The World On Thailand’s Political Crisis

[webfact]

The World on Thailand’s Political Crisis

The rift in Thai society triggered by differences in political affiliation is growing wider as time passes, since conflicting groups cannot and will not agree to solve the problems through the Parliamentary process. The unresolved conflicts have paved way for a series of confrontations between government officials and red-shirt protesters that have resulted in many casualties, prompting our neighbors, ASEAN countries and the international community to turn and look upon Thailand and its democracy with grave concern.

Ever since its inception, democracy in Thailand has been mired in misapplication, corruption and military coups. It could be said that our democracy is just a “knock-off” of the British model and superficially revolves around an electoral process, while there is still the lack of a profound understanding of democratic principles including duties and responsibilities of citizens in addition to their fundamental rights.

Yet regrettably, many of us know only to exercise our rights, but forget our responsibilities under a democratic system. That is why our democracy is still kind of crippled.

 A couple days ago, our thriving neighbors Singapore and Indonesia expressed their concerns about the political situation in Thailand and called for a peaceful resolution towards the crisis.

Singapore's foreign ministry urged Thais to overlook differences and refrain from violence for the sake of the nation. Indonesia’s Foreign Minister Marty Natalegawa even proposed to mediate negotiations between conflicting parties to break the political deadlock in Thailand.

Also, Secretary-General of the United Nations Ban Ki-moon and United States President Barrack Obama were worried about Thailand’s political standoff, fearing that the situation could escalate into what has happened in Africa in the past.

Shouldn’t we feel embarrassed at all?

Admittedly, our neighboring countries in Southeast Asia are also struck by the spillover of our political dispute, as it has stalled co-operations and agreements between ASEAN member nations.

Our tourism sector is in tatters after the Ratchprasong Intersection, Bangkok’s central financial and shopping area, is sealed off by the red shirts and blotted by cases of clashes that killed and injured many people. United States, Japan, China and many European countries have prohibited their nationals to make trips to Thailand. Japanese headquarters also told their executives not to attend meetings or contract signings held in Thailand.

Most recently, Britain’s foreign ministry advised British vacationers not to travel to Thailand unless necessary, while British travel firms have announced that they will offer a full refund of purchased tour packages for Thailand if holidaymakers make a cancellation within April 30.

I only wish that every party involved in the political battle come to their senses soon and restart talks for national interests and prevent the country from further damages.

Taken from 'Mai Het Pratet Thai' column, Thai Rath newspaper, April 30th

Translated and edited by Wacharapol Isaranont

-- Tan Network 2010-05-01

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

[Thailand]

I think in general the world does not care about Thailand's problems each country having enough of their own.

Most countries interest are simply to cover their back's by issuing warnings to travelers to ensure there will be no backlash in the case of problems.

[toenail]

The article said: It could be said that our democracy is just a “knock-off” of the British model and superficially revolves around an electoral process, while there is still the lack of a profound understanding of democratic principles including duties and responsibilities of citizens in addition to their fundamental rights.

This is part of the problem, Thais not understanding their personal responsiblity of the democratic process. Yes, protesting freely is part of democracy, but you still have to follow the ordances and guidelines for a demonstration; next voting "smart" is another responsibility of a citizen which means you do not vote for a candidate because you are "bribed". I can remember taking civic classes when I was in school which educated me what a democracy was. I wonder if the Thai schools teach what responsibilities one has living in a democracy and how it works? (I doubt it)

(After living in 5 different countries) I sometimes think a "developing" country is not ready for a "true" democracy, but it takes a firm hand to get things on the right track.(which means a strong leader wanting the best for his country-not a "thug") Look at Taiwan, South Korea, and Singapore...these countries did not start as a democracy... Today they have their own "form" of democracy. I think as citizens of a country becomes more affluent and educated, then a "true" democracy can prosper. Unlike my American friends back home, I truly feel China some day will a "democracy" as it becomes developed. It cannot happen over night (look at what happened to Russia).

[Starrysky]

But which European countries have 'prohibited' their nationals from coming to Thailand?! My Dutch friend is now visiting family in Holland. Does this mean that she won't be able to return next week?

[whybother]

But which European countries have 'prohibited' their nationals from coming to Thailand?! My Dutch friend is now visiting family in Holland. Does this mean that she won't be able to return next week?

No one would be "prohibited" from coming to Thailand.

With the raising of the risks by various countries, it just effects the insurance that individuals can get.

[devaram]

I fell asleep while I was reading this article...

[sbk]

An off topic post and all responses to that post have been deleted. Further such posts will result in a warning.

[retarius]

I keep in touch with the UK/US press as well as Al Jazeera (in my opinion the best unbiased news source) and some of the Asian publications like New Mandala....it's pretty clear that Thailand isn't exactly high on the list of priorities or newsworthiness in much of the world....the UK is absorbed with the upcoming election, the UK is absorbed with itself, EU is absorbed with Greece's financial meltdown...the Guardian has had a couple of blogs on the subject and one editorial but neither raised much in the way of comments...ditto for the Independent....the Times had an article this week...and the Economist has had a couple of articles...all of the articles/editorials/blogs I read were broadly sympathetic to the idea of elections...what I've been surprised at is the issue of free speech, the world doesn't seem to be aware that all red supporting media have been closed down, but they are not buying into the yellow government propaganda....

The best article by far is in the New Mandala about the Royal Thai Army...it's a well researched article written by people who know something of the complexities of the military relationships...and beats hands down all the simplistic drivel from the yellow blind posters on TVF....

[retarius]

The article said: It could be said that our democracy is just a “knock-off” of the British model and superficially revolves around an electoral process, while there is still the lack of a profound understanding of democratic principles including duties and responsibilities of citizens in addition to their fundamental rights.

This is part of the problem, Thais not understanding their personal responsiblity of the democratic process. Yes, protesting freely is part of democracy, but you still have to follow the ordances and guidelines for a demonstration; next voting "smart" is another responsibility of a citizen which means you do not vote for a candidate because you are "bribed". I can remember taking civic classes when I was in school which educated me what a democracy was. I wonder if the Thai schools teach what responsibilities one has living in a democracy and how it works? (I doubt it)

(After living in 5 different countries) I sometimes think a "developing" country is not ready for a "true" democracy, but it takes a firm hand to get things on the right track.(which means a strong leader wanting the best for his country-not a "thug") Look at Taiwan, South Korea, and Singapore...these countries did not start as a democracy... Today they have their own "form" of democracy. I think as citizens of a country becomes more affluent and educated, then a "true" democracy can prosper. Unlike my American friends back home, I truly feel China some day will a "democracy" as it becomes developed. It cannot happen over night (look at what happened to Russia).

Toenail,

I think that the problem is less a misunderstanding of democracy, and more a general lack of respect for the law...if the rich and powerful elite are seen to be above the law, why would the poor respect it? For laws to be seen to be legitimate they have be seen to apply to everybody and to be impartial applied and enforced...in Thailand the law seems to be applied selectively; the judiciary do not give the appearance of impartiality; and enforcement is spotty at best....

[Slip]

I keep in touch with the UK/US press as well as Al Jazeera (in my opinion the best unbiased news source) and some of the Asian publications like New Mandala....it's pretty clear that Thailand isn't exactly high on the list of priorities or newsworthiness in much of the world....the UK is absorbed with the upcoming election, the UK is absorbed with itself, EU is absorbed with Greece's financial meltdown...the Guardian has had a couple of blogs on the subject and one editorial but neither raised much in the way of comments...ditto for the Independent....the Times had an article this week...and the Economist has had a couple of articles...all of the articles/editorials/blogs I read were broadly sympathetic to the idea of elections...what I've been surprised at is the issue of free speech, the world doesn't seem to be aware that all red supporting media have been closed down, but they are not buying into the yellow government propaganda....

The best article by far is in the New Mandala about the Royal Thai Army...it's a well researched article written by people who know something of the complexities of the military relationships...and beats hands down all the simplistic drivel from the yellow blind posters on TVF....

Just what this thread needed- some red propoganda!

[jdinasia]

I keep in touch with the UK/US press as well as Al Jazeera (in my opinion the best unbiased news source) and some of the Asian publications like New Mandala....it's pretty clear that Thailand isn't exactly high on the list of priorities or newsworthiness in much of the world....the UK is absorbed with the upcoming election, the UK is absorbed with itself, EU is absorbed with Greece's financial meltdown...the Guardian has had a couple of blogs on the subject and one editorial but neither raised much in the way of comments...ditto for the Independent....the Times had an article this week...and the Economist has had a couple of articles...all of the articles/editorials/blogs I read were broadly sympathetic to the idea of elections...what I've been surprised at is the issue of free speech, the world doesn't seem to be aware that all red supporting media have been closed down, but they are not buying into the yellow government propaganda....

The best article by far is in the New Mandala about the Royal Thai Army...it's a well researched article written by people who know something of the complexities of the military relationships...and beats hands down all the simplistic drivel from the yellow blind posters on TVF....

Pardon me? The New Mandala "article" would better be described as an "essay" by a college student and is just speculative. It isn't news and is not factual.

[Lite Beer]

A post discussing moderation has been deleted.

[tlongdon]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/travelne...vel-advice.html

I'm not sure if this has been posted elsewhere yet, but a short piece on the UK travel advisory, and TAT pretending everything's ok (outside BKK). Which it probably is, but still, you have to wonder whats next, when a McD's gets hit.

[Stjohnm]

But which European countries have 'prohibited' their nationals from coming to Thailand?! My Dutch friend is now visiting family in Holland. Does this mean that she won't be able to return next week?

I think that one was lost in Translation, Travel Advisories don't prohibit you from travelling, its just a warning, also insurance companies can invoke clauses not to pay out if an advisory is issued.

[jdinasia]

I keep in touch with the UK/US press as well as Al Jazeera (in my opinion the best unbiased news source) and some of the Asian publications like New Mandala....it's pretty clear that Thailand isn't exactly high on the list of priorities or newsworthiness in much of the world....the UK is absorbed with the upcoming election, the UK is absorbed with itself, EU is absorbed with Greece's financial meltdown...the Guardian has had a couple of blogs on the subject and one editorial but neither raised much in the way of comments...ditto for the Independent....the Times had an article this week...and the Economist has had a couple of articles...all of the articles/editorials/blogs I read were broadly sympathetic to the idea of elections...what I've been surprised at is the issue of free speech, the world doesn't seem to be aware that all red supporting media have been closed down, but they are not buying into the yellow government propaganda....

The best article by far is in the New Mandala about the Royal Thai Army...it's a well researched article written by people who know something of the complexities of the military relationships...and beats hands down all the simplistic drivel from the yellow blind posters on TVF....

Pardon me? The New Mandala "article" would better be described as an "essay" by a college student and is just speculative. It isn't news and is not factual.

And I guess you have "insider" information? You get your information unfiltered direct from God? Or do you get it from the Nation?

I have nothing special in the way of insider information at all .... but the fabulous point made here is that you accept speculation NOT based on fact from one source (that tends to support a conspiracy theory favored by the Reds) but oppose (apparently) speculation and opinion from another source that does not support conspiracy theories favored by the reds

"Double Standards" :-)

[rychrde]

The article said: It could be said that our democracy is just a "knock-off" of the British model and superficially revolves around an electoral process, while there is still the lack of a profound understanding of democratic principles including duties and responsibilities of citizens in addition to their fundamental rights.

This is part of the problem, Thais not understanding their personal responsiblity of the democratic process. Yes, protesting freely is part of democracy, but you still have to follow the ordances and guidelines for a demonstration; next voting "smart" is another responsibility of a citizen which means you do not vote for a candidate because you are "bribed". I can remember taking civic classes when I was in school which educated me what a democracy was. I wonder if the Thai schools teach what responsibilities one has living in a democracy and how it works? (I doubt it)

Actually, students do learn about democracy at school! I can't speak for what Thai teachers teach but the teachers in English and Bilingual Programmes do make an effort to explain the history and concepts of democracy as laid down by the ministry of education's curriculum. Democracy is part of the Social Studies curriculum, which this year has been expanded. However, until Thais accept that there is a wider world out there that they can learn from I'm going to have to skip 'sensitive' parts of the history of systems of rule such as the Bolshevik revolution, the storming of the Bastille and indeed any revolution against an autocrat, royal or otherwise.

So, will be interesting to see how far I will be able to enlighten my students on democracy assuming this current crisis carries on into the new academic year.

[whiterussian]

I keep in touch with the UK/US press as well as Al Jazeera (in my opinion the best unbiased news source) and some of the Asian publications like New Mandala....it's pretty clear that Thailand isn't exactly high on the list of priorities or newsworthiness in much of the world....the UK is absorbed with the upcoming election, the UK is absorbed with itself, EU is absorbed with Greece's financial meltdown...the Guardian has had a couple of blogs on the subject and one editorial but neither raised much in the way of comments...ditto for the Independent....the Times had an article this week...and the Economist has had a couple of articles...all of the articles/editorials/blogs I read were broadly sympathetic to the idea of elections...what I've been surprised at is the issue of free speech, the world doesn't seem to be aware that all red supporting media have been closed down, but they are not buying into the yellow government propaganda....

The best article by far is in the New Mandala about the Royal Thai Army...it's a well researched article written by people who know something of the complexities of the military relationships...and beats hands down all the simplistic drivel from the yellow blind posters on TVF....

Pardon me? The New Mandala "article" would better be described as an "essay" by a college student and is just speculative. It isn't news and is not factual.

How on earth do you know its not factual?

For what it's worth it echoes the gripes of (some) of the low level red shirt. By low level, I mean those red shirts that I know personally! Therefore: low level red shirts! The 'propoganda' in that article is what is driving (some of) the common garden variety red shirt to support the reds. This is fact!

Might not be the whole picture, for instance the same red shirts that had previously told me about the new mandala topics over a year ago, also told me there are communist elements within the yellow side at the very very top ( ^^^) . So obviously it may not be 100% accurate, but it is certainly what many believe. And it seems to fit.

Of course I find it amusing that the red shirts in question uttered the word 'communist', with a scowl... as an insult to the top echelons of the yellow side..

Why else would the yellows want to prolong the agony if not for the reshuffle. By all accounts they would be booting out in the blink of an eye come election day...especially now that the reds have martyrs.

The strangest bit of red prop/gossip involves a 90 something year old (not ^^^), which is mentioned in the article. Which I certainly wont go into here!

-----

I dont know how Thai politcs works, but it's obviously bust.

- Independent media - free of LM charges is a good step (unwritten understanding would suffice as in the UK). That way Thais can actually get the boogie man out of the closet. But this also depends on Thai attention span. And of course could end up like Italy with Berlusconi

- Do the Thai's have an equivalent of The House of Lords - able to block legislation? - The Prviy Council sound similar, bt is obviously not functioning 100% to allow such levels of corruption as under mr T. The US system is about as corrupt as can be, so European models seem the best option. Swedish/English/Dutch...

Edited May 1, 2010 by whiterussian

[hammered]

I think in general the world does not care about Thailand's problems each country having enough of their own.

Most countries interest are simply to cover their back's by issuing warnings to travelers to ensure there will be no backlash in the case of problems.

Nice concise and imho correct

[jdinasia]

I keep in touch with the UK/US press as well as Al Jazeera (in my opinion the best unbiased news source) and some of the Asian publications like New Mandala....it's pretty clear that Thailand isn't exactly high on the list of priorities or newsworthiness in much of the world....the UK is absorbed with the upcoming election, the UK is absorbed with itself, EU is absorbed with Greece's financial meltdown...the Guardian has had a couple of blogs on the subject and one editorial but neither raised much in the way of comments...ditto for the Independent....the Times had an article this week...and the Economist has had a couple of articles...all of the articles/editorials/blogs I read were broadly sympathetic to the idea of elections...what I've been surprised at is the issue of free speech, the world doesn't seem to be aware that all red supporting media have been closed down, but they are not buying into the yellow government propaganda....

The best article by far is in the New Mandala about the Royal Thai Army...it's a well researched article written by people who know something of the complexities of the military relationships...and beats hands down all the simplistic drivel from the yellow blind posters on TVF....

Pardon me? The New Mandala "article" would better be described as an "essay" by a college student and is just speculative. It isn't news and is not factual.

How on earth do you know its not factual?

For what it's worth it echos the gripes of (some) of the low level red shirt. By low level, I mean those red shirts that I know personally! Therefore: low level red shirts! The 'propoganda' in that article is what is driving (some of) the common garden variety red shirt to support the reds. This is fact!

Might not be the whole picture, for instance the same red shirts that had previously told me about the new mandala topics over a year ago, also told me there are communist elements within the yellow side at the very very top ( ^^^) . So obviously it may not be 100% accurate, but it is certainly what many believe. And it seems to fit.

Of course I find it amusing that the red shirts in question uttered the word 'communist', with a scowl... as an insult to the top echelons of the yellow side..

Why else would the yellows want to prolong the agony if not for the reshuffle. By all accounts they would be booting out in the blink of an eye come election day...especially now that the reds have martyrs.

The strangest bit of red prop/gossip involves a 90 something year old (not ^^^), which is mentioned in the article. Which I certainly wont go into here!

How do I know that it is not factual? Because it doesn't contain facts, it contains speculation.

Bob is caucasian (that is a fact if bob is white).

Bob appears to think that .... (that is speculation)

New Mandala does as much in the way of speculation as the Nation does (imho) ...

Please feel free to go back to the article about the Army and share with us the FACTS that are in there versus the speculation

[retarius]

I keep in touch with the UK/US press as well as Al Jazeera (in my opinion the best unbiased news source) and some of the Asian publications like New Mandala....it's pretty clear that Thailand isn't exactly high on the list of priorities or newsworthiness in much of the world....the UK is absorbed with the upcoming election, the UK is absorbed with itself, EU is absorbed with Greece's financial meltdown...the Guardian has had a couple of blogs on the subject and one editorial but neither raised much in the way of comments...ditto for the Independent....the Times had an article this week...and the Economist has had a couple of articles...all of the articles/editorials/blogs I read were broadly sympathetic to the idea of elections...what I've been surprised at is the issue of free speech, the world doesn't seem to be aware that all red supporting media have been closed down, but they are not buying into the yellow government propaganda....

The best article by far is in the New Mandala about the Royal Thai Army...it's a well researched article written by people who know something of the complexities of the military relationships...and beats hands down all the simplistic drivel from the yellow blind posters on TVF....

Pardon me? The New Mandala "article" would better be described as an "essay" by a college student and is just speculative. It isn't news and is not factual.

How on earth do you know its not factual?

For what it's worth it echos the gripes of (some) of the low level red shirt. By low level, I mean those red shirts that I know personally! Therefore: low level red shirts! The 'propoganda' in that article is what is driving (some of) the common garden variety red shirt to support the reds. This is fact!

Might not be the whole picture, for instance the same red shirts that had previously told me about the new mandala topics over a year ago, also told me there are communist elements within the yellow side at the very very top ( ^^^) . So obviously it may not be 100% accurate, but it is certainly what many believe. And it seems to fit.

Of course I find it amusing that the red shirts in question uttered the word 'communist', with a scowl... as an insult to the top echelons of the yellow side..

Why else would the yellows want to prolong the agony if not for the reshuffle. By all accounts they would be booting out in the blink of an eye come election day...especially now that the reds have martyrs.

The strangest bit of red prop/gossip involves a 90 something year old (not ^^^), which is mentioned in the article. Which I certainly wont go into here!

How do I know that it is not factual? Because it doesn't contain facts, it contains speculation.

Bob is caucasian (that is a fact if bob is white).

Bob appears to think that .... (that is speculation)

New Mandala does as much in the way of speculation as the Nation does (imho) ...

Please feel free to go back to the article about the Army and share with us the FACTS that are in there versus the speculation

I guess I have to hand it to the yellow shirt propaganda machine...when anyone writes a thoughtful factual researched article about an aspect of the conflict and it's conclusion does support the lies from the yellow camp, it becomes red shirt lies....if it is some idle half baked report from the Nation it becomes gospel truth...this is why there is no end to this conflict....

[craigt3365]

I keep in touch with the UK/US press as well as Al Jazeera (in my opinion the best unbiased news source) and some of the Asian publications like New Mandala....it's pretty clear that Thailand isn't exactly high on the list of priorities or newsworthiness in much of the world....the UK is absorbed with the upcoming election, the UK is absorbed with itself, EU is absorbed with Greece's financial meltdown...the Guardian has had a couple of blogs on the subject and one editorial but neither raised much in the way of comments...ditto for the Independent....the Times had an article this week...and the Economist has had a couple of articles...all of the articles/editorials/blogs I read were broadly sympathetic to the idea of elections...what I've been surprised at is the issue of free speech, the world doesn't seem to be aware that all red supporting media have been closed down, but they are not buying into the yellow government propaganda....

The best article by far is in the New Mandala about the Royal Thai Army...it's a well researched article written by people who know something of the complexities of the military relationships...and beats hands down all the simplistic drivel from the yellow blind posters on TVF....

I do like Al Jazeera also. But I have seen Thailand coverage every day on both BBC and CNN. In their world report editions. Right there with the oil spill, Brown's problems, Greece, etc.

As for red supporting media being shut down, TiT! But I do agree with the government here that is was basically full of lies and clearly supporting overthrow of the government in a violent manner. I would hope ANY country would shut such a site down. If not, hope someone with brains would do it for them....

[Redsunset]

FROM THAI VISA!

"Somchai's relatives dressed in black: Bannawit

Adm Bannawit Kengrien, a former deputy permanent secretary for Defence, posted a message on his Twitter page, saying he has learned that all family members of former Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat are now dressed in black.

Bannawit also claimed that his friend, who is a Pheu Thai MPs, received an order that if someone asked him about former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, he would have to reply that he had just talked to Thaksin over the phone."

I think THAKSIN is either gravel ill, or as the above quote from Thai Visa suggests, he is dead. Until I see him on video talking about recent events, he is dead in my opinion... All the Twitter and Facebook postings are so fake. Anyway, that is NOT Thaksin's style...

He did look sick in his last video link... balding chalk white.... hollow eyes... DEAD...... He is DEAD!

[hammered]

I keep in touch with the UK/US press as well as Al Jazeera (in my opinion the best unbiased news source) and some of the Asian publications like New Mandala....it's pretty clear that Thailand isn't exactly high on the list of priorities or newsworthiness in much of the world....the UK is absorbed with the upcoming election, the UK is absorbed with itself, EU is absorbed with Greece's financial meltdown...the Guardian has had a couple of blogs on the subject and one editorial but neither raised much in the way of comments...ditto for the Independent....the Times had an article this week...and the Economist has had a couple of articles...all of the articles/editorials/blogs I read were broadly sympathetic to the idea of elections...what I've been surprised at is the issue of free speech, the world doesn't seem to be aware that all red supporting media have been closed down, but they are not buying into the yellow government propaganda....

The best article by far is in the New Mandala about the Royal Thai Army...it's a well researched article written by people who know something of the complexities of the military relationships...and beats hands down all the simplistic drivel from the yellow blind posters on TVF....

Go back and read the NM article again and tell us it is well reesearched. If it were in the Nation and slanted a different way it wouyld be described as unsubstantiated gossip by an unnamed author. By the way that is what it is an unsubstantiated opinion piece quoting unnamed sources. A well researched piece is kinda different from that. Whether it is accurate or not who knows but it certainly uisnt well researched and is certainly unsubstantiated.

Considering it is presented under a false name I would also be interested in how you know it is written by "people" (plural) "who know something of the complexities of the military relationships.." Come on you are one of the authors of it arent you;) That is the only way you could know that

[jdinasia]

Pardon me? The New Mandala "article" would better be described as an "essay" by a college student and is just speculative. It isn't news and is not factual.

How on earth do you know its not factual?

For what it's worth it echos the gripes of (some) of the low level red shirt. By low level, I mean those red shirts that I know personally! Therefore: low level red shirts! The 'propoganda' in that article is what is driving (some of) the common garden variety red shirt to support the reds. This is fact!

Might not be the whole picture, for instance the same red shirts that had previously told me about the new mandala topics over a year ago, also told me there are communist elements within the yellow side at the very very top ( ^^^) . So obviously it may not be 100% accurate, but it is certainly what many believe. And it seems to fit.

Of course I find it amusing that the red shirts in question uttered the word 'communist', with a scowl... as an insult to the top echelons of the yellow side..

Why else would the yellows want to prolong the agony if not for the reshuffle. By all accounts they would be booting out in the blink of an eye come election day...especially now that the reds have martyrs.

The strangest bit of red prop/gossip involves a 90 something year old (not ^^^), which is mentioned in the article. Which I certainly wont go into here!

How do I know that it is not factual? Because it doesn't contain facts, it contains speculation.

Bob is caucasian (that is a fact if bob is white).

Bob appears to think that .... (that is speculation)

New Mandala does as much in the way of speculation as the Nation does (imho) ...

Please feel free to go back to the article about the Army and share with us the FACTS that are in there versus the speculation

I guess I have to hand it to the yellow shirt propaganda machine...when anyone writes a thoughtful factual researched article about an aspect of the conflict and it's conclusion does support the lies from the yellow camp, it becomes red shirt lies....if it is some idle half baked report from the Nation it becomes gospel truth...this is why there is no end to this conflict....

Here is why there are issues

I state the New Mandala article is Speculative in nature. I state that The Nation tends to be speculative in Nature.

Instead of contradicting what I say with fact ... Retarius ignores that I say that The Nation is speculative in nature (quite often). So he creates a strawman that I suggest the Nation is reporting fact (most of the crap they put out is in fact just opinion pieces and much of the rest IS colored by the owner's editorial policy!).

What are the FACTS in the New Mandala article (and please refer back to post 15!)

[jdinasia]

Thanks Hammered --- exactly my points but put forward in a much more succinct manner!

[rixalex]

I guess I have to hand it to the yellow shirt propaganda machine...when anyone writes a thoughtful factual researched article about an aspect of the conflict and it's conclusion does support the lies from the yellow camp, it becomes red shirt lies....if it is some idle half baked report from the Nation it becomes gospel truth...this is why there is no end to this conflict....

Who has said that reports from the Nation are gospel truth? Nobody i know of.

So are you the author of the article in NM?

[whybother]

FROM THAI VISA!

"Somchai's relatives dressed in black: Bannawit

Adm Bannawit Kengrien, a former deputy permanent secretary for Defence, posted a message on his Twitter page, saying he has learned that all family members of former Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat are now dressed in black.

Bannawit also claimed that his friend, who is a Pheu Thai MPs, received an order that if someone asked him about former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, he would have to reply that he had just talked to Thaksin over the phone."

I think THAKSIN is either gravel ill, or as the above quote from Thai Visa suggests, he is dead. Until I see him on video talking about recent events, he is dead in my opinion... All the Twitter and Facebook postings are so fake. Anyway, that is NOT Thaksin's style...

He did look sick in his last video link... balding chalk white.... hollow eyes... DEAD...... He is DEAD!

"Weekend at Thaksin's"

[lannarebirth]

FROM THAI VISA!

"Somchai's relatives dressed in black: Bannawit

Adm Bannawit Kengrien, a former deputy permanent secretary for Defence, posted a message on his Twitter page, saying he has learned that all family members of former Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat are now dressed in black.

Bannawit also claimed that his friend, who is a Pheu Thai MPs, received an order that if someone asked him about former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, he would have to reply that he had just talked to Thaksin over the phone."

I think THAKSIN is either gravel ill, or as the above quote from Thai Visa suggests, he is dead. Until I see him on video talking about recent events, he is dead in my opinion... All the Twitter and Facebook postings are so fake. Anyway, that is NOT Thaksin's style...

He did look sick in his last video link... balding chalk white.... hollow eyes... DEAD...... He is DEAD!

"Weekend at Thaksin's"

[lannarebirth]

FROM THAI VISA!

"Somchai's relatives dressed in black: Bannawit

Adm Bannawit Kengrien, a former deputy permanent secretary for Defence, posted a message on his Twitter page, saying he has learned that all family members of former Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat are now dressed in black.

Bannawit also claimed that his friend, who is a Pheu Thai MPs, received an order that if someone asked him about former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, he would have to reply that he had just talked to Thaksin over the phone."

I think THAKSIN is either gravel ill, or as the above quote from Thai Visa suggests, he is dead. Until I see him on video talking about recent events, he is dead in my opinion... All the Twitter and Facebook postings are so fake. Anyway, that is NOT Thaksin's style...

He did look sick in his last video link... balding chalk white.... hollow eyes... DEAD...... He is DEAD!

"Weekend at Thaksin's"

That brought tears. Good one.

[niteswim]

Hi can someone please give me the link to the New Mandala article.

Thanks !