not see anything close to a threatening situation. That doesn’t mean there couldn’t have been a major incident just down the road and we would not have known.

I do agree that some Thai adults are fearful, and some of motorcycle gangs can seem pretty intimidating at times, but they mostly seemed concerned with each other and ignored the bystanders and we were fairly careful not to provoke them. But they were far outnumbered by the normal people riding in back of trucks and walking down the street having a blast.

Just comes down to how much of kid you have left in you.

TH

[Thomas_Merton]

I am bumping this thread (not because I started it), but because the sad story contained in it may not be read, seeing as someone has now started a similar thread.

Edited April 17, 2005 by Thomas_Merton

[Boatabike]

This is indeed a sad story, but this is alcohol not Songkran. This is why Alcohol sales are banned during election times and Kings birthday. A culture that is traditionaly made to smile whilst feeling anger does not not know how to channel its emotions properly, when you add alcohol to that the resulting boom can & is messy, that anger and frustration build up when there is no easy outlet. I got angry one day at work, everything that could go wrong did go wrong, it was hot, i was tired and angry so i kicked the wall, i felt much better, but the Thai person who happened to see it was shocked, it took 3 weeks before all (yes she had to tell every one) the staff allowed me to forget it. For me it was a 2 second outlet that cured my frustration. For the staff it would have been better apparently (& this is what she told me her self) if i had actually hit someone, work that one out?

In my town there used to be shootings or stabbings daily just 10- 15 years ago, they didnt need to wait for a big holiday, just add alcohol. These occurences have dropped hugely since thoes days. Thai people can be extremely violent when they lose control, this is not a new thing. In my view they have calmed down a lot to how it used to be(maybe not pataya). But drunken violence is common when Thai men are pissed. We all avoid drunk Thai youths do we not? If not you should unless you know them well. I hope that the police will eventualy do something about what happened, but hope is about all i feel will happen if they couldnt be arsed when the bastards were in plain sight.

Its a horrid thing to have to witness, god forbid anyone else has to see that happening. Alcohol is the key, not songkran. Repressed emotional outlet is the problem.

Solution? christ knows.

Sogkran here was very good fun, i saw a few youths having inter group fistycuffs a couple of times (drunk yes) but 99.9% of the people, even the drunk ones, just wanted a good time. If the same event happened in the UK i am sure we would see far more violent fights occuring, maybe not the death rate but the fighting yes.

sorry if this is a bit disjointed but i am tired and cant be editing it right now.

Edited April 17, 2005 by Boatabike

[booma]

Does it not tend to be more brutality for a reason over here though ie. girls/money/face disagreements as oppose to in the west where it often happens as part of the Friday night pissup package?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What 'Friday night pissup scrap' or any form of violence can avoid being associated with arguments about girls/money/face?

[HarryHacker]

it was a great days water throwing down the cowboy yesterday , a great atmosphere of laughter , the whole street singing along to isaan songs blasting out of loudspeakers , kids playing , pick-ups coming through loaded with people all getting into the fun.

although there was a lot of drinking and most of the girls were legless there was none of the menace you can get in crowds such as you do at english soccer matches or rowdy concerts , no hint that violence might make an appearance.

suddenly from out of nowhere a group of about 6 drunk thai youths jumped down off the pickup that was passing just where i was stood and laid into a thai youth.

punching him and hitting him with beer bottles , soon he was down and then they really got going on him , kicking him very hard in the face and head. looked like a rag doll being kicked around . it was relentless ultra - violence. they were on him like a pack of wild dogs. others joined in either to stop the assault or attack the downed mans friends.

a big falang went ballistic too and had to be held back by thais after he punched a thai man in the face.

by now a policeman had arrived and within a couple of minutes a police pickup was on the scene , the guy was still on the ground. the police didnt so much as look at him or offer any assistance in getting him into their vehicle to take him to hospital.

he was being given mouth to mouth and chest thumping by some thais.he was unconscious with wide staring eyes.

eventually a car pulled into the soi and he was bundled in and the car drove off.

the pickup containing the gang was still down the other end of soi cowboy when the police arrived and it was pointed out to them but they didnt seem to want to know.

within 10 minutes the police had left.

i heard today that the man died later in hospital , he never regained consciousness , and he was part of a crew delivering beer to the bars.

nobody seemed to know what sparked it off.

as i said it was truly disturbing to see , you read about mob violence , but to see it from close up like that was something else and knowing that a young mans life was taken from him in a couple of minutes without warning , well you see it in films but to see it like that ..... i cant really find the words for it.

the disinterest shown by the police was something else too.

i guess he was just some unknown delivery boy , at the bottom end of the social ladder , and not worth investigating fully in order to bring justice to his family.

this indeed is the real unseen  thailand.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[HarryHacker]

it was a great days water throwing down the cowboy yesterday , a great atmosphere of laughter , the whole street singing along to isaan songs blasting out of loudspeakers , kids playing , pick-ups coming through loaded with people all getting into the fun.

although there was a lot of drinking and most of the girls were legless there was none of the menace you can get in crowds such as you do at english soccer matches or rowdy concerts , no hint that violence might make an appearance.

suddenly from out of nowhere a group of about 6 drunk thai youths jumped down off the pickup that was passing just where i was stood and laid into a thai youth.

punching him and hitting him with beer bottles , soon he was down and then they really got going on him , kicking him very hard in the face and head. looked like a rag doll being kicked around . it was relentless ultra - violence. they were on him like a pack of wild dogs. others joined in either to stop the assault or attack the downed mans friends.

a big falang went ballistic too and had to be held back by thais after he punched a thai man in the face.

by now a policeman had arrived and within a couple of minutes a police pickup was on the scene , the guy was still on the ground. the police didnt so much as look at him or offer any assistance in getting him into their vehicle to take him to hospital.

he was being given mouth to mouth and chest thumping by some thais.he was unconscious with wide staring eyes.

eventually a car pulled into the soi and he was bundled in and the car drove off.

the pickup containing the gang was still down the other end of soi cowboy when the police arrived and it was pointed out to them but they didnt seem to want to know.

within 10 minutes the police had left.

i heard today that the man died later in hospital , he never regained consciousness , and he was part of a crew delivering beer to the bars.

nobody seemed to know what sparked it off.

as i said it was truly disturbing to see , you read about mob violence , but to see it from close up like that was something else and knowing that a young mans life was taken from him in a couple of minutes without warning , well you see it in films but to see it like that ..... i cant really find the words for it.

the disinterest shown by the police was something else too.

i guess he was just some unknown delivery boy , at the bottom end of the social ladder , and not worth investigating fully in order to bring justice to his family.

this indeed is the real unseen  thailand.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Taxexile, just picked up this topic. Your account is spot on, I was drinking in the Irish Bar, two bars up from the action.

Just a couple of add-ons. The single cop who was first on the scene had no idea how to contain the situation, he got his gun out, still in a plastic bag and pointed it towards the sky, later without the plastic bag pointed it in all directions. I really thought he was losing it!

The two farangs who got involved did so to help the poor Thai lad. Should they have? Thai V Thai and all that, I just don’t know the answer to that one.

It spoilt a very good day but in the many years I have done Cowboy at Songkran I have never ever seen a hint of trouble.

[taxexile]

The two farangs who got involved did so to help the poor Thai lad. Should they have

i dont know the answer to that , by the time they got involved the thai lad was down and out and the gang were down the other end of the soi.

ive been there three times for songkraan , its always been a great days fun.

last week was the first time it went sour.

and yes , the police were out of their depth.

the gun in the bag reminded me of a woody allen film where he tries to escape from jail with a gun shaped bar of soap and its raining hard and he's left pointing with a hand full of foam.

[bkkmadness]

Does it not tend to be more brutality for a reason over here though ie. girls/money/face disagreements as oppose to in the west where it often happens as part of the Friday night pissup package?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What 'Friday night pissup scrap' or any form of violence can avoid being associated with arguments about girls/money/face?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

people get drunk and violence towards someone else is just an addition to the fun, it happens all over the uk. Friday night, go out, get pissed, beat some one up, go home, watch a movie.