Korean Newspaper Criticizes Thaksin

[webfact]

Korean Newspaper Criticizes Thaksin

The South Korean president has been quoted as saying former Thai premier Thaksin Shinawatra is the real cause of the current political crisis in Thailand.

Meanwhile, a Korean newspaper suggests Thaksin-style populist polices could lead to the collapse of a nation.

South Korean President Lee Myung Bak was quoted as saying former Thai prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra has been inciting national discord.

He advised Koreans not to follow this example as the country used to suffer a severe conflict during the Korean War which resulted in the separation of North and South Korea.

An English editorial in the Chosun Ilbo newspaper, meanwhile, advised Korean politicians and people to learn from the Thaksin-style populist policies as they could lead to the collapse of a country like what took place in Argentina.

The editorial entitled “Beware of Populism” recalled the April 10 clash where scores of law-enforcement officials and protesters were killed and almost 1,000 were injured after the Thai government declared a state of emergency.

It also noted the red-shirt protesters in April last year stormed the ASEAN Summit meeting venue, forcing the Korean president to flee by helicopter.

The editorial said the current red-shirt anti-government protests are centered around globe-trotting Thaksin, whose premiership was ended in 2006 by a military coup.

It said protesters marched across Bangkok, aiming only to see him return despite his massive corruption as they have already been addicted to his populist policies that have dried up the state coffer.

The editorial suggested the current protests are pushing Thailand to a civil war as the demonstrators may confront government supporters.

It also urged Korean political parties to take the lesson from Thailand and beware of luring voters with populist policies.

-- Tan Network 2010-04-19

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

[brahmburgers]

It would also be interesting to hear what Chinese leaders are thinking.

The Chinese cut short the Avatar movie showings, even though people were enthusiastically lined up all over the country to see it multiple times - as Avatar shows how an oppressed minority, if it's focused enough, can repel the full might of an entrenched military machine. Message from Chinese politburo to Tibetans: Don't watch that movie!

Similarly, the Chinese leaders would not want the lesson of Reds in Bkk to be broadcast widely as it highlights class divisions - between haves and have-nots, country bumkins mobilizing and causing havoc in a big city. Such concepts spook the Chinese leadership. Plus, they're reluctant to criticize T, as he's Chinese descent. Sorry for being off-topic, as this thread relates to Korea.

Edited April 19, 2010 by brahmburgers

[grandpops]

The Thaksin Anguish Network comes up trumps again.

They should stick to the vacuous airheads promoting one of their friends range of coffees. 4 days after the murders at Phan Fah, TAN were airing a political debate which a normal person (and I don't even mean me) would expect to be current. But it was from a week before!!!

Pattaya TV creams them. The advert for Crazy Dave's is a Documentary par excellance compared to anything TAN have come up with. Dave still alive Bob... Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeah

[lannarebirth]

The Thaksin Anguish Network comes up trumps again.

They should stick to the vacuous airheads promoting one of their friends range of coffees. 4 days after the murders at Phan Fah, TAN were airing a political debate which a normal person (and I don't even mean me) would expect to be current. But it was from a week before!!!

Pattaya TV creams them. The advert for Crazy Dave's is a Documentary par excellance compared to anything TAN have come up with. Dave still alive Bob... Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeah

You can bypass TAN and read the original editorial if you're so inclined:

http://english.chosun.com/site/data/html_d...0041501109.html

[hammered]

Oh no they'll have to listen to countless Jatuporn diatribes against their state

[Brocher]

The South Korean president has been quoted as saying former Thai premier Thaksin Shinawatra is the real cause of the current political crisis in Thailand.

At long last an article in the foreign media pinning the blame where it lies - on the greedy corrupt scumbag whose only concern is for himself and his equally greedy family and cronies. I heard the usual rubbish from BBC World tonight from a reporter who must have spent a lot of time with the Red Shirts - he was going on about how the rich elite in Thailand hated Thaksin "because he'd empowered the rural poor".

How to reduce a complex political situation to an 'us versus them' simplistic scenario - and that from the famous BBC!!!

[Publicus]

South Korea, pop 45m first achieved a GDP of USD $1 trn in 2008 and continues to do even better.

In S Korea (the Republic of Korea) there actually are freedom of speech, press, academic freedom etc and no topic is off the table in the public square of free and open discussion, debate and discourse.

I like especially that several years ago NGO's and other groups of Korean civil society began taking full page newspaper ads during election campaigns presenting photos of politicians with the words in large bold black

font: This Man is Corrupt.

On the page opposite the photo page is stated specifically and in detail how each such ID'd Korean politician is corrupt. This happens every election cycle in Korea and each time the number of photos become fewer, not for a paucity of film or cameras, or because of government censorship, but for the fact of an increasingly clean government and political system.

The US Government and people suffered through decades of S Korean dictators, especially Park Chung Hee and up to Gen Chun Doo Wan as recently as the Seoul Olympic Games of 1988, but patience has paid off and paid off handsomely.

I mention this because I want to suggest to the Thai politicians that instead of suing anyone making such true statements of them - and under the laws these elites have written, the more true the statement, the more guilty is the person who makes it - that Thailand surrender to the United States, or apply to become a protectorate of it, so the country and all Thai people can reverse their present dead ender situation, instead shortly to become a peaceful and prosperous democracy - a model to all of Asean. (I mean, lookit Japan and Germany.)

Especially given that the alternative seems to be the country becoming a N Korea or a Burma, a Zimbabwe

or perhaps even worse, a Montenegro.

[wayfarer108]

The Thaksin Anguish Network comes up trumps again.

They should stick to the vacuous airheads promoting one of their friends range of coffees. 4 days after the murders at Phan Fah, TAN were airing a political debate which a normal person (and I don't even mean me) would expect to be current. But it was from a week before!!!

Pattaya TV creams them. The advert for Crazy Dave's is a Documentary par excellance compared to anything TAN have come up with. Dave still alive Bob... Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeah

You can bypass TAN and read the original editorial if you're so inclined:

http://english.chosun.com/site/data/html_d...0041501109.html

+1 lannarebirth

[RickBradford]

The Chinese cut short the Avatar movie showings, even though people were enthusiastically lined up all over the country to see it multiple times - as Avatar shows how an oppressed minority, if it's focused enough, can repel the full might of an entrenched military machine.

Almost as dumb as Vietnamese Customs, who relieved me of the novel 'The Hunt For Red October' as being subversively anti-communist....

[whiterussian]

How to reduce a complex political situation to an 'us versus them' simplistic scenario - and that from the famous BBC!!!

and the washington post, amnesty international, french dailies (hardly suprising there though) because facts are facts, the message is clear:

don't intervene with military coups.*

no one disputes Thaksin is not an angel, has blood on his hands, is a bit of a nutter, ok, IS a nutter... but then again, the same can be said for a lot of people in power right now. (abroad that is... phew)

*unless the yanks are backing it.

Edited April 19, 2010 by whiterussian

[Chunky1]

interesting how some international stories make it onto thai visa and how others dont.

[YouYouYou]

"The South Korean president has been quoted as saying former Thai premier Thaksin Shinawatra is the real cause of the current political crisis in Thailand."

Me too IMHO ....that's it and nice to see some eh' hem 'world leaders' saying so.

Nite nite

[animatic]

Clearly stated article, and not a Thaksin bought and paid for hagiography.

Nor a particularly a hatchet job on Thaksin, more; Just The Facts Ma'am.

Many stories DON'T make it to TVF. But you can bring ANY story you want to a Mods attention.

Webfact is scouring a list of local sources, but you can point him to anything,

as long as it isn't on the short list of 'not agreeing to link' publications like BP..

You CAN write up a topic with images and links, and post it in OPEN forum sections,

report it to a mod and ask them to move it. If it isn't against standard TVF policy

and has relevancy, they likely will put it in new.

Edited April 19, 2010 by animatic

[Phuket Stan]

The South Korean president has been quoted as saying former Thai premier Thaksin Shinawatra is the real cause of the current political crisis in Thailand.

At long last an article in the foreign media pinning the blame where it lies - on the greedy corrupt scumbag whose only concern is for himself and his equally greedy family and cronies. I heard the usual rubbish from BBC World tonight from a reporter who must have spent a lot of time with the Red Shirts - he was going on about how the rich elite in Thailand hated Thaksin "because he'd empowered the rural poor".

How to reduce a complex political situation to an 'us versus them' simplistic scenario - and that from the famous BBC!!!

The BBC has lauded Thaksin as if he is the Messiah for quite some time....when the reporter for BBC was a guy called Head it was pathetic how one eyed he was...am afraid that what was once a great if not the best in the world news service has been busy shooting itself in the foot and slowly slipping down the gurgler ...IMHO

[Oberkommando]

The BBC has lauded Thaksin as if he is the Messiah for quite some time....when the reporter for BBC was a guy called Head it was pathetic how one eyed he was...

Jonathan Head was charged with LM after his story, 'Thailand's Wealthy Untouchables" was put on the BBC website after Moo Ham drove his Mercedes into a bus queue, killing one woman.

Must have irked somebody.

He was always close to the mark when he was reporting on Thailand.

Ironic indeed how they have tried to silence him.

[monkfish]

Edit: missed the link but got it now

Edited April 19, 2010 by monkfish

[Siam Simon]

The South Korean president has been quoted as saying former Thai premier Thaksin Shinawatra is the real cause of the current political crisis in Thailand.

At long last an article in the foreign media pinning the blame where it lies - on the greedy corrupt scumbag whose only concern is for himself and his equally greedy family and cronies. I heard the usual rubbish from BBC World tonight from a reporter who must have spent a lot of time with the Red Shirts - he was going on about how the rich elite in Thailand hated Thaksin "because he'd empowered the rural poor".

How to reduce a complex political situation to an 'us versus them' simplistic scenario - and that from the famous BBC!!!

The BBC has lauded Thaksin as if he is the Messiah for quite some time....when the reporter for BBC was a guy called Head it was pathetic how one eyed he was...am afraid that what was once a great if not the best in the world news service has been busy shooting itself in the foot and slowly slipping down the gurgler ...IMHO

Plain silly. Jonathan Head was openly critical of Thaksin's abuses of power when Thaksin was in power, then later he also called the PAD and their erstwhile old elite and army backers out for what they are.

[Publicus]

The Chinese cut short the Avatar movie showings, even though people were enthusiastically lined up all over the country to see it multiple times - as Avatar shows how an oppressed minority, if it's focused enough, can repel the full might of an entrenched military machine.

Almost as dumb as Vietnamese Customs, who relieved me of the novel 'The Hunt For Red October' as being subversively anti-communist....

Yeah, a major reason the ruling Chinese Communist Party of the People's Republic of China aborted the showings of "Avatar" (the Chinese mispronunciation of the word is hilarious) is that it was blowing away the government's new production of the movie biography of Confucious. PRC Cinemas showing Avatar were full and sold out for the next showings while the cinemas showing Confucious were sparse of viewers. The government took a double-barreled action - it aborted the showings of Avatar and bused in secondary school children to the Confucious showings to try to prop up its sagging and sorry numbers both in viewers and in cash income. (The same middle and high school students who'd already seen Avatar two or three times, but had ignored Confucious the government propaganda movie.)

Meanwhile, in free societies such as Korea and Thailand, people are freely eating up Avatar thus adding to its record box office intake by which James Cameron has surpassed his own previous record box office hit Titanic.

Speaking of the Thaitanic...do you know where your lifeboat is

Edited April 19, 2010 by Publicus

[clockworkorange]

interesting how some international stories make it onto thai visa and how others dont.

Well spotted. But consider that this forum is "The Nation Thaivisa".

Looking at the propaganda mill that the once proud 'the Nation' has degenerated into, it would be wishful thinking to expect any balancing articles to be quoted here.

Edited April 19, 2010 by clockworkorange

[RussellHantz]

The South Korean diplomats are going to wish their government never opened their ignorant mouths after the next Thai election.

A real diplomatic blunder by the South Koreans.

[Thai at Heart]

I would also like to add, that Korea has a long and proud history of organised civil protest particularly by unions. One could say that the little man has his voice in Korea and it is achieved by removing his labour from the table.

Hence, I can understand any Korean PM being rather concerned that instead of sitting in the road for a day or two, then going to negotiations for an apparent victory, the protesters in Korea started to copy the PAD or UDD and simply decided to sit put ad nauseum until the relevant organisation caved 100% or the government shot the protesters.

I was in Seoul when the trade agreement concerning American beef imports was being done. It made the pictures of Silom yesterday look timid. The police/riot police presence was absolutely enormous, the venue was locked down secure, the people/farmers protested and the deal got signed.

Compare this to Suthep's pitiful efforts in Pattaya and ever since, and no wonder people really do wonder why Thailand even bothers with a law enforcement group like the Thai police? They would be better off subcontracting the riot control to outside contractors.

Edited April 20, 2010 by Thai at Heart

[Moruya]

Jonathan Head mostly tried to report the news as it was although he did suffer from regurgitating the same old phrases day in day out and became a little predictable and stale towards the end. Rachel Harvey is either shockingly ignorant of the facts or chooses to ignore them completely. The reds are not a bunch of poor farmers from upcountry – there are many factors in the mix from communists, anarchists, anti-government, Thaksinistas, paid attendees, republicans, aggrieved army personnel etc. Their leaders have asked “a million people to bring a million bottles of petrol to Bangkok and set it on fire”, to “burn the election office” to throw shit at Aphisit’s and Prem’s house as well as the rather sick collection of blood and throwing it at people’s personal residences. Criminal offences in any country. By the time all this has filtered through her rather simplistic mind it comes out as “the rich against the poor”. She clearly went to the Barbie school of foreign journalism.

Unfortunately it’s the same with the Thaksin era and the coup. She forgets or ignores the fact that Thaksin had held illegal elections – not giving the opposition the required time to prepare, buying votes aplenty and paying other political parties to oppose. At best he was a caretaker PM up to his old tricks when the army rolled in. From the Barbie school of journalism that becomes “PM Thaksin, overthrown in a military coup” etc. etc.

About the only thing I await with any interest from her is her distillation of the yellow shirted loons who appear to be making a comeback. She will certainly omit the New Politics party and their electoral beliefs and Sonthi’s history with Thaksin and will probably label them as “pro-establishment” or some such wishy washy claptrap.

Send her off where she belongs – covering the world’s knitting competitions.

[Publicus]

I would also like to add, that Korea has a long and proud history of organised civil protest particularly by unions. One could say that the little man has his voice in Korea and it is achieved by removing his labour from the table.

Hence, I can understand any Korean PM being rather concerned that instead of sitting in the road for a day or two, then going to negotiations for an apparent victory, the protesters in Korea started to copy the PAD or UDD and simply decided to sit put ad nauseum until the relevant organisation caved 100% or the government shot the protesters.

I was in Seoul when the trade agreement concerning American beef imports was being done. It made the pictures of Silom yesterday look timid. The police/riot police presence was absolutely enormous, the venue was locked down secure, the people/farmers protested and the deal got signed.

Compare this to Suthep's pitiful efforts in Pattaya and ever since, and no wonder people really do wonder why Thailand even bothers with a law enforcement group like the Thai police? They would be better off subcontracting the riot control to outside contractors.

During the two years I lived in S Korea (1996-98) I saw civilian demonstrators in the streets weekly and this was after democracy had been established. Indeed, any time the union leaders were welcomed to stay a while at the huge Buddhist temple in Seoul - a frequent occurance - the corporate family giants of the Chaebol knew that sooner or later they had to sign on the dotted line.

However, previous to the first 1992 democratic elections in the country's history, there was the famous but tragic massacre of the population of GwangJu City by the military junta that seized power on Dec 12, 1979 after the assassination of Pres (Dictator) Park Chung Hee by his own head of the Korean CIA (KCIA). (Park's wife had been killed during a previous unsuccessful assassination attempt against Park, who throughout the wild shooting melee continued speaking in the auditorium while and after his wife was carried off the stage, and while his security guards shot it out against and killed the several would-be assassins.)

GwangJu City, the major urban center of southwest Korea was the center of the pro-democracy movement in the country, led by the late Kim Dae Jung who in 1981 was abducted under Martial Law on orders by the coup leader Gen Chun Doo Hwan, thus igniting the historic KwangJu Democracy Movement and massacre by army troops of protesting citizens of GwangJu. Kim Dae Jung, who finally was elected president in 1997 had survived several previous assassination attempts by Park to include one in which Kim was abducted from his hotel in Tokyo and moments before being dropped from the air into the East Sea (formerly the Sea of Japan) was rescued by the intervention of the US CIA (the US Government threatened to withdraw its support of Park if Kim were dumped).

During the Martial Law period of May 18, 1980 forward Korean soldiers drawn from Seoul invaded GwangJu city in the southwest to bayonet civilians rather than shoot them. Pro-democracy citizens of GwangJu had occupied the Provincial Hall of the city after being led through the streets by taxis three abreadst, had torched the government television station and the tax collection office and taken full possession of the city.

Immediately after the 1979 assassination of Park, the military divided pro-democracy vs pro-business-as-usual and shot it out in the streets of Seoul for several days. Gen Chun then staged his coup as US intelligence identified large troop movements by North Korea to the common border in what appeared to be a developing rerun of the 1950 - 53 Korean War.

After the 1992 first free, open and democratic election in S Korea, Pres Kim Young Sam put Gen Chun and his coup makers on public trial which resulted in their convictions and imprisonment - Gen Chun got life imprisonment and is still there..

For you Reds who would like to see how citizens eventually overcame the all powerful and long dominant Korean military, you may care to go to the following link:

http://www.eng.518.org/eng/html/main.html?TM18MF=02030000

Edited April 20, 2010 by Publicus

[Phuket_Brad]

Jonathan Head mostly tried to report the news as it was although he did suffer from regurgitating the same old phrases day in day out and became a little predictable and stale towards the end. Rachel Harvey is either shockingly ignorant of the facts or chooses to ignore them completely. The reds are not a bunch of poor farmers from upcountry – there are many factors in the mix from communists, anarchists, anti-government, Thaksinistas, paid attendees, republicans, aggrieved army personnel etc. Their leaders have asked “a million people to bring a million bottles of petrol to Bangkok and set it on fire”, to “burn the election office” to throw shit at Aphisit’s and Prem’s house as well as the rather sick collection of blood and throwing it at people’s personal residences. Criminal offences in any country. By the time all this has filtered through her rather simplistic mind it comes out as “the rich against the poor”. She clearly went to the Barbie school of foreign journalism.

Unfortunately it’s the same with the Thaksin era and the coup. She forgets or ignores the fact that Thaksin had held illegal elections – not giving the opposition the required time to prepare, buying votes aplenty and paying other political parties to oppose. At best he was a caretaker PM up to his old tricks when the army rolled in. From the Barbie school of journalism that becomes “PM Thaksin, overthrown in a military coup” etc. etc.

About the only thing I await with any interest from her is her distillation of the yellow shirted loons who appear to be making a comeback. She will certainly omit the New Politics party and their electoral beliefs and Sonthi’s history with Thaksin and will probably label them as “pro-establishment” or some such wishy washy claptrap.

Send her off where she belongs – covering the world’s knitting competitions.

Well stated!

[Thai at Heart]

I would also like to add, that Korea has a long and proud history of organised civil protest particularly by unions. One could say that the little man has his voice in Korea and it is achieved by removing his labour from the table.

Hence, I can understand any Korean PM being rather concerned that instead of sitting in the road for a day or two, then going to negotiations for an apparent victory, the protesters in Korea started to copy the PAD or UDD and simply decided to sit put ad nauseum until the relevant organisation caved 100% or the government shot the protesters.

I was in Seoul when the trade agreement concerning American beef imports was being done. It made the pictures of Silom yesterday look timid. The police/riot police presence was absolutely enormous, the venue was locked down secure, the people/farmers protested and the deal got signed.

Compare this to Suthep's pitiful efforts in Pattaya and ever since, and no wonder people really do wonder why Thailand even bothers with a law enforcement group like the Thai police? They would be better off subcontracting the riot control to outside contractors.

During the two years I lived in S Korea (1996-98) I saw civilian demonstrators in the streets weekly and this was after democracy had been established. Indeed, any time the union leaders were welcomed to stay a while at the huge Buddhist temple in Seoul - a frequent occurance - the corporate family giants of the Chaebol knew that sooner or later they had to sign on the dotted line.

However, previous to the first 1992 democratic elections in the country's history, there was the famous but tragic massacre of the population of GwangJu City by the military junta that seized power on Dec 12, 1979 after the assassination of Pres (Dictator) Park Chung Hee by his own head of the Korean CIA (KCIA). (Park's wife had been killed during a previous unsuccessful assassination attempt against Park, who throughout the wild shooting melee continued speaking in the auditorium while and after his wife was carried off the stage, and while his security guards shot it out against and killed the several would-be assassins.)

GwangJu City, the major urban center of southwest Korea was the center of the pro-democracy movement in the country, led by the late Kim Dae Jung who in 1981 was abducted under Martial Law on orders by the coup leader Gen Chun Doo Wan, thus igniting the historic KwangJu Democracy Movement and massacre by army troops of protesting citizens of GwangJu. Kim Dae Jung, who finally was elected president in 1997 had survived several previous assassination attempts by Park to include one in which Kim was abducted from his hotel in Tokyo and moments before being dropped from the air into the East Sea (formerly the Sea of Japan) was rescued by the intervention of the US CIA (the US Government threatened to withdraw its support of Park if Kim were dumped).

During the Martial Law period of May 18, 1980 forward Korean soldiers drawn from Seoul invaded GwangJu city in the southwest to bayonet civilians rather than shoot them. Pro-democracy citizens of GwangJu had occupied the Provincial Hall of the city after being led through the streets by taxis three abreadst, had torched the government television station and the tax collection office and taken full possession of the city.

Immediately after the assassination of Park, the military divided pro-democracy and pro-business-as-usual and shot it out in the streets of Seoul for several days. Gen Chun then staged his coup as US intelligence identified large troop movements by North Korea to the common border in what appeared to be a developing rerun of the 1950 - 53 Korean War.

After the 1992 first free, open and democratic election in S Korea, Pres Kim Young Sam put Gen Chun and his coup makers on public trial which resulted in their convictions and imprisonment.

For you Reds who would like to see how citizens eventually overcame the all powerful and long dominant Korean military, you may care to go to the following link:

http://www.eng.518.org/eng/html/main.html?TM18MF20200000

Seems there is nothing truly original in this world. Thanks for posting that.

[Insight]

Does anybody have more details on the copper that launched the LM charge against Jonathan Head?

There's no doubt it hasn't worked in Thailand's favour (when do they ever?) - the more recent BBC reports on the ongoing crisis seem more narrow-minded than ever.

[Trickcyclist]

Korea aint the land of Smiles!!

I would also like to add, that Korea has a long and proud history of organised civil protest particularly by unions. One could say that the little man has his voice in Korea and it is achieved by removing his labour from the table.

Hence, I can understand any Korean PM being rather concerned that instead of sitting in the road for a day or two, then going to negotiations for an apparent victory, the protesters in Korea started to copy the PAD or UDD and simply decided to sit put ad nauseum until the relevant organisation caved 100% or the government shot the protesters.

I was in Seoul when the trade agreement concerning American beef imports was being done. It made the pictures of Silom yesterday look timid. The police/riot police presence was absolutely enormous, the venue was locked down secure, the people/farmers protested and the deal got signed.

Compare this to Suthep's pitiful efforts in Pattaya and ever since, and no wonder people really do wonder why Thailand even bothers with a law enforcement group like the Thai police? They would be better off subcontracting the riot control to outside contractors.

[clockworkorange]

the more recent BBC reports on the ongoing crisis seem more narrow-minded than ever.

Narrow minded in your opinion perhaps. Not everybody shares your opinion, and the bbc is internationally respected even though its articles sing from your propaganda hymn sheet. Your opinions,conversely, are not internationally acknowledged in the same way.

I wonder how it is that an verified quote from a Korean journal makes banner headlines in thaivisa while respectable outlets are not covered in a similar way.?

[quiksilva]

Are you implying that the South Korean President's opinions are in some way disrespected by the international community?

[longway]

The South Korean diplomats are going to wish their government never opened their ignorant mouths after the next Thai election.

A real diplomatic blunder by the South Koreans.