Real Estate Agents

[sharecropper]

I am interested to hear whether estate agents – realtors - in other parts of Thailand and not just in Pattaya where I live, are generally regarded as a professional and credible bunch or quite the opposite. Also how they seem to be faring now we are coming into less high season.

The subject is a pretty inflammatory one in Pattaya, generally regarded as the Wild West in terms of professional ethics, with a couple of notable long-established exceptions in the town.

But I would be interested to know whether you use them in your area, whether they even have them and how they are generally regarded – without libeling anyone, flaming or getting the thread closed in about 5 minutes flat.

Many thanks,

Sharecropper

[Pakboong]

The one agency I dealt with in Pattaya, East Coast Real Estate, was quite good. David was very professional and service was great.

I have since however, developed an irritation with the bulk of the other agents who talk up an ugly situation as if everything was quite fine. They are working for sellers but they must be truthful to buyers and spreading myths about prices that rightfully should be much lower really turns me off to all of them. This is more than a slump, it is a crash. To talk of it in any other terms is simply IMHO stupid. When the rah rah crap starts I want to be sick. I am looking to buy in Pattaya within the next year so this stupidity is keeping prices artificially high and very few are falling for it. As soon as they get on with the reality of today's market and advise their sellers accordingly, perhaps we can get on with life.

They don't seem to get that they should have made lots of money during the peak bubble years and over the next few years, they must adjust their own income based on reality. If they did not understand that the largest historical bubble such as the one we just experienced must break they can't fix it now. And, it did break and both sellers and agents will not do as well for a while. They must hold to the simple logic that buyers are not going to absorb losses incurred by those that bought at the wrong time for the wrong prices. The sellers and to a lesser extent the agents, must absorb those losses, not the buyers.

I rented for 5 years waiting for this bubble to break and I resent morons who talk as if it is not breaking while claiming the rest of us are simply being negative. We are not being negative at all, we want to buy but at a real price and not an inflated one.

[robblok]

The one agency I dealt with in Pattaya, East Coast Real Estate, was quite good. David was very professional and service was great.

I have since however, developed an irritation with the bulk of the other agents who talk up an ugly situation as if everything was quite fine. They are working for sellers but they must be truthful to buyers and spreading myths about prices that rightfully should be much lower really turns me off to all of them. This is more than a slump, it is a crash. To talk of it in any other terms is simply IMHO stupid. When the rah rah crap starts I want to be sick. I am looking to buy in Pattaya within the next year so this stupidity is keeping prices artificially high and very few are falling for it. As soon as they get on with the reality of today's market and advise their sellers accordingly, perhaps we can get on with life.

They don't seem to get that they should have made lots of money during the peak bubble years and over the next few years, they must adjust their own income based on reality. If they did not understand that the largest historical bubble such as the one we just experienced must break they can't fix it now. And, it did break and both sellers and agents will not do as well for a while. They must hold to the simple logic that buyers are not going to absorb losses incurred by those that bought at the wrong time for the wrong prices. The sellers and to a lesser extent the agents, must absorb those losses, not the buyers.

I rented for 5 years waiting for this bubble to break and I resent morons who talk as if it is not breaking while claiming the rest of us are simply being negative. We are not being negative at all, we want to buy but at a real price and not an inflated one.

You just want it to break.. and it hasnt broken yet so your complaining. Its a normal thing you see people on Dutch forums do the same thing. I am not saying its not true that prices should be a bit lower but for people like you its never low enough and the situation is always worse then the real one because your looking at it from an other angle. You are not objective and they are not objective so the truth is in the middle

[Pakboong]

The one agency I dealt with in Pattaya, East Coast Real Estate, was quite good. David was very professional and service was great.

I have since however, developed an irritation with the bulk of the other agents who talk up an ugly situation as if everything was quite fine. They are working for sellers but they must be truthful to buyers and spreading myths about prices that rightfully should be much lower really turns me off to all of them. This is more than a slump, it is a crash. To talk of it in any other terms is simply IMHO stupid. When the rah rah crap starts I want to be sick. I am looking to buy in Pattaya within the next year so this stupidity is keeping prices artificially high and very few are falling for it. As soon as they get on with the reality of today's market and advise their sellers accordingly, perhaps we can get on with life.

They don't seem to get that they should have made lots of money during the peak bubble years and over the next few years, they must adjust their own income based on reality. If they did not understand that the largest historical bubble such as the one we just experienced must break they can't fix it now. And, it did break and both sellers and agents will not do as well for a while. They must hold to the simple logic that buyers are not going to absorb losses incurred by those that bought at the wrong time for the wrong prices. The sellers and to a lesser extent the agents, must absorb those losses, not the buyers.

I rented for 5 years waiting for this bubble to break and I resent morons who talk as if it is not breaking while claiming the rest of us are simply being negative. We are not being negative at all, we want to buy but at a real price and not an inflated one.

You just want it to break.. and it hasnt broken yet so your complaining. Its a normal thing you see people on Dutch forums do the same thing. I am not saying its not true that prices should be a bit lower but for people like you its never low enough and the situation is always worse then the real one because your looking at it from an other angle. You are not objective and they are not objective so the truth is in the middle

Foreign demand for housing in Thailand is off 90% I hope that is your idea of the middle.

http://www.globalpropertyguide.com/Asia/Th...d/Price-History

[sharecropper]

http://www.globalpropertyguide.com/Asia/Th...d/Price-History

Excellent and interesting article. Thanks.

The market is Pattaya is overpriced and unloved, and it is only a matter of time before prices dramatically come down to a more realistic level, although I understand from a number of agets that 20-30% discounts are becoming common to ensure sales of condos (hardly any house sales right now) go through.

I am hoping to get some feedback from places like the southern islands, Hua Hin, and Chiang Mai posters on the real estate market/industry there - in fact anywhere in Thailand - to try to build up a picture of the state of the wider foreigner-bought and Thai owned market in the country.

[Pakboong]

http://www.globalpropertyguide.com/Asia/Th...d/Price-History

Excellent and interesting article. Thanks.

The market is Pattaya is overpriced and unloved, and it is only a matter of time before prices dramatically come down to a more realistic level, although I understand from a number of agets that 20-30% discounts are becoming common to ensure sales of condos (hardly any house sales right now) go through.

I am hoping to get some feedback from places like the southern islands, Hua Hin, and Chiang Mai posters on the real estate market/industry there - in fact anywhere in Thailand - to try to build up a picture of the state of the wider foreigner-bought and Thai owned market in the country.

Agents not in a coma know this information exists. They also know of the BOT pricing index which is way off. Problem is, they will not talk about it and if they do, it is with dismissive remarks such as the BOT guy had the flu the week he did his research and the data is not accurate.

http://www.bot.or.th/English/Statistics/Ec...ndicators.aspx#

And, if they are so unprofessional that they do not know about this data, would you really want them to represent you? When they start talking about the realities of such data, then then they will get the professional respect which would be due anyone doing research and talking in reality terms instead of dismissive hocus pocus terms.

[robblok]

http://www.globalpropertyguide.com/Asia/Th...d/Price-History

Excellent and interesting article. Thanks.

The market is Pattaya is overpriced and unloved, and it is only a matter of time before prices dramatically come down to a more realistic level, although I understand from a number of agets that 20-30% discounts are becoming common to ensure sales of condos (hardly any house sales right now) go through.

I am hoping to get some feedback from places like the southern islands, Hua Hin, and Chiang Mai posters on the real estate market/industry there - in fact anywhere in Thailand - to try to build up a picture of the state of the wider foreigner-bought and Thai owned market in the country.

Agents not in a coma know this information exists. They also know of the BOT pricing index which is way off. Problem is, they will not talk about it and if they do, it is with dismissive remarks such as the BOT guy had the flu the week he did his research and the data is not accurate.

http://www.bot.or.th/English/Statistics/Ec...ndicators.aspx#

And, if they are so unprofessional that they do not know about this data, would you really want them to represent you? When they start talking about the realities of such data, then then they will get the professional respect which would be due anyone doing research and talking in reality terms instead of dismissive hocus pocus terms.

90% less demand does not mean the price should drop 90%. But what i mean to say is that the truth is in the middle houses should be cheaper but you will always feel it should be cheaper and you back it up with sources you like and others use other sources.

[ExpatJ]

I am looking to buy in Bangkok...personally i stay well away from any real estate agents with farangs bosses/staff (apart from CBRE)- lets be honest the farang staff in these companies are mostly ex english teachers who dont know any more about the market than i do.

I use Thai agents who have lived and worked in bkk for years..

[Pakboong]

http://www.globalpropertyguide.com/Asia/Th...d/Price-History

Excellent and interesting article. Thanks.

The market is Pattaya is overpriced and unloved, and it is only a matter of time before prices dramatically come down to a more realistic level, although I understand from a number of agets that 20-30% discounts are becoming common to ensure sales of condos (hardly any house sales right now) go through.

I am hoping to get some feedback from places like the southern islands, Hua Hin, and Chiang Mai posters on the real estate market/industry there - in fact anywhere in Thailand - to try to build up a picture of the state of the wider foreigner-bought and Thai owned market in the country.

Agents not in a coma know this information exists. They also know of the BOT pricing index which is way off. Problem is, they will not talk about it and if they do, it is with dismissive remarks such as the BOT guy had the flu the week he did his research and the data is not accurate.

http://www.bot.or.th/English/Statistics/Ec...ndicators.aspx#

And, if they are so unprofessional that they do not know about this data, would you really want them to represent you? When they start talking about the realities of such data, then then they will get the professional respect which would be due anyone doing research and talking in reality terms instead of dismissive hocus pocus terms.

90% less demand does not mean the price should drop 90%. But what i mean to say is that the truth is in the middle houses should be cheaper but you will always feel it should be cheaper and you back it up with sources you like and others use other sources.

The Bank Of Thailand is not a source that I like. If anything they are underestimating the severity of the situation. It is bad for banks when real estate devalues. It is the data that exists. There is no contrary data for Thailand at this particular time.

[robblok]

The Bank Of Thailand is not a source that I like. If anything they are underestimating the severity of the situation. It is bad for banks when real estate devalues. It is the data that exists. There is no contrary data for Thailand at this particular time.

You still dont get my point .. im not saying things should not be lower just saying that it might not be low enough for you. Besides if nobody sells the prices are still high because prices only drop when people buy things at lower rates not when nothing is sold.

[Pakboong]

The Bank Of Thailand is not a source that I like. If anything they are underestimating the severity of the situation. It is bad for banks when real estate devalues. It is the data that exists. There is no contrary data for Thailand at this particular time.

You still dont get my point .. im not saying things should not be lower just saying that it might not be low enough for you. Besides if nobody sells the prices are still high because prices only drop when people buy things at lower rates not when nothing is sold.

I understand your point completely. I do not expect to pay the same price for a house that the current owner paid at the top of the bubble. Only time will tell where the bottom is and I will probably miss it but I will wait along with apparently many others. It is not only in my best interest that we get on with this cleanup of empty properties, the vitality of the town is connected to filling up the vacancies and getting back to business. When houses, condos and shop houses are occupied, the entire community benefits. But, the sellers and seller's agents who bought at the bubble top will not make money under these conditions.

Any pricing strategy must take into consideration the drop in the market with the understanding that nobody can predict the drop exactly. The age-old strategy of asking a lot and getting offers will not work in this market. This is a falling knife. An asking price not within reality's reach will not get offers. There will be exceptions of course as there will always be a few who do not care what something costs when they want it. I do not happen to be one of them. 90% less demand does not mean anybody should pay 90% less than the original price it simply means that things are really bad and those who bought anywhere near the top of the bubble can expect to lose money. And they rightfully should lose money on the capital end of the transaction.

There are developments here in Pattaya who still have their asking price at the same level it was in 2007. Who would pay a 2007 price for a house today? Again, the turnip truck pulls up out front every day and somebody gets off, but I am not about to pay a 2007 price for a house today. Nobody would expect the price to be 90% less, but a drop consistent with BOT price indexes would be reasonable in anybodies mind. That is pretty much why these indexes exist. They are simply a negotiation start point. Nobody had a problem with this logic when the prices were at their top, why have a problem near the bottom? A rhetorical question of course but you get the point I hope.

[yabaaaa]

http://www.globalpropertyguide.com/Asia/Th...d/Price-History

Excellent and interesting article. Thanks.

The market is Pattaya is overpriced and unloved, and it is only a matter of time before prices dramatically come down to a more realistic level, although I understand from a number of agets that 20-30% discounts are becoming common to ensure sales of condos (hardly any house sales right now) go through.

I am hoping to get some feedback from places like the southern islands, Hua Hin, and Chiang Mai posters on the real estate market/industry there - in fact anywhere in Thailand - to try to build up a picture of the state of the wider foreigner-bought and Thai owned market in the country.

ok my wife bought land in Hua Hin area we ignored the 1 million + per rai in Hua Hin and down to pranburi sam roi yot and found a nice plot 10 odd rai for 800000 not 8 million on a good hard road with water and electric it was valued officially higher by the sam roi yot off ice by about 80.000 baht. Many other plots in the same location are aLOT more than this from Thai and farang agents. It took us 18 months of searching and a lot of hard work.

Its only worth what someone will pay, we wouldnt pay the crazy prices there so looked elsewhere and not so far from Hua Hin (26km south) either and in my opinion for us anyway a much nicer area.

It was just my wife asking at every local village with a good hard surfaced road in it. Best way.

On initial contact they wanted 1000000 then 900000 then 800000 after a 6 month period.

[Benjie]

The Bank Of Thailand is not a source that I like. If anything they are underestimating the severity of the situation. It is bad for banks when real estate devalues. It is the data that exists. There is no contrary data for Thailand at this particular time.

You still dont get my point .. im not saying things should not be lower just saying that it might not be low enough for you. Besides if nobody sells the prices are still high because prices only drop when people buy things at lower rates not when nothing is sold.

I understand your point completely. I do not expect to pay the same price for a house that the current owner paid at the top of the bubble. Only time will tell where the bottom is and I will probably miss it but I will wait along with apparently many others. It is not only in my best interest that we get on with this cleanup of empty properties, the vitality of the town is connected to filling up the vacancies and getting back to business. When houses, condos and shop houses are occupied, the entire community benefits. But, the sellers and seller's agents who bought at the bubble top will not make money under these conditions.

Any pricing strategy must take into consideration the drop in the market with the understanding that nobody can predict the drop exactly. The age-old strategy of asking a lot and getting offers will not work in this market. This is a falling knife. An asking price not within reality's reach will not get offers. There will be exceptions of course as there will always be a few who do not care what something costs when they want it. I do not happen to be one of them. 90% less demand does not mean anybody should pay 90% less than the original price it simply means that things are really bad and those who bought anywhere near the top of the bubble can expect to lose money. And they rightfully should lose money on the capital end of the transaction.

There are developments here in Pattaya who still have their asking price at the same level it was in 2007. Who would pay a 2007 price for a house today? Again, the turnip truck pulls up out front every day and somebody gets off, but I am not about to pay a 2007 price for a house today. Nobody would expect the price to be 90% less, but a drop consistent with BOT price indexes would be reasonable in anybodies mind. That is pretty much why these indexes exist. They are simply a negotiation start point. Nobody had a problem with this logic when the prices were at their top, why have a problem near the bottom? A rhetorical question of course but you get the point I hope.

Looking at the index the prices for houses (with land) are virtually the same now as in 2007.

[Pakboong]

The Bank Of Thailand is not a source that I like. If anything they are underestimating the severity of the situation. It is bad for banks when real estate devalues. It is the data that exists. There is no contrary data for Thailand at this particular time.

You still dont get my point .. im not saying things should not be lower just saying that it might not be low enough for you. Besides if nobody sells the prices are still high because prices only drop when people buy things at lower rates not when nothing is sold.

I understand your point completely. I do not expect to pay the same price for a house that the current owner paid at the top of the bubble. Only time will tell where the bottom is and I will probably miss it but I will wait along with apparently many others. It is not only in my best interest that we get on with this cleanup of empty properties, the vitality of the town is connected to filling up the vacancies and getting back to business. When houses, condos and shop houses are occupied, the entire community benefits. But, the sellers and seller's agents who bought at the bubble top will not make money under these conditions.

Any pricing strategy must take into consideration the drop in the market with the understanding that nobody can predict the drop exactly. The age-old strategy of asking a lot and getting offers will not work in this market. This is a falling knife. An asking price not within reality's reach will not get offers. There will be exceptions of course as there will always be a few who do not care what something costs when they want it. I do not happen to be one of them. 90% less demand does not mean anybody should pay 90% less than the original price it simply means that things are really bad and those who bought anywhere near the top of the bubble can expect to lose money. And they rightfully should lose money on the capital end of the transaction.

There are developments here in Pattaya who still have their asking price at the same level it was in 2007. Who would pay a 2007 price for a house today? Again, the turnip truck pulls up out front every day and somebody gets off, but I am not about to pay a 2007 price for a house today. Nobody would expect the price to be 90% less, but a drop consistent with BOT price indexes would be reasonable in anybodies mind. That is pretty much why these indexes exist. They are simply a negotiation start point. Nobody had a problem with this logic when the prices were at their top, why have a problem near the bottom? A rhetorical question of course but you get the point I hope.

Looking at the index the prices for houses (with land) are virtually the same now as in 2007.

Farangs in Thailand cannot own Houses with Land.

[Pakboong]

The Bank Of Thailand is not a source that I like. If anything they are underestimating the severity of the situation. It is bad for banks when real estate devalues. It is the data that exists. There is no contrary data for Thailand at this particular time.

You still dont get my point .. im not saying things should not be lower just saying that it might not be low enough for you. Besides if nobody sells the prices are still high because prices only drop when people buy things at lower rates not when nothing is sold.

I understand your point completely. I do not expect to pay the same price for a house that the current owner paid at the top of the bubble. Only time will tell where the bottom is and I will probably miss it but I will wait along with apparently many others. It is not only in my best interest that we get on with this cleanup of empty properties, the vitality of the town is connected to filling up the vacancies and getting back to business. When houses, condos and shop houses are occupied, the entire community benefits. But, the sellers and seller's agents who bought at the bubble top will not make money under these conditions.

Any pricing strategy must take into consideration the drop in the market with the understanding that nobody can predict the drop exactly. The age-old strategy of asking a lot and getting offers will not work in this market. This is a falling knife. An asking price not within reality's reach will not get offers. There will be exceptions of course as there will always be a few who do not care what something costs when they want it. I do not happen to be one of them. 90% less demand does not mean anybody should pay 90% less than the original price it simply means that things are really bad and those who bought anywhere near the top of the bubble can expect to lose money. And they rightfully should lose money on the capital end of the transaction.

There are developments here in Pattaya who still have their asking price at the same level it was in 2007. Who would pay a 2007 price for a house today? Again, the turnip truck pulls up out front every day and somebody gets off, but I am not about to pay a 2007 price for a house today. Nobody would expect the price to be 90% less, but a drop consistent with BOT price indexes would be reasonable in anybodies mind. That is pretty much why these indexes exist. They are simply a negotiation start point. Nobody had a problem with this logic when the prices were at their top, why have a problem near the bottom? A rhetorical question of course but you get the point I hope.

Looking at the index the prices for houses (with land) are virtually the same now as in 2007.

Even in this category, quarter to quarter, they average 10 points lower today than 2007.

[sharecropper]

ok my wife bought land in Hua Hin area we ignored the 1 million + per rai in Hua Hin and down to pranburi sam roi yot and found a nice plot 10 odd rai for 800000 not 8 million on a good hard road with water and electric it was valued officially higher by the sam roi yot off ice by about 80.000 baht. Many other plots in the same location are aLOT more than this from Thai and farang agents. It took us 18 months of searching and a lot of hard work.

Its only worth what someone will pay, we wouldnt pay the crazy prices there so looked elsewhere and not so far from Hua Hin (26km south) either and in my opinion for us anyway a much nicer area.

It was just my wife asking at every local village with a good hard surfaced road in it. Best way.

On initial contact they wanted 1000000 then 900000 then 800000 after a 6 month period.

Thanks. A DIY result!

Last time I was in Hua Hin I was baffled to see big posh real estate agents newly-opened offices being closed down only a year after opening, yet further down the street new ones were busy opening. I hardly ever see potential buyers in any of them and given he bad press Hua Hin developers have had recently, I wonder how the market is over there?