What Is Your Favorite Restaurant Western Food Nationality In Thailand?

[dantilley]

Here is the VERY CONCLUSIVE poll about where to best categorize MEXICAN food. The conclusion was INTERNATIONAL, and NOT western. Feel free to vote and comment there about that --

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?s=...t&p=3230499

That link's broken.

So, if Mexican food isn't western, do you still define Mexico as a western country? If not, what geographic region does it belong in?

[Jingthing]

Sorry, I'll supply a new link.

That is the place to discuss this. Not here.

In any case, for the purposes of this poll, the vast majority went for international so that's where it is categorized on these sister polls. If the VOTE had gone the other way, Mexican would be here in the western poll. To those who don't like this, what is the problem, you don't respect popular voting?

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?s=...t&p=3230499

Edited January 13, 2010 by Jingthing

[lazygourmet]

I voted Belgian... Not due to nationalistic pride, but more for the lack of typical Belgian fares!

To my knowledge, the one & only restaurant offering real Belgian dishes in the realm is Patrick, in Pattaya.

[sabaijai]

I could have included Mexican food but I didn't (as it is more properly categorized as international, not western)

Wrong.

Its a matter of opinion. In this opinion poll, the majority disagreed with you.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?s=...t&p=3230499

Whether the mods respect the opinion of the clear majority (that Mexican is best categorized as INTERNATIONAL, not WESTERN) is their call. However, how I choose to design a poll is MY call.

"[A]s it is more properly categorized as international, not western" pushes your opinion as fact.

As respondents are a self-selected group, there is no true 'majority' in the sense of a poll that surveys random respondents. Your 'majority' - which is not that great - does not in any way tell us what the majority of members viewing that subforum believe. In either case, it's a logical fallacy to conclude that a majority don't consider Mexican cuisine to be Western based on such a limited sampling.

What you consider to be non-Western, in Mexican cuisine, is a historical fact, not a cultural one. Cuisine can't be separated from culture based on historical roots alone. By the same logic, Italian cuisine would not be Western since it relies heavily on tomatoes and tomatoes are from the Americas.

As far as mods 'respecting' the poll .....

[dantilley]

I'm with SabaiJai on this one.

I mean, why wouldn't Mexican food be considered "Western"? Mexico's in the West after all, which is surely the one over-riding factor which dictates whether a country's food is considered western or not. And it's not as if it's right on the cusp of being considered in the East - e.g. you may say it's a matter of contention as to whether Turkish food is western or eastern, as part of the country is in Asia and part is in Europe. But Mexico is due south of the USA, which I'm pretty sure everyone agrees is very much a western country.

[Jingthing]

I could have included Mexican food but I didn't (as it is more properly categorized as international, not western)

Wrong.

Its a matter of opinion. In this opinion poll, the majority disagreed with you.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?s=...t&p=3230499

Whether the mods respect the opinion of the clear majority (that Mexican is best categorized as INTERNATIONAL, not WESTERN) is their call. However, how I choose to design a poll is MY call.

"[A]s it is more properly categorized as international, not western" pushes your opinion as fact.

As respondents are a self-selected group, there is no true 'majority' in the sense of a poll that surveys random respondents. Your 'majority' - which is not that great - does not in any way tell us what the majority of members viewing that subforum believe. In either case, it's a logical fallacy to conclude that a majority don't consider Mexican cuisine to be Western based on such a limited sampling.

What you consider to be non-Western, in Mexican cuisine, is a historical fact, not a cultural one. Cuisine can't be separated from culture based on historical roots alone. By the same logic, Italian cuisine would not be Western since it relies heavily on tomatoes and tomatoes are from the Americas.

As far as mods 'respecting' the poll .....

First of all, pot calling the kettle black here as far as BIAS on this issue. Of course you have every right to have a strong personal opinion on the question. However, I find your charges that the poll design was not objective to be in error. You are confusing the DESIGN of the poll (the questions and answer section) from my own personal comments. Totally different things. Before you accused even the design of being biased. I had to counter that the text of the answers was COPIED EXACTLY from the headings here from the food forums. Except the null option which I perhaps flippantly described as no other choices, sorry. The reason I wrote it that way was because that was the intent, to ONLY include the text of the existing forums, and NO OTHER CHOICES. To keep it is objective as I could and I believe I succeeded in that.

If you think a person who posts a poll does not have the right to state their own opinion outside of the actual proposed question and answer section, well I don't agree with you. I also don't think your assumption that people would LISTEN to my opinion has any basis in reality! I post a lot, but I am not particularly popular (2 stars, check it). The majority PERCENTAGE though is MASSIVE by polling standards. If you say it isn't, you reveal a lack of knowledge about polling. As far as it being an unscientific sample, agreed. Self selected voting, agreed. Only people who were interested enough in the topic and cared enough to vote, voted. OF COURSE. That's the way polls are done here. I could NOT have put the poll in EITHER the western or international forums because that of course would have been a bias, so I started it in general and it was later moved to farang pub. Yes that did mean that people who don't often visit the food forums may indeed vote. Anyone can vote in any poll here no matter where the actual poll is placed. Again, so what? Its impossible to restrict a poll to subset of members.

Look I am sorry if you don't like what the results of that poll said, but that part, the RESULTS, was out of my control entirely. It is what it is.

BTW, sometimes the structure of polls themselves are designed to be biased in the question and answer section. I do this sometimes for some humorous entertainment style polls. The Mexican category poll was a sober one, designed to be objective in structure.

Edited January 14, 2010 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

I'm with SabaiJai on this one.

I mean, why wouldn't Mexican food be considered "Western"? Mexico's in the West after all, which is surely the one over-riding factor which dictates whether a country's food is considered western or not. And it's not as if it's right on the cusp of being considered in the East - e.g. you may say it's a matter of contention as to whether Turkish food is western or eastern, as part of the country is in Asia and part is in Europe. But Mexico is due south of the USA, which I'm pretty sure everyone agrees is very much a western country.

There is a separate thread to discuss this, already linked. Geographical location is one factor of a number. Hemisphere is one factor of a number. I have addressed that issue in more detail over there and the categorization discussion is best KEPT over there.

This thread has kind of been hijacked, yes? I HAD to put Mexican in either western or international for these twin nationality preference polls. I picked the majority opinion of the poll, that's it. You may not believe me but if the results had gone the OTHER way, I would have put Mexican in the western poll without question.

Edited January 14, 2010 by Jingthing

[DP25]

In any case, for the purposes of this poll, the vast majority went for international so that's where it is categorized on these sister polls.

50% said international, 50% didn't, at current results, that's not exactly a vast majority. The poll was flawed because those were the only choices when it's obvious many people feel there shouldn't even BE separate 'Western' and 'international' food forums, just Thai and international forums as Western food is international in Thailand.

Anyway I voted for Italian. I like pasta and you can get it pretty much throughout Thailand, it's not too difficult to make it edible. It's also worked it's way in to Thai cuisine somewhat, you can find stuff like spaghetti kee mao in some places that only serve Thai food. Other nationalities are very hit and miss, and it can be an adventure ordering at a restaurant you've never been to. I'm really surprised at the number of votes for Irish. Guess a lot of people here go to Irish pubs? I don't think I've ever eaten in one in Thailand.

[Jingthing]

In any case, for the purposes of this poll, the vast majority went for international so that's where it is categorized on these sister polls.

50% said international, 50% didn't, at current results, that's not exactly a vast majority. The poll was flawed because those were the only choices when it's obvious many people feel there shouldn't even BE separate 'Western' and 'international' food forums, just Thai and international forums as Western food is international in Thailand.

Nice try. You simply added NULL votes to the western total. That is absurd. Null votes are null votes! You expect a limited poll to be about EVERY issue and still be coherent? That also is absurd. You are talking about a totally separate question (a wider reorganization) that of course was not there as that was NOT the topic of the poll. It's obvious, huh? Do a poll and you might know something about it, yes?

Edited January 14, 2010 by Jingthing

[bonobo]

The question of where threads on Mexican food should be has been discussed ad nauseum elsewhere. Please do not bring that up here.  Keep your comments to the poll here as designed or simply ignore it if you have a problem with it.

Any additional posts in this thread going into the Mexican/Western/International debate will be deleted.

Thanks.

[kikoman]

My Vote is Mexican Food, Tacos and Salsa.

Cheers:

[Jingthing]

My Vote is Mexican Food, Tacos and Salsa.

Cheers:

Then perhaps you should vote for Italian. Tomato sauce/salsa, what's the diff? :D

BTW, I think you may have misunderstood the question anyway. It isn't about your favorite SPECIFIC restaurant. It's about your favorite western restaurant NATIONALITY of what's available to you in Thailand. So what western nationalities of restaurants are available in the Nakhon Sawan area?

Edited January 15, 2010 by Jingthing

[SantiSuk]

Pizza and I am of Pizza nationality

[Jingthing]

Pizza and I am of Pizza nationality

And a very CRUSTY nationality it is ...

[koheesti]

What a mess. Instead of one thread with one poll, we get three threads and three polls just because the pollmeister made one clear omission.

If I knew enough about different styles of Thai food, I'd start a poll about that. As it is, living way down here on Samui about all I get is Issan style.

Back to Western food...

Can anyone give three examples of food that I might find on a menu if I went to a restaurant specializing in any of these...?

Belgian - Belgian waffles, Chocolate, ?

Dutch - Edam (or is it Gouda?) cheese sandwiches? Indonesian food?

Swiss - more cheese & chocolate, a variety of dishes from Germany, France & Italy?

Edited January 15, 2010 by koheesti

[Jingthing]

What a mess. Instead of one thread with one poll, we get three threads and three polls just because the pollmeister made one clear omission.

There is no omission of Mexican. There WAS an editorial decision to place Mexican in the international preference poll. The separate question about categorization of Mexican poll was done well BEFORE these twin polls about nationality restaurant preference. The reason I did that poll was because I felt that putting Mexican topics in the western food forum wasn't as good a fit as putting them being in international. I was curious how others felt. I found the majority agreed with me.

We have three food forums here, Thai, western, and international. Anyone doing a poll has the choice how to categorize things. There are no official Thaivisa rules at this time, as to which national cuisine belongs where. Most are totally obvious! There are just a few popular ones that aren't. Mexican is the most popular of the ambiguous ones. That is why I did a poll about it! I can see the heat and passion of those who seem to hold a kind of religious fervor that Mexican MUST be categorized as western way exceeds that of mine, still, the fact remains that the majority of people who cared to vote on the matter voted that it belongs better as International.

I have commented before that good arguments can be made PRO and CON about the Mexican categorization question. Indeed, such good arguments have been made on that separate poll thread. Many of the opinions coming in favor of Mexican are more like we are right and you are wrong. Frankly, that grates. I feel I am being quite reasonable and rational about this. Yes, the issue is very trivial. But based on some people's emotional reactions, its like we are talking about seizing their first born male baby.

Edited January 15, 2010 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

Belgian - Belgian waffles, Chocolate, ?

Dutch - Edam (or is it Gouda?) cheese sandwiches? Indonesian food?

Swiss - more cheese & chocolate, a variety of dishes from Germany, France & Italy?

Sure ... (all easily available in Pattaya)

Wiki sourced text ..

Belgian --

Waterzooi: (lit. 'Water mess') a rich stew/soup of chicken (or sometimes fish), vegetables, cream and eggs, associated with Ghent.

Dutch --

Erwtensoep has a very thick consistency and often includes pieces of pork and rookworst - smoked sausage - and is almost a stew rather than a soup.

frikandel (a deep fried skinless minced meat sausage),

kroket (deep fried meat ragout covered in breadcrumbs).

Swiss --

Fondue

Rösti: This simple dish, similar to hash browns, is traditionally regarded as a Swiss German favorite.

[koheesti]

What a mess. Instead of one thread with one poll, we get three threads and three polls just because the pollmeister made one clear omission.

If I knew enough about different styles of Thai food, I'd start a poll about that. As it is, living way down here on Samui about all I get is Issan style.

Back to Western food...

Can anyone give three examples of food that I might find on a menu if I went to a restaurant specializing in any of these...?

Belgian - Belgian waffles, Chocolate, ?

Dutch - Edam (or is it Gouda?) cheese sandwiches? Indonesian food?

Swiss - more cheese & chocolate, a variety of dishes from Germany, France & Italy?

There is no omission of Mexican. The categorization of Mexican poll was done well BEFORE these twin polls about nationality restaurant preference. We have three food forums here, Thai, western, and international. Anyone doing a poll has the choice how to categorize things. There is no official Thaivisa rules at this time, as to which national cuisine belongs where. Most are totally obvious! There are just a few popular ones that aren't. Mexican is the most popular of the ambiguous ones. That is why I did a poll about it! The absurd passion people are showing about this triviality is being the pale.

nevermind, I see your next post. thanks.

Edited January 15, 2010 by koheesti

[Jingthing]

I have commented before that good arguments can be made PRO and CON about the Mexican categorization question. Indeed, such good arguments have been made on that separate poll thread. Many of the opinions coming in favor of Mexican are more like we are right and you are wrong. Frankly, that grates. I feel I am being quite reasonable and rational about this. Yes, the issue is very trivial. But based on some people's emotional reactions, its like we are talking about seizing their first born male baby.

Sorry I ran out of edit time.

The text --

Many of the opinions coming in favor of Mexican are more like we are right and you are wrong.

Should read --

Many of the opinions coming in favor of Mexican being categorized as Western are more like we are right and you are wrong.