Mot Dam, Small Black Decentralized Ant Invasion

[grrr]

We live on 6 rai of land, with many lamyai, teak, and other assorted fruit and native trees. Nearly everything growing here is infested with "mot dam", the common small black ants that bite (though not very painfully). They don't live in the ground, but prefer to live in any above ground enclosed space, such as between roof tiles, in dried teak leaves, inside dead wood or bamboo, in PVC pipes, etc. Unfortunately they don't have any interest in commercial bait, so I assume a homemade bait (like boric acid & sugar) wouldn't work either. Dishsoap and water kills them on contact, but doesn't seem to do anything to control their population. The ant-killing chalk available here stops them, but chalking 200 trees is not very practical. We avoid pesticides as much as possible, but absolutely need to do something to control these suckers.

Does anyone have a recommendation for bait or is spraying (everything!) the best way to fight them? If spraying, what is the best least toxic, readily available thing to use? Does neem oil work well controlling ants?

[IMA_FARANG]

Question: What are they eating?

In general the key to ant infestations is to find their food supply and kill them by poisoning the food supply.

Another thought is, if they are eating your fruit, you give them a food supply they like. For example over ripe fruit placed there as bait. Use a slow acting poison in that "free" food, so that when they come to eat they will take the poison, and then go back to their nests to die.

Ants can't/won't cross a water moat. They can't swim well enough, so that if the moat is wide enough they drown.

If you want to protect the trees, put some kind of protective barrier around the trees, with a sticky substance in/on it. That way when the ants try to cross the barrier, they will get stuck and die. (remember the old sticky fly paper we used to hang to trap flies?)

Just some general thoughts on how to deal with the problem. You'll have to decide if any of them might be applicable to your exact situation.

Good luck

Edited December 26, 2009 by IMA_FARANG

[jubby]

I'm watching this thread with Interest. I've tried a nasty pesticide spray which works but they just come back after a week. What do they eat ? It looks like tree bark or atleast there young does. I suspect nothing less than napalm would control them. I've taken to jetting them off the trees with water but its just a minor inconvenience for them. There just so prolific it would be difficult to put numbers on them. every teak leaf that drops becomes a nest. I suppose keeping the garden tidy and burning all fallen leaves etc. would help a bit. I like the idea of coating the base of the trees in something , anyone recomend a suitable substance ?

[jandtaa]

The boric acid mix works on them for me no problems.The bonus being it is carried back to the nest and destroys the entire colony.

cheers J

[grrr]

Question: What are they eating?

In general the key to ant infestations is to find their food supply and kill them by poisoning the food supply.

Another thought is, if they are eating your fruit, you give them a food supply they like. For example over ripe fruit placed there as bait. Use a slow acting poison in that "free" food, so that when they come to eat they will take the poison, and then go back to their nests to die.

Ants can't/won't cross a water moat. They can't swim well enough, so that if the moat is wide enough they drown.

If you want to protect the trees, put some kind of protective barrier around the trees, with a sticky substance in/on it. That way when the ants try to cross the barrier, they will get stuck and die. (remember the old sticky fly paper we used to hang to trap flies?)

Just some general thoughts on how to deal with the problem. You'll have to decide if any of them might be applicable to your exact situation.

Good luck

It's hard to say what they are eating, none of our trees have fruit right now. Things like bird and gecko poop attract them. Interestingly, they seem to be starved for water now that everything is so dry. Areas around outdoor faucets, cat water bowls, etc. draw them in. The sticky substance around the base of trees is a good idea, and would help with climbing termites as well. It wouldn't work for bamboo though, where they are overwhelming.

I'm watching this thread with Interest. I've tried a nasty pesticide spray which works but they just come back after a week. What do they eat ? It looks like tree bark or atleast there young does. I suspect nothing less than napalm would control them. I've taken to jetting them off the trees with water but its just a minor inconvenience for them. There just so prolific it would be difficult to put numbers on them. every teak leaf that drops becomes a nest. I suppose keeping the garden tidy and burning all fallen leaves etc. would help a bit. I like the idea of coating the base of the trees in something , anyone recomend a suitable substance ?

Yes, sticky substance ideas please! My wife thought of grease...

The boric acid mix works on them for me no problems.The bonus being it is carried back to the nest and destroys the entire colony.

I'd like to try the boric acid mix, but have yet to find it for sale in Chiang Rai. What sort of shop generally sells it?

[jandtaa]

If you come out of the old bus station where the tuk-tuk/songthaw stand is cross the road and turn right towards the main drag you'll come to an old fashioned pharmacy (lots of buckets and bottles of medicinal herbs and spices out the front with signs in english). The owner speaks some English and understood Boric acid. cost was 20 baht for 100g.

cheers for now J

[grrr]

If you come out of the old bus station where the tuk-tuk/songthaw stand is cross the road and turn right towards the main drag you'll come to an old fashioned pharmacy (lots of buckets and bottles of medicinal herbs and spices out the front with signs in english). The owner speaks some English and understood Boric acid. cost was 20 baht for 100g.

Thanks, I know the shop you are talking about!

The ants must know I'm plotting their demise as they invaded our kitchen this evening...and they usually stay outside.

[jubby]

I was in the shop your talking about today Jaantaa. No have Borax or boracic acid. I sent the missus in afterwards to double check. Nope . No have.

If you come across some on your travels please get some for me. I've got a real problem with them. I inspected and had to remove quite a few teak trees that had been damaged severely. Luckily I was going to thin them out anyway. But I've got to get on top of the problem.

[jandtaa]

Hi Jubby

I've got nearly 500g so can easily spare some, PM me if you want to pop over for some

J

[jubby]

Hi Jubby

I've got nearly 500g so can easily spare some, PM me if you want to pop over for some

J

Thanks Mate. I'll do that.

Little Bl&ck Barstewards are going to get it. Everyone will remember the Ant wars of 2010 ! ........... or maybe not !

Ooops I'm tripping again, got to change my brand of Coffee

Edited January 17, 2010 by jubby

[jandtaa]

Hi Jubby

All warfare is based on deception. Hence, when able to attack, we must seem unable; when using our forces, we must seem inactive; when we are near, we must make the enemy believe we are far away; when far away, we must make him believe we are near. Hold out baits to entice the enemy. Feign disorder, and crush him.

- Sun Tzu, the Art of War

We must drink the same brand of coffee  !!

J

[finner]

Boric acid is readily available in pattaya pharmacies. They must have a lot of falangs asking for it.

Down there though, it's not Ant Wars, it's the art of Panty Wars that are held daily.

Good luck and keep us posted..........

[jubby]

Boric acid is readily available in pattaya pharmacies. They must have a lot of falangs asking for it.

Down there though, it's not Ant Wars, it's the art of Panty Wars that are held daily.

Good luck and keep us posted..........

Interesting. I must google Boracic acid for its other uses. wouldn't want to make any assumptions

as for Sun Tsu, he is wasted on me. No deception or surprise, these MOFO's know they've got it comming

I'm not sure its the Coffee, maybe I need to get out more ............

[jubby]

Thanks for the Boric Acid Jaantaa. I've made up my first batch (probably too much water) . The ants are having a feeding frenzy.

Its clear I;m going to need Gallons of the stuff though. If you come across any more on your travels let me know.

Thanks.

[poldebol]

We have them in the kitchen and the bathroom. The in-laws says it is the time of year for the ants to come and visit us. I sprayed all their routes with shaving foam. The bathroom looks like a shopping window at X-mas now.

I know nothing about land or ants. But

"They don't live in the ground, but prefer to live in any above ground enclosed space"

+ : you never see ants on a clean beach

+: my little grey cells

= could you just try to clean one tree as much as possible, clear the land under it and cover at least a circle around the three with beach sand? Compare with another tree after a few days.

If it does not work, you can sit on it and think you have a private beach. If it works, I want a few kilo of lamyai.

[billd766]

Does anyone know what boric acid is in Thai.

My local pharmacies may have it but it will probably not be in English

[rice555]

Hello build766, if you want the thai word, just google boric acid google.th.co, great

way to find a word sometimes.

On one of the other posts about borax and boric acid, also one on slacked lime and masa threads, I gave the chem company in BKK that will ship cheap. Boxes are 450 to 500 grms.

Or call 02-381-7100-2

I buy mine at a chem supply store in Korat.

rice555

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[billd766]

Thanks a lot for that.

I have printed it out which should make life a bit easier.

[finner]

Got real tired of watching the 8 lane ant highway traffic through my hong nam which has been ongoing for 4 months now but they've gone over the edge with me now and I've decided to use THE KILLER! Boric acid and sugar about 1 : 4 ratio in warm water. I hate these small red ants because they snuck into my towel and the next shower guess what I discovered all over me (especially in the sensitive places). YIKES!

They loved it and I had to refill the bowl 3 times about 1/4 " each time. 2 days later, all gone, ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

[jubby]

The Borix acid works a treat but after a few weeks the things just come back. There's just so many of them.

I finally got round to trying to see what the effect of transfering some of the much bigger, 3 - 4 times bigger, Red ants to the trees hopeing the bigger ants would move the smaller black ants on so to speak. I transfered one red ants nest from another place approx 2 kms away onto one of our lamyai's. The first few minutes didn't look good. Something like the Alamo or Zulu. The Reds were vastly outnumbered and a little confused. I was hopeing they would dig in and form somesort of defence . after 3 days the reds are all deceased and the Blacks look better for it.

Nothing short of an Air Strike with Napalm is going to get rid of these little barstewards.