The Effect Of Hr 3200 (us Health Care Bill) On Expat Americans

[connda]

I'm sure if you are an American expat you're probably wondering what the effect of the new Health Care bill (HR 3200) will have on you. Many of us already have health insurance that covers us in Thailand. The new bill mandates that individuals obtain "acceptable health insurance coverage" or else pay a tax. Starting in 2014, the tax is 1% of your gross income or $95. In 2016 it increases to 2.5% of your gross income or a flat rate of $625. Of course, "acceptable health insurance coverage" will only be insurance that is offered by the insurance cartels who lobbied congress in the first place. Which means that your Thai issued health insurance is a worthless piece of paper as far as the US federal government is concerned.

But – good news! Obviously enough pissed off American expats wrote to their congressmen and senators. The bill actually contains a provision that exempts expat Americans from the tax. Here's the quote from the bill:

HR 3200, Title IV, Subtitle A, Part VIII, Subpart A, Sec 59B ( c )(3) states:

INDIVIDUALS RESIDING OUTSIDE UNITED STATES.— Any qualified individual (as defined in section 911(d)) (and any qualifying child residing with such individual) shall be treated for purposes of this section as covered by acceptable coverage during the period described in subparagraph (A) or ( B ) of section 911(d)(1), whichever is applicable.

Ok, so what is a "qualified individual". You need to go to the Internal Revenue Code, Sec. 911: Citizens or Residents of the United States Living Abroad for that information. Basically if you're an expat American who has lived outside of the US for a full year then you are "qualified". See that specific reference below:

Internal Revenue Code, Sec. 911: Citizens or Residents of the United States Living Abroad

TITLE 26, Subtitle A, CHAPTER 1, Subchapter N, PART III, Subpart B, (d) Definitions and special rules:

For purposes of this section - (1) Qualified individual -- The term ''qualified individual'' means an individual whose tax home is in a foreign country and who is -

(A) a citizen of the United States and establishes to the satisfaction of the Secretary that he has been a bona fide resident of a foreign country or countries for an uninterrupted period which includes an entire taxable year, or

( B ) a citizen or resident of the United States and who, during any period of 12 consecutive months, is present in a foreign country or countries during at least 330 full days in such period.

So if you're an American Expat and your home is here in the LOS, it looks like you will not be forced to buy overpriced insurance that will probably not cover you here in Thailand anyway -- and -- you won't be forced to pay the penalty tax if you chose not to purchase mandated US health insurance.

Edited March 23, 2010 by connda

[YanTree]

It will impact me by making me donate more money to Obama. The best thing to happen to America since the Internet.

[Huey]

It will impact me by making me donate more money to Obama. The best thing to happen to America since the Internet.

Well said, I'm donating again too. Is the bill perfect nahh, but it's a damm good start and if anyone can finish the battle he can. I felt really proud of him when I heard this went through, against all odds he stuck it through and got the door cracked open. Mabey by the time my 10yr old can vote HC will be socialized and free for every American, like it is for the rest of the civilized world.

[MrRichard2009]

Health care is not "free" anyplace in the world, people pay tax and receive health care, not exactly free. Health care is a good thing but eventually Americans will have to live within their means, a lot of spending reduction is in order. In theory this might help but it's not nearly enough.

[TAWP]

If you support socialized medicin, since (to borrow MSNBC's Keith Olbermann words) "everyone has the right to live", why not socialize food. Surely that must be the the true 'right to live'?

And nothing is ever free. You are paying. Dearly.

[a2396]

Health care is not "free" anyplace in the world, people pay tax and receive health care, not exactly free. Health care is a good thing but eventually Americans will have to live within their means, a lot of spending reduction is in order. In theory this might help but it's not nearly enough.

The feds & states have already done quite a bit of choppin'. Cuts to schools, and a host of other programs. Many states have got billion + deficits, most of which will be reconciled by cuts in spending. The problem is that there has been no foresight and planning for problems such as this for 30 some years. Americans think they can continue to get tax cuts and fight expensive wars in two countries. Dreamland.

[Jingthing]

If you support socialized medicin, since (to borrow MSNBC's Keith Olbermann words) "everyone has the right to live", why not socialize food. Surely that must be the the true 'right to live'?

And nothing is ever free. You are paying. Dearly.

Silly argument. The USA has had socialized food for decades now. It is called FOOD STAMPS. There is so much food in the US, it is actually good for the food business to have it. If only medical care in the US were as cheap as food, this wouldn't even be worth discussing.

Edited March 23, 2010 by Jingthing

[MrRichard2009]

The people who already qualify for food stamps also qualified all along for free medical ..... it's the middle class that's not well insured. I'm not sure exactly how much it will help when you take these 2 facts into account: 65 percent of bankruptcies are due to medical expenses, you would think insuring people would solve that until you realize that of those 65 percent 78 percent had insurance. So about 80 percent of the people who go broke because of health care already have insurance. It will help a little not a lot.

[Jingthing]

Not exactly. There are many, many reasons people don't have health care access in the US. Many people cannot buy insurance because of preexisting conditions. So if they are ever to qualify for poverty Medicaid before the bill they must spend down to total poverty. The intent of the new bill is that people shouldn't need to lose everything they have worked for all their lives because they get sick. It is also true a lot of the insurance isn't good enough and even people with insurance go bankrupt due to health problems. The rational answer was universal single payer, removing health care from the profit system. Impossible with socialism phobic America who are calling the Obama reform as a government takeover when it is nothing of the kind. Instead it is a huge bonanza for every sector of the for profit health industry.

Edited March 23, 2010 by Jingthing

[MrRichard2009]

That's true, one of at least 2 good parts of it , the other being you can transfer it so your not uncovered between jobs.

[YanTree]

If you support socialized medicin, since (to borrow MSNBC's Keith Olbermann words) "everyone has the right to live", why not socialize food. Surely that must be the the true 'right to live'?

And nothing is ever free. You are paying. Dearly.

Food is socialized in many places - probably many of the same places where HC is. It is called welfare. If the government gives money to you if you are poor - a good chunk of that money is for buying food. In the US they call these 'food stamps' - not sure how it works in Europe but I'm nearly certain it exists, probably on a massive scale.

I felt really proud of my vote and support and for Obama as well - especially after hearing his quote 'this is what change looks like'. Even his biggest detractors, if they are objective, must give him some credit for this and nobody can say he is a lame duck president getting nothing done after promising the world. This is indeed what change looks like - hard fought, not easy, compromises having been made - and fundamentally altering the way Americans will live their lives for decades and beyond.

I know a lot of people wont give him credit for the first but in my opinion this is the second sweeping positive change he has made. The first being shoring up the economy. I wonder what he is going to tackle next - and you can be sure he will tackle something. He has said he would rather be a great one term president than a mediocre two-term president - and I believe him. If he thinks he can get even one more amazing thing done, even if at the cost of getting re-elected, I have no doubt he will do it.

[Jingthing]

It is true. Obama has been challenged and he has shown real Profiles in Courage. Many had written him off as too diplomatic, but now he has emerged as a strong leader. His base has been reinspired, I predict two terms.

[OZEMADE]

Health care is not "free" anyplace in the world, people pay tax and receive health care, not exactly free. Health care is a good thing but eventually Americans will have to live within their means, a lot of spending reduction is in order. In theory this might help but it's not nearly enough.

All Aboriginals receive free health care, all Veterans of any conflict with a 70% disability, which might be PTSD receive 100% free health care, all veterans of any conflict, which also includes some that never left Australia and are (TPI's) Totally Permanently Incapacitated receive free health care. This also includes any members of the (AFP) Aust Fed Police and State Police and Doctors and nursers the list goes on.

However, yes they did pay taxes. But most of them for a very short time being young members of the forces.

[Jingthing]

Its still true. Nothing is free. Even if you get it free, someone is paying.

[elliss]

It will impact me by making me donate more money to Obama. The best thing to happen to America since the Internet.

i admire mr obama , and his new health plan..

how is it going to be financied ??

and will it impact on the value of the USD ..??????

[OZEMADE]

It will impact me by making me donate more money to Obama. The best thing to happen to America since the Internet.

i admire mr obama , and his new health plan..

how is it going to be financied ??

and will it impact on the value of the USD ..??????

He stopped the space program for one, he is closing Wantanamo, he is bringing the troops home from Iraq, he is reducing the Neuclear arms and wont make any more and a lot more things he is stopping. So I reckon he will save Trillions in the finish.

Sorry about the spelling.

I think he is doing a great job at present, hope he keeps it up.

[fiddlehead]

Already things are changing.

Pepsi came out today and said they are going to reduce sugar/fat/salt in their products.

That alone can save the health system a few billion dollars.

Hopefully the other culprits will follow: Coke, McDonalds, Burger King, etc.+.

[Tedhead]

And nothing is ever free. You are paying. Dearly.

True, but Americans are paying more for healthcare per capita than any other country in the world. So much for the terrible cost of 'socialized medicine' - or universal healthcare as a lot of people prefer to call it.

U.S. Still Spends More on Health Care than Any Other Country

[BlackArtemis]

Let's see what happens over the next few weeks to months before we start worrying or not worrying about how it affects expats.

[BkkMD]

The bill absolutely sucks for physicians in the United States though.

Looks like plumbers are going to be making more than primary care physicians.

dam_n, should've gone to plumbing school instead..

[TheItaliann]

Quote CNN:

"This is going to go down as a great day in American history just like when the medicare and social secruity bills were signed into history"

....medicare and social security, both headed towards bankruptcy.

the us government in massive debt with no way out

the us government with 0% interest rates

the us government paying 400 billion a year in interest payments

X million smokers now ready for their health care

X million obese now ready for their health care

the bill is not going to lower the cost of healthcare - stocks up on the news LOL

BARRACK OBAMA

WORLD SAVIOR

itd be great if more than 5% of america understood economics like

AMERICA IS BANKRUPT

EUROPE IS BANKRUPT

WE JUST MADE IT THROUGH WHAT COULD HAVE BEEN A GREAT DEPRESSION

INTEREST RATES ARE ZERO

INFLATION IS INEVITABLE WITH ZERO % INTEREST RATES

Edited March 24, 2010 by TheItaliann

[Beardog]

I am all for it. About time that the excessively rich get to pay their share. They should disband accountants & getting all the deduction percs as well. Obama is the only president to beat the good old boys while the repubs just picked their asses. Sure my health care will go up- but I am not that cheap of a charlie & always have been willing to pay my share. I have owned 6 major companies & paid the old skyrocketed workman's comp- Maybe this time the health care will go to the needy....not the greedy. I am a registered republican & they make me want to puke. If you or I showed up to do a job & refused we would be immediately be served walking papers. To bad the tea toadlers can't be extracted from govn.

As for the bill while it is by no means perfect it is the right steps & besides that from the Europeans & Brits I talked to they like national health care & think Americans are idiots for letting the rich dictate the fear that they dole out, While at the same time those in the professions or heavily laden in SPECIAL INTEREST groups capitalize on fear mongering. Time for some one to Sheppard the lost sheep back home.

[TheItaliann]

America was one of the last free nations.

You Euros really have it good

(guess that is why you are in Thailand and not back home, eh?)

Its very funny to hear about Euros happy to pay half their check to the government for free medicine. totally clueless imho.

And nothing is ever free. You are paying. Dearly.

True, but Americans are paying more for healthcare per capita than any other country in the world. So much for the terrible cost of 'socialized medicine' - or universal healthcare as a lot of people prefer to call it.

U.S. Still Spends More on Health Care than Any Other Country

Edited March 24, 2010 by TheItaliann

[TheItaliann]

no offense but you are totally wrong.

this bill is just the beginning and it was a best case scenario quote so that the dems could starve off the hits they will take in nov. nothing government says its gonna cost actually costs that. only the utterly naive believe it. the iraq war cost more than 15x orginal estimates. we are talking healthcare for americas, 50% who are obese.

medicare and ss are already going bankrupt. where is this money coming from?

i guess we can borrow more from China eh?

the us is currently spending 25% of its tax revenue on INTEREST PAYMENTS TOWARDS ITS DEBT

is any of this making sense to you?

It will impact me by making me donate more money to Obama. The best thing to happen to America since the Internet.

i admire mr obama , and his new health plan..

how is it going to be financied ??

and will it impact on the value of the USD ..??????

He stopped the space program for one, he is closing Wantanamo, he is bringing the troops home from Iraq, he is reducing the Neuclear arms and wont make any more and a lot more things he is stopping. So I reckon he will save Trillions in the finish.

Sorry about the spelling.

I think he is doing a great job at present, hope he keeps it up.

Edited March 24, 2010 by TheItaliann

[WinnieTheKhwai]

It is true. Obama has been challenged and he has shown real Profiles in Courage. Many had written him off as too diplomatic, but now he has emerged as a strong leader. His base has been reinspired, I predict two terms.

Hear hear..! Though, like the man said himself: I would prefer a REALLY good one term over two mediocre ones!

What Americans appreciate more than anything else is have their president be 'a winner'.. He's shown that beyond all doubt now.

As for expats, a lot of the complainers in the USA didn't get much further than that it's a complicated bill. Well guess what, BECAUSE it needs to word things out for specific groups (such as us expats here) the text obviously gets longer.

[TheItaliann]

that must be it!

no way anything obama does could be wrong. he won a nobel peace prize while at war! that is how perfect he is!

surely the opposition cannot be basing their disillusionment on something called "MATH"

It is true. Obama has been challenged and he has shown real Profiles in Courage. Many had written him off as too diplomatic, but now he has emerged as a strong leader. His base has been reinspired, I predict two terms.

Hear hear..! Though, like the man said himself: I would prefer a REALLY good one term over two mediocre ones!

What Americans appreciate more than anything else is have their president be 'a winner'.. He's shown that beyond all doubt now.

As for expats, a lot of the complainers in the USA didn't get much further than that it's a complicated bill. Well guess what, BECAUSE it needs to word things out for specific groups (such as us expats here) the text obviously gets longer.

[rametindallas]

Not exactly. There are many, many reasons people don't have health care access in the US. Many people cannot buy insurance because of preexisting conditions. So if they are ever to qualify for poverty Medicaid before the bill they must spend down to total poverty. The intent of the new bill is that people shouldn't need to lose everything they have worked for all their lives because they get sick. It is also true a lot of the insurance isn't good enough and even people with insurance go bankrupt due to health problems. The rational answer was universal single payer, removing health care from the profit system. Impossible with socialism phobic America who are calling the Obama reform as a government takeover when it is nothing of the kind. Instead it is a huge bonanza for every sector of the for profit health industry.

Everyone in the US has access to healthcare. There are public hospitals here that rival any in the world. The problem is that because everyone doesn't have/can't get affordable insurance, they wait until they are very sick and then go to hospital emergency rooms where the costs are 10 times what a clinic for the insured would go to. As for profit, it is 4 tenths of 1 per cent for the insurers which is a lot of money but not a significant savings if they were out of the equation. The problem the govt. didn't plan for is having adequate infrastructure to care for 30+ millions of citizens who can now see a doctor anytime they feel like it. There are not enough staff nor facilities so rationing as in Canada will surely happen. I also see the govt. taking complete control of the healthcare system as the legislation they have passed will make the current system unworkable. I hope the quality will be better than other, current, disfunctional govt. services or everyone will suffer. FYI I get all my healthcare in Thailand and pay out of pocket for checkups in the US. Don't know what I'll be doing in the future.

[toptuan]

It is true. Obama has been challenged and he has shown real Profiles in Courage. Many had written him off as too diplomatic, but now he has emerged as a strong leader. His base has been reinspired, I predict two terms.

Oh pul-eeze! Forcing Americans to buy insurance (many of whom could not afford to do so in the first place) or penalize them, is not quite the umbrella of health care that is world-standard in civilized countries. Heck, I'd even be happy with a 30-baht scheme!

Now that we've canonized this new American Saint, can we go on to the 500+ other campaign promises he's broken or not fulfilled? Just to list a few....

Political Hiring: In an executive order issued on Obama’s first day in office, he agreed "that any hiring or other employment decisions I make will be based on the candidate's qualifications, competence, and experience." It is too soon to tell. However, preference in the first rounds of hiring have gone to people who worked on the Obama presidential campaign.

Taxes: A great applause line on the campaign trail was a constantly repeated Obama pledge to abolish the income tax for seniors making under $50,000. So far, the plan has not surfaced in any legislative or policy proposal.

Guantanamo: Obama pledged to close the detention facility at Guantanamo. On Jan. 22, his second day in office, he issued an executive order ordering Guantanamo closed in a year. Waiting, waiting, waiting....

Pork-barreling: No Earmarks (Pork-Barreling) in the Budget or any bills

Lobbyists: No Lobbyist in the White House

Bank Bail Out: Failure to Demand and Receive a full accounting of the disbursement of the 700 Billion Dollars in Bank Bail Out Money

The War: Bring home troops in 16 months; waiting, waiting, waiting....

'Sunlight Before Signing': When Obama campaigned for the Democratic presidential nomination in Manchester, N.H., on June 22, 2007, he announced his "Sunlight Before Signing" promise."When there is a bill that ends up on my desk as the president, you the public will have five days to look online and find out what's in it before I sign it," he said. He repeated that promise on his campaign website:"Too often bills are rushed through Congress and to the president before the public has the opportunity to review them. As president, Obama will not sign any non-emergency bill without giving the American public an opportunity to review and comment on the White House website for five days."

• However, Obama signed his first bill, the Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Restoration Act, on Jan. 20 – only two days after its passage.
  

• He signed a second bill expanding the State Children's Health Insurance Program just three hours after Congress passed it.
  

• Again, on Feb. 17, Obama signed his 1,000-page $787 billion stimulus aimed at jolting the declining U.S. economy. He did so only one business day after it passed through Congress – without allowing for five days of public comment.
  

Support human mission to moon by 2020: The Promise:Will "endorse the goal of sending human missions to the Moon by 2020, as a precursor in an orderly progression to missions to more distant destinations, including Mars." Update February 15th, 2010: Obama budget abandons moon-by-2020 goal

Sources:

http://www.suntimes.com/news/sweet/1548444...-042909.article

http://www.nowpublic.com/world/top-10-obam...ch-public-trust

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?pageId=91286

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/pr...o-moon-by-2020/

Politics: same, same

Edited March 24, 2010 by toptuan

[TAWP]

he is bringing the troops home from Iraq

He is increasing the numbers in Afghanistan...

[TAWP]

And nothing is ever free. You are paying. Dearly.

True, but Americans are paying more for healthcare per capita than any other country in the world. So much for the terrible cost of 'socialized medicine' - or universal healthcare as a lot of people prefer to call it.

U.S. Still Spends More on Health Care than Any Other Country

The problem in the US with the insurance companies etc is a side-effect of corporatism and switching to socialism will not solve it. It is just another bad road to the same doomed end.