Red Shirts Put Lives On Hold To Camp Out In Bangkok

[anotherpeter]

i love it how people scoff about only 100,000 people turning up for the intial protest. compare that with a miserly 1000 people today at victory monument. Also compare it to the numbers that turned out in protest against the loathed health care bill in US. approx 1-10k depending on fox (10k) less if u don't listen to the nazis!!

Obviously they had to 'big it up' for calls of 1 million people but 100,000 is a lot if u think that allegedly 50% of americans hate the health care bill. thailand has approx 60 million and usa 300 million. work out the proportions if u care to do so but even with people being paid to attend it still shows the majority of thais by a distance support the reds! i think that 10,000 out of 30,000,000 is less than 100,000 out of 60,000,000.

enough said i think!!

So if 100,000 people came out to support the current government, do you think the reds would go home?

[Slip]

i love it how people scoff about only 100,000 people turning up for the intial protest. compare that with a miserly 1000 people today at victory monument. Also compare it to the numbers that turned out in protest against the loathed health care bill in US. approx 1-10k depending on fox (10k) less if u don't listen to the nazis!!

Obviously they had to 'big it up' for calls of 1 million people but 100,000 is a lot if u think that allegedly 50% of americans hate the health care bill. thailand has approx 60 million and usa 300 million. work out the proportions if u care to do so but even with people being paid to attend it still shows the majority of thais by a distance support the reds! i think that 10,000 out of 30,000,000 is less than 100,000 out of 60,000,000.

enough said i think!!

So if 100,000 people came out to support the current government, do you think the reds would go home?

I think that way, madness lies.

[warfie]

double post - see below.

That's twice today this has happened. Hmmm.

maybe you've had too much coffee...

[jucel]

i love it how people scoff about only 100,000 people turning up for the intial protest. compare that with a miserly 1000 people today at victory monument. Also compare it to the numbers that turned out in protest against the loathed health care bill in US. approx 1-10k depending on fox (10k) less if u don't listen to the nazis!!

Obviously they had to 'big it up' for calls of 1 million people but 100,000 is a lot if u think that allegedly 50% of americans hate the health care bill. thailand has approx 60 million and usa 300 million. work out the proportions if u care to do so but even with people being paid to attend it still shows the majority of thais by a distance support the reds! i think that 10,000 out of 30,000,000 is less than 100,000 out of 60,000,000.

enough said i think!!

So if 100,000 people came out to support the current government, do you think the reds would go home?

u r missing my point. i am simply saying that a lot of people have said that 100,000 is a derisory figure. I actually believe it is a fair representation of the thai people. ive heard people say that 100,000 out of 60 million is nothing. I believe it is a strong movement that is backed by a high percentage of the population.

Compared to the US, the health care bill is apparently depised by approx 150 million people!! Yet only 10,000 max could be arsed to show up in washington to show their feelings. These approx 150 million are also supposedly the higher echelon of society so could travel from any part of the US if they really wanted to air their disapproval!

Edited April 15, 2010 by jucel

[jitenshaman]

"There is nothing under the sun which the Thai police cannot do," Thaksin said on January 14, 2003, adding, "You must use iron fist against drugs traffickers and show them no mercy. Because drug traffickers are ruthless to our children, so being ruthless back to them is not a bad thing…If there are deaths among traffickers, it is normal."

If a lot of western countries had a Thaksin around, we would not be having the problems we are having. Look at the US/Mexican border..it's a bloody war zone with the drug cartels running the war. Thousand of innocent bystanders get killed in the crossfire. Human Rights watch/ Amnesty Int can not do much about that but, if the Americans sent in a couple of infantry brigades and slaughtered ever one of the SOB's (Mexico is far to corrupt to do it themselves) these same organizations would be howling like banshees. Ohhh don't hurt the drug dealers...don't put the cuffs on too tight you are violating their human rights. We kill civilians- in a war zone...war crime...Taliban kills 20 times more civilians...dead silence...same kind of BS.

Drug trafficers have no human rights as far as I'm concerned...they give them up when they decide to get into the trade. Sewer rats have more rights.

The other interesting thing about drug trafficers is that they are always...always innocent. Yep I'll just bet all those folks who got wasted on Thaksins watch

were just innocent little boys....just like their brothers in Mexico. Like I said...some people will believe anything....especially if some bleeding heart at Humans right watch tells it. These outfits have to spout and publish---their funding depends on it.

In countries like Burma or in the Taliban's Afghanistan, the "government" (read generals or people with guns) decides who has human rights. Under the Taliban, opium production was in fact lowered due to their hardline stance and thousands were killed. In a majority of Western countries, although it often leads to great problems, even the most despicable lout at least in theory gets a fair trial in front of a jury of his/her peers and again, at least in theory, is given the benefit of the doubt until proven guilty as charged, because this way of doing things is considered to be one of the tenets of what is considered "democracy." It seems to me that most of the Red supporters are stating on here that that is what this movement is about...to make Thailand a more fair place where the masses have a chance to improve and have rights and dignity which they feel they dont under the current system...if Thaksin's style of democracy is a better choice, I suggest you try some time in North Korea or the Union of Myanmar to see how utopian those societies are.

[sawadeeken]

I think this is an AWESOME post. You certainly have a way with words which clearly paints a picture of "THINGS THE WAY THEY ARE"

Well someone should try to point out to them a world wide problem The top 20% have 80% of the wealth everywhere on the planet, and that will never ever change. So they had better get used to it.

Thank you, Mosha.. that was a brilliant post.

"That is the way, and that's the way it IS" (lyrics from the song "It's like that" - Run DMC, circa 1984)

And, for the poster that mentioned that South Africa wasn't seeing protests by educated students, yes, that's true.

But the people that WERE protesting, weren't BEING FUNDED FROM A SINGLE ENTITY to be there. They also didn't ONLY come to the central urban center to disrupt the lives and businesses of completely innocent people (peaceful demonstrations; MY ASS). That's not democracy, it's a puppetshow with agendas.

Back to here in Thailand:

The in-season fields back home (in 44 provinces) are drought-burned, and Dear "Uncle Taksi" is layin out traveling money, and in fact, rather handsome day-wages (compared to what some of these people make in a day), and not EVERY Redshirt you see marching owns a farm; some of them just work on farms, or in farm-related vocations, like harvest-machine rental/maintenance, food processing/packing facilities & transport, etc.. (it's not ALL illegal foreign labor, you know).

With really <removed>-all to do in the dry cracked earth back home, can you really not see the true motive of most of the "protesters"? To come sliding down to the big city, in the huge Red all day/all night party.. to BBQ, picnic, eat, drink, tootle around in the back of a pickup with their friends, see shows (on the Red stages {very good to get some fun endorphins pumping}), go to see professionally projected movies in airconditioned theaters (instead of a 20 year old film print being chewed and sliced to shreds in a 40 year old hackneyed projector hastily erected on a pile of rotten wood crates in the sweltering dirt parking lot of the local Wat, with distorted sound being shrieked from a 70 year old speaker box), and enjoy bathrooms that aren't just ramshackle wood shacks with porcelain holes in the ground? It's everything they love to do back in the sticks, but better, more comfortably, AND GET PAID FOR IT??

Why is that SO HARD for some people to understand? Perhaps, in a civilized country (not a 3rd world one), a protesting mob can be given credence, for being interested in TRUE democracy. But (and some people just can't seem to GRASP THIS); THIS IS THAILAND!!! It's not civilized, or advanced. Don't let the 3G phone network or the Skytrain fool you.

Now, to be fair, South Africa is certainly is a 3rd world country. But the democratic movement there against Apartheid, was born of the fact that the ruling factions were in the habit of sending armies/police/thug-tribesmen into their villages and homes to hack/shoot/rape/amputate them. I believe that explains the rise of an unpaid democracy movement in that 3rd world country.

That is not the case here in Thailand. No one's been sending groups of government SWAT into rural people's homes to kill them. It's just the ageless plight of the Haves and the HaveNots and the political tides those opposing forces generate. (and in this particular case, the efforts of a ruthless billionaire despot to regain his court appropriated ill-gotten funds and especially his ill-gotten power)

Oh wait! I just remembered: There WERE indeed SWAT teams that went into people's homes, and executed them, here in Thailand! And it happened under TAKSIN'S RULE, and under the guise of his "ask no questions - no arrest - no trial" War On Drugs Policy (I've heard that was actually part of a system to remove elements in the drug trade that could lead back to some important officials that wouldn't wish to have their hands exposed for being fully in the Golden Triangle trade).

So.. again.. enough with this "democratic movement" crap. It's a paid protest, as corrupt and foundless/faithless (and in the the scheme of things, pointless) as so many things are, in the LOS.

THIS IS ABOUT MONEY, CORRUPTION, and GREED FOR ABSOLUTE POWER, AS EVERYTHING IS, IN THAILAND, and many other 3rd world countries.

And really, western people.. how can you not know this? Is it really so hard to see? I personally see the Redshirt movement as just circling the drain (not increasing in size or support). Most Thais that I hear from, are sad for the deaths, but understand the mobs were pushed into harms way by the Red leaders, and clearly see that is was the doing of forces other than the government (why would the government want to so handily give the gift of some 16+ martyrs to the Reds, really?) It just doesn't make sense that the soldiers would go in there as a killing machine. (for many reasons).

The Thais I know are far from "falling" into support for the Redshirts, and are in fact more tired than ever of the whole deadly and pointless paid puppet show. The worst thing, is that with the Reds now consolidating into the business district (to mask their dwindling numbers), the ones with REAL power (the ones who are now losing 1billion Bath per day from massive closures of entire commercial areas) are going to have to enter the fracas, and.. I'm afraid that I don't think that's gonna work out so well for the nice jolly country folk, in town for their little paid holiday. And now with the Yellows planning THEIR counter-protest on the 18th? I really do fear that a full on civil war will erupt, with casualties in the thousands. All this, for that evil man in Dubai.

Poor Thailand.

[sotsira]

I think this is an AWESOME post. You certainly have a way with words which clearly paints a picture of "THINGS THE WAY THEY ARE"

Well someone should try to point out to them a world wide problem The top 20% have 80% of the wealth everywhere on the planet, and that will never ever change. So they had better get used to it.

Thank you, Mosha.. that was a brilliant post.

"That is the way, and that's the way it IS" (lyrics from the song "It's like that" - Run DMC, circa 1984)

And, for the poster that mentioned that South Africa wasn't seeing protests by educated students, yes, that's true.

But the people that WERE protesting, weren't BEING FUNDED FROM A SINGLE ENTITY to be there. They also didn't ONLY come to the central urban center to disrupt the lives and businesses of completely innocent people (peaceful demonstrations; MY ASS). That's not democracy, it's a puppetshow with agendas.

Back to here in Thailand:

The in-season fields back home (in 44 provinces) are drought-burned, and Dear "Uncle Taksi" is layin out traveling money, and in fact, rather handsome day-wages (compared to what some of these people make in a day), and not EVERY Redshirt you see marching owns a farm; some of them just work on farms, or in farm-related vocations, like harvest-machine rental/maintenance, food processing/packing facilities & transport, etc.. (it's not ALL illegal foreign labor, you know).

With really <removed>-all to do in the dry cracked earth back home, can you really not see the true motive of most of the "protesters"? To come sliding down to the big city, in the huge Red all day/all night party.. to BBQ, picnic, eat, drink, tootle around in the back of a pickup with their friends, see shows (on the Red stages {very good to get some fun endorphins pumping}), go to see professionally projected movies in airconditioned theaters (instead of a 20 year old film print being chewed and sliced to shreds in a 40 year old hackneyed projector hastily erected on a pile of rotten wood crates in the sweltering dirt parking lot of the local Wat, with distorted sound being shrieked from a 70 year old speaker box), and enjoy bathrooms that aren't just ramshackle wood shacks with porcelain holes in the ground? It's everything they love to do back in the sticks, but better, more comfortably, AND GET PAID FOR IT??

Why is that SO HARD for some people to understand? Perhaps, in a civilized country (not a 3rd world one), a protesting mob can be given credence, for being interested in TRUE democracy. But (and some people just can't seem to GRASP THIS); THIS IS THAILAND!!! It's not civilized, or advanced. Don't let the 3G phone network or the Skytrain fool you.

Now, to be fair, South Africa is certainly is a 3rd world country. But the democratic movement there against Apartheid, was born of the fact that the ruling factions were in the habit of sending armies/police/thug-tribesmen into their villages and homes to hack/shoot/rape/amputate them. I believe that explains the rise of an unpaid democracy movement in that 3rd world country.

That is not the case here in Thailand. No one's been sending groups of government SWAT into rural people's homes to kill them. It's just the ageless plight of the Haves and the HaveNots and the political tides those opposing forces generate. (and in this particular case, the efforts of a ruthless billionaire despot to regain his court appropriated ill-gotten funds and especially his ill-gotten power)

Oh wait! I just remembered: There WERE indeed SWAT teams that went into people's homes, and executed them, here in Thailand! And it happened under TAKSIN'S RULE, and under the guise of his "ask no questions - no arrest - no trial" War On Drugs Policy (I've heard that was actually part of a system to remove elements in the drug trade that could lead back to some important officials that wouldn't wish to have their hands exposed for being fully in the Golden Triangle trade).

So.. again.. enough with this "democratic movement" crap. It's a paid protest, as corrupt and foundless/faithless (and in the the scheme of things, pointless) as so many things are, in the LOS.

THIS IS ABOUT MONEY, CORRUPTION, and GREED FOR ABSOLUTE POWER, AS EVERYTHING IS, IN THAILAND, and many other 3rd world countries.

And really, western people.. how can you not know this? Is it really so hard to see? I personally see the Redshirt movement as just circling the drain (not increasing in size or support). Most Thais that I hear from, are sad for the deaths, but understand the mobs were pushed into harms way by the Red leaders, and clearly see that is was the doing of forces other than the government (why would the government want to so handily give the gift of some 16+ martyrs to the Reds, really?) It just doesn't make sense that the soldiers would go in there as a killing machine. (for many reasons).

The Thais I know are far from "falling" into support for the Redshirts, and are in fact more tired than ever of the whole deadly and pointless paid puppet show. The worst thing, is that with the Reds now consolidating into the business district (to mask their dwindling numbers), the ones with REAL power (the ones who are now losing 1billion Bath per day from massive closures of entire commercial areas) are going to have to enter the fracas, and.. I'm afraid that I don't think that's gonna work out so well for the nice jolly country folk, in town for their little paid holiday. And now with the Yellows planning THEIR counter-protest on the 18th? I really do fear that a full on civil war will erupt, with casualties in the thousands. All this, for that evil man in Dubai.

Poor Thailand.

For all of you that think this is all about Thaksin really need to open your minds and try and understand the whole picture of whats really going on in Thai politics.

Thailand has had how many coups? and in how many years?

What does that tell you all?

This isn't about one man in Dubai, it goes way way beyond that.

What's happening at the present time is just the tip of the iceburg in comparison to the full picture.