Thai Forces Use Tear Gas, Water Cannon Against Protesters

[dobadoy]

Yes he is still looking like the Pattaya Asean summit Abhisit, where he was in deep political trouble most pundits couldn't imagine him recovering from. And then he did indeed recover during Bangkok Black Songkran. So it ain't over till its over. Not predicting the outcome but he has come back from the abyss before, so he may again.

How can you suggest that he ever came back from the abyss and recovered when the reds are still protesting from the moment he stepped in to power.

Jing, you need to look at the whole picture not just specific events that have occurred since his appointment.

You have to realise that this country is widely split in politics and also in prosperity.

The Reds are the majority of the population, they are poor hard working people that have nothing to lose cos they have been repressed,

all their lives with little future.

When they say they are willing to "die for their cause" it shows they have had enough of all the propaganda they've been hearing.

They won't stop until they feel they have achieved their goal whether it's now or next week,month or year.

And it's all because they have nothing to lose! as the economics of the population suggests.

And when the people have the majority in numbers then they have the power to win democratically.

here is the great fallacy of the Red Elite argument - the oppressed poor. The poor in Thailand are poor, pretty much like the poor all around the world. One huge difference between the poor in Thaliand and other place - particular in this region - is that they are NOT oppressed. Go ask the Burmese or the North Koreans if they'd trade places.

It is very easy for those who've grown up on idealistic and romantic notions of class war to confuse the difference between economic hardship and political oppression.

[Jingthing]

Their leader Weng is a Maoist. In fact, as far I can tell the only intellectual factions of the reds are also Maoists. Read up on the history of Thailand's neighbors about what happens when Maoists take power. This will take into taboo areas we can't talk about, but savvy people understand.

Don't tell me that Thaksin is Maoist as well!

No, I won't tell you that. Answer me this, why haven't the reds rejected this major faction of their movement, the only faction that includes serious intellectual thinkers, the Maoists? Doesn't that worry just a little bit if they take over power that their intellectual backbone is comprised of Maoists with everything that implies historically?

[gregb]

Where on earth has anyone got the idea from that PRP/TRT represent democracy? It was under thaksin that all the democratic institutions that were put in place by the 1997 constitution were usurped so that Thaksin could turn himself into a de facto dictator. This was precisely why the other elites (notice that I say other - because Thaksin and everyone in PRP/TRT is part of the same brand, they're just in-fighting over the spoils).

You are blind if you think anything to do with PRP/TRT is about democracy.

I think a lot or even most of these people fooled by the democracy rhetoric weren't in Thailand at the time of Thaksin's rule.

I guarantee you none of the people who are supporting the demagogue have actually tried to run a company in an industry he decided belonged to him. The man is pure evil.

I would hazard a guess that most of these people are retired and don't actually care what happens to anyone other than themselves. Anybody who was actually trying to work and be responsible during his reign of terror learned very quickly that Thaksin stood for one thing and one thing only, himself.

Anyone he helped was completely incidental to that cause. His return would be a disaster for this great land.

[dobadoy]

Their leader Weng is a Maoist. In fact, as far I can tell the only intellectual factions of the reds are also Maoists. Read up on the history of Thailand's neighbors about what happens when Maoists take power. This will take into taboo areas we can't talk about, but savvy people understand.

Don't tell me that Thaksin is Maoist as well!

Not at all. Which is precisely why the irony of the Thaksin's Reds declaring a class war is both ridiculous and deceitful. It is, as always, the poor, who will be used and abused by Thaksin's elite red wannabe leaders. They will soon forget the poor once they are getting the required share of the pie that they demand (as will everyone else, including poster 'levelhead' and all those like him.)

[chantorn]

Taken from Nationmultimedia. http://www.nationmultimedia.com/home/2010/...n-30126828.html

I am sure he is aiming at a charging water buffalo, and NOT a Red shirt person.

[otherstuff1957]

Here is the cover of a recent Red magazine:

(courtesy of 2Bangkok!)

The fate of Czar Nicholas II and his family is frequently referred to in Red publications. They say that it paved the way toward Democracy.

Let's hope that it doesn't take 72 years of dictatorship to 'pave the way toward Democracy' in Thailand too.

Of course, I do believe that the leftists in the Red movement are just being used by Thaksin. When he gets back into power, they will be discarded as tools that are no longer needed. (Just as all this talk about democracy will be discarded).

Edited April 9, 2010 by otherstuff1957

[dobadoy]

I guarantee you none of the people who are supporting the demagogue have actually tried to run a company in an industry he decided belonged to him. The man is pure evil.

I would hazard a guess that most of these people are retired and don't actually care what happens to anyone other than themselves. Anybody who was actually trying to work and be responsible during his reign of terror learned very quickly that Thaksin stood for one thing and one thing only, himself.

Anyone he helped was completely incidental to that cause. His return would be a disaster for this great land.

Glad to see this perspective coming out. About time there was more people who remember the reality of Thaksin' proto-dictatorial regime. Thailand and Thais have enjoyed far more freedoms since 2006. Anyone who denies this is either ignorant or blind.

[rainman]

80,000 cops

60,000 protesters

.... and yet still the protesters have the upper hand....

Out of the 80,000 cops, 79,999 are "poor Thais" (aka. red shirts). Ever wondered why they always step aside when the red shirts come through? Why they're laughing and smiling with them?

[krakatoa]

state of emergency should not be used against the cornerstone of the democratic process - independent mass media.

Many now would be convinced, in thailand and abroad, that thailand really is an authoritarian regime state, ruled by the army and police, with disregard to laws

Go look in the mirror.

Earlier it was a picture of an expat in a redshirt, So, OK no connection.

BUt, the world is looking at Thailand as just one big joke and with derision.

If you want to associate yourself with that "som nam naa"

[madi]

Farang should be worried in Thailand but our too bush with chang to care.

Their nations tell them to leave Thailand but they stay.

If the beer stops flowing and the nightlife ends, look for a mass Exodus. it will be better than when the sea parted for Charlton Heston in The Ten Commandments.

Unlike the Jews, the Farang here will be drinking beer on their way out.

Cambodia and other places will have new money soon.

Are revolutions dangerous?

If they turn violent they are.

Will the Police protect Farangs?

HAAAAAA HAAAAAA--that was a funny question.

Good luck all.

[TITI1971]

here is the great fallacy of the Red Elite argument - the oppressed poor. The poor in Thailand are poor, pretty much like the poor all around the world. One huge difference between the poor in Thaliand and other place - particular in this region - is that they are NOT oppressed. Go ask the Burmese or the North Koreans if they'd trade places.

It is very easy for those who've grown up on idealistic and romantic notions of class war to confuse the difference between economic hardship and political oppression.

Yes right, they are not opressed.... and in Burma or N. korea they wish they can vote but they can't or fake vote.... Here they voted Red but did'nt see their vote respected and bored to see that Elite or Democrats or richer doesn't care of them...... just some "democrats" with same Ego as Thaksin try to do everything to kill the other side or pure vengeance... Is it the democracy ? no one is right but minimum is to respect the vote of majority ! after you can fight in politics for disband some members but always keep the same "color" until the next vote... or next putch or next manifest etc... neverending story

[Chaimai]

Announce a dissolution of parliament and it might, just might, prevent LOS from going down the tubes. For those of you who advocate tougher measures your only prolonging the inevitable, this won't be put to bed this easy, these are seismic events taking place and they will change Thailand forever. Wake up and smell the coffee.

It already has been announced - nine months hence.

[kissdani]

This is great news for the red shirts the pictures have gone around the world just watched it on the BBC Troops provoked the reaction the Thai people will not accept this Abhisit will be gone very soon I just hope it doesnt mean Thaksin's coming back

Yes. That's the problem. The prospect of Thaksin coming back.

That's one reason I don't understand why the army doesn't seem to be supporting the government. Red coup?

This means nothing close to a victory of the Reds as someone wants to explain it.

Actually it only disprove the Reds claim that the army had installed the Abhisit government.

Don't forget the days in power of the Democrats expires soon. The independent and not politically motivated EC will rule their dissolution.

boing sound

What happen next? Again it is not a victory for the red shirts, but they will have nothing more to complain about double standard, politically motivated courts and that everybody is against them. Time to go home.

We will see a government of national unity. Thai people have to work together and not fighting each other.

[animatic]

Their leader Weng is a Maoist. In fact, as far I can tell the only intellectual factions of the reds are also Maoists. Read up on the history of Thailand's neighbors about what happens when Maoists take power. This will take into taboo areas we can't talk about, but savvy people understand.

Don't tell me that Thaksin is Maoist as well!

Strickly Observant Opportunist.

[sotsira]

Yes he is still looking like the Pattaya Asean summit Abhisit, where he was in deep political trouble most pundits couldn't imagine him recovering from. And then he did indeed recover during Bangkok Black Songkran. So it ain't over till its over. Not predicting the outcome but he has come back from the abyss before, so he may again.

How can you suggest that he ever came back from the abyss and recovered when the reds are still protesting from the moment he stepped in to power.

Jing, you need to look at the whole picture not just specific events that have occurred since his appointment.

You have to realise that this country is widely split in politics and also in prosperity.

The Reds are the majority of the population, they are poor hard working people that have nothing to lose cos they have been repressed,

all their lives with little future.

When they say they are willing to "die for their cause" it shows they have had enough of all the propaganda they've been hearing.

They won't stop until they feel they have achieved their goal whether it's now or next week,month or year.

And it's all because they have nothing to lose! as the economics of the population suggests.

And when the people have the majority in numbers then they have the power to win democratically.

here is the great fallacy of the Red Elite argument - the oppressed poor. The poor in Thailand are poor, pretty much like the poor all around the world. One huge difference between the poor in Thaliand and other place - particular in this region - is that they are NOT oppressed. Go ask the Burmese or the North Koreans if they'd trade places.

It is very easy for those who've grown up on idealistic and romantic notions of class war to confuse the difference between economic hardship and political oppression.

I don't confuse the difference, i've seen it with my own eyes lived in prosperous Bangkok and been up country many times and i can tell you the economic hardship is there for all to see, but now the political oppression is there too.

Burma & North Korea are ruled by extremists dictators, thats why the UDD was formed to prevent Thailand from the same.

If all they want is fair and democratic elections then why are they being denied that wish.

Ask yourself who is acting like the dictator?

[blaze]

Human rights groups as well as journalists assossacion were fast to criticise this kind of abuse

Always the first groups to complain about anything and everything.

Amazing.

[Sunderland]

Taken from Nationmultimedia. http://www.nationmultimedia.com/home/2010/...n-30126828.html

I am sure he is aiming at a charging water buffalo, and NOT a Red shirt person.

After the incompetency shown by the police and army, I think the soldier would not have been able to hit a herd of buffalo with an RPG, never mind one red protester.

[dobadoy]

Yes he is still looking like the Pattaya Asean summit Abhisit, where he was in deep political trouble most pundits couldn't imagine him recovering from. And then he did indeed recover during Bangkok Black Songkran. So it ain't over till its over. Not predicting the outcome but he has come back from the abyss before, so he may again.

How can you suggest that he ever came back from the abyss and recovered when the reds are still protesting from the moment he stepped in to power.

Jing, you need to look at the whole picture not just specific events that have occurred since his appointment.

You have to realise that this country is widely split in politics and also in prosperity.

The Reds are the majority of the population, they are poor hard working people that have nothing to lose cos they have been repressed,

all their lives with little future.

When they say they are willing to "die for their cause" it shows they have had enough of all the propaganda they've been hearing.

They won't stop until they feel they have achieved their goal whether it's now or next week,month or year.

And it's all because they have nothing to lose! as the economics of the population suggests.

And when the people have the majority in numbers then they have the power to win democratically.

here is the great fallacy of the Red Elite argument - the oppressed poor. The poor in Thailand are poor, pretty much like the poor all around the world. One huge difference between the poor in Thaliand and other place - particular in this region - is that they are NOT oppressed. Go ask the Burmese or the North Koreans if they'd trade places.

It is very easy for those who've grown up on idealistic and romantic notions of class war to confuse the difference between economic hardship and political oppression.

I don't confuse the difference, i've seen it with my own eyes lived in prosperous Bangkok and been up country many times and i can tell you the economic hardship is there for all to see, but now the political oppression is there too.

Burma & North Korea are ruled by extremists dictators, thats why the UDD was formed to prevent Thailand from the same.

If all they want is fair and democratic elections then why are they being denied that wish.

Ask yourself who is acting like the dictator?

I don't know. Perhaps you could ask the families of the 3000+ people murdered by Thaksin without charge, arrest or conviction in his so-called 'war on drugs'.

[animatic]

Here is the cover of a recent Red magazine:

(courtesy of 2Bangkok!)

The fate of Czar Nicholas II and his family is frequently referred to in Red publications. They say that it paved the way toward Democracy.

Let's hope that it doesn't take 72 years of dictatorship to 'pave the way toward Democracy' in Thailand too.

Of course, I do believe that the leftists in the Red movement are just being used by Thaksin. When he gets back into power, they will be discarded as tools that are no longer needed. (Just as all this talk about democracy will be discarded).

So...

what if Thaksin really is dieing and can't control them,

Yingluk can't take the reins strongly enough,

and suddenly Weng and Jakrapob are running the show...

Street revolutions are historically notorious for spinning out of control...

Ask the ghosts of D'anton, Robespierre and Marais...

[mrtoad]

state of emergency should not be used against the cornerstone of the democratic process - independent mass media.

Many now would be convinced, in thailand and abroad, that thailand really is an authoritarian regime state, ruled by the army and police, with disregard to laws

Thanks for the laugh

[rogerdee123]

The headline should be updated " The reds had recaptured the Thaicom"...The reds had gained so much momentum , I think abhisit time is near..He has insubordination from the military officials... Who is the commander in chief in Thailand ? (for sure its not abhisit)....

The unmentionable

[4223rhodes]

I guarantee you none of the people who are supporting the demagogue have actually tried to run a company in an industry he decided belonged to him. The man is pure evil.

I would hazard a guess that most of these people are retired and don't actually care what happens to anyone other than themselves. Anybody who was actually trying to work and be responsible during his reign of terror learned very quickly that Thaksin stood for one thing and one thing only, himself.

Anyone he helped was completely incidental to that cause. His return would be a disaster for this great land.

Glad to see this perspective coming out. About time there was more people who remember the reality of Thaksin' proto-dictatorial regime. Thailand and Thais have enjoyed far more freedoms since 2006. Anyone who denies this is either ignorant or blind.

No we just have a different opinion from you. Many of us who didn't particularly appreciate Thaksin at the time think back fondly to the years 2002-2005 fondly and think it was a better time for Thailand than the post-coup fiasco.

[gemini81]

80,000 cops

60,000 protesters

.... and yet still the protesters have the upper hand....

yeah, I guess two guys only half trained equals one. Funny though, allegedly they did all this training for months before this? useless id it's true! this is half bad news bears and half hogan's heroes out there!

They now occupy the place now...reds overcame it, and this is just tolerated? now they knwo they can get away with almost anything! sheesh!

Edited April 9, 2010 by gemini81

[Luciano1860]

...get off your sofa! Have any of you Chang fueled EXPERTS lifted a finger to help (either side)? Brave Farangs you lot...I've been off with a shield and a sword to fight for the King and the good people of Thailand, tired, hot but Proud to be a resident of this Great Country...PINK FOREVER!

Red shirts BLOW.

[rogerdee123]

I hate to teach people to suck eggs, but please look backwards.

Sondthi, the coup leader who granted himself immunity and said he would never enter politics, who now is in a political party............. (tells you everything)

Sondthi said that he was scared Thaksin would invoke the SOE, as once the SOE is invoked the top brass can be replaced for failing to follow orders.

I think we are seeing a massive fight between Annupong and Abhisit/Suthep.

In order to appear to follow orders its why the Army put up a weak fight, fired some tear gas and then fell back at Thaicom.

Annupong has followed orders so Abhisit and Suthep cannot replace him.

Its all a game but it tells you loud and clear that the invoking of the SOE was a game by Suthep/Abhisit to get rid of Annupong.

We now have the Reds against the Democrats and the Army against the Democrats.

There could well be a coup soon, or more likely Annupong, the man said to be behind getting the small parties to go with the Democrats, will tonight get the small parties to join PTP and get the Democrats kicked out of office.

Possible. Amongst many other possibilities. I seriously doubt Abhisit or Suthep want to square off with the military.

way2muchcoffee you make a lot of sense. Granted A/S may not be strong enough or have the military connections to square off, but the powers above them do. LevelHead you have an interesting theory and if you are correct, if Annupong is replaced, this may trump or pre-empt the replacement issue scheduled for later this year .... possibly. And if so, this may remove that poker chip from the table.

[rogerdee123]

I guarantee you none of the people who are supporting the demagogue have actually tried to run a company in an industry he decided belonged to him. The man is pure evil.

I would hazard a guess that most of these people are retired and don't actually care what happens to anyone other than themselves. Anybody who was actually trying to work and be responsible during his reign of terror learned very quickly that Thaksin stood for one thing and one thing only, himself.

Anyone he helped was completely incidental to that cause. His return would be a disaster for this great land.

Glad to see this perspective coming out. About time there was more people who remember the reality of Thaksin' proto-dictatorial regime. Thailand and Thais have enjoyed far more freedoms since 2006. Anyone who denies this is either ignorant or blind.

No we just have a different opinion from you. Many of us who didn't particularly appreciate Thaksin at the time think back fondly to the years 2002-2005 fondly and think it was a better time for Thailand than the post-coup fiasco.

The time under Prem was arguably better in many ways ..... and that was many coups ago.

[dobadoy]

I guarantee you none of the people who are supporting the demagogue have actually tried to run a company in an industry he decided belonged to him. The man is pure evil.

I would hazard a guess that most of these people are retired and don't actually care what happens to anyone other than themselves. Anybody who was actually trying to work and be responsible during his reign of terror learned very quickly that Thaksin stood for one thing and one thing only, himself.

Anyone he helped was completely incidental to that cause. His return would be a disaster for this great land.

Glad to see this perspective coming out. About time there was more people who remember the reality of Thaksin' proto-dictatorial regime. Thailand and Thais have enjoyed far more freedoms since 2006. Anyone who denies this is either ignorant or blind.

No we just have a different opinion from you. Many of us who didn't particularly appreciate Thaksin at the time think back fondly to the years 2002-2005 fondly and think it was a better time for Thailand than the post-coup fiasco.

Fair enough. Could you elaborate in what ways?

Was it: 3000+ shot dead in the streets without charge, arrest or conviction?

The escalation of troubles in the south?

The restricted freedom of the press?

The 30baht health care scheme was good, (a good idea in principle, though it didn't quite work in practice); has that been rescinded? No.

Maybe it was all the credit cards that people on low-income were encouraged to get, which certainly increased domestic spending, but alas ended up in Thaksin and his proxy successors like Samak having to write off lots of unpayable farmer debts.

Or maybe it was the 10 million people who ABSTAINED in the last election for which Thaksin run with no oppostion parties. What democrat holds an election with no opposition to run against, and STILL only gets 2/3 majority.

Or maybe you DON'T like the fact that Abhisit has extended free education to the entire population from age six to 18?

Maybe you don't like the fact that in an attempt to be reasonable, he agreed to a compromise between 15 days and 1yr 9 months to 9 months on house dissolution.

Maybe you liked Thaksin's way of doing things better. No compromise, no negotiation, extra-judicial killings, and refusing to speak to the press about important matters of state for over 2 months because his astrological zodiac told him it was ill-starred (remembe that one in your fond memories of Thaksin?).

I'm not protesting your right to hold such views. I'm just dumbstruck at why you would hold them.

Edited April 9, 2010 by dobadoy

[sotsira]

How can you suggest that he ever came back from the abyss and recovered when the reds are still protesting from the moment he stepped in to power.

Jing, you need to look at the whole picture not just specific events that have occurred since his appointment.

You have to realise that this country is widely split in politics and also in prosperity.

The Reds are the majority of the population, they are poor hard working people that have nothing to lose cos they have been repressed,

all their lives with little future.

When they say they are willing to "die for their cause" it shows they have had enough of all the propaganda they've been hearing.

They won't stop until they feel they have achieved their goal whether it's now or next week,month or year.

And it's all because they have nothing to lose! as the economics of the population suggests.

And when the people have the majority in numbers then they have the power to win democratically.

here is the great fallacy of the Red Elite argument - the oppressed poor. The poor in Thailand are poor, pretty much like the poor all around the world. One huge difference between the poor in Thaliand and other place - particular in this region - is that they are NOT oppressed. Go ask the Burmese or the North Koreans if they'd trade places.

It is very easy for those who've grown up on idealistic and romantic notions of class war to confuse the difference between economic hardship and political oppression.

I don't confuse the difference, i've seen it with my own eyes lived in prosperous Bangkok and been up country many times and i can tell you the economic hardship is there for all to see, but now the political oppression is there too.

Burma & North Korea are ruled by extremists dictators, thats why the UDD was formed to prevent Thailand from the same.

If all they want is fair and democratic elections then why are they being denied that wish.

Ask yourself who is acting like the dictator?

I don't know. Perhaps you could ask the families of the 3000+ people murdered by Thaksin without charge, arrest or conviction in his so-called 'war on drugs'.

The "War on Drugs" has nothing to do with this although i have no sympathy for Drug dealers, Dead or Alive!

For you to mention that as an answer to my previous statement shows that your right, you don't know!

[4223rhodes]

Many Thai people and farang preferred the pre-coup years to the post-coup years. Many believed that the coup was a mistake at the time and still do. People are allowed to disagree.

[Old Man River]

what if Thaksin really is dieing and can't control them,

Yingluk can't take the reins strongly enough,

and suddenly Weng and Jakrapob are running the show...

Street revolutions are historically notorious for spinning out of control...

Ask the ghosts of D'anton, Robespierre and Marais...

You meant Jatuporn didn't you? Jakrapob has been surprisingly quiet.