Arms Seized By Thailand Were Iran-bound

[george]

Arms Seized by Thailand Were Iran-Bound

Plane's Cargo Described as 'Oil Industry Spare Parts'

A plane loaded with weapons from North Korea that was recently impounded in Bangkok was bound for Iran, according to documents obtained by arms-trafficking experts.

The destination of the Ilyushin-76, which Thai authorities have said carried 35 tons of armaments, has been unknown. Thai officials said the plane flew to Pyongyang via Bangkok to collect its cargo, then returned to Bangkok to refuel on Dec. 11. It was seized during that stop and its five crew members were detained by Thai police.

A flight plan for the IL-76, obtained by researchers in the U.S. and Belgium, shows that after Bangkok the plane was due to make refueling stops in Sri Lanka, the United Arab Emirates and Ukraine before unloading its cargo in Tehran. Iranian officials didn't respond to requests for comment.

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The flight plan indicates that en route to Pyongyang the plane stopped at an air force base in Azerbaijan; the nature of that stop is unclear. Azerbaijani officials couldn't be reached for comment.

The apparent links among the military cargo, North Korea and Iran raise fresh questions about how nations try to evade international sanctions. The United Nations Security Council has banned the sale of small and heavy weapons from North Korea and all weapons sales from Iran.

The new information is presented in a joint draft report by analysts at TransArms, based in Chicago, and the International Peace Information Service, or IPIS, of Antwerp, Belgium. Both organizations conduct research on conflicts around the world, including how they are financed and supplied with weapons. A draft copy of the report was provided to The Wall Street Journal. The report hasn't been independently confirmed.

U.S. State Department spokesman Darby Holladay declined to comment on the seizure of the weapons and referred questions to the Thai government.

It remains unclear whether Iran intended to use the weapons itself. Western governments have accused Iran of supporting militants in Lebanon, the Palestinian territories and Iraq.

Thai officials say they have received little information from the plane's crew. The crew say they were told the cargo was oil-drilling equipment and have denied knowing there were weapons aboard.

The flight documents obtained by TransArms and IPIS state that the cargo is "oil industry spare parts." The flight's planners appear to have worked hard to maintain appearances. A packing list includes eight categories of equipment, such as "Geothermal rigs spare parts -- model MTEC6". Thai officials have said the actual cargo included shoulder-launched missiles, parts for surface-to-air missiles and electronic systems to control weapons.

Arms-trafficking specialists have puzzled over the stop in Bangkok, an airport that is heavily policed because of the drug trade. "This is an unusual flight plan for general cargo, but if it's for an arms flight, it doesn't make any sense," said Peter Danssaert, an arms-trade researcher at IPIS involved in preparing the report.

A question still unanswered is who organized the weapons shipment. It appears the planners went to great lengths to hide their identities. The plane is registered to a company in the Republic of Georgia, Air West Ltd. Air West on Nov. 5 leased it to another firm, SP Trading Ltd., according to an Air West manager and a contract seen by The Wall Street Journal. SP Trading, registered in New Zealand, appears to be a shell company owned by other companies.

In another contract dated Dec. 4, discussed in the report by TransArms and IPIS and seen by the Journal, SP Trading leased the plane to a Hong Kong-based company. The Hong Kong company is owned by a second Hong Kong firm, which is owned by a third firm, based in the British Virgin Islands, according to company registration documents. These companies appear to have organized the cargo.

An Air West manager said the company had leased the plane to SP Trading and he knew no more. Officials from SP Trading couldn't be located.

The Georgian-registered IL-76 plane is owned by a company based in the United Arab Emirates, according to information in the draft report confirmed by Georgian aviation officials. The company, Overseas Cargo FZE, is based in Sharjah, one of the U.A.E.'s seven emirates.

A U.A.E. official confirmed that the IL-76 landed in the country on Dec. 9. The plane refueled and took off with an empty cargo hold, the official said.

Overseas Cargo's registration documents, reviewed by The Wall Street Journal in Sharjah, describe it as an aircraft-handling firm and oil-services consultancy with one shareholder, Svetlana Zykova.

Overseas Cargo's office in Sharjah referred inquiries to Ms. Zykova, who was contacted on a U.A.E. cellphone. The woman who answered identified herself as Svetlana Zykova, confirmed she was the owner of Overseas Cargo, and hung up when asked about the company's connection to the plane seized in Thailand.

-- Wall Street Journal 2009-12-21

[nonthaburial]

Iran seems a strange final destination considering its geographical location, they have a lot of dodgy countries closer to hand. Plus if Iran is capable of building nuclear weaponary I would have thought they would have no problem manufacturing their own weapons.

[Credo]

Nothing is for sure as of yet, except that some people involved won't be having a very Merry Christmas.

[hhgz]

"if Iran is capable of building nuclear weaponary I would have thought they would have no problem manufacturing their own weapons."

What makes you think that Iran has the ability to build nuclear weaponry?

[webfact]

MCOT -NEWS

Thai Crime Suppression Division suspects Thais involved in planeload of weapons from NKorea seized in Bangkok; to question customs, ground officials

-- TNA 2009/12/21

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

[Thongkorn]

"if Iran is capable of building nuclear weaponary I would have thought they would have no problem manufacturing their own weapons."

What makes you think that Iran has the ability to build nuclear weaponry?

Because they have under ground Development sites, Also the British have confirmed this to be true , They are not far from producing a mechanism to detonate one , also they have carried out a test fireing of a home made rocket, capable of carrying a nuclear warhead ,and reaching Israel.

[kennkate]

"if Iran is capable of building nuclear weaponary I would have thought they would have no problem manufacturing their own weapons."

What makes you think that Iran has the ability to build nuclear weaponry?

Because they have under ground Development sites, Also the British have confirmed this to be true , They are not far from producing a mechanism to detonate one , also they have carried out a test fireing of a home made rocket, capable of carrying a nuclear warhead ,and reaching Israel.

Are we talking about the same British people who told the British public that Iraq had WMD's and we had to go to war with them ASAP

Later this has been proved NOT to be the case

I am not saying that Iran is not working towards that goal.

I doubt the manufacture of weapons like the ones sized is outside the capability of Iran. That begs the question was that the real destination ?

[TAWP]

"if Iran is capable of building nuclear weaponary I would have thought they would have no problem manufacturing their own weapons."

What makes you think that Iran has the ability to build nuclear weaponry?

Or even weapon or weapon-systems.

They have a limited number of years in trying to do it. All of their planes where purchased (F-14A's for example) from foreign countries.

And for small arms etc: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equipment_of_...army#Small_arms - while they want to put as much as possible under local production, it will take some time before they are covered.

[TAWP]

"if Iran is capable of building nuclear weaponary I would have thought they would have no problem manufacturing their own weapons."

What makes you think that Iran has the ability to build nuclear weaponry?

Because they have under ground Development sites, Also the British have confirmed this to be true , They are not far from producing a mechanism to detonate one , also they have carried out a test fireing of a home made rocket, capable of carrying a nuclear warhead ,and reaching Israel.

Do you have any source to this claim? (Not including The Sun etc.)

[Thongkorn]

"if Iran is capable of building nuclear weaponary I would have thought they would have no problem manufacturing their own weapons."

What makes you think that Iran has the ability to build nuclear weaponry?

Because they have under ground Development sites, Also the British have confirmed this to be true , They are not far from producing a mechanism to detonate one , also they have carried out a test fireing of a home made rocket, capable of carrying a nuclear warhead ,and reaching Israel.

Do you have any source to this claim? (Not including The Sun etc.)

Its been on the BBC news , CNN, Quite a few other TV stations around the world, Its been on AljazerTv , Iran have Admitted that they are not far off developing a bomb ,The Rocket launch is common knowledge

[Spoonman]

Dumb Question, how does one fly a plane randomly around the world and stop at an airport to refuel, does it work the same as if i was pulling my pickup into whatever petrol station to fill up with fuel ??

[nowork114]

Dumb Question, how does one fly a plane randomly around the world and stop at an airport to refuel, does it work the same as if i was pulling my pickup into whatever petrol station to fill up with fuel ??

Basically yes. You need only a flight plan from the airport you are now to the next destination - therefore it's not that quick and easy to find the intended destination as Thai authorities knew only the next refueling stop. I bet the crew knew about the weapons (anyway who would buy oil-drilling equipment from North Korea) but it wouldn't bee impossible to keep them in dark by providing them only with flight plan to the next stop.

IMHO Anyway this investigation will come to a dead end - too difficult to find the real owners of the shell companies in HKG. Crew will get few years in Thai jail, later "quietly" released, cargo plane will be seized and sold in auction or returned to the owner for some payment ...

There will be no will to fully investigate coz I would put my month salary on that it will not be pleasant for many governments if the crew start to talk what they have transported in their carers...

[TAWP]

Its been on the BBC news , CNN, Quite a few other TV stations around the world, Its been on AljazerTv , Iran have Admitted that they are not far off developing a bomb ,The Rocket launch is common knowledge

Sorry, unspecified references to news-networks in general and references to propaganda claims with someone supposedly claiming Iran 'are not far away from developing a bomb' isn't a valid source.

[moskito]

Because they have under ground Development sites, Also the British have confirmed this to be true , They are not far from producing a mechanism to detonate one , also they have carried out a test fireing of a home made rocket, capable of carrying a nuclear warhead ,and reaching Israel.

The British confirmed weapons of mass destruction in Irak too

nothing sure yet and in the meantime a lot of agencys have had time enough to set up a story.

Edited December 21, 2009 by moskito

[hammered]

Mmmmm. Interesting so a group in the US claims the weapons were heading from one great satan to another and everyone is expected to believe it unquestioningly. Now why exactly would Iran be buying illicit weapons of a dubious quality from North Korea when they can call up Russia or China and have anything they wanted shipped in?

By the way, most assessments of Irans potential nuclear security by independent bodies put it many years off. Just because some British or US source said it would be earlier doesnt mean it is true. Remember all the lies about what Saddam had just so a war could be started. I also dont remember anyone in the UK or US getting all excitable when Israel developed nukes and started a nuclear arms race in the middle east.

Another inconvenient fact many ignore is that even when you develop a bomb it takes ages to then miniturise it to stick on a rocket. Quite why if it developed nukes why Iran would suddenly use them is also beyond comprehension. The only time nukes were ever used was when there was no retaliatory ability. They in fact are a deterrent and not an attack option as history shows us.

Edited December 21, 2009 by hammered

[wolf5370]

Because they have under ground Development sites, Also the British have confirmed this to be true , They are not far from producing a mechanism to detonate one , also they have carried out a test fireing of a home made rocket, capable of carrying a nuclear warhead ,and reaching Israel.

The British confirmed weapons of mass destruction in Irak too

nothing sure yet and in the meantime a lot of agencys have had time enough to set up a story.

No they didn't - there's no such place as Irak!

Now, if you meant Iraq, then so did the US and most of Europe. There were just different agendas and thus different intended strategies to deal with it.

Edited December 21, 2009 by wolf5370

[moskito]

Because they have under ground Development sites, Also the British have confirmed this to be true , They are not far from producing a mechanism to detonate one , also they have carried out a test fireing of a home made rocket, capable of carrying a nuclear warhead ,and reaching Israel.

The British confirmed weapons of mass destruction in Irak too

nothing sure yet and in the meantime a lot of agencys have had time enough to set up a story.

No they didn't - there's no such place as Irak!

Now, if you meant Iraq, then so did the US and most of Europe. There were just different agendas and thus different intended strategies to deal with it.

seems Wolfi is a smart ass, my deepest apologies for the K in Irak, in German its spelled like this and just why it is spelled IraQ in English doesnt make it

correct. The real name of that country is btw. ‏العراق‎ its sumerian language and means Araki, or rise of the sun......

And since you are so fantastic in history, maybe you will explain which countries in Europe are THE MOST for you? Poland? ‎

[brahmburgers]

"if Iran is capable of building nuclear weaponary I would have thought they would have no problem manufacturing their own weapons."

What makes you think that Iran has the ability to build nuclear weaponry?

Because they have under ground Development sites, Also the British have confirmed this to be true , They are not far from producing a mechanism to detonate one , also they have carried out a test fireing of a home made rocket, capable of carrying a nuclear warhead ,and reaching Israel.

a bit off topic, but I distinctly recall, back in my flower power days, a left wing free press tabloid in Washington D.C. came out with an article on how to build an H-bomb. I distinctly remember the accompanying diagram. (it was in the days of the Pentagon Papers incident, when radicals felt that everything had to be revealed).

Anyhow, if the details were published, way back in 1966, showing the basics of building a bomb, then why is it such a stretch to think that a national government couldn't get the detailed specs on bomb making 40 years later - a country which borders the former USSR, no less.

As for weapons shipments to Iran. There's no surprise in that dynamic. Even if they produce their own small weapons, there's no reason why they might not buy from another supplier. A person who works at Pepsi might go out and buy Fanta for his family. Plus, if some elements in Iran are planning to clandestinely ship weapons to Hezbollah, it would make more sense to ship items that would be traced to N.Korea if found. That would add an element of deniability to Iranian agents.

Now, with the mystery woman with the Russian name, the story gets twisted even further. This is playing out almost weirder than the Iran/Contra imbroglio. I say 'almost' because it would take a very odd scenario to top the Christmas cake in the shape of a Bible that was personally hand delivered to an Iranian Ayatollah by the then US Secretary of Defense, to show appreciation for the illegal tangle of arms dealing they were both involved in at the time.

[zaphodbeeblebrox]

It is possible Iran was the destination of the arms, but I don't trust the source at all. The WSJ is now owned by Rupert Murdoch and FoxNews, so the WSJ no longer should be considered as independent or even particularly credible

[Publicus]

It is possible Iran was the destination of the arms, but I don't trust the source at all. The WSJ is now owned by Rupert Murdoch and FoxNews, so the WSJ no longer should be considered as independent or even particularly credible

Google each of the organizations identified and cited in the WSJ report - the International Peace Information Service in Belgium and TransArms in Chicago. They're entirely credible and on the side of right.

The WSJ has superb reporters and investigative journalists globally. Murdock ain't had time to muck it up nor will he be able to without a wholesale revolt at the institution and in US journalism from coast to coast.

Next we'll be hearing crap that because TransArms investigators of global illicit arms transactions is in Chicago it's an Obama front that is bogus.

Get the facts and information. 

[wolf5370]

Because they have under ground Development sites, Also the British have confirmed this to be true , They are not far from producing a mechanism to detonate one , also they have carried out a test fireing of a home made rocket, capable of carrying a nuclear warhead ,and reaching Israel.

The British confirmed weapons of mass destruction in Irak too

nothing sure yet and in the meantime a lot of agencys have had time enough to set up a story.

No they didn't - there's no such place as Irak!

Now, if you meant Iraq, then so did the US and most of Europe. There were just different agendas and thus different intended strategies to deal with it.

seems Wolfi is a smart ass, my deepest apologies for the K in Irak, in German its spelled like this and just why it is spelled IraQ in English doesnt make it

correct. The real name of that country is btw. ‏العراق‎ its sumerian language and means Araki, or rise of the sun......

And since you are so fantastic in history, maybe you will explain which countries in Europe are THE MOST for you? Poland? ‎

I was only pulling your leg mossieman -= no need to bother sufing wikipedia for repostes.

As to Europe I was talking about current EU countries at the time and included Russia into the toss - no need to be brilliant at history, its pretty current, I lived it, I watched the news and read the papers like everyone else. Seen as you like surfing facts, I'm sure you can bring your history knowledge up to date with a little work

[Jingthing]

Mmmmm. Interesting so a group in the US claims the weapons were heading from one great satan to another and everyone is expected to believe it unquestioningly. Now why exactly would Iran be buying illicit weapons of a dubious quality from North Korea when they can call up Russia or China and have anything they wanted shipped in?

By the way, most assessments of Irans potential nuclear security by independent bodies put it many years off. Just because some British or US source said it would be earlier doesnt mean it is true. Remember all the lies about what Saddam had just so a war could be started. I also dont remember anyone in the UK or US getting all excitable when Israel developed nukes and started a nuclear arms race in the middle east.

Another inconvenient fact many ignore is that even when you develop a bomb it takes ages to then miniturise it to stick on a rocket. Quite why if it developed nukes why Iran would suddenly use them is also beyond comprehension. The only time nukes were ever used was when there was no retaliatory ability. They in fact are a deterrent and not an attack option as history shows us.

Iran is on the path to having working nukes. Everyone knows this. It will be very threatening to the Arab countries in the middle east, mostly Saudi Arabia, for this to happen, and stoke a nuclear escalation in a region that is already a powder keg. This isn't good and it is NOT only about Israel, not by a long shot.

Edited December 21, 2009 by Jingthing

[Soutpeel]

Iran is on the path to having working nukes. Everyone knows this. It will be very threatening to the Arab countries in the middle east, mostly Saudi Arabia, for this to happen, and stoke a nuclear escalation in a region that is already a powder keg. This isn't good and it is NOT only about Israel, not by a long shot.

Iran is about as close to a viable nuke as North Korea is.....remember the nuclear test not so long ago ???....more a fizzle than a bang...

As it stands Iran still does not have a viable enrichment program..a key component to getting a nuke off the ground so to speak...

My perception of this....Political sabre rattling from Iran and scare mongering from the US/Israel to justify another invasion/round of sanctions etc etc...

[LaoPo]

It is possible Iran was the destination of the arms, but I don't trust the source at all. The WSJ is now owned by Rupert Murdoch and FoxNews, so the WSJ no longer should be considered as independent or even particularly credible

Google each of the organizations identified and cited in the WSJ report - the International Peace Information Service in Belgium and TransArms in Chicago. They're entirely credible and on the side of right.

The WSJ has superb reporters and investigative journalists globally. Murdock ain't had time to muck it up nor will he be able to without a wholesale revolt at the institution and in US journalism from coast to coast.

Next we'll be hearing crap that because TransArms investigators of global illicit arms transactions is in Chicago it's an Obama front that is bogus.

Get the facts and information. 

I second that Publicus

LaoPo

[Jingthing]

I said they are on the path. I didn't say tomorrow. They are obviously working on it and they obviously want to do this as soon as they can. Iran's government isn't exactly a desirable one, so it is no wonder that not only Israel and the US, but also the Arab middle east, Russia, China, and Europe do not want them to succeed. I realize some people oppose Israel and the US so much that they do wish the Iran government success. However, the Arab middle east who also oppose Israel are not so irrational.

Edited December 21, 2009 by Jingthing

[pete_r]

The British confirmed weapons of mass destruction in Irak too

nothing sure yet and in the meantime a lot of agencys have had time enough to set up a story.

No they didn't - there's no such place as Irak!

Now, if you meant Iraq, then so did the US and most of Europe. There were just different agendas and thus different intended strategies to deal with it.

seems Wolfi is a smart ass, my deepest apologies for the K in Irak, in German its spelled like this and just why it is spelled IraQ in English doesnt make it

correct. The real name of that country is btw. ‏العراق‎ its sumerian language and means Araki, or rise of the sun......

And since you are so fantastic in history, maybe you will explain which countries in Europe are THE MOST for you? Poland? ‎

I was only pulling your leg mossieman -= no need to bother sufing wikipedia for repostes.

As to Europe I was talking about current EU countries at the time and included Russia into the toss - no need to be brilliant at history, its pretty current, I lived it, I watched the news and read the papers like everyone else. Seen as you like surfing facts, I'm sure you can bring your history knowledge up to date with a little work

Er, "current EU countries at the time", do you mean like France and Germany? Where did the "Old Europe" label come from if as you say "most of Europe" was so convinced by the WMD story?

[moe666]

So sorry no invasion of Iran from US cannot aford it.

[aras]

what are you talking about, the known facts ( for the public) are all over the media. You also need proof that the earth circles around the sun?

1 Iran has NEVER admitted they are close or are planning to make a nuclear bomb.( obviously )

2 Iran is indeed getting pretty good at making missiles they already have them with a range of 3000km and 3 are tested many times and these missiles of cours can carry the bomb.

they seem to be close to the 10 000 km missiles

4 they make helicopters and airplaines but naturally they cant be compared to russian us ..

for the rest well why the hel_l would the plane go around the globe to get to iran....isnt it easy to fly directly from korea to Iran. Or am i too dumb

Its been on the BBC news , CNN, Quite a few other TV stations around the world, Its been on AljazerTv , Iran have Admitted that they are not far off developing a bomb ,The Rocket launch is common knowledge

Sorry, unspecified references to news-networks in general and references to propaganda claims with someone supposedly claiming Iran 'are not far away from developing a bomb' isn't a valid source.

[tw25rw]

"if Iran is capable of building nuclear weaponary I would have thought they would have no problem manufacturing their own weapons."

What makes you think that Iran has the ability to build nuclear weaponry?

Because they have under ground Development sites, Also the British have confirmed this to be true , They are not far from producing a mechanism to detonate one , also they have carried out a test fireing of a home made rocket, capable of carrying a nuclear warhead ,and reaching Israel.

Assuming this to be correct, the technology and expertise is imported.

I'm sure they can obtain small arms easily enough for their own forces, but if they are arming Hezbollah they might want to do it in a way that can't easily be traced back to them.

[LaoPo]

what are you talking about, the known facts ( for the public) are all over the media. You also need proof that the earth circles around the sun?

1 Iran has NEVER admitted they are close or are planning to make a nuclear bomb.( obviously )

2 Iran is indeed getting pretty good at making missiles they already have them with a range of 3000km and 3 are tested many times and these missiles of cours can carry the bomb.

they seem to be close to the 10 000 km missiles

4 they make helicopters and airplaines but naturally they cant be compared to russian us ..

for the rest well why the hel_l would the plane go around the globe to get to iran....isnt it easy to fly directly from korea to Iran. Or am i too dumb

I wouldn't know if you're dumb but here's a map of Asia (and Iran doesn't even fit into that map..... to show the distances) and maybe you can tell us where the plane would have refueled, flying directly from Korea to Iran...?

BTW: interesting to know for the audience that Iran has exactly the same population as Thailand....66 Million

edit:

Here's a better ASIA map, different scale though, INCLUDING Iran:

LaoPo

Edited December 22, 2009 by LaoPo