Advice Please re. Farming Isaan Land

[chownah]

fenced pasture means u have to feed supplement them... its a bit more expensive isnt it??

as for caretaking, if there are family involved, u can spread out the care if its just for a few for yourself, not milk production dairy or something... these thai cows seem low maintainence since i guess a lot of the calves die early and people dont always treat for problems (expensive for meds), selectiveness for health probably happens (maybe im wrong?)...

curious also, do the thai in these muubaan spray alot (i've heard they do) and doesnt that effect the pasture (make it poisonous)areas if the cows are free ranging around?/

If the fenced pasture is big enough and is growing the right types of forage you don't need to supplement.

Enlisting family members is good but it has drawbacks...if I ask my uncle to put my cows out in my pasture when I take a two week vacation he might start to think that the logical thing is for him to put *his* cows out with my cows in my pasture and he doesn't worry about if it wears out the pasture because I can always go stake them three or four times a day by the road like everyone else.....no problem......so he thinks. For me this would be a problem...I don't want to take the trouble to go stake my cows out....that's why I'm investing alot of time and money building the fences. Don't know if this would happen but having lived here for four years and seen how the path of least resistence is often justified in similar ways and then taken, I want to try to avoid these pitfalls....let's just say that I am going to proceed very cautiously especially at first so that I don't set a precedent I'll regret later. If I don't want him to use my pasture I need to find a polite and indirect way to let him know this long before the possiblity arises.

Around here people mostly only spray when necessary and it happens in the early part of the rice growing cycle when there are no cows in the fields. Several months will pass before cows are let back into the fields including at least one month of heavy rainfall. I think that the fields are pretty well purged of residual spray before the cows are let back in. Some people do plant soybeans in the off season and I don't know if they spray or not but of course you don't let the cows go graze on your beans!!!

[bina]

hadnt thought of that but your right....

u know, someone ought to plow thru this thread and pull out all the basic info into a list or something.... when i will need all this info in reality, i;ll never find it of course and then ill have to ask it all again....

i forgot one other thing, how do u water the cows if they are pastured (i live in a desert so we have to bring them to water or bring water to them if they are out in pasture-- people use movable tanks with a portable trough-- even the beduins do this); the donkeys come home in evening to drink by themselves.

i;e noticed that korat doesnt seem a water filled area for the most part, with salinated water in lots of areas , so in dry seasons what do u do?

[chownah]

Where I live farmers mostly keep their cows in sheds near thier houses at night (water is available there by hose usually) and during the day they are led out away from the barn to pasture and in the dry season they will either carry buckets of water too them or take them to water once during the day at about noon.

[teletiger]

AI in Thailand is pretty much a hit and miss affair. Semen straws are available free from the local Ag department. In reality you pay 100 baht for the straw and 150 baht for a local man to come and administer it. You'd better be able to tell if your cow is in standing heat, because they sure can't. I stopped at 2 dairy farms outside Pak Chong because from the road I could see they had a few dairy x brahman calves. Asked them why they chose that cross. They didn't. They used the straws supplied by the local Ag. They were supposed to be all dairy.

If you've got the pasture. using a bull on Brahman cows is easier than AI. A dairy cow will stand still 'til midnight as long as she's got grain in front of her. Try fiddling with rear end of a Brahman cow and she'll kick your head off. You'll need a tight chute and a headgate and rope.

We use water tanks made from old tyres. They range from small up to very large.Very portable and cheap, starting at about 150 Baht. Depending on what your feeding (straw or grass) cows can drink up to 50 litres per day. Twice a day watering should be the minimum. If they're thirsty they'll eat less.

To my mind a mineral suppliment is essential. You can use a salt/mineral lick block hung somewhere, or better is loose minerals in a tub. Make sure the tub is weighed down or fixed. The minerals help with their digestion, keeps them healthier, especially on low protein, high fibre forage.

regards

Edited July 15, 2006 by teletiger

[bina]

nice pragmatic ideas: show a pic of the waterer? please...

true, actually in winter here its cold so i give warmed water with some table salt in it and the goats love it... and in summer the goats enjoy the cold water/salt mix when offerred (especially a off feed animal) it does stimulate their appetite ive noticed.

mineral blocks/etc are problematic if u dont know what you're missing in the area u are in (including selenium copper etc)... unless what u buy is already made for thai soils? how many people send their dry forage for analyses (we dont either too expensive)

[Korat Correct]

Fascinating thread.

Random Chances challenges my statement that Brahmans are kept as a status symbol.

To clarify that they sure aren't kept for milk or beef production.Just look at the conformation.

Keeping them as a status symbol doesn't mean they don't want a profit.

Presumably one has visited the local "cattle market".Its the heifers that make the money for breeding cattle, to produce more heifers.

Thats OK until saturation point, when everyone has enough.( I understand that there has been a spate of unnatural cow deaths within 60km of Korat?

The principle is that cattle grow into money, especially if they are heifers.

I kept 75 Dairy/Beef cross Cows and ran two Simmental bulls to cover them, until I retired.(I also ran 530 breeding ewes.)

The cows had nothing but grass/silage. The calves were creep fed better silage or grass and "straights" in winter. Calves were expected to put on at least 1kg per day and were sold at 350-400kg for finishing. Of course they put that on from milk and grass until housed and even then had access to the dam until sold. The cows sort of weaned them off when they were expecting again!

For the beef system try to stay off the concentrates. In Thailand I understand they are about £90 per ton and there is no subsidy support. The real key is growing the grass and probably on a zero grazing system.That means having the right land, irrigation and harvesting set up.

The trick is to find the right processing set up and market.

At 270bht per kg deadweight one should make a profit.

I rather like the brown/ white indigenous Thai cow. I think it could be covered by a Hereford /Angus or Simmental, but the Charolais may be too big.

The Chary/Limo would be OK on a fit Fresian dairy cow ( avoid Holstein) and would make an excellent beef cross cow.

Use a Chary/ Limo on the beef cross cow too, but buy/or make a calving aid just in case.

If anyone has gone down this road I would be very interested to come and see how they manage their set up.

You can email me!!

[bannork]

I've been trying to improve the grass on our land. I planted lucerne grass in April with mixed results, it likes the raised parts of fields but not the low lying, I had heard of this so I tried a grass called something like kinjee or kinnee in Thai, expensive at 200 baht a kilo but that doesn't seem to have grown though the initial blades appeared.

I'm wondering if this is the same grass I've seen and cut from ponds and their edges, looks a bit like sugar cane. Could that be the jumbo grass RC refers to though I see RC calls that sorhgam.

Please excuse my ignorance Teletiger but could you give me an example of a hybrid brachiara in Thailand and a legum style\centro?

Your point about ground water being salt contaminated is very interesting, we have a 40 metre well and I was thinking once we get the promised electricity in the fields of using that for irrigation but a deep pond sounds better although that ground water is fine for drinking.

We already have one pond about 4 metres deep and that has water all year round what with being rocky.

We had a bull for a year but sold him just as the rice planting began as he wandered too easily, saw a female on the horizon and off he went, wouldn't go down well with the neighbours trampling across paddies. Now we use a neighbour's bull, maybe AI soon as the vets sell it, though a bit pricey.

[teletiger]

Korat Correct. Whilst I have no doubt that you have owned cattle in the past, from some of your comments, I doubt very much that you have worked them.

"The principle is that cattle grow into money, especially if they are heifers."

Now that is a downward spiral that the majority of Thai people (unfortunately) have fallen into. How many of those heifers are going to be better than their mothers? Even with the best semen......maybe 30%. The rest you add to the feedlot. Given the quality of Local Ag semen maybe 10%.

"The cows sort of weaned them off when they were expecting again!"

So...the cows were running your operation? All your calves would have been born in a 1/2 month period (spring). 2/3 months after your cows gave birth, they would have been re-bred. When the oldest calf is 7 months, you wean the lot. Run the herd through a chute and all calves get loaded onto a trailer. Cows need to be dried off (no milk) before the next calf.

I rather like the brown/ white indigenous Thai cow. I think it could be covered by a Hereford /Angus or Simmental, but the Charolais may be too big.

The Chary/Limo would be OK on a fit Fresian dairy cow ( avoid Holstein) and would make an excellent beef cross cow.

Use a Chary/ Limo on the beef cross cow too, but buy/or make a calving aid just in case.

If anyone has gone down this road I would be very interested to come and see how they manage their set up.

You can email me!!

erm.... nope. if I followed that I'd want to sue you.

The thought of my (really cute?) Thai dai cow (400/450 kilos) being covered by a Hereford/angus/simmental bull...a small one maybe 900 kilos? Ok maybe were talking semen here?

I'd bring a calving aid (AKA a puller) and a couple of vets. ( 1 experienced in C-sections).

When's the last time you saw a Fresian dairy cow in Thailand. Most are ( I think) Holstein/fresian crosses and if the farmer is smart an 1/8th of Brahman in there too.

Not trying to get on your case Korat Correct, but maybe the reality in Thailand is a lot different to the UK.

People here feed their cattle what they can. If the cattle are still alive, the owners figure they're doing it right.

The "principle" of improving your herd, even when it means culling 80/90% of the calves, is unthinkable here. The thought of selecting semen with the right EPD's (what are they??).

Your posts seem to highlight your C.V. Yes, you are to be congratulated for speaking in front of a Parlimentry Commission. But I fear this thread is more about the "meat & potatoes of raising cattle.

Some of your generalisations can be dangerous when taken in the wrong context.

regards

[RamdomChances]

AI in Thailand is pretty much a hit and miss affair. Semen straws are available free from the local Ag department. In reality you pay 100 baht for the straw and 150 baht for a local man to come and administer it. You'd better be able to tell if your cow is in standing heat, because they sure can't. I stopped at 2 dairy farms outside Pak Chong because from the road I could see they had a few dairy x brahman calves. Asked them why they chose that cross. They didn't. They used the straws supplied by the local Ag. They were supposed to be all dairy.

We pay 50 bhat, for basic sperm you can get more expensive stuff but as we dont bother keeping the calfs there is no point. To be honest ours are pretty good the only problem is sometimes getting someone out at the right time. People go on courses here to learn AI and often the ones that do it are'nt proper vets and have just been on a week or two's course. Saying that one of the guy's that does most of our vet stuff is'nt a vet and has just been on a few courses but he's better and more knowlagable than the real vet's many of which you have to call out and tell them whats wrong with the cow and what to administer. Most injections calfing probs I do myself, still cant put a drip in though.

If you've got the pasture. using a bull on Brahman cows is easier than AI. A dairy cow will stand still 'til midnight as long as she's got grain in front of her. Try fiddling with rear end of a Brahman cow and she'll kick your head off. You'll need a tight chute and a headgate and rope.

We put them in the milking stalls for doing it most of the local farmers just tie them up somewhere. For water I've two 6000l troughts in the main encloseure and concrete tubs dotted around all fed off piped water with float valves so there is always water fro then to drink, got to keep an eye on the valves though as sometimes they break and flood the place.

To my mind a mineral suppliment is essential. You can use a salt/mineral lick block hung somewhere, or better is loose minerals in a tub.

We use the blocks hung up in the "barn" I think its about 500 bhat for two 10kg blocks.

If they're thirsty they'll eat less.

Yea you should try and posotion any water troughs in the shade, in hot season espacialy most cows suffer from some form of heat stress putting them off their food, less milk or less weight increse if your into beef, We've got 4 big industrial fans that we sometimes blow into the barn in particularly hot weather.

Keeping them as a status symbol doesn't mean they don't want a profit.

Presumably one has visited the local "cattle market".Its the heifers that make the money for breeding cattle, to produce more heifers.

I might of mis-under stood, "keeping as a status symbly" to me implies that there is no profit in it. Yes mate I have been to many cattle markets, we buy and sell cows all the time, although dairy not beef. Most of the people around here tend to keep the female calfs and sell the bulls at around 12-14 months for finnishing, the females when for sale are more expensive as they are the ones that get you your stock for selling.

Bannork, Sounds like it could it be Guinea grass miss pronounced in thai as they do with ruzzi (called lucy here) Thes stuff I'm growing is forage sorgham "khow fang wan" in thai or usually just called jumbo as I've said its not the best but really easy to grow and you get a lot of it, I'm probably going to put half the land over to ruzzi this year for grazing and the "jumbo" for cut'n'carry.

When's the last time you saw a Fresian dairy cow in Thailand. Most are ( I think) Holstein/fresian crosses and if the farmer is smart an 1/8th of Brahman in there too.

Yes mate most are HF crosses, pure breeds dont do too well here due to the heat (mainly) saying that all my cows are a mix of one sort or an other, some jersy crosses, one new zealand red and a couple with a lot of Thai/Brahman in them, I dont really worry too much when I'm out buying except to avoid the "pegigree" prime HF milkers like the plague, you pay too much of a premium for them in the hope of better milk yeilds and if it has trouble conceving you are just left with an expensive bit of meat.

I only buy cows over 5 month pregnant, ones that have just calfed, or young cows over 5 months into their first pregnancy over, 7 months pregnant is ideal, (or anything if it's cheap enough and I can turn a quick bhat ) we sell old cows, calfs and anything that the milk yield has droped to less them 7 kg a day and is'nt pregnant...conception rates are a big problem here for dairy. It cost me around 3kg of milk a day to feed a cow 5kg if giving rice straw so anything above that is profit (well less fixed running costs). We average about 13 kg/head/day at the moment which is well above average (about 10kg) a decent milker should give you around 20kg a day when just droped, going down to around 8-5kg just before drying off.Some of the "prime" milkers give around 30kg but to be honest the ones we have had have proved to be more trouble than they are worth, difficulty in conciving, prone to mastitis sensitive to heat, so we dont bother any more.

For the beef system try to stay off the concentrates. In Thailand I understand they are about £90 per ton and there is no subsidy support. The real key is growing the grass and probably on a zero grazing system.That means having the right land, irrigation and harvesting set up.

Yep 90 pound a ton seems about right, it stands to reason that if you can get the weight gains without giving concentrate then you will be on a winner, very few people can though, in fact I've never come across a set-up which does'nt use concentrate, except the local small heards producing calfs for the feed lot guys.

One of the biggest problems for "falangs" to make money out of cattle IMO is knowing the market, Its taken me years to get to know the dairy market (I feel I know it pretty well as we buy and sell all the time, much more than the ave small dairy farm) You get your buying and selling price right and you can make money off virtually anything, but usually you are up against guy's that may have been doing it all thier lifes and with much more patiance then the average falang for bartering.

RC

[Korat Correct]

Ramdom Chances

Now I see you are from Sakhon Nakhon I can see the misunderstanding.

Being in Korat and visiting the area within 60km the topography is different.

The Brahman bull calves are not kept beyond 6 months here.They sell for around 6-8000bht at the local market.

Maybe you would like to show me your holding when I get round to visiting the area?

I think the idea is to stay in Udon Thani and travel to Sakhon daily.

[bannork]

No, no RC is in Nakhon Sawan which is nowhere near Sakon Nakhon!

Thanks for your answer RC, I've been buying 'lucy' seeds from the shop and I assumed that was short for lucerne grass but now it seems it's actually ruzzie! Oh dear, so much to learn!

[RamdomChances]

Now I see you are from Sakhon Nakhon I can see the misunderstanding.

Bannork is right mate, I'm no where near Sakhon Nakhon, but in Nakhon Sawan, Central Thailand about 170 km north of BKK, if ever your in the area feel free to drop in. Parts of Nakhon are big rice producing areas around the Chao Praya, but maily it's Sugar Cane, Maize, Peanuts, not much rice around near me. Bannork it took me ages to figure out the "lucy" thing as well...one day it just clicked Edited July 17, 2006 by RamdomChances

[chownah]

Also, not all "lucy" (Ruzzi) seems to be the same. A local farmer gave me a start of "lucy" and told met that it is grown for fodder. It is a wide bladed grass that gets fairly tall in good soil and if not cut or grazed and sort of looks like the pictures on the internet.....but....when it flowers, the seed stalks look nothing like what is shown on the net. I don't know how significant this is.....I've got just one little patch of this "lucy" growing and other than what I've described I know nothing about it.

[Korat Correct]

RandomChances

I have no problem with those outside this Issan section commenting on the Issan problems,but if this is this the case may we also suggest you post your farming concerns on your own section? Is it like farming in Kinloss or Kent, Kintyre or (k) Cornwall?

Teletiger

Do tell us about your farming management system. I think you may need help friend.

There are only three ways of getting into farming -- Matrimony,Patrimony and Parsimony.

Which one applies to you Tiger?

You do understand the question?

Just trying to be helpful and polite you understand.

I will always stand by what I say.

I have been farming since 1959 but don't admit to know the half of it yet.

I've now retired on my ill gotten gains now but don't let that worry you.

[bannork]

Also, not all "lucy" (Ruzzi) seems to be the same. A local farmer gave me a start of "lucy" and told met that it is grown for fodder. It is a wide bladed grass that gets fairly tall in good soil and if not cut or grazed and sort of looks like the pictures on the internet.....but....when it flowers, the seed stalks look nothing like what is shown on the net. I don't know how significant this is.....I've got just one little patch of this "lucy" growing and other than what I've described I know nothing about it.

Cows love it and whilst I haven't had the experience of cows pulling it up by the roots, in spite of the wife letting the cows loose on it within 2 months of planting, I have found it prefers raised ground.

To stop cows eating it just spread some cow manure around, they won't touch it then but I wonder for how long.

[bina]

korat correct,

curb your tongue a bit , na??

rc has been one of the more pragmatic and informative posters and being area specific doesnt really matter too too much as we all know where he lives (from previous posts).

some of us are just asking theoretical questions at the moment and any farming info is useful (for instance i am in israel raise goats donkeys etc but alot of the medical etc for ruminants apllies all over the world and rc tells me how it is in thailand in general) '; and do raise thai veggies also for fun and the zoo, people like to see new things;

when i will need specific korat soil analyses and prices i will ask u for sure... at the moment im just absorbing info that is thailand related in general for farming etc ;

maybe ill buy a cow or two from him in five years!!

every farmer i've ever met, and i've met thoughsands since i am also a safety advisor for agriculture in israel, has his /her BEST WAY of raising chickens, goats, cows, wheat, cotton, organics, etc etc... all info is good info it is YOU the farmer that applies what is needed in YOUR area...

and hands on experience is best ...........

this is a great thread and i hope it stays informative and practical, as i am getting a clearer picture of small farm thai style and what to expect etc

to all, keep up the good answers and questions.

bina

israel

[RamdomChances]

RandomChances

I have no problem with those outside this Issan section commenting on the Issan problems,but if this is this the case may we also suggest you post your farming concerns on your own section? Is it like farming in Kinloss or Kent, Kintyre or (k) Cornwall?

Most of the "farming" threads seem to be in the "issan" forum. I tend to post in them as very few people here have any practical experiance in farming in thailand. I've had a dairy farm here for about 6 years, not as a hobby or something to do but as an ongoing profit making buissines, I dont rely on any outside income. I just do what works and turns a profit. Most of the stuff is'nt area specific anyway, 70 km north east and I'd be in Issan, do you really think that would change anything?

[Ken]

RandomChances

I have no problem with those outside this Issan section commenting on the Issan problems,but if this is this the case may we also suggest you post your farming concerns on your own section? Is it like farming in Kinloss or Kent, Kintyre or (k) Cornwall?

.....

Most of the "farming" threads seem to be in the "issan" forum. I tend to post in them as very few people here have any practical experiance in farming in thailand. I've had a dairy farm here for about 6 years, not as a hobby or something to do but as an ongoing profit making buissines, I dont rely on any outside income. I just do what works and turns a profit. Most of the stuff is'nt area specific anyway, 70 km north east and I'd be in Issan, do you really think that would change anything?

Good answer RC and the "Issan" forum is a better place because of your posts IMHO. The way Korat Correct posts you might get the idea that he thinks he IS the "Issan" forum.

[ThaiRanger]

RandomChances

I have no problem with those outside this Issan section commenting on the Issan problems,but if this is this the case may we also suggest you post your farming concerns on your own section? Is it like farming in Kinloss or Kent, Kintyre or (k) Cornwall?

.....

Most of the "farming" threads seem to be in the "issan" forum. I tend to post in them as very few people here have any practical experiance in farming in thailand. I've had a dairy farm here for about 6 years, not as a hobby or something to do but as an ongoing profit making buissines, I dont rely on any outside income. I just do what works and turns a profit. Most of the stuff is'nt area specific anyway, 70 km north east and I'd be in Issan, do you really think that would change anything?

Good answer RC and the "Issan" forum is a better place because of your posts IMHO. The way Korat Correct posts you might get the idea that he thinks he IS the "Issan" forum.

Spot on Ken!!

I enjoy this thread very much even though I am not a farmer but my son is. The infomation posted from where ever Issan , Central or South Thailand, US, Oz, Israel or Timbuktu has been most informative and professional. Maybe not to KC who thinks he knows everything except Thai geography . Oh Well! Who cares!

Thai Ranger

Edited July 18, 2006 by ThaiRanger

[teletiger]

Squire Korat, Sorry if you thought I rattled your cage. Stick the dummy back in son, you'll get over it.

Must agree with you others about RC's candid and very entertaining posts.

Sorry if you misunderstood RC. The bold type from my post were exerps taken from The Squire's posting.

If most people in Thailand own cattle as a status symbol, then I'm running in the wrong circles

Most of my neighbours own between 2 and 20 cattle. They do so to earn a few extra Baht, grazing them in the mango orchards, or chop and carry for them. There's scores of small dairies (up to 20 cows) over towards Pak Chong and a few larger ones. We've also got Chok Chai beside us. Only one place I know owns cattle as a status symbol and thats a vineyard on the way to Wang nam Keow, who recently bought a long eared Brazilian brahman for 2 million Baht. As a phenotype he's not the best I've seen (his rear feet pointed out, very chaplinesque ) but hey.....his ears hung down to his knees

This Thai obsession with long ears is a real puzzle to me. Cattle =milk and beef. This particular breed fill neither criteria. Maybe the Squire can enlighten me on this point, having snuffled in more august company than this mere mortal.

regards

[diddlysquat]

Squire Korat, Sorry if you thought I rattled your cage. Stick the dummy back in son, you'll get over it

This Thai obsession with long ears is a real puzzle to me.

Teletiger.The only way Squire Korat could stick the dummy back in is if he first extracted it from your posterior. And I expect it smells like the tone of your posts.

Many companies (not least Campina) are experimenting to determine which cattle and cross-breeding gives the best milk yields in Thailand. You would know this if you live near Chok Chai, as you say. Maybe your inbreeding means you also have long ears which cover your eyes and senses, and are leeching blood from your brain

Edited July 18, 2006 by diddlysquat

[teletiger]

Very good diddly. You sound like the squires alter-ego. You and your master have had your dummies up a lot of posteriors I should imagine.

This has been an excellent thread up to now and I really don't want it to turn into a bunfight, so I'm going to retire from it. Good luck to you all.

regards

[chownah]

Isn't the brahma genetics of value for its disease resistence and its large body structure? Don't really know...that's why I'm asking.

Edited July 18, 2006 by chownah

[RamdomChances]

This Thai obsession with long ears is a real puzzle to me. Cattle =milk and beef. This particular breed fill neither criteria.

Me too, Ive been trying to work it out for ages now, the only answer I've got of thai farmers is that they are beautiful, mabye it's these "long eared" brahma that KC was talking about when he refered to status symbol, I had'nt thought of that but would fit although it would be a tiny percentage of the market. Back in an earlier post I mentioned about 2,000 bhat for AI, I'm pretty sure that was pedigree semen in an attempt to get "long eared" calfs. Too me it's all just a self fufilling proficy....they are expencive cos they are expencive!! the bubble will have to burst sometime, if it has'nt already, I have'nt heared much about them for a while.

This has been an excellent thread up to now and I really don't want it to turn into a bunfight, so I'm going to retire from it. Good luck to you all.

That would be a shame.

Many companies (not least Campina) are experimenting to determine which cattle and cross-breeding gives the best milk yields in Thailand.

Yes most of the large companies experiment to try and find better milkers, more suted to the envioment here, Chock Chai has actually registered its own breed, the Chock Chai Freisian, I dont really see the relevence to "keeping cattle as status symbols" though and the "long eared" varity that teletiger was talking about has nothing to do with dairy production. You can buy "Chock Chai" seman and they also sell offf their young , pregnant cows, I think at something like over 5 or 6 months pregnant, you dont get to pick them though they do that for you and I have no idea how much they sell for, although I would think they are probably expencive. The problem with a lot of the breeds kept by the big companies is that they are kept in fairly optimum conditions on the big farms most of which have their own vets, for most small dairy farms IMO they would be more trouble than they are worth.

Isn't the brahma genetics of value for its disease resistence and its large body structure? Don't really know...that's why I'm asking.

More or less yes mate, good resistance to the heat, and parasites and the ability to put weight on while eating virtualy anything, although teletiger was talking about the "long eared" one's. I'm not sure you have the same craze for them up around your way, but they sometimes go for crazy money and dont really apear to have any advantages apart for being beautiful, if anyone has any info on them I'd like to know as it's been a mystery to me

[bina]

Anybody have a pic of the really long eared ones???

i suspect that the long ears on the cow are like the very roman nosed shami goats; very expensive, status symbol but any other decent goat would do the job (got compliments on a nose/jawline yesterday from a beduin who raises shamis, and here i always thought dokmai's underbite was a genetic problem, turns out this is also REQUIRED... god knows how she could graze this way in a pasture)

remember, beauty is in the eye of the beholder:

shapes of udders, set of eyes, noses(muzzles), etc... not always functional but differentiate the breed from the other plebian types, making them status symbols

dare i mention body shape for men/women (fat , large breasted, flat chested, huge bum, etc... according to culture/country)

well, back on topic....

post some pics

bina

[teletiger]

a young calf and tyre tanks.

regards.

[ThaiRanger]

a young calf and tyre tanks.

regards.

TeleTiger she is beautiful. This is my Pride and Joy Saan

Thai Ranger

[bina]

i want one !!!!!!!!!!

i love ears that flap........i can sit and pet and play with the ears for hours.....

ummm......

how did u do those tire waterers????? hard for me to see from the pics...

[plachon]

i want one !!!!!!!!!!

i love ears that flap........i can sit and pet and play with the ears for hours.....

ummm......

how did u do those tire waterers????? hard for me to see from the pics...

Hi Bina - good thread, pity about Farmer Giles, but there's always one.......

Like a big eared Brahman? If you got the odd hundred grand to two million it can be arranged (my commission is v. reasonable) But, don't expect to make any profit from it, cos like RC, I'm of the opinion that the bubble on those beasts is about to burst some time soon, and in the end all they'll be is skin, bones and beef. (120-130 Baht a kilo retail).

The tyre tanks are available at tyre recycled furniture and rubbish bin shops, along the main roads out of Khon Kaen, Kalasin, Udon and other main cities. Some can also make quite nice lotus tanks on the cheap.

[bina]

well actually unless khon kaen is near jerusalem that doesnt help me; i wanted to make them for the zoo; it just seems a nifty idea to use all those old tyres laying around, and i dont have to replace plastic buckets all the time...

i just want one cow so i can play with her ears, thats all, so when i win the lottery thats what i want to buy.... dont they ahve 'adopt an animal' type thing in thailand like they do here (adopt an abandoned donkey, goat, camel etc)?? id be a good home until they become skin bones and beef and then ill still be a good cook oops i mean home....

bina

btw, what in gods name are those wattles they have on their necks???? those bumby rubbery thingys hanging there????